Dragon Age: Origins gameplay and discussion thread.

[tibilicus]

Is Awakening worth the money?

Also, sounding completely like a fool here, how do I bring the tactics menu up (Xbox 360). I genuinely can't find it anywhere..

[Monk]

Is Awakening worth the money?.

IMO: No, Awakening is not worth it. It's just a dull affair. It doesn't expand the gameplay, fix any of the annoyances from the first game and is very bare bones when it comes to characters. It feels like a step backward imo.

Honestly, you shouldn't get the DLC's. They are trully of bad quality. Even for 7$/€, it's not worth it. Most are only 30 minutes long (the first, then it gets down to 15-20 minutes if you replay them). The Stone Prisonner is the only good one, because Shale is a wonderful character.

Agreed. Other than Stone Prisoner the others never felt like much beyond a very short side-show. I liked Warden's Keep but it sorta just ends, never to be mentioned again.

[johnhughthom]

IMO: No, Awakening is not worth it. It's just a dull affair. It doesn't expand the gameplay, fix any of the annoyances from the first game and is very bare bones when it comes to characters. It feels like a step backward imo.

Bored the life out of me, didn't get around to completing it, probably never will. Playing it felt more like a chore than a game.

[rajpoot]

I was pretty surprised the find out it was actually a real RPG, not a combat orientated shooter with RPG elements like ME and ME2.

Savour this one. DA2 is going to be ME2 style.

Edit:
Awakening's story and characters might've been duller than Origins, and I specially disliked the limited dialogue which could be triggered only at pre-decided times, but in some ways Awakening was a step forward. The over all choices-consequences deal was more complex. There were more than a few quests which interdependent and how you finished one affect the other. Also the result of the many of the choices was apparent by the end game itself, unlike Origins where it was all in the epilogue.

[tibilicus]

Savour this one. DA2 is going to be ME2 style.

At this point I'm thinking that might be a good thing. I feel like I'm doing something wrong in combat as I'm getting my behind handed to me constantly. I just got repeatedly annihilated by an Ogre in the fade. A rage quit did in fact follow.

[Monk]

DAO is a bit notorious for sudden, out of nowhere difficulty spikes. Playing on anything above Normal without using the Tactics menu is almost impossible imho.

[tibilicus]

I still don't really know how the tactics menu works so at the minute I'm saving often. I'm not sure whether to laugh or cry when I open a door and it turns out there's a ridiculously hard NPC or mob behind the door. Also, I'm currently playing a human warrior but from playing as Morrigan and Wynne it feels like the mage is the easiest of the classes to play, is this generally the case? Their combination of healing and hold powers means you can stay out of the fight and just spam the heal spell, or so it seems.

[johnhughthom]

It's pretty much accepted that mages are overpowered, especially if you have two (or even three). My last playthrough I didn't use mages at all and enjoyed it more than my other playthroughs, though Genlock Emissarries were a nightmare without magic.

[seireikhaan]

It's pretty much accepted that mages are overpowered, especially if you have two (or even three). My last playthrough I didn't use mages at all and enjoyed it more than my other playthroughs, though Genlock Emissarries were a nightmare without magic.

Ah, yeah, I can see that. Templars aren't even much help either until you get holy smite, and even then, you pretty much need two templars to totally neutralize them. Arrow of slaying works very well too, but again, that's a high level skill. Plus, to get it, you either need to make a dex-based warrior, which can be problematic, or you can use a rogue, but then you're leaving many good rogue skills by the wayside.

And yes, mages are really strong. Unless you make them a shapeshifter and spend your time in wolf form. Its a bit of an issue that the best way to counter mages is with your own.

[seireikhaan]

In unrelated news, patch 1.04 was released. Apparently most of its bug fixes.

[rajpoot]

I still don't really know how the tactics menu works so at the minute I'm saving often.

I don't have a Xbox so I don't know how much this helps you, but, here's a tactics guide on the Bioware forums.

If you need help just opening the menu, then -

Your tactics are in the character status menu. Hit select and go to the page where you level up your character, when they get a level up. From there press triangle to access your tactics screen.

Interactive Map of Thedas (With places marked which are expected to be in Dragon Age 2.
Good news is they have Par Vollen and Minrauthous both marked in there, along with a bunch of other places. So we might get learn a bit more about the Qunari and actually check out the capital of Tevinter Imperium.
Bad news is that they don't have the Anderfels or Antiva marked.

