The fight for Inishmore [Concluded]

[Sasaki Kojiro]

Thanks for not lynching me. Boo to those of you who nearly did. It would have been just as much a waste for town as lynching Ares was.

So your defense is "well, I'm innocent, thanks"?

[Ituralde]

So Ares really did make up those arguments, interesting. Also I would have preferred a double lynch just to be sure. And whether you believe me or not I was actually expecting the vote to be over by the time I logged on this morning and wanted to use the time I had to catch up with the discussion.

We're already down to Night 4, I hope the town gets some support from the detective come the next Day phase, he should have found something to work with. ATPGs idea to get the information to us might actually work, though it is wide open to abuse.

[LittleGrizzly]

Boudica i don't know if your in a position to criticise those who voted for you.... voting atpg has got to be the one of the easiest votes to make... not that it makes you scum but mafia sometimes like going for the easy cases... like atpg...

All this being said watch this turn out to be the game ATPG is scum... better lynch him otherwise i may look stupid... ;)

[Thermal]

I don't mind you choosing to lynch me, just don't keep telling people what to do when your not always right :whip:

edit: actually your not controlling your just heavily influencing, I apologize :bow: :laugh4:

[Thermal]

Thanks for not lynching me. Boo to those of you who nearly did. It would have been just as much a waste for town as lynching Ares was.

As a 'townie' you really shouldn't need to tell us that... (yes I used ellipses DEAL with it :balloon2: )

[Reenk Roink]

edit: actually your not controlling your just heavily influencing, I apologize :bow: :laugh4:

:laugh4:

I tried to save you Ares, you will be avenged.

Dear Mafia, contact me and we can like work together for a bit killing off people who don't share my point of view. I promise not to betray you until the end. :bow:

[Askthepizzaguy]

To make it easier on me, I'm responding to each in one post, and giving you all cute but inappropriate nicknames, like George W. Bush does.



Itsy Bitsy Spider-

So Ares really did make up those arguments, interesting. Also I would have preferred a double lynch just to be sure. And whether you believe me or not I was actually expecting the vote to be over by the time I logged on this morning and wanted to use the time I had to catch up with the discussion.

We're already down to Night 4, I hope the town gets some support from the detective come the next Day phase, he should have found something to work with. ATPGs idea to get the information to us might actually work, though it is wide open to abuse.Anyone who claims to be an investigator can have their so-called facts checked. We lynch the person they investigate, and if they don't have a role.... you have a liar on your hands. :mellow:

Papa Bear-

Boudica i don't know if your in a position to criticise those who voted for you.... voting atpg has got to be the one of the easiest votes to make... not that it makes you scum but mafia sometimes like going for the easy cases... like atpg...

All this being said watch this turn out to be the game ATPG is scum... better lynch him otherwise i may look stupid... ;)Thanks for the vote of confidence Papa Bear, seems I will never make it all the way through a game, and I don't care to do so. I love being dead. I already basically committed suicide twice this game, on the first round and again this last one, and I offer myself a third time later on if I fail to catch any scum. It would be easier for me to assist you guys if I didn't have to respond to calls for my lynch. Either decide to do so or wait a bit. I am honoured you still think I could be mafia after my behavior so far this game. I consider it a high compliment, but even I am not so willing to stick my neck out. Your benefit of the doubt warms my rotting zombie heart.

God Boy-

I don't mind you choosing to lynch me, just don't keep telling people what to do when your not always right :whip:

edit: actually your not controlling your just heavily influencing, I apologize :bow: :laugh4:I didn't tell anyone to do anything! I asked people to spare boudica for a round, because you were acting more strangely to me than she was. Turns out you were being your usual 777Ares777 self. Now I made myself and boudica look guilty, which is the price I pay for being wrong about you. I don't believe it would have been a responsible townie move to let the round end in a tie. Runoff and delay of game because no one had the Balzac to pick between the two of you? Double lynch? The game had to progress and I was the only one willing to make it happen.

Roinktastic Bus-

:laugh4:

I tried to save you Ares, you will be avenged.

Dear Mafia, contact me and we can like work together for a bit killing off people who don't share my point of view. I promise not to betray you until the end. :bow:How deliciously devious. I'd like the mafia to contact me too. But not just because I stole the idea from Reenk. I'd like to re-reveal to everyone in the game that I am the Irish Godfather, just as I said. The English mafia cannot afford to take a gamble, can they? Pick me! Pick me!

[LittleGrizzly]

Thanks for the vote of confidence Papa Bear, seems I will never make it all the way through a game, and I don't care to do so. I love being dead. I already basically committed suicide twice this game, on the first round and again this last one, and I offer myself a third time later on if I fail to catch any scum. It would be easier for me to assist you guys if I didn't have to respond to calls for my lynch. Either decide to do so or wait a bit. I am honoured you still think I could be mafia after my behavior so far this game. I consider it a high compliment, but even I am not so willing to stick my neck out. Your benefit of the doubt warms my rotting zombie heart.

The last line was a joke... i meant what i said about boudica choosing you as an easy vote/lynch...

[Askthepizzaguy]

I know it was. :bow: There hasn't been an easier lynch all game.

[Seamus Fermanagh]

:laugh4:

I tried to save you Ares, you will be avenged.

Dear Mafia, contact me and we can like work together for a bit killing off people who don't share my point of view. I promise not to betray you until the end. :bow:

Scarily enough, I think they might consider it AND I believe you would honor such a promise.

Reenk, you are abso-********-lutely awesome.

[boudica]

So your defense is "well, I'm innocent, thanks"?

Defense? Defending oneself in a close lynch vote that one didn't even read up on properly til after the event: I think you'll find is impossible.

I already said I was a fine choice of lynch given my lack of participation, but a bad one given my innocence. I stick by that - and kind of don't really mind - As a relative newcomer to mafia, I was reticent about joining a third game after discovering not so long ago that 2 was my limit - and now I have more RL work on than I thought I would have to boot.

My only shame in being lynched tomorrow would be that I have already served town poorly.

- Also, a bit about my vote for Askthepizzaguy and how I was admonished by Little Grizzley for it. All I can say is that I can only play the posts in the thread in front of me, and though I try not to cross-game - you even 'jokingly' said yourself that this would be the one time that super-keen super-town pizza guy would turn out to be mafia. Now you said you were joking when ATPG thanked you for it, but you still said it and the fact that you (assuming you are a townie) don't want to be caught out, coupled with the fact that we know ATPG will keep on investigating even when he is rotting in the ground IS the reason that ATPG keeps getting lynched. :yes:

So far I've voted for a zombie detective without a badge and before that - a 'God-like master' who displays the very scummy qualities that he himself claims in this very thread :laugh4:
If that makes me guilty - go ahead and lynch me :smash:

[LittleGrizzly]

It was just a criticism of your choice of an easy lynch, doesn't nessecarily make you guilty....

What i meant was the joke was the lynch him now part... otherwise i would have voted for him with you..

I am slightly worried that i could campaign for ATPG to stay alive and then it turns out he's mafia... would be twisted, but i don't expect it...

anything else...

ohh yeah Vote Boudica ~;)

[Sasaki Kojiro]

Defense? Defending oneself in a close lynch vote that one didn't even read up on properly til after the event: I think you'll find is impossible.


I meant towards the reasons people voted you earlier...the fact that the vote got to the point where it was tied is a point in your favor though. I think looking back on this round some time from now will give a better view of your guilt/innocence.

[Thermal]

Scarily enough, I think they might consider it AND I believe you would honor such a promise.

Reenk, you are abso-********-lutely awesome.

what curse would fit into that gap thats 8 letters long? I'll go with 7 :wink:


Reenk, you are abso-*******-lutely blingin! :party:

[Seamus Fermanagh]

what curse would fit into that gap thats 8 letters long? I'll go with 7 :wink:

I meant "freaking," but was worried that it might be too harsh for present company. ~;)

[pevergreen]

greyblades, for your post (#716) consider this a warning...no screenshots.

Thank you. :bow:

[Greyblades]

Well just quoteing it would have probably gotten me accused of faking a PM. But if that is your rules then im fine with it.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Now you said you were joking when ATPG thanked you for it, but you still said it and the fact that you (assuming you are a townie) don't want to be caught out, coupled with the fact that we know ATPG will keep on investigating even when he is rotting in the ground IS the reason that ATPG keeps getting lynched. :yes:

Yakety Yak, in spoilers.
First of all, boudica's defense satisfies me. (Imagine that! No one saw that coming) I did indeed invite votes on myself, and you really can't criticize someone who does vote for me after I do that. My only criticism with her was that she didn't seem to be paying attention to the facts. On reflection; that doesn't indicate to me that she has a role. If she had a valuable role, for example, she would want to be very careful who she chooses to have night actions performed on.
(...I could make a joke here, but I'll abstain, courteously. :bow:)

I'm fine with the lynch Askthepizzaguy early policy at present, however I would like to suggest that it's not wise to do so every game. If I end up with a good role, you could be hurting the town, and it could end up being less fun. Imagine if I did get saddled with a godfather role, for example. Your game would be over on round one, and then... no real reason to assemble 30 people just to slaughter me. It would be amusing in retrospect but also less fun. To me, if I ever got such a role, I'd be squirming the whole game because I'd know I was doomed.

We should mix it up. I've noticed boudica, for example, getting stomped pretty quick by the lynch due to her recent streak of mafia roles, and others like CountArach or Tratorix or Ignoramus getting murdered but not lynched due to previous games where they were less talkative post-death. Just so that everyone gets a fair shake, I think that we should take note of settling into predictable patterns. I'd like to see players like those mentioned survive longer into a game, and have a shot at maybe winning such a game as mafia. You'll also notice right away when some of these players don't get murdered, and probably lynch them for the unusual nature of their survival, and at that point; the players could be asking themselves "when will I get a break?"

