Sorceror 17er Game Thread

[Sunbae]

HollowKatt: I think their interactions with Monstr are interesting. Immediately called out Monstr for feeling spicy for the sake of spicy, follows up on it by reiterating it to Cuth, monstr returns by saying it's not a real thought and voting hk. That is the entirety of HK's iso that I feel I can call towny and, frankly, I'm pretty ok saying it's reasonable to expect monstr to be a bus target at that point. I don't think anything else in there feels like someone trying to solve the game and I think the case on Dobby is like, really twisty in a nefarious way. I have this slot as a possible wolf. Not a lock. Could easily still be villa. But thus far isoing everyone up to this point, this one is the least villagery to me by far

[nebjiamn]

nice to know im not the only one thinking "man there's lots of villagers"

[Sunbae]

I mean that's just how it works when half the wolves are dead on day 2

[Newcomb]

Just popping in before bed to say the last 15 or so posts have been really just enjoyable werewolf, nice job guys. I feel like I should have something really deep and insightful to say about them but honestly my biggest takeaway is "man now I remember why this game is fun sometimes."

In terms of more relevant stuff... I think I was working myself around to a Monte vote, influenced a bit by Zack's case and the general idea of "well who's not actually trying to solve the game, in simple terms?" And before that last flurry I'd have said Monte, Rask, and then like HK/Dobby/Cape but only if you wanted to be like, uncharitable. Like those 3 it's more like the way they're approaching the game is kind of.. peripheral. Which at least when I'm a wolf and especially if I'm on a team that's not doing so hot I kind of end up playing that way just out of sheer self preservation.

What I mean is - I guess this is directly to you Sunbae, but what is the easy world here? Both wolves are just not in any kind of place where they have any thread control?

I keep coming back to sleep, ender, katze. There's an element of wanting there, I have to admit it. The idea that the people who have been most critical of me this game have all 3 been genuine about it is... distasteful. But, possible. I suppose.

But like I can't get out of that spiral. I suppose I'm tunneled a bit. Like I see that latest post from Ender where he like, very very begrudgingly entertains a townread on me and my brain just SCREAMS "this guy just realized he lost a mislynch."

Anyway I'm not really going anywhere with this. TL;DR good posts, love the energy. What's the easy world if we're in the easy world though?

[Sunbae]

Katze: A bit of a difficult one for me. There was a really great post towards Ladd kinda trying to pull a punch when asking if Ladd had a thought on sleep wolf before newcomb posted it. The rest of her posts show some good attempts at solving. I have some lingering issues though:

1. I struggle to follow the progression as EOD happens from saying she's the biggest anti-newcomb voice to this lackadaisical vote on newcomb with 'fingers crossed but i do not like any other wagon at all really ' while there's like 6 wagons within a vote of each other.

2. I am skeeved out by the HK defense using the term read decay because it's the exact same way Ladd defended HK. I have both seen and been in wolf chats where a wolf makes some goofy sounding tagline for a defense and other wolves meme on it a bit in the thread. Benneh knows it as the Super Smash Bros spicy read. It's, silly but it crossed my mind.

3. I kind of think HK is a wolf in a lot of worlds and Katze I think has been defending HK a lot in this game. HK being the only one to get a larger blurb in the wagons bad post with why is this even a wagon.

4. Outside of the one prod at Ladd, I don't think Katze really interacted with the dead wolves much. In fact, Katze tried to give Dolby some town credit today for the pronoun read, then pretty much swapped over to dolby once it became clear that wasn't going to fly today.

None of these are that strong but I have strong reasons to call others villagery and I don't really have many for Katze.

With that said, if Newcomb is a wolf then Katze killed it this game.

Have as a possible wolf. Likely paired with either HK, Rask, or Neb if a wolf. i think?

[Sunbae]

"what is the easy world"

Not sure yet, going through everyone individually and seeing how I feel.

[Sunbae]

Mont: Voted Ladd. Thought the vote count comment was just the right level of towny tinfoil. Voted monstr d1 and had Dolby as second to bottom. I have very little experience with Mont and I know Zack has said they are capable of bussing. Thought their posting today was good though. I'm fine calling a likely villager for now and letting others determine if that's incorrect later.