[Meneldil]

It's pretty much accepted that mages are overpowered, especially if you have two (or even three). My last playthrough I didn't use mages at all and enjoyed it more than my other playthroughs, though Genlock Emissarries were a nightmare without magic.

Heh, oddly, the most overpowered mages are the ones who rarely cast spells. The Arcane Warrior is incredibely badass. I never took the time to really focuse on mine, but I've seen videos of an Arcane Mage soloing pretty much every end game boss on nightmare. Without losing much health everytime.

It goes to show just how poorly the game is balanced. I know it's not a multiplayer game, but it sometimes look like the game wasn't even tested before going gold.

[tibilicus]

http://www.1up.com/do/previewPage?cId=3180562

New preview. So it's basically confirmed now that DA2 will be ME in a fantasy setting. As much as I love the Mass Effect series, I'm struggling to see what was so bad about the combat of DA:O. I also don't understand why Bioware wants to throw away the more tactical approach to combat, surely the answer lies some where in the middle? I think the ME2 combat system worked well due to the fact it was essentially a third person shooter with RPG elements. I think exporting that system to the Dragon Age universe, one which is focused much more on close quarters combat will be a much harder task. If the series moves towards the tactical style of ME I also think that might not be such a good thing. Even on Insanity difficulty in ME2, you rarely had to issue orders telling your squad mates where to go. At most, you would click and tell them to take cover and that was it.

[Monk]

http://www.1up.com/do/previewPage?cId=3180562

New preview. So it's basically confirmed now that DA2 will be ME in a fantasy setting. As much as I love the Mass Effect series, I'm struggling to see what was so bad about the combat of DA:O. I also don't understand why Bioware wants to throw away the more tactical approach to combat, surely the answer lies some where in the middle? I think the ME2 combat system worked well due to the fact it was essentially a third person shooter with RPG elements. I think exporting that system to the Dragon Age universe, one which is focused much more on close quarters combat will be a much harder task. If the series moves towards the tactical style of ME I also think that might not be such a good thing. Even on Insanity difficulty in ME2, you rarely had to issue orders telling your squad mates where to go. At most, you would click and tell them to take cover and that was it.

Even though your heart is breaking - laugh Monk, laugh..

It's like Bioware is trying everything they can to make me not want DA2. I'm a well documented raging fanboy when it comes to the ME series, but that is not what Dragon Age needed... at all. This news of DA2 becoming a "hack and slash" game, forgoing it's tactical routes is about as disappointing as finding out the new X-com game is a FPS. Seriously, what is the point of turning this franchise into Mass Effect with swords?

Did both games not have their place in the current generation? Must we really marginalize the state of gaming further with this homogenization? Is variety not the spice of life? According to Bioware: No, yes and no.

[rajpoot]

Another GI preview.

The updated look for DA2 -

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Before, I think Origins was kind of like Death Dealer meets The Hobbit. It was half really “raah, scary” and half really whimsical. We wanted to take it into more of a desolate feel and kind of strip it down to a hot-rod Samurai look. Not only visually, but in terms of the actual storytelling motifs that appear in those movies. The cautionary tale was really appropriate for DA2.

They are simplifying the game, just as they simplified ME2. As always probably to make it 'accessible' to more types of gamers. I mean I'm sure more shooter fans bought ME2 than ME. This kind of sucks, but since ME2 was fun to play and very engaging despite having no inventory and just one type of armour, I'm sure that DA2, despite not being what we might have wanted it to be, would still be a great game.

[tibilicus]

Another GI preview.

The updated look for DA2 -

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Before, I think Origins was kind of like Death Dealer meets The Hobbit. It was half really “raah, scary” and half really whimsical. We wanted to take it into more of a desolate feel and kind of strip it down to a hot-rod Samurai look. Not only visually, but in terms of the actual storytelling motifs that appear in those movies. The cautionary tale was really appropriate for DA2.

They are simplifying the game, just as they simplified ME2. As always probably to make it 'accessible' to more types of gamers. I mean I'm sure more shooter fans bought ME2 than ME. This kind of sucks, but since ME2 was fun to play and very engaging despite having no inventory and just one type of armour, I'm sure that DA2, despite not being what we might have wanted it to be, would still be a great game.