Lynching the lurkers every game, shouldn't happen. It should happen enough times to discourage lurking, and to encourage discussion, in my opinion; you may disagree. Lurking is a valid strategy and lurkers will never be talkers. And if we make the lurkers scapegoats every game, they may not want to play anymore. At some point, I'll be changing my methods as well and will hope to survive at least to the mid-game on occasion. For now, I think it is a good tactic in games with lots of pro-town roles to have a volunteer to die, and for the present moment, that would be me. Others may volunteer in the future.

[A Very Super Market]

If the godfather DID get lynched round one on a large game like this, we would be permitted to restart, right?

[LittleGrizzly]

If he did theres another one left to kill...

BTW ATPG's talking to much... lynch him

[Askthepizzaguy]

@AVSM-

Up to the host

@Papa Bear-

:laugh4: Make up your mind!!!

[Sasaki Kojiro]

To me, if I ever got such a role, I'd be squirming the whole game because I'd know I was doomed.

So, never offer yourself up for lynch.

[Seamus Fermanagh]

Well just quoteing it would have probably gotten me accused of faking a PM. But if that is your rules then im fine with it.

Grey: That's exactly the point. If screenshots are allowed then the ONLY thing that will be accepted is screenshots and any who won't provide them must be guilty. Game over, boring. So, in the interests of play.....

...Even though it creates situations where two mafiosoi can claim they're BOTH detective and the real detective must be fake and actually get him LYNCHED with their fake PMs :beadyeyes2: ...

... the no screenies rule is an important one.

[Reenk Roink]

Grey: That's exactly the point. If screenshots are allowed then the ONLY thing that will be accepted is screenshots and any who won't provide them must be guilty. Game over, boring. So, in the interests of play.....

...Even though it creates situations where two mafiosoi can claim they're BOTH detective and the real detective must be fake and actually get him LYNCHED with their fake PMs :beadyeyes2: ...

... the no screenies rule is an important one.

Even I use it in my game and you all know how permissive I am. :laugh4:

Also, The Wanax is the friend of the Bible killer once again... The Bible killer does not know this yet...

[Diana Abnoba]

Got caught up on thread, will be back tomorrow on day phase to vote before going to work IRL.

[pevergreen]

It was a warm night and murder was at large. YLC didn't care for it as he stepped outside to take a leak. Too much Guinness - it would be the end of him. The silver of blades flickered in the darkness and YLC lay there in a pool of piss and blood.
Happy with himself Mike Fingers leaned down to tie a knot in his shoelace. Humming a tune he tucks away his knives and strolls off. Not noticing the cat - watching him - apparently intent on cleaning her fur.

Blackadder went in to the Mcdoogals bar and ordered a pint. This time the guy serving the drinks was Brendan. You knew here? Said Blackadder. Youre not the usual barkeep. Brendan said no, I had to kill him because he wont fight for ireland. Blackadder said what??? Brendan said Its too bad, he was a good lad. Now, will you fight for ireland or do I have to kill you to? Blackadder jumped over the bar and said those are fightin words. But Brendan stabbed him in the neck and the fight was over. Blackadder bled in to the handkerchief in his pocket and Brendan left a card stuck in the hole in his neck that said Two Blind Mice.

In the back room of Mcdoogals, a man said to pevergreen, "He's made me an offer I can't refuse."
pevergreen nodded with a hint of a smile in his eyes.

Alive:
Andres
Askthepizzaguy
shlin28
LittleGrizzly
Reenk Roink
GeneralHankerchief
Sasaki Kojiro
Lord Winter
White Eyes
Seamus
Factionheir
serierkhaan
yoyoma1910
Diana Abnoba
boudica
Sigurd
greyblades
Ituralde
El Diablo

Dead:
Publius Aelius Hadrianus
A Very Super Market
Jolt
taka
Polemists
gaelic cowboy
Alexander the Pretty Good
CountArach
Psychonaut
YLC
Captain Blackadder

Lynched:
Beefy187
F.C is the bees knees
777ares777

It is now Day 5.

[Andres]

Vote : Abstain

Apparently, I have to read about 10 "new" pages :sweatdrop:

[Askthepizzaguy]

~:wave: Hello Reenk Roink! Just a few questions and comments.


Also, The Wanax is the friend of the Bible killer once again... The Bible killer does not know this yet...
What's this mean, Reenk? You're the Wanax, apparently. Who is the Bible killer?


Dear Mafia, contact me and we can like work together for a bit killing off people who don't share my point of view. I promise not to betray you until the end
Yeah, that's not suspicious.


It was a warm night and murder was at large. YLC didn't care for it as he stepped outside to take a leak. Too much Guinness - it would be the end of him. The silver of blades flickered in the darkness and YLC lay there in a pool of piss and blood.
Happy with himself Mike Fingers leaned down to tie a knot in his shoelace. Humming a tune he tucks away his knives and strolls off. Not noticing the cat - watching him - apparently intent on cleaning her fur.A new murderer? How interesting. And the implication is obviously that it's Greyblades who did the kill, though I cannot fathom Greyblades intentionally incriminating himself.


In the back room of Mcdoogals, a man said to pevergreen, "He's made me an offer I can't refuse." pevergreen nodded with a hint of a smile in his eyes.So, the mafia are recruiting now, are they?


Also boudica may be acting strange but she has been very busy and also she may prove of much use to me, do not move to lynch her or you may die. Thanks.I don't quite follow this, even in retrospect. You keep accusing others of foul play, but you're clearly up to no good.

That is all. Thank you for listening to my fascist questions. Have a pint for the trouble. :medievalcheers:


Edit: More...

Bible killer eh.... what game were you in with someone that sounds like a hankerchief...


The Conclusion


Generalhankerchief invited TevashSzat outside for a victory celebration dinner which he offered to cook. They would drink wine and eat chicken and lamb and pork (as there was no more beefyz) and would tell stories of their glorious victory.

(SNIP)

Tevash: "You're no mere computer engineer..."

GeneralHankerchief: "And you're not just the mastermind of our heist. You wanted the gold to yourself all along."

Tevash: "At last we understand each other!!! Die, comrade!"

(SNIP)

The General prepared the killing blow but Tevash ducked into woad's cabin, and flung the Bible at the General in retaliation. He only had a few bullets left, and wanted to make sure they counted. The General ran down the hall, and whipped the assassin's sword back in Tevash's direction, just as Tevash turned the corner and fired a spray of bullets.

GeneralHankerchief's face was torn to shreds, and he died instantly. Tevash laughed and laughed as he watched his final opponent die. When he looked down, he saw the sword embedded in his stomach... and the blood pouring onto the deck. He felt surprisingly little pain, and dropped to his knees.

"Why???" Tevash moaned.

Within minutes, he was dead as well. He lost consciousness and passed out, face down on the Bible.

GeneralHankerchief and Reenk Roink, both players in the Golden Rule (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=110184) game, GH with a murder involving a Bible, Reenk looking to be recruited in this game, Reenk referring to himself as the Wanax, and a new murderer in the latest writeup... plus a reference to handkerchiefs in the second writeup. Plus the wonderful segment about making an offer you can't refuse.
Coincidences, all, I am sure.

[FactionHeir]

Hmmm looks like a new England killer?

[Askthepizzaguy]

I doubt that Oswald got WOG'ed, and there was never any writeup with his death, so probably an additional killer for England, or just as likely... a third mafia family has formed.

Pizza no like. Bad medicine.

[Ituralde]

Scary new avatar you have there ATPG. Of course a detective can also help by providing news about the innocence of people, although he might only be trusted after his credibility is proven by a righteous lynch of a guilty candidate.

Either way I think it is time to take a closer look at some of the lurkers again.

Vote: serierkhaan

Haven't seen anything but colourful messages throughout the game. Of course Sigurd has also been lurking, but right now he's more a candidate for WoG than for lurking mafia.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Thanks! I'd been looking for a zombie-esque url avatar for a while, didn't see one until this morning. Keep tabs on my accusation of Reenk; I'd like answers from him this round.

vote: Reenk Roink

Just pressure for now.

[Reenk Roink]

Do you not learn from your mistakes Atpg? :rolleyes: What an awful case, is this what Midas holds for us? :laugh4:

I'm trying to send secret messages to people without breaking pevergreen's rules. Only you would think I would leave clues as Mafia. I'm not like you in Prometheus Atpg, I wouldn't hurt my team like that just to keep a "super townie" persona. :wink:

Now then, I demand everyone in this game put me and Seamus (except pevergreen of course :bow:) on ignore so we can communicate privately in the thread while keeping within the parameters of the rules.

Also vote: Askthepizzaguy

It's best you not be able to vote as you are proving dangerous to the towns cause. :yes:

Bible Killer - hearts change and methods change

[LittleGrizzly]

Is this cat some kind of detective... can he get us results somehow...

ohh a lurker and the usual atpg and reenk lynches...

Im gonna Vote Abstain for the moment not sure who to suspect....

[Sasaki Kojiro]

Vote:LittleGrizzly

He's seemed off to me this game. Usually I have a feeling that he's innocent by this point, don't this game. Good choice for grunt as well. I'll try and see if I can find some more specific examples of what's tweaking my gut, aside from that "so was padraic the IRA boss?" post.

[GeneralHankerchief]

Time to call up the bandwagon...

Vote: Ituralde

All aboard! Come on and join the party! https://img258.imageshack.us/img258/5050/emotbandwagonqr2.gif

Don't question me, just do it.