[nebjiamn]

1. I struggle to follow the progression as EOD happens from saying she's the biggest anti-newcomb voice to this lackadaisical vote on newcomb with 'fingers crossed but i do not like any other wagon at all really ' while there's like 6 wagons within a vote of each other.

its funny how perspective works, because i totally get this progression from katze and if she's a wolf she played it exactly how i did as a villager minus me having the guts to follow through on the vote, so points for authenticity

[Sunbae]

Neb: Had a big post about their eod earlier. I think the only way they are a wolf is specifically with Newcomb at this point, otherwise I think they ensure a villager goes over instead of ladd. I totally understand villa Neb's eod thought process and progression. I think we think about werewolf very similarly and it's how I envision my posting if I were around. Also think there's been good solving there throughout the two days. Their progression on Newcomb could be one of realizing they don't have to cut their losses on him anymore and moving him back, but I also think it's entirely reasonable for villager neb to treat newcomb this way today as well. Basically, I wouldn't kill Neb unless newcomb flipped wolf. Again, think the solving today is very good.

[Sunbae]

its funny how perspective works, because i totally get this progression from katze and if she's a wolf she played it exactly how i did as a villager minus me having the guts to follow through on the vote, so points for authenticity
[/COLOR]

I mean to add another thing: I thought the way she expressed concern about you pocketing her a little bit after a bunch of people town read me for saying that Ladd was trying to pocket people was a bit weird. Obviously in this player list I'm never going to be like "so and so is an obvious wolf". They won't be. I'll just say "hey, you're not as towny as others are so sorry" and that's kinda where I am with Katze. I uh, am not saying to kill Katze or anything.

[nebjiamn]

Neb: Had a big post about their eod earlier. I think the only way they are a wolf is specifically with Newcomb at this point, otherwise I think they ensure a villager goes over instead of ladd. I totally understand villa Neb's eod thought process and progression. I think we think about werewolf very similarly and it's how I envision my posting if I were around. Also think there's been good solving there throughout the two days. Their progression on Newcomb could be one of realizing they don't have to cut their losses on him anymore and moving him back, but I also think it's entirely reasonable for villager neb to treat newcomb this way today as well. Basically, I wouldn't kill Neb unless newcomb flipped wolf. Again, think the solving today is very good.

man.

lmao

i get it but damn

[Sunbae]

Newcomb: I've talked a ton about Newcomb already. My thoughts are pretty clear. Could still be a wolf. Kinda don't think so. Going to make my final call (I assume i'll die tonight? Maybe zack will?) tomorrow before eod but idk, he doesn't read as dead inside to me and frankly I think the wolves probably feel pretty dead inside after that d1/start of day2.

[Sunbae]

man.

lmao

i get it but damn

I asked myself "how is neb a wolf in this game" and my answer is "wolf with newcomb or something went horribly wrong" lol

it might be unfair but idk, its 230 am cut me some slack haha

[nebjiamn]

trust me i get it

i'm already on record saying i've moved past the 'probable' stage for newcomb to be a wolf but the heart still wants d1!benneh to have been right on something that i actually cared about and to read "if newcomb's a wolf prob kill benneh" just hurts since that pelt, i feel, would belong partially to me but i'd be understandably yeeted for not having the balls to commit to it on d1

if newcomb IS a wolf this game you strong players better watch your backs in the future cause i'm never holding back again

[EnderWiggin]

I keep coming back to sleep, ender, katze. There's an element of wanting there, I have to admit it. The idea that the people who have been most critical of me this game have all 3 been genuine about it is... distasteful. But, possible. I suppose.

But like I can't get out of that spiral. I suppose I'm tunneled a bit. Like I see that latest post from Ender where he like, very very begrudgingly entertains a townread on me and my brain just SCREAMS "this guy just realized he lost a mislynch."

Anyway I'm not really going anywhere with this. TL;DR good posts, love the energy. What's the easy world if we're in the easy world though?

You ever looked through posts and realised that maybe your triumphant case you spent ages on and the tunnel you lovingly constructed might be a miss?

You'd be begrudging about it too =P

[EnderWiggin]

Bunch of other posts I probably should respond to but low energy dip in and only have 20m and want to formulate my really rough thoughts from earlier into something coherent for the rest of town because right now it's a hot steaming mess.

[Zack]

I don't think anyone has responded to any of my Monty stuff? other than newcomb referencing it

and people are still giving him credit for ending on ladd when I've pointed out 80 times that he actually tried to unvote but it was at :01 (after seeing several other people suddenly vote ladd)

his posts today are not doing it today for me but I seem to be on an island here

[Sunbae]

Rask: voted ladd. Have one nagging concern in the back of mind. The way monstr responded ?are you trying to make me look bad? before voting. Feels kinda w/w but I also know that's silly. Almost no experience with Rask myself so I don't really know what to look for. I ask myself what it would take for Rask to be wolf and the answer is just self-pressing and not realizing Newcomb was a wagon OR newcomb being a wolf? Maybe even thinking they were lead wagon and were trying to make Ladd look better and then the votes piled on and whoops? It's a stretch. Mostly think the slot is villa. Just kinda crapped on Dolbys entrance with a lmao, just was having no part of Newcombs wagon, etc. Would only evaluate this slot if we get to end game and things seem hard.