No doubt it will be great, Bioware have a knack for making quality games. What disappoints me though is that the sequel seems to be loosing its RPG elements by the day. Instead of making a character we can define and sculpt as our own (RPG), we are instead merely deciding the story of Hawke (character driven game). People may disagree but to me that isn't really an RPG. That's just you, the player, deciding the story of a character. The character sculpted isn't really your own kind of like Shepard. You made Shepard's decisions but in the end it was the difference between X and Y, the good or the bad Shepard. Dragon Age seems to have more than this shade of good and bad and more than the X and Y decision. Because of this, in some ways, decisions immerse you more. Mass Effect relied mostly on visuals and amazing cinematic sequences to hit home its decision and role play process, nothing wrong with that as it worked great. But Dragon Age has an equally good decision making process, one which relies less on cinematic and one which in many ways, makes you think a lot more.

I guess I was just hoping the Dragon Age team would try for the second game to refine the formula and produce a true RPG, but one which works better than Dragon Age. Not just take the mechanics from there other games and paste them over Dragon Age 2. Point being that my Dragon Age character feels more like a character influenced by my decisions, Shepard on the other hand does not. I kind of like that attachment in games and have doubts over I can feel an attachment to Hawke like I do my Dragon Age character.

[rajpoot]

No doubt it will be great, Bioware have a knack for making quality games. What disappoints me ...... my Dragon Age character.

I know what you mean....it's kind of bitter sweet...but it's a simplification that's taking place everywhere....in almost every genre. It's a sales thing I guess.

[johnhughthom]

I know what you mean....it's kind of bitter sweet...but it's a simplification that's taking place everywhere....in almost every genre. It's a sales thing I guess.

The killer is that DA:O sold better than ME2, so they simplify DA 2 to make it more Mass Effecty. Umm... wha??

[Monk]

The killer is that DA:O sold better than ME2, so they simplify DA 2 to make it more Mass Effecty. Umm... wha??

If it isn't a sales thing then it becomes vision related. You can already tell something happened in the time between Origins and now that changed the team's priorities in the game they want to make, the story they want to tell. Maybe that thing was as simple as seeing Mass Effect 2, and the phrase "How cool would it be to make a game like that?" was uttered at a business meeting. This of course suffers one problem: not everyone who likes Dragon age liked Mass Effect (and vice versa).

I liked both of them, but even still the sudden change of everything I liked about Origins is a hard pill to swallow. That art style (as featured in the gameinformer link) is especially hideous for Darkspawn, they look completely comical.

[seireikhaan]

I liked both of them, but even still the sudden change of everything I liked about Origins is a hard pill to swallow. That art style (as featured in the gameinformer link) is especially hideous for Darkspawn, they look completely comical.

Same for me. I don't feel quite like judging the game itself yet, since its a ways off and I'm not entirely sure how the pc version will play out. But the art.... bleh. The original DA had excellent art, even if it wasn't the most graphically spectacular game ever. This looks, well, like a comic book.

[rajpoot]

Early gameplay video at GI.

Taking a lot of time to load for me....

[Double A]

It's pretty much accepted that mages are overpowered, especially if you have two (or even three). My last playthrough I didn't use mages at all and enjoyed it more than my other playthroughs, though Genlock Emissarries were a nightmare without magic.

Dude.

Crippling Shot + Hurl.

[johnhughthom]

Dude.

Crippling Shot + Hurl.

You want me to vomit on them?

[tibilicus]

Rumour going round the Bioware social from those who saw an early version of the game at Comic-Con seems to bring the words Ninja Gaiden and "Dynasty Warriors in RPG format" up in many threads. Now make of this what you will but it seems Bioware may be moving into the area of over the top fantasy combat, make of that what you will.

More interestingly, apparently new DLC based on the Deep Roads is in the works and one of the Bioware staffers at Comic-Con stated that Bioware would like to continue DLC for Origins, even after Dragon Age 2 is out. Whilst of course none of this is concrete, it's generating a lot of discussion and suggests to me at at least that the role of origins, as opposed to what Mass Effect was to Mass Effect 2, will have less impact on Dragon Age 2 and the world of Dragon Age II itself. Perhaps it's Bioware's aim to make the Dragon Age series a more tighter narrative, one which has a much more concrete story and more "canonicity". If this is the case, it will probably dramatically alter the way the series plays out.

EDIT:

http://gameinformer.com/b/news/archi...i-evolved.aspx

All I can say is, are the Dragon Age team beginning to lose their minds? I've never had any reason to lose faith in Bioware before but I just have to ask why? Sure, the Qunari, or Sten at least looked too humanoid, but why did they have to be re-branded as some semi-daemons. This and the new art style fuels my worries that Dragon Age 2 will be some Comic style mess. I hope Bioware convince me otherwise.