[Ituralde]

Yeah, listen to GH! He sounds like he has a plan!

Unvote: sireikhaan

Vote: Ituralde

[Greyblades]

It was a warm night and murder was at large. YLC didn't care for it as he stepped outside to take a leak. Too much Guinness - it would be the end of him. The silver of blades flickered in the darkness and YLC lay there in a pool of piss and blood.
Happy with himself Mike Fingers leaned down to tie a knot in his shoelace. Humming a tune he tucks away his knives and strolls off. Not noticing the cat - watching him - apparently intent on cleaning her fur.
A new murderer? How interesting. And the implication is obviously that it's Greyblades who did the kill, though I cannot fathom Greyblades intentionally incriminating himself.

Silvery blades sorta goes against the point of my forum name


Also vote: Askthepizzaguy

It's best you not be able to vote as you are proving dangerous to the towns cause. :yes:

Bible Killer - hearts change and methods change

The days just started and you're allready revenge voting? Hmm...

[GeneralHankerchief]

Yeah, listen to GH! He sounds like he has a plan!

Unvote: sireikhaan

Vote: Ituralde

You seem to be overreacting.

[boudica]

I'll jump on a Little Grizzley bandwagon. Aside from going along with Sasaki's gut instinct and while I know a joke is a joke, attempting to put the cat into the frame of suspects smells a little bit fishy. :laugh4:

vote: Little Grizzley

[Ituralde]

You seem to be overreacting.

Your cunning arguments were just soo convincing!

[ULC]

Such a wonderful day today - :brood:

I wake up with a sinus infection,
I'm still waiting on my apartment,
The game I like to play seems to be going downhill,
Nothing has happened in LotR,
I have a full hour+ to kill,
And I am dead in this game for God knows what,

I am very, very angry, irritated, and sick, and the mafia pick this day to kill me - nice. :brood:

Now, knowing some people know me as a very bitter townie sometimes - if I am lynched. :brood:

I lost my vote, but I can still cast suspicion - FoS: White Eyes

[seireikhaan]

VOTE: SASAKI

[ULC]

VOTE: SASAKI

Wow, such a mind blowing accusation - you willing to be questioned Khaan, or is this you being a :daisy:, and wasting your vote needlessly. You never contribute, you never help, and as far as I am concerned, you and White Eyes need to be lynched.

[Greyblades]

Wow thats pretty bitter... but he has a point Vote: Seireikhaan

[Seamus Fermanagh]

GH:

You're lynch suggestions both here and in Settler have been pretty....straightforward. Are you SURE this is the way to go?


Sasaki:

I agree with you that Griz' does seem a bit "off." No missing votes, no outrageous vote choices (abstain, alex, boudica, abstain), but he's not sticking his neck out at all with the votes and his posts are a notch less focused then usual.

YLC/Grey':

Why 'khaan? He's voting all Sasaki this time and without any supporting argument, but that's almost like abstaining unless someone else is putting pressure on Sasaki. Good or evil, Sasaki won't even bother answering such a thing. Yet khaan has been around long enought to know that voting unsupported with evidence can get the focus on you.....

'khaan: what say you?

[ULC]

Why 'khaan? He's voting all Sasaki this time and without any supporting argument, but that's almost like abstaining unless someone else is putting pressure on Sasaki. Good or evil, Sasaki won't even bother answering such a thing. Yet khaan has been around long enough to know that voting unsupported with evidence can get the focus on you.....

'khaan: what say you?

Bolded key points for further clarification.

Literally the above makes him an excellent choice this round.

[Greyblades]

If I remember correctly, from the games I have read that had him as a player, khaan was pretty active especially when he had atpg openly suspecting him.

[LittleGrizzly]

his posts are a notch less focused then usual.

Ill be honest with my watcher role in the settlement i was more focused on that game... partially just because i had a role but partially also because i had contacts i was talking to and information being shared... and as an informed power town role it is my solemn duty to lead the town to success!!

Here im a basic townie... the will is still there! but the flesh is weak and unwilling... in other words theres not much i can do... i don't really like contacting other players as paranoia takes over me... so im just trying to pull together what we have in the thread... which is far from my strong point!

He's seemed off to me this game. Usually I have a feeling that he's innocent by this point, don't this game.

seeming off and gut instinct... i dont suppose you flicked a coin as well... "heads, we lynch grizzly"

Good choice for grunt as well.

If we are going to kill people for thier mafia skill im sure theres one or two players who we should lynch first.. like... hmm... you!

aside from that "so was padraic the IRA boss?" post.

This is twice you have accused me of making posts i didn't even make!

Or at least im fairly sure i didn't make that post... but i definetly didnt make the one where you said i was either mafia dropping hints or picking up on hints.. something about AVSM i think...

I'll try and see if I can find some more specific examples of what's tweaking my gut

Please do! with links to the relevant posts so we can be sure its something i said!

attempting to put the cat into the frame of suspects smells a little bit fishy.

Putting the cat in the frame of the suspects...?

this is what i said Is this cat some kind of detective... can he get us results somehow...

Usually detectives being good guys... i was asking if he is a good guy and if he can help us...

I agree with you that Griz' does seem a bit "off."

Is this from advice from your horoscope or did you do a tarot card reading ?

No missing votes

I don't miss many... occasionally some on the weekend... but i have made a vote every round here like i have in the settlement since this game started...

no outrageous vote choices

Apart from my errm... niave pursual of Jolt are my vote choices usually that outrageous ... ?

Im usually voting with at least a few other people.. my vote on atpgood was the only one (though pizza voted him and unvoted..) so surely if im the only person voting for someone that is perhaps more outrageous than my usual voting ?

Boudica's post...

Little Grizzley

Little Grizzley

Ok you want outrageous voting you can get outraegous voting!

Vote Boudica purely for spelling my name wrong... constantly... when she spells my name properly i shall switch my vote to sasaki as a pure revenge vote for voting for me...

and well maybe not just a revenge vote... i often wonder when i am an innocent and a player as skilled at this game as sasaki is makes a case against me... if they are simply mafia directing my lynch as an easy one.. rather than making a rare mistake...

no outrageous vote choices (abstain, alex, boudica, abstain),

I would like to make another point on this...

There were far easier lynches on those first two days i could have joined in with.... an ATPG or Reenk bandwagon would have been a simple fist round vote for me to make... but because im town i fought against these pointless lynches and did stick my neck out by refusing to vote for either and abstaining instead...the ATPGood lynch was my own original thought which i figured would be a better idea than some of the other dismal choices other people suggested....

Again that was sticking my neck out.. far easier to just follow someone else's reasoning than to come up with your own which may be bad...

Anyone else think possibly 'khaan could be hinting at us... ?

Edit: My last abstain vote was more of a placeholder.. i had a few minutes to quickly make the post in uni before i left... not really enough time to form an opinion vote someone and put reasons behind it..

Unless of course there was some nice easy grizzly bandwagon for me to jump on...

[GeneralHankerchief]

Vote Ituralde.

[boudica]

Boudica's post...

Little Grizzley

Little Grizzley

Ok you want outrageous voting you can get outraegous voting!

Vote Boudica purely for spelling my name wrong... constantly... when she spells my name properly i shall switch my vote to sasaki as a pure revenge vote for voting for me...

and well maybe not just a revenge vote... i often wonder when i am an innocent and a player as skilled at this game as sasaki is makes a case against me... if they are simply mafia directing my lynch as an easy one.. rather than making a rare mistake...


:laugh4::laugh4::laugh4:

fair enough - and it shows how much attention I've been paying. Let's leave Inspector Wee Thomas out of this.

and as to your claim about voting, let's see if this throws Wee Thomas amongst the pigeons...

unvote: Vote: Sasaki

[Sasaki Kojiro]

https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=2180165&postcount=329

That's the one I was referring to. With regards to some speculation that the IRA were trying to pretend that one of their guys had died, so that we would think there were only two of them (two blind mice instead of three). It's not important though, I'm basing my vote from the feeling that your posting is off. The same accusation I made of Andres day 2 last game...

The latest post doesn't seem like you either. This isn't a thing where I make accusations and you defend yourself though, this is the thing where I say I think your style is off and if other people agree then they vote you.



Anyone else think possibly 'khaan could be hinting at us... ?

Tell me more about what you think of khaan's posts.

[boudica]

(LittleGrizzly, LittleGrizzly, LittleGrizzly - there is that all better now? :2thumbsup:)

[LittleGrizzly]

(LittleGrizzly, LittleGrizzly, LittleGrizzly - there is that all better now? :2thumbsup:)

Music to my ears!

or correctly arranged letters to my eyes...

Unvote Boudica

https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpo...&postcount=329 (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpo...&postcount=329)

This is the part of the post Sasaki is referring to...

Padriac named character ? assuming he is IRA... sound about right ?

please explain to me the thought process that took from what i said here...

to... "so was padraic the IRA boss?"


The first part of the post was asking if Padriac is a named charater or just someones username... i was too lazy to check and i thought i better make it a question rather than say something stupid...

The second part im guessing from his name he was an ira charater... given that the name is not english sounding in the slightest and a little bit irish sounding... it was/is probably a correct assumption... though thinking on it now he culd be some other role... it didn't occur to me at the time though...

Where is the part where i call him the ira boss... i can't even see how you could even call that me hinting at him being the boss of ira... there is absolutely nothing in that post that hints towards him being a boss...

This isn't a thing where I make accusations and you defend yourself though, this is the thing where I say I think your style is off and if other people agree then they vote you.

At least base your suspicions on posts i have made!

And an accurate interpratation of those posts as well!

There are points that have been made that i can answer... the gut and bad feelings are just something i can make little remarks like coin flicking or horoscopes about...