[Sunbae]

trust me i get it

i'm already on record saying i've moved past the 'probable' stage for newcomb to be a wolf but the heart still wants d1!benneh to have been right on something that i actually cared about and to read "if newcomb's a wolf prob kill benneh" just hurts since that pelt, i feel, would belong partially to me but i'd be understandably yeeted for not having the balls to commit to it on d1

if newcomb IS a wolf this game you strong players better watch your backs in the future cause i'm never holding back again

Oh wait, you know what. Let me double check something, you might be very right about that

[Zack]

and the chainsaw defense from ladd just rings my alarm bells

it was a weird, weak reason that he kept bringing up to defend him, and he also tried to share me for voting Monty and made a post saying "one of your villa tells is when you defend lhf like Monty"

[Zack]

shade not share

[Sunbae]

I don't think anyone has responded to any of my Monty stuff? other than newcomb referencing it

and people are still giving him credit for ending on ladd when I've pointed out 80 times that he actually tried to unvote but it was at :01 (after seeing several other people suddenly vote ladd)

his posts today are not doing it today for me but I seem to be on an island here

I'm really unsure, sorry. Not like, unsure of you being right more like being unsure about my take on the slot. I know the unvote happened. Just trying to get a general take going on, idk

[EnderWiggin]

I don't think anyone has responded to any of my Monty stuff? other than newcomb referencing it

and people are still giving him credit for ending on ladd when I've pointed out 80 times that he actually tried to unvote but it was at :01 (after seeing several other people suddenly vote ladd)

his posts today are not doing it today for me but I seem to be on an island here

I did respond but I also didn't agree. An unvote doesn't do as much as swapping a vote if he really was w/w

[Sunbae]

forgive me for running out of steam, but the last one is sleep and they just seem like a villager to me while ladd also ended the day voting them and kinda piggybacking off of newcombs suspicion onto sleep to case/wagon them too. Just seems like an obvious villager and I'm sorry if that ends up being wrong

[nebjiamn]

I don't think anyone has responded to any of my Monty stuff? other than newcomb referencing it

and people are still giving him credit for ending on ladd when I've pointed out 80 times that he actually tried to unvote but it was at :01 (after seeing several other people suddenly vote ladd)

his posts today are not doing it today for me but I seem to be on an island here

strangest thing with mont is his clearing of kat/sleep/HK while clamoring for me but i just assumd that comes from inexperience with that playerlist more than anything? I guess it kind of makes sense if he's pre-flipping newcomb w but if thats the case why's he pushing for my lunch?

but aside from that i just kinda think he's a villager? i get he unvoted but uh, eh, idk

[Sunbae]

update: think neb is right about the whole newcomb thing. Don't think the rest of the posting d1 makes sense as w/w, so I think neb is just a villager?

[nebjiamn]

​Vote: Cape90

[nebjiamn]

update: think neb is right about the whole newcomb thing. Don't think the rest of the posting d1 makes sense as w/w, so I think neb is just a villager?

[EnderWiggin]

cuthillius
Raskolnikov
Montmorency

-----Probably none above this line

nebjiamn
Newcomb
Dobby
katze
Sleep
Cape90
hollowkatt

Not ordered, just needed that view.

I'm ignoring the Ladd voters. I don't think there's ever 2 wolves in them, and I don't really think there's one. But if there is one we can catch them later.

Of the bottom set: I'd say I definitely have come around to Newcomb a lot today. Part of it is a bad emotional read on the reaction to Zack, but I am seeing some other stuff.

I would be lying if I said I didn't hold a kernal of hope I was right about NewComb all along but I'm setting that aside for now.

As I said before:
Ben probably not wolf unless with NewC. And there's a sequence that I kinda don't think is with NC (see my catchup) so I think that's just clear.

I'm afraid that Sleep has me pocketed but damn if I don't like their posts a lot. Which filtered down leaves me with:

Dobby
katze
Cape90
hollowkatt

(This looks surprisingly similar to other POEs I'm seeing which feels good.)

Dobby/HK are not paired. (Today case and interactions)
Cape/Katze not paired. (Early sniping from Cape towards Katze)

Still trying to diff pair the rest brain is slowly catching up.

[Sunbae]

So that's my (mostly) in depth thoughts on every player. Tomorrow during the day I'll try to get some good pairs/not-pairs and come up with my final guess. I am eager for any feedback on those thoughts.