Apparently they're also changing the way Elves and Dwarves look. I don't understand why they can't just fix Origins' flaws and build on what they already have. It sounds like DA II is going to cause a major continuity crisis for a lot of people.

[Beskar]

That tactics menu is really easy. Even if you are sure what to do, all you do is like "Alistair -> Defender -> Aggressive", "Morrigan -> Damage -> Ranged", etc.

Not sure why so many people had problems with it.

[Monk]

EDIT:

http://gameinformer.com/b/news/archi...i-evolved.aspx

All I can say is, are the Dragon Age team beginning to lose their minds? I've never had any reason to lose faith in Bioware before but I just have to ask why? Sure, the Qunari, or Sten at least looked too humanoid, but why did they have to be re-branded as some semi-daemons. This and the new art style fuels my worries that Dragon Age 2 will be some Comic style mess. I hope Bioware convince me otherwise.

Apparently they're also changing the way Elves and Dwarves look. I don't understand why they can't just fix Origins' flaws and build on what they already have. It sounds like DA II is going to cause a major continuity crisis for a lot of people.

And thus the Dragon Age team ruins the original game. Taken from your link -

The change in qunari appearances have practical roots as well. “Art wanted to create more space between the races so we changed the way the qunari looked,” says senior artist Matt Goldman. “We have also changed the way elves and dwarves look for that matter, but qunari seem the most dramatic because you only ever saw Sten in Dragon Age: Origins.”

This is not how you tell a story or establish a setting, Bioware. You cannot - CAN NOT - change things so radically without completely destroying the setting's sense of identity. It kills continuity, confuses fans and serves to disconnect the player from the experience. It's not an excuse to completely redesign the people of your universe because "Our artists were bored". I'm glad you have original IPs now, but good god you have to have respect for them. Changing things so broadly demonstrates lack of respect for the IP you've created, and if you don't care then why should I?

edit: Also the above is not true. We saw more Qunari than simply Sten, the problem was the DA team was lazy and used Sten's model for all the Qunari we encountered, this painted the picture of a race who had a very established appearance even if it was not the desired intent.

[seireikhaan]

And thus the Dragon Age team ruins the original game. Taken from your link -



This is not how you tell a story or establish a setting, Bioware. You cannot - CAN NOT - change things so radically without completely destroying the setting's sense of identity. It kills continuity, confuses fans and serves to disconnect the player from the experience. It's not an excuse to completely redesign the people of your universe because "Our artists were bored". I'm glad you have original IPs now, but good god you have to have respect for them. Changing things so broadly demonstrates lack of respect for the IP you've created, and if you don't care then why should I?

edit: Also the above is not true. We saw more Qunari than simply Sten, the problem was the DA team was lazy and used Sten's model for all the Qunari we encountered, this painted the picture of a race who had a very established appearance even if it was not the desired intent.

I disagree. It does not affect my view of the original game. That's like saying that Star wars ep. 1 through 3 ruined 4 through 6. Bioware's pulling a Lucas on us, sadly. DA 2 is heading rapidly from the "wait and see" category where I might have bought it fairly early if I heard good news to the "hope one of my roommates gets it to see how the game is" category. Otherwise I'm hands off.

[Monk]

I disagree. It does not affect my view of the original game. That's like saying that Star wars ep. 1 through 3 ruined 4 through 6. Bioware's pulling a Lucas on us, sadly. DA 2 is heading rapidly from the "wait and see" category where I might have bought it fairly early if I heard good news to the "hope one of my roommates gets it to see how the game is" category. Otherwise I'm hands off.

We're not gonna see eye to eye on this, i fear! I understand the concept of denying continuity, in the same way Highlander 2 never happened I can claim the same for DA2. But I'm of the opinion that doing this to the IP devalues the source material and the overall universe Bioware had sought to create. While the fun of the original will be intact, what made it special will not be.

However, I will fully agree that this is fast becoming a game I want no part of.

[rajpoot]

DLC about the deep roads confirmed.
Golems of Amgarrak.

And yay! The Warden is returning once more!!

Trailer for DLC on MMORPG.com

Edit :
While the redesigned Qunari seem...well...weird.....But it will now kind of make sense why Ogres have horns while other Darkspawn do not.

As far as breaking the continuity is concerned I don't think it'll matter much because I sincerely doubt that there will be any major continuity at all....Aside from the major decisions like who's the king/queen, I doubt that anything else will have much effect.

[Vladimir]

"some are born without horns"

I wonder how many of their women die during childbirth.