TBH the fact you are making such a weak case is making me less suspicious of you... im sure mafia sasaki would have a blindingly brilliant case to follow rather than one with more holes than swiss cheese...

on the other hand i don't really have anything else to go on...

Vote Sasaki

[GeneralHankerchief]

on the other hand i don't really have anything else to go on...

You could always follow my lead.

[LittleGrizzly]

You could always follow my lead.

and make a unbolded vote for someone without explanation ?

Though in fairness you didn't lead us wrong in the settlement... its just a lot easier to follow your lead when indirectly i gave you the lead in the first place... smething to consider i suppose...

[FactionHeir]

Sometimes I wonder whether GH is mafia and just leading us on because he can :grin:

me, I'm still not certain of boudica's innocence, so vote: boudica

[FactionHeir]

I doubt that Oswald got WOG'ed, and there was never any writeup with his death, so probably an additional killer for England, or just as likely... a third mafia family has formed.

Pizza no like. Bad medicine.

Considering pever wanted us to ignore someone's role post, maybe he redistributed?

[Askthepizzaguy]

Considering pever wanted us to ignore someone's role post, maybe he redistributed?Fair enough.

Ok, I've reconsidered. Call me naive... but I'm going to listen to seireikhaan. He seems to have a role which negates the possibility of talking to us....

rechecking.

unvote: Reenk
vote: Sasaki

I don't think anyone if following my lead on Reenk anyway. I give up.


edit: seireikhaan hasn't spoken all game. Someone needs to protect him tonight. If Sasaki is innocent, I suggest we go after seireikhaan tomorrow.

[Greyblades]

So... is Khaan usually so quiet?

[Askthepizzaguy]

Greyblades:

No. He either has a role which negates speaking except to vote, or he's trying to make us think so. As such, we give him the benefit of the doubt for one round, and if he fails to nail the mafia, he must die. That's my theory anyway. Unfortunately unless Seireikhaan speaks, he can't even confirm or deny it.

If I am wrong, he could always unvote: sasaki. That would be a clear message.

[Ituralde]

Well, I see the chance for a tie coming up and lynching myself just doesn't sound like fun to me.

Unvote: Ituralde

Vote: sireikhaan

Back to the lurker it is.

[Askthepizzaguy]

I really, really think you're mafia, Ituralde. You aren't even listening, are you? This self-vote stuff was just a bluff, and you're trying to lynch someone who may be a mute detective. GH keeps suggesting you're guilty. From that I have to assume that he may have gotten a guilty result on you. And how about showing up right before the lynch but doing nothing to affect the total? Just in time for night phase?

Your explanations, votes, and behavior, plus the fingers of suspicion on you coming from people who are asking for the benefit of the doubt... you need to start explaining now.

Seireikhaan is not a "lurker"... he appears to simply be unable to speak in-thread. I'm willing to toss him or GH one round of doubt to see if they have uncovered one of you as mafia.



I encourage votes on Ituralde.

[Sasaki Kojiro]

https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpo...&postcount=329 (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpo...&postcount=329)

This is the part of the post Sasaki is referring to...

Padriac named character ? assuming he is IRA... sound about right ?

please explain to me the thought process that took from what i said here...

to... "so was padraic the IRA boss?"


The first part of the post was asking if Padriac is a named charater or just someones username... i was too lazy to check and i thought i better make it a question rather than say something stupid...

The second part im guessing from his name he was an ira charater... given that the name is not english sounding in the slightest and a little bit irish sounding... it was/is probably a correct assumption... though thinking on it now he culd be some other role... it didn't occur to me at the time though...

Where is the part where i call him the ira boss... i can't even see how you could even call that me hinting at him being the boss of ira... there is absolutely nothing in that post that hints towards him being a boss...

Let's talk about this...






Donney decided to leave Mcdoogals right then and there, and make sure he got patched up. Brendan just looked around sadly, and decided to leave his card anyway, but now it said Two Blind Mice.
Sounds like A Very Supper Market was the IRA mafia boss.

Reading back, he mentions that he thinks the "two blind mice" means one family has two people. I thought before that the mafia switched from "three blind mice" to two because they thought they could pass of padraic as one of their own. They'd have had to not read the thread carefully, but then Ares apparantly didn't read carefully.

...

Yoyoma also dropped in this idea, as did little grizzly. Eh, maybe the mafia are pointing out their own hints or maybe townies are just picking up on them. Yoyoma did suspect avsm who then turned up dead. Though he made sure to mention it next day which is bold.
As much as i would like to be able to take credit for such a claim... im pretty sure i didn't.. at least i can't remember saying anything similar to that...

Ares refusal to shift his vote is intresting... mafia with a brass pair or townie with good intentions ?

This is the original set of posts, set over several pages. Side note: lack of commitment on ares by LG.

First thing, you can see that LG was only mentioned in passing here. By far the main focus was on yoyo and ares, neither of whom I particularly suspected. Like I said, townies can easily pick up on mafia clues. I was somewhat surprised when LG responded, so I remembered it and mentioned that set of posts in my vote for grizz:


I'll try and see if I can find some more specific examples of what's tweaking my gut, aside from that "so was padraic the IRA boss?" post.

LG responded with this:


This is twice you have accused me of making posts i didn't even make!

Or at least im fairly sure i didn't make that post... but i definetly didnt make the one where you said i was either mafia dropping hints or picking up on hints.. something about AVSM i think...

I posted a link to the post that was possible "mafia dropping hints" and an explanation. His response is the first quote.

It should be evident that I never considered this blind mice/padraic/mafia hints thing to be substantial. Grizzly's response is therefore off the charts of normalcy, I either struck a nerve with the mafia hints accusation, or he's jumping on something to accuse me of.


This isn't a thing where I make accusations and you defend yourself though, this is the thing where I say I think your style is off and if other people agree then they vote you.

At least base your suspicions on posts i have made!

And an accurate interpratation of those posts as well!


I feel that this is more defensive than usual for you.

Going back to grizz's last post:


the ATPGood lynch was my own original thought which i figured would be a better idea than some of the other dismal choices other people suggested....

Baloney. Here (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=2182600&postcount=494) is your accusation of Alexander the pretty good:


Vote ATPGood

Needs to catch up in posting with his similarly named .orger!

But maybe your accusation was later? Let's see:


Ohh its F.C's birthday, i may just have to chang my vote to F.C now!!

We lynched seamus on his bday i think... whose the other ?


Well there precedent for you... we have to lynch players on thier birthday!!

My birthday is NOT coming up.... honest!


So have we got any good suspects... i voted for atpgood but he's posted since then, was just trying to get some response.... anybody have any ideas or just voted for anyone who seems shady ?

No, it's a direct contradiction of what you just claimed. You want examples of what tweaked my gut? Look at the posts from this day. Meaningless votes, no real comment on the major case of the day, a post saying "I dunno" and asking if anyone has any ideas?


here were far easier lynches on those first two days i could have joined in with.... an ATPG or Reenk bandwagon would have been a simple fist round vote for me to make... but because im town i fought against these pointless lynches and did stick my neck out by refusing to vote for either and abstaining instead...

Claiming that "so-and-so" is not a bad a lynch is a classic move for mafia who want to look innocent. The idea being, mafia wouldn't care if a atpg or reenk was lynched, so if you protest it you're more townie. Actually, mafia would want atpg and reenk to survive till endgame.


and well maybe not just a revenge vote... i often wonder when i am an innocent and a player as skilled at this game as sasaki is makes a case against me... if they are simply mafia directing my lynch as an easy one.. rather than making a rare mistake...

Seamus accused you as well, and not long ago in the settlement I went whole hog after TinCow and you were the one who warned me off him. This is you looking to justify your revenge vote.



Anyone else think possibly 'khaan could be hinting at us... ?

You didn't elaborate on this when I asked you to, so I'll say what I think about it.

This is a game where if you have a role, it is revealed after death. Khaan just came off of being detective in GF3, where we went over and over his poem with a fine toothed comb, looking for hidden clues. I even tried anagrams of capital letters, lol. So if he was the detective and hinting at my guilt, he would have been a lot more subtle than voting me three times in the first round and doing nothing else. And even if he wasn't, as detective he wouldn't keep pushing it...he would either claim and ask for maireads protection, or post normally so that he didn't stand out so much.

This to me, is you grasping at another reason to justify a revenge vote.

In summary: LittleGrizzly hasn't been posting in his townie style this game. His claimed townie behavior is a common mafia ploy, his claimed original case isn't anything of the sort, he defensively overreacted to my suggestion that it was possible that he was dropping or picking up on mafia hints, and he is being inconsistent, ignoring things he knows to be true, and grasping at straws to justify his revenge vote on me, which despite all that he still tries to indicate he is not attached to:



on the other hand i don't really have anything else to go on...

[Sasaki Kojiro]

I really, really think you're mafia, Ituralde. You aren't even listening, are you? This self-vote stuff was just a bluff, and you're trying to lynch someone who may be a mute detective. GH keeps suggesting you're guilty. From that I have to assume that he may have gotten a guilty result on you. And how about showing up right before the lynch but doing nothing to affect the total? Just in time for night phase?

Your explanations, votes, and behavior, plus the fingers of suspicion on you coming from people who are asking for the benefit of the doubt... you need to start explaining now.

Seireikhaan is not a "lurker"... he appears to simply be unable to speak in-thread. I'm willing to toss him or GH one round of doubt to see if they have uncovered one of you as mafia.



I encourage votes on Ituralde.

Have no issue with Ituralde's earlier pushing Seamus, makes no sense for a mafia ploy. What would his goal be? But he's clearly spooked by GH's post.

