What animals are ours to kill, and eat, and skin... etc

[penguinking]

actually, the methods used by kosher butchers are much more humane than normal butchers.

Completely false. Ritual slaughter involves a knife being drawn across the unfortunate animal's throat, and it is bled to death. Which is excruciatingly painful. The animal can survive for minutes in intense pain after it's throat has been slit, and the animal is not stunned.

Of course, other animal slaughtering also uses horrific methods.

[rajpoot]

To speak on the two ways they use to slaughter animals here, we call one of them 'halal', which penguinking has mentioned in the post above. The other is called 'jhatka', where the animal is killed with a single blow, usually involving breaking of the neck.

[Hooahguy]

Completely false. Ritual slaughter involves a knife being drawn across the unfortunate animal's throat, and it is bled to death. Which is excruciatingly painful. The animal can survive for minutes in intense pain after it's throat has been slit, and the animal is not stunned.

Of course, other animal slaughtering also uses horrific methods.

maybe you should do a bit of research into Jewish ritual slaughter before making a comment like that.

same goes for you too, Philipvs Vallindervs Calicvla.

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

maybe you should do a bit of research into Jewish ritual slaughter before making a comment like that.

same goes for you too, Philipvs Vallindervs Calicvla.

I checked just in case, the animal must be concious and the spine must not be severed at the first cut, the two main ways of limiting suffering.

So, I am quite happy to stand by my previous statement. Modern slaughter techniques, properly practiced, are less traumatic and cause less suffering.

Edit: BBC article: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/2977086.stm

The idea that severing the front of the neck immidiately causes the animal to lose conciousness is unsupportable, given that we know you can starve the brain for around four minutes in a human.

[Hooahguy]

I checked just in case, the animal must be concious and the spine must not be severed at the first cut, the two main ways of limiting suffering.

So, I am quite happy to stand by my previous statement. Modern slaughter techniques, properly practiced, are less traumatic and cause less suffering.

Edit: BBC article: http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/2977086.stm

The idea that severing the front of the neck immidiately causes the animal to lose conciousness is unsupportable, given that we know you can starve the brain for around four minutes in a human.

thus is the opinion of the uninformed.

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

thus is the opinion of the uninformed.

If you have an insight to share, then do so.

[Hooahguy]

what the rabbi said in the article was true. Jewish law demands that the butcher use a very charp knife, and make ONE swift cut ona certain part of the neck that immediatly kills the animal. if you want proof, visit your local jewish slaughterhouse. trust me, when i visited a few months ago, its actually pretty interesting.

or read up in the Talmud, which goes into detail about this FOR THE EVERY REASON that the animal feels no pain. G-d knows best, right?

[Philippus Flavius Homovallumus]

what the rabbi said in the article was true. Jewish law demands that the butcher use a very charp knife, and make ONE swift cut ona certain part of the neck that immediatly kills the animal. if you want proof, visit your local jewish slaughterhouse. trust me, when i visited a few months ago, its actually pretty interesting.

or read up in the Talmud, which goes into detail about this FOR THE EVERY REASON that the animal feels no pain. G-d knows best, right?

I don't believe what the Rabbi said, simply because personal experience doesn't bear it out, and because it has been fairly well proved that even if you remove the head the animal/man can remain concious for several minutes. The appearence of unconciousness is usually caused by going into shock.

as to the Talmud, it's just words on the page, wasn't written by God, or any of his prophets (certainly not Leviticus) and is replete with errors and anachronisms.

[Vuk]

May I point something out Cute Wolf? It is impossible to have this discussion the way you want without religion. Religion defines the world as something created and owned by someone else, so we need their permission to use what is theirs. If you do not believe in religion however, and we evolved or just are here, then everyone is his own, and either you believe in breaking the sanctity of somethings life or you don't. Do you get what I am saying?
I am a Christian, and God gave man full stewardship over all the earth, so I believe that it is not only mans right but also his responsibility to manage the earth. (Would a good steward of a house not dust the house? Or a good steward of the field not sow, weed, and reap?) What restrictions God puts on eating those animals is beside the point, as we are their stewards and have the right to kill them, skin them, or whatever else we want that does not violate God's laws.