As for the detective, maybe I'm confused. But we have three pro town roles, which I take to be donney, davey, and mairead. Mairead a doctor, seamus is donny, and davey is looking for a cat...and well, you saw that deleted post too. So I can't see how GH could be the detective. To me his posts look like part of his new style. He did the same with taka in king wahaha, and with factionheir in the settlement. I guess what I'm saying is, I'm not a believer in "lynch someone because so-and-so says he is with no reasoning, because so-and-so might be the detective". The reasonable suspicion on Ituralde would be because of the way he got spooked.

I believe LittleGrizz is the lynch for today.

[Askthepizzaguy]

It's possible GH is just messing with me/us, but the problem is, that's independent of Ituralde's objectively bizarre behavior.

The case on Ituralde is everything Ituralde has done so far; it makes no sense to me coming from a townie. I am unwilling to let him skate on this. I'll post my own case on him if I have to. He could be a Godfather and that is why he's so nervous-sounding and erratic in his behavior.



EDIT:

And he just skips out while I am questioning him. He's not willing to discuss anything. He's nervous and non-contributory, and intentionally ducking suspicion. If he keeps this up, I will once again offer my head as punishment if town lynches him and he turns up innocent.

As a matter of fact, consider it done. You lynch Ituralde, I am wrong, kill me.

[El Diablo]

Well shows what I know I was starting to get suspicious of Captain Blackadder!

However, back to the game...

Vote Ituralde

If he is a townie your for the chop GH/ATPG.

[GeneralHankerchief]

But the one thing you'll notice is that I was right about all of them. :yes:

[Askthepizzaguy]

Who were your other suspects, GH? Forgive my laziness, don't want to go back and use the search function. And yeah, if Ituralde is innocent I'll vote myself every round until I die.

[Seamus Fermanagh]

Yeah, his push vote on me earlier made sense, I agree. But Ituralde DOES seem spooked. He went to an auto-vote very quickly after GH posted his bandwagon. Then, after discussion of 'khaan's potential role by you, he quickly shifts back to 'khaan as a lurker vote.

'khaan IS a lurker -- and we need him involved or gone -- but I agree with you pizza that Ituralde seems "hinkey" to me too. Okay, GH, I'll

Vote: Ituralde

myself. Not sure how you are doing it -- secret sources? -- but your similar plea in Settlement did end up with a good hit. I will be watching to see if Ituralde is a "name" here.


Ituralde and others are correct though -- we need more from 'khaan. Unless his "named" role is Wee Thomas and he can't talk in the thread.

If THAT weirdness is the case, I would expect at least a simple MEOW from him...:laugh4:

[Askthepizzaguy]

Do we have a protector who can guard him? Or is Mairead just your defender?

unvote: Sasaki
vote: Ituralde

Need to put my money where my mouth is. Still looking at Sasaki and LittleGrizzly, if Sasaki turns up innocent.

[seireikhaan]

MEOW

[Askthepizzaguy]

THANK YOU.

You're claiming to have a guilty result on Sasaki. But I don't think the detective has the ability to detect Godfathers. We need to kill the Godfather, not the henchman Sasaki. Don't bother voting Sasaki! Get the real target! Get the Godfather and Sasaki dies too!

If this makes sense, unvote Sasaki. Otherwise, I'll consider it.




edit-
about 30 mins later... still no reply. Not sure which one to vote for now. Sasaki could be a henchman, and at least, that reduces their voting power. But Ituralde has got to go...

[Askthepizzaguy]

Unvote: Ituralde
vote: Sasaki

We need to solve the mystery of Seireikhaan's cat "claim", and his insistence that Sasaki is mafia. Next round, though, I really really think we need to look at Ituralde.

And LittleGrizzly as a suspect: I don't think so, Sasaki. Not unless you turn out innocent. With Sasaki's death, much will be revealed, I believe.



Tally... PLEASE recheck... someone? Anyone? Thanks.


Sasaki: 4 (seireikhaan, boudica, LittleGrizzly, Askthepizzaguy)
Ituralde: 3 (GH, El Diablo, Seamus)
seireikhaan: 2 (Ituralde, greyblades)
Askthepizzaguy: 1 (Reenk Roink)
LittleGrizzly: 1 (Sasaki)
boudica: 1 (FactionHeir)

Abstain: 1 (Andres)

[Reenk Roink]

Unvote: Atpg
Vote: Ituralde

The angel of protection has informed me that GH will not be protected and I encourage the angel of death to pay him a visit as the angel of knowledge states he is full of crap. :bow:

[Diana Abnoba]

I think we have 2 good suspects today, Sasaki and Ituralde. I also feel that LittleGrizzly is a townie, and put forth the best argument against Sasaki.

Vote: Sasaki

[Askthepizzaguy]

New tally- (plz recheck)


Sasaki: 5 (seireikhaan, boudica, LittleGrizzly, Askthepizzaguy, Diana Abnoba)
Ituralde: 4 (GH, El Diablo, Seamus, Reenk Roink)
seireikhaan: 2 (Ituralde, greyblades)
LittleGrizzly: 1 (Sasaki)
boudica: 1 (FactionHeir)

Abstain: 1 (Andres)


Can I just ask why FactionHeir is being so tame with his voting preferences? Boudica is not going to get the axe, so the vote on her makes no sense. It's the same as abstaining, but not looking like you're abstaining.

FoS: FactionHeir.

If we fail to get a Godfather soon, I'm thinking it could be you.

[Greyblades]

Well, I am going to go with the whole Khaan is an investigator thong so, Unvote Vote Intralude I suspect him more than I do Sasaki.

[Sasaki Kojiro]

I think we have 2 good suspects today, Sasaki and Ituralde. I also feel that LittleGrizzly is a townie, and put forth the best argument against Sasaki.

Vote: Sasaki

I don't think you read very carefully.


the ATPGood lynch was my own original thought which i figured would be a better idea than some of the other dismal choices other people suggested....


Vote ATPGood

Needs to catch up in posting with his similarly named .orger!

One example from my case. Have you read LittleGrizz's case?

[Askthepizzaguy]

Well, I am going to go with the whole Khaan is an investigator thong so, Unvote Vote Intralude I suspect him more than I do Sasaki.If you believe that Seireikhaan is the investigator, then you cannot possibly think that Ituralde is a better lynch than Sasaki, because you believe the investigator proved Sasaki guilty.

Vote how you like, I think ituralde needs to die and soon, but what you said makes no sense. And even though I suspect Ituralde, I doubt that my suspicions are better than the investigator's.

[Diana Abnoba]

I don't want to argue with you Sasaki, but I think those examples you gave were from the earlier part of the game, and I was talking about today's posts. I think he made a better case today than you did, that's all. :smile:

[Sasaki Kojiro]

but I think those examples you gave were from the earlier part of the game, and I was talking about today's posts.

Yes...you're right, they were from an earlier part of the game, my bad :coffeenews:

[seireikhaan]

Folks need to stop bein' so silly...

[Askthepizzaguy]

Oh, so Seireikhaan can talk. That plus Sasaki's reasoning in private makes me completely doubt your investigator/cat behavior now as being anything but a ploy. Now, Sasaki is off the hook. And, Ituralde is back on.

Stop messing with my brain!

unvote: Sasaki
vote: Ituralde

[Askthepizzaguy]

~:mecry: no one checks my tallies. :wall:


Ituralde: 6 (GH, El Diablo, Seamus, Reenk Roink, Greyblades, Askthepizzaguy)
Sasaki: 4 (seireikhaan, boudica, LittleGrizzly, Diana Abnoba)
seireikhaan: 1 (Ituralde)
LittleGrizzly: 1 (Sasaki)
boudica: 1 (FactionHeir)

Abstain: 1 (Andres)

[Sasaki Kojiro]

My tally has more votes on LittleGrizzly, but I don't think that's the version you're looking for.

[Askthepizzaguy]

I'll vote for LittleGrizzly next round. If you're playing me, you're doing an excellent job. In spite of all reasons to the contrary, I actually trust you.

I am going to regret this, I just know it.

[FactionHeir]

New tally- (plz recheck)




Can I just ask why FactionHeir is being so tame with his voting preferences? Boudica is not going to get the axe, so the vote on her makes no sense. It's the same as abstaining, but not looking like you're abstaining.

FoS: FactionHeir.

If we fail to get a Godfather soon, I'm thinking it could be you.

I don't usually vote abstain. Plus, I doubt I'd get the Godfather role AFTER I asked for a PM way after the game started.

And I am suspicious why you think khaan cannot speak.

[Sasaki Kojiro]

Plus, I doubt I'd get the Godfather role AFTER I asked for a PM way after the game started.

You didn't notice that bit where it said townies don't get pm's, huh? :fishing:

[Askthepizzaguy]

I don't usually vote abstain. Plus, I doubt I'd get the Godfather role AFTER I asked for a PM way after the game started.Easily a ploy. That's not proof or defense, it's WIFOM. I doubt I'd be the Irish Godfather after I revealed as such, but hey... that's WIFOM too.


And I am suspicious why you think khaan cannot speak.Because he didn't speak all game until now. Now I know better. People make mistakes. People are intentionally messing with my head this game, and silly me, I believed them.

I am still suspicious of you. Your responses do not satisfy me.

[FactionHeir]

Fine, lynch me.

[Askthepizzaguy]

That's easy for you to say when no one really thinks you're suspect except me. And, again... WIFOM.

[White_eyes:D]

Ituralde, the way he checked the last minute votes and how he reacted to GH tells me he is guilty....:clown:
Wow, such a mind blowing accusation - you willing to be questioned Khaan, or is this you being a :daisy:, and wasting your vote needlessly. You never contribute, you never help, and as far as I am concerned, you and White Eyes need to be lynched.What did I do???:bigcry:

[White_eyes:D]

Vote:Ituralde I edited my post....:juggle2:

[Askthepizzaguy]

Tally-


Ituralde: 7 (GH, El Diablo, Seamus, Reenk Roink, Greyblades, Askthepizzaguy, White_Eyes)
Sasaki: 4 (seireikhaan, boudica, LittleGrizzly, Diana Abnoba)
seireikhaan: 1 (Ituralde)
LittleGrizzly: 1 (Sasaki)
boudica: 1 (FactionHeir)

Abstain: 1 (Andres)

Seems as though Ituralde is on his way out. Let's not waste the rest of the round. I am hearing from several people that boudica is suspicious. I cannot recall a good case made against her, but I'd like to hear it or get a link back to it please.

[Andres]

Finally finished reading :sweatdrop:

GH has done something similar in The Settlement (not that I agree with my lynching in that game, which was obviously a bad idea :brood:).

Unvote : Abstain ; Vote : Ituralde.

[FactionHeir]

He wanted me lynched there too, though I was investigated and found innocent :yes:

[Seamus Fermanagh]

Do we have a protector who can guard him? Or is Mairead just your defender?

unvote: Sasaki
vote: Ituralde

Need to put my money where my mouth is. Still looking at Sasaki and LittleGrizzly, if Sasaki turns up innocent.

My role contains no automatic defense system -- which is why I publicly thanked "her."

'khaan: thanks for that! :laugh4:


EDIT: Tally =
Ituralde = 8 (Andres, 'pizza', El D, GH, Grey, Reenk, Seamus, W_E)
Sasaki = 4 (Boudica, Diana, Grizz, 'khaan)
LittleGrizzly = 1 (Sasaki)
Boudica = 1 (FactionHeir)

Pizza: please use this as a double check, I'm vote recording as I go; THank's za-man!

[Askthepizzaguy]

He wanted me lynched there too, though I was investigated and found innocent :yes:Ah, but that also means nothing in this game. That's cross-gaming. So far, all your responses seem like excuses and WIFOM. Spidey senses are tingling.

Yay Seamus for the tally! W00t!


edit: Tally was wrong! Missing a vote by Diana on Sasaki!

edit 2: Thanks!

[LittleGrizzly]

My response to sasaki...

Apparently all the bold hurt some fragile things eyes... ~;)

So its in spoilers...

lack of commitment on ares by LG.

I was asking the question and giving out what i thought were the 2 possibilities..

First thing, you can see that LG was only mentioned in passing here. By far the main focus was on yoyo and ares, neither of whom I particularly suspected.

So why would I jump on it and get defensive if i am mafia... the idea that padriac was the mafia boss did not come from me... and i have explained my reasons for thinking he is ira already...

No, it's a direct contradiction of what you just claimed.

Im not saying ATPGood was some great lynch everyone else needed to join... i just figured it was better than lynching ATPG for tradition or Reenk for behaving like Reenk... at least if we try to look for something we may find it...

Look at the posts from this day. Meaningless votes, no real comment on the major case of the day, a post saying "I dunno" and asking if anyone has any ideas?

I made only one vote which demanded looking for something rather than just joining the easy bandwagons, i did comment on the major case of the day... i criticised them!

I don't see whats wrong with asking for ideas... im not a great player as a townie so i need some guidance to a certain extent... (preferably by a variety of players to help me through)

Claiming that "so-and-so" is not a bad a lynch is a classic move for mafia who want to look innocent.

I'd much rather blend with the crowd as mafia then try to come up with a half decent alternative to lynches i thought were crap

The idea being, mafia wouldn't care if a atpg or reenk was lynched, so if you protest it you're more townie. Actually, mafia would want atpg and reenk to survive till endgame.

Godfather 3... Reenk surviving innocent...

I wouldn't be so bothered about the town going for easy lynches on day 1... its a bit hard to try and guide the on day 1 and im not the most persusive typer either...

Seamus accused you as well

Seamus wrote 3 lines on the matter and didn't vote for me...

and not long ago in the settlement I went whole hog after TinCow and you were the one who warned me off him.

I don't really see what this has to do with anything but yes you accused an innocent player i had investigated... so i told you he was innocent... excellent proof of my pro town values...

This is a game where if you have a role, it is revealed after death. Khaan just came off of being detective in GF3, where we went over and over his poem with a fine toothed comb, looking for hidden clues. I even tried anagrams of capital letters, lol. So if he was the detective and hinting at my guilt, he would have been a lot more subtle than voting me three times in the first round and doing nothing else.

So you couldn't decipher clues from 'khaan last time he was detective... maybe he lernt from this...

TBH i haven't got a set behaviour of 'khaan as detective that i can remember and compare with...

Originally Posted by LG
Anyone else think possibly 'khaan could be hinting at us... ?

This was my post... it says nothing about 'khaan being detective

And even if he wasn't, as detective he wouldn't keep pushing it...he would either claim and ask for maireads protection, or post normally so that he didn't stand out so much.

He could be in contact with the detective, he could have some information hes trying to pass on... i didn't say heres the solid evidence for a sasaki lynch... i asked a question

This to me, is you grasping at another reason to justify a revenge vote.

Wasn't really part of my case... i was curious about peoples opinion on it...

In summary: LittleGrizzly hasn't been posting in his townie style this game.

What because im making an effort and i dont want to get lynched ?

Am i really that bad atownie usually...

His claimed townie behavior is a common mafia ploy

So if claimed townie behaviour is common mafia ploy what kind of behaviour should townies claim ?

he defensively overreacted to my suggestion that it was possible that he was dropping or picking up on mafia hints

I felt it was wrong... so it needed to be put right...

and he is being inconsistent

What ? Rubbish!

ignoring things he knows to be true, and grasping at straws to justify his revenge vote on me

More rubbish!

which despite all that he still tries to indicate he is not attached to:

Im not saying its an iron clad case but your behaviour is making me want to keep it there..

I believe LittleGrizz is the lynch for today.

I believe Sasaki is the lynch for today...

I'll vote for LittleGrizzly next round. If you're playing me, you're doing an excellent job. In spite of all reasons to the contrary, I actually trust you.

I am going to regret this, I just know it.

You will regret it!!

Lynch me by all means... it will be the proof of the sasaki case!

I have always insulted this as townie behaviour... but if i can confirm sasaki's guilt with my death then so be it...
Unvote Sasaki
Vote LittleGrizzly

:wall:

[Askthepizzaguy]

Blarg! So much bold hurts my eyes, please spoiler it. :bow:

LittleGrizzly, you're not even close to dying this round, and if you believe Sasaki is guilty, you will have supporters on it maybe next round. Don't remove your vote from him and put it on yourself. That kind of tactic is okay, I think, at the beginning of the game when we have no suspects and don't know who the pro-town roles are. I think we know who the pro-town roles are now, and Sasaki isn't one of them, and if you're not mafia, you shouldn't be voting for yourself. Ironic that I am the one to say this.

If you were to be lynched, you wouldn't need your own vote on it to make that happen. It's the middlegame now, we need to tighten up. And the self-lynch tactic is also ineffective on a round where there is zero chance of your lynch.


Ituralde = 8 (Andres, 'pizza', El D, GH, Grey, Reenk, Seamus, W_E)
Sasaki = 3 (Boudica, Diana, 'khaan)
LittleGrizzly = 2 (Sasaki, Grizzly)
Boudica = 1 (FactionHeir)

[LittleGrizzly]

Ok i guess so...

Unvote
Vote Sasaki

[White_eyes:D]

Ok i guess so...

Unvote
Vote Sasaki

Why are you trying so hard to save Ituralde???:whip:(Is he your Godfather???:inquisitive:)

[Askthepizzaguy]

Muchos Gracias Papa Bear. :bow:

[LittleGrizzly]

Why are you trying so hard to save Ituralde???:whip:(Is he your Godfather???:inquisitive:)

You'll have to point out my frantic pleas for everyone to vote for sasaki... i can't seem to locate them and wonder if they exsist at all

By all means continue with you Ituralde lynch, a sasaki lynch doesn't seem to be a threat to his lynching...

[Ituralde]

Man sleeping isn't good when you get accused this much. Seems my online/offline times just weren't compatible with this game. First game in a long time, was good to get back into the stuff. I'll see you around...

*flourishes knives*

[Askthepizzaguy]

Mmmm, did I hear a confession, or was that just a deliciously misleading teaser?

Consolation prize Ituralde; you can join all my games.

[pevergreen]

Ituralde was chosen to be killed today. He had slept in late and woken up at weird times. No one really heard much from him. As they prepared to hang him, he grabbed the noose and said "No one catches Mike Fingers!"
In doing so, he jumped off the platform and broke his neck.


Ituralde = 8 (Andres, ATPGuy, El D, GH, Grey, Reenk, Seamus, WE)
Sasaki = 4 (Boudica, Diana, 'khaan, LG)
LittleGrizzly = 1 (Sasaki)
Boudica = 1 (FactionHeir)


Alive:
Andres
Askthepizzaguy
shlin28
LittleGrizzly
Reenk Roink
GeneralHankerchief
Sasaki Kojiro
Lord Winter
White Eyes
Seamus
Factionheir
serierkhaan
yoyoma1910
Diana Abnoba
boudica
Sigurd
greyblades
El Diablo

Dead:
Publius Aelius Hadrianus
A Very Super Market
Jolt
taka
Polemists
gaelic cowboy
Alexander the Pretty Good
CountArach
Psychonaut
YLC
Captain Blackadder

Lynched:
Beefy187
F.C is the bees knees
777ares777
Ituralde

It is now Night 5, please send in orders.

[Askthepizzaguy]

How sweet it is. Let's see if Oswald is here tonight, or if he was WOG'ed earlier. :mellow:

[Ituralde]

Ituralde was chosen to be killed today. He had slept in late and woken up at weird times. No one really heard much from him. As they prepared to hang him, he grabbed the noose and said "No one catches Mike Fingers!"
In doing so, he jumped off the platform and broke his neck.

Classy! :2thumbsup:

[boudica]

Good lynch. Now Ituralde / Mike Fingers is listed as killed not lynched. I yam confused.

[LittleGrizzly]

Good work guys!

Unfortunately for me maybe this means we should concentrate on those who didn't vote for him... Is he part of the english crew ?(genuine question not mafia hinting...)

[pevergreen]

Good lynch. Now Ituralde / Mike Fingers is listed as killed not lynched. I yam confused.

oops my mistake.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Yes, because I believe it is known who the members of the IRA are from the play. Mike Fingers is not a person from the play. I believe he is in as a replacement for another player.

LittleGrizzly, I have my suspects... but...

Master Beefy187 teaches that it may be unwise to have this discussion at night. I think more discussion is better, but I see the downside if the mafia are choosing who to kill. What do you guys think? Discussion?

[Greyblades]

I beleive it would be a good idea to look back and identify those who tried to get attention away from Ituralde.

Edit- how do you pronounce Ituralde anyway?

[Ituralde]

It-tour-rahl-dh

If you want to know for sure listen to the Wheel of Time Audio Books. Crossroads of Twilight for example has Ituralde in it. :beam:

[ULC]

Yay, we got one!

As to White Eyes - why aren't you complaining at all? Usually, you go with an endless stream of angry posts, especially after death, if you lack a role, or try something really weird. You feel to much like GF3 right now...

[Askthepizzaguy]

'ere, he says he's not dead. He doesn't want to go on the cart.

What weirdness are you referring to?

[ULC]

'ere, he says he's not dead. He doesn't want to go on the cart.

What weirdness are you referring to?

Have you not played with him ATPG? Check Dark Vacuum, after he was lynched, check Whispers in the Night, check your Simpsons game.

Compare this to the White Eyes for every game he was mafia, such as GF3 and Golden Rule.

His current behavior is matching up nicely with when he was mafia, rather then when he was not.

[Reenk Roink]

Have you not played with him ATPG? Check Dark Vacuum, after he was lynched, check Whispers in the Night, check your Simpsons game.

Compare this to the White Eyes for every game he was mafia, such as GF3 and Golden Rule.

His current behavior is matching up nicely with when he was mafia, rather then when he was not.

I strongly advise you not to go up this line of questioning if you want to live. :bow:

[Diana Abnoba]

Yeah! One down. Good work guys.

[ULC]

I strongly advise you not to go up this line of questioning if you want to live. :bow:

Considering I am already dead? Reenk, you okay at all?

[Reenk Roink]

Considering I am already dead? Reenk, you okay at all?

Hmm, it appears someone is feeding me bad information, my mistake. :laugh4:

[ULC]

So I shall continue along my little wee quest unhindered now, thank you :brood:.

[Reenk Roink]

Hmm, it appears someone is feeding me bad information, my mistake. :laugh4:

Now this person is questioning how I can blame him for misinformation for not reading the alive list. I will be working on a refutation of this, and obviously it will be hard, so excuse my lurking. :bow:

[Sasaki Kojiro]

Reenk, I confess I hacked your computer to make it look like YLC was still alive.

What bugs me about yesterday is [removed...might have more speculation than is healthy].

[Askthepizzaguy]

LOL awesome. Epic failure. :smash:

[Seamus Fermanagh]

LOL awesome. Epic failure. :smash:

Huh? :inquisitive:

Which of the above?




Reenk:

You should merely have resurrected him and then whacked him again as a lesson. :devilish:

[Askthepizzaguy]

Which of the above?

Reenk... YLC dead.... thing... :smash:

[Greyblades]

I would like to report that I will not be posting as much for a while due to my main pc being repaired and I'm stuck with this crappy Linux laptop.

[Askthepizzaguy]

@greyblades

He's a witch! Let's burn him! :campfire:

just kidding amigo. Just know that I keep track... if you use RL excuse as a lie, I no longer believe RL excuses. Partly why I am suspect of Sigurd right now... he's done it before.




:knight:

[Seamus Fermanagh]

@greyblades

He's a witch! Let's burn him! :campfire:

just kidding amigo. Just know that I keep track... if you use RL excuse as a lie, I no longer believe RL excuses. Partly why I am suspect of Sigurd right now... he's done it before.

:knight:

I assure you that Sigurd is NOT making up this real life excuse -- I cannot assure you that he is not ALSO using it as cover. Actually, his voting record leaves him almost woggable.

[White_eyes:D]

I assure you that Sigurd is NOT making up this real life excuse -- I cannot assure you that he is not ALSO using it as cover. Actually, his voting record leaves him almost woggable.

Yeah, the last time a Mod told us this at his behalf.....he won a landslide Mafia victory in "Chicago Soiree":laugh4:

Edit:I am afraid he killed his REP with being inactive or busy:bow:

[Askthepizzaguy]

I would believe it, the trouble is he has posted in the Settlement game and has made posts on a fairly consistent basis elsewhere. I hate to be a stickler, but he's fooled me before with this stuff. I'm not pursuing it because he could get WOG'ed, and I'd also feel bad if he turned out to be a townie.

[White_eyes:D]

After the "Chicago Soiree disaster" you must forgive me if I seem a little more wary of RL excuses...:bow:

[Askthepizzaguy]

I still believe if I had shut my big fat mouth after I died, Andres and TinCow could have survived, and we could have won that one.

I blame myself. The lurkers were bound to die eventually. Me and my big fat mouth.





:wall:

[Seamus Fermanagh]

I said he wasn't joking about the RL stuff.

Doesn't mean he still isn't a viable lynchee :devilish: -- Chicago does indeed prove that.

[Askthepizzaguy]

I'm probably pressing my luck, but if he can post in the Settlement game, and if he can post on other threads, and is generally able to post every day, he can post here. To say hi. Or vote abstain.

Lurking on this level is unacceptable to me, RL or not. If he's town, he should post. If he's mafia, I hope he gets WOGed. I would prefer not to waste a lynch on a lurker, town or mafia. Let our God take care of him.

[GeneralHankerchief]

Agreed. We have other targets to worry about.

[ULC]

...Let Reenk take care of him.

Fixed.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Same thing, YLC. Reenk is a god of some sort. God of mischief, perhaps. :smash:

[Greyblades]

just kidding amigo. Just know that I keep track... if you use RL excuse as a lie, I no longer believe RL excuses. Partly why I am suspect of Sigurd right now... he's done it before.


I never said that I would stop posting completely, its just I have to share my Internet time for now. I have no intention of lurking.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Wonderful! The more the merrier. :bow: The more people we have solving the puzzle, the better.

[ULC]

I have never even finished a Rubix Cube, ever...Hmmm...thinking of a change in user name to Rubix...

[pevergreen]

Same thing, YLC. Reenk is a god of some sort. God of mischief, perhaps. :smash:

Midgard flashback. :groan:

I did delete my role pm >_>

[Sasaki Kojiro]

Midgard flashback. :groan:

I did delete my role pm >_>

Rule #4: Never delete your role pm

[Beefy187]

It would be funny if anyone was a cat. Like...

Congratulations Beefy. You are a cat

Your soo adorable so you get immunity from being lynched
Also your soo adorable so you won't get killed by anyone sane.

Your aim is to scratch the hell out of bad guys without getting him angry.

Good luck.

[Askthepizzaguy]

link to your rules that I keep hearing about plz.

[Sasaki Kojiro]

link to your rules that I keep hearing about plz.

Can't do that sorry...Rule #9.

You should be able to guess Rule #2 though.

[Askthepizzaguy]

No...? :no:

Are these rules like... fluid... you can make them up and they don't have actual numbers?


Found them (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=100312). Bwahahaha. You cannot keep secrets from me.

[pevergreen]

Brendan walks into Mcdoogals and sees shlin28 sitting there drinking beer. Brendan says I havent seen you in the bar much. You havent been drinking much lately. shlin says I been cutting back on beer. Brendan says then youre not really irish are you. And Brendan kills him with a knife. shlin died and he heard Brendan say you should have fought for ireland. then he leaves a card which says Two Blind Mice.

While other men frittered away their lives in the pub, Greyblades spent his time in study. Although he had by nature nothing heroic about him, and preferred running about the country to books—or at least books of information—for, provided that nothing like useful knowledge could be gained from them, provided they were all story and no reflection, he had never any objection to books at all. But he was in training to become a hero; he read all such works as a hero must read to supply their memories with those quotations which are so serviceable and so soothing in the vicissitudes of their eventful lives.

From Pope, he learnt to censure those who


"bear about the mockery of woe."

From Gray, that


"Many a flower is born to blush unseen,
"And waste its fragrance on the desert air."

From Thompson, that—


"It is a delightful task
"To teach the young idea how to shoot."

And from Shakespeare he gained a great store of information — amongst the rest, that—


"Trifles light as air,
"Are, to the jealous, confirmation strong,
"As proofs of Holy Writ."

And that


"The poor beetle, which we tread upon,
"In corporal sufferance feels a pang as great
"As when a giant dies."

So far his improvement was sufficient—and in many other points he came on exceedingly well; for though he could not write sonnets, he brought herself to read them; and though there seemed no chance of him throwing a whole party into raptures by a prelude on the pianoforte, of his own composition, he could listen to other people's performance with very little fatigue. His greatest deficiency was in the pencil—he had no notion of drawing—not enough even to attempt a sketch of his lover's profile, that she might be detected in the design. There he fell miserably short of the true heroic height. Oswald certainly thought so, and laughed to himself at the thought of a little Irish boy attempting to comprehend Shakespeare.

As Greyblades turned the page in his book a note fell out. Penned of course by Oswald, it nevertheless had a light, feminine slant to it and purported to be from an admirer of Greyblade's who, as a fellow admirer of Shakespeare was greatly excited at the prospect of conversing at length about his plays and sonnets. She invited him for a walk along the riverbank outside the village, by moonlight!

The note was signed "Iago". Oswald could barely contain himself when he saw how eagerly Greyblades donned his coat and hurried off to the meeting place.

In the morning, the body of Greyblades was found washed up on the shore near the edge of town. The investigation determined that he had crawled out onto the branch of a willow tree farther upstream and had drowned when the branch broke and dropped him into the river. This determination, read by Oswald in the morning paper, caused him to soak said paper in his morning coffee, drawing disapproving looks from the other patrons as he laughed loud and long at the expense of the people of Inishmore, and of the Irish in general.

"Provincial scarcely describes it" he said, when he had regained his composure. Donny, seated nearby and thinking the comment was addressed to him, nodded his head in agreement, wondering what "provincial" meant. It certainly wasn't a word he'd been taught during the six months he'd spent in school. Of course the vast quantities of cheap beer he swilled every night, even at a young age, had rather impaired his learning abilities.

As the town gathered again in the morning, the talk was not of the murders, but of the current rumour. "Donney's alive and 'ere ta 'elp, watch 'is space".

Alive:
Andres
Askthepizzaguy
LittleGrizzly
Reenk Roink
GeneralHankerchief
Sasaki Kojiro
Lord Winter
White Eyes
Seamus
Factionheir
serierkhaan
yoyoma1910
Diana Abnoba
boudica
Sigurd
El Diablo

Dead:
Publius Aelius Hadrianus
A Very Super Market
Jolt
taka
Polemists
gaelic cowboy
Alexander the Pretty Good
CountArach
Psychonaut
YLC
Captain Blackadder
greyblades
shlin28

Lynched:
Beefy187
F.C is the bees knees
777ares777
Ituralde

It is now Day 6.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Can I just take a moment and say, whoever wrote the above Oswald kill is a very articulate, well-read, and delightfully sadistic fellow. As such, I'd have to point at myself... but I absolutely loathe Shakespeare and I nearly failed English class. I hate verbose and snobbish-sounding English writing. Call me plebian, but I simply zone out when I read that stuff, and I do not even bother to hide it. And, I might employ WIFOM tactics, but I don't think my forging ability is up to snuff to match Reenk's style.

Now, even if it gets me killed, I absolutely must lay out a very simple case, with evidence, that leads me to believe that it was either Reenk who wrote the kill, or a VERY intelligent impostor, who is also a mafia veteran, and that also narrows the suspect list a bit, doesn't it? Pardon me for a moment, while I prepare some evidence.

Vote: Reenk Roink

[White_eyes:D]

Its Yoyoma.....he knows Shakespeare, like the back of his hand....:yes: and a whole bunch of other authors....I will bring up evidence and quotes to back this up...:smash:

[Andres]

I'll have to take a closer look to the Sasaki-LittleGrizzly duel from the previous round. I really didn't like how they seemed to try to draw attention away from Ituralde.

Vote : Sasaki

[Askthepizzaguy]

As soon as I read the above, I suspected Reenk. But, not wanting to merely act on instinct, I decided to check up on his writing style, especially from Mafia games, but also in instances where he was not writing for a mafia game. Some interesting examples:


So it seems that the Mafia have responded to my taunts of their ineptitude, if I could be so presumptuous and self-important. :shame: They are still stupid for letting two nights with no kills, and only causing minor confusion (by my standards of course :laugh4:).

However, I'm not sure I agree with attacking people for speculating on the nature of the Mafia. It may have been a valid tactic early on or before the game started, but now it's not, as the Mafia have obfuscated things (poorly, they are dumb Mafia, but still some) and gotten the crew talking.

Therefore, I do not believe that KukriKhan-sama or Chaotix27 or Yoyoma1910 should be imprisoned yet. I agree with Peasant Phill that the Mafia have clouded things up a bit, and would not be THAT stupid to give precise logistics of their operation. "Always trust in the stupidity of the Mafia" rings true, but the only Mafia to be stupid enough to blatantly incriminate himself was yours truly and even I did it in two separate games :laugh4:.

Reenk is a very fancy talker, to put it in layman's terms. He also delights in calling people inept or stupid or otherwise demonstrating his own intelligence at the expense of others when he writes. I mean no disrespect in making this observation. I am simply stating that from the above example, we can see Reenk in a mafia game sort of... turning up his nose towards other playing styles. Also note the abundant use of parentheses, and his sentence structure is complex and more voluminous than average.


:laugh4::laugh4::laugh4::laugh4::laugh4::laugh4:

I have taunted Mafia before, but this is just a new high (low?). Gentlemen, it seems that the Mafia here are too stupid to kill anyone. :laugh4::laugh4::laugh4:

I don't care what kind of plans they have, but the town is used to getting two people killed in standard games. 4 kills missed already! At the very least, kills should have been carried out for one of the two nights. I mean, I'm all for trying new things and experimenting, but let's not forget the purpose of the game. :beam:

Remember the long used (maybe long forgotten) maxim:

:stupido: Always trust in the stupidity of the Mafia

On the other hand, maybe they knew they would lose and are going for leniency. My lawyer says with this kinda of behavior, an insanity plea would be convincing. :yes:

Also, since my moral compass Aries777777 has not spoken, I think today I will follow Andres.

Vote: Alexander the Pretty Good

Sorry bud, no hard feelings. :shakehands:

Again, in this relevant example from previous games, I note that there is a slight whiff of condescension. Of course, in this example, the mafia he refers to is... himself. Which is a common Reenk tactic. I employ tactics all the time which are designed to make me appear like a townie to throw off the trail, but Reenk here is the hands-down master. He lasted a very long time in the Prometheus game, and it wasn't because of luck alone either. He is a brilliant player. Again here we see an example of parentheses, which he uses a lot more often than the average player. He also employs a choppy one-or-two sentence paragraph structure with double spaces in between, a style characteristic of myself and only a few others that I know of. Sasaki does it on occasion, but he's never quite this verbose. So, again, I say if this is a forgery, well done. I would also make the subtle observation that Reenk does enjoy talking, almost as much as me!


Ok, Aries777777, where are you buddy? You didn't vote last round, and I could not find another suitable man to follow so I didn't vote last round (though I participated but our captain says it is not enough; he must follow that silly "Vote or Die" slogan :grin2:).

Early on you were active with your jokes and your votes, but now you're gone and I'm not laughing or guided, and it's becoming terribly hard to play in my new way. :shame: I may have to vote for you in the future.

Because I am not kept satisfied by such good humor, I took some time out to be 'analytical' today in the hopes that maybe I could be helpful to us crewmembers.

First, I am shocked that Sigurd Fafnesbane was lynched this early for a pretty weak reason, even by common townie standards. An incredibly stupid thing to do if I may criticize the crew.

The history of Mafia has seen a lot of great people (many of the new ones I don't know so much about either), some almost legendary; but Siggy Fafnessie is by far the most complete player. I consider him to be one of the best hosts and one of the best townies, as well is the best Mafia ever.

By lynching him, especially this early, Sigurd's alignment is unknown. You can imagine the epistemic problems this brings when he will attempt to posthumously 'help' the town...

What would have been wiser was to let the Mafia kill him off, at least making it much more plausible that Sigurd was innocent or in a non-Mafia role. Then he could help us and we could trust him. :idea2:

And had Sigurd remained alive by the end stages of the game, you could be sure that I would be on him hard for it. Sigurd has screwed the town and myself personally over brilliantly twice before in endgame, and one of my personal goals is to foil him.

What we did to Sigurd is the worst thing to do concerning him.

Secondly, I'm saddened though not surprised at how dogmatically people draw conclusions about the Mafia from scant evidence such as write ups or non killing behavior. They really prove nothing, and I would never make conclusions about the number of Mafia or how they operate from them personally.

Lastly, and I held off on doing this for a bit because I respect Seamus Fermanagh a ton, but I would be somewhat inclined to view him suspiciously since the get go.

Read this:



I think Seamus is doing what he did in that game. He is propping up the same framework so as to not blatantly show a change in behavior, but at the same time, it is also more shallow which, according to popular townie thought, is an indicator of trying to fly under the radar, which, again according to popular townie though, is a telltale mark of Mafia.

Now, I must add that I am probably one of the strongest opponents of using changes in behavior or semi-lurking as indicators of Mafia, because of the fact that it is such a poorly grounded theoretical framework (yes it has worked before, but I look for an epistemic and not pragmatic justification and you would think Mafia would caught on by now).

So by no means does this damn Seamus or anything close to it. Unlike Kommodus, I will not endorse voting for people based on the above-mentioned methodology for the above-mentioned reasons.

I do caution you to deal with Seamus with some trepidation though. Something about him is just not right (actually, that is MY personal reason for my suspicion, and I gave the evidence that usual townies accept so that YOU would also consider it).

No hard feelings buddy, as I said my personal stance makes me very critical of this method of suspicion in the first place. However, since everyone else is grasping at imaginary threads, I would like to point out a particularly big and fat imaginary thread. You are a great player and were it not for my close knowledge of your ways from earlier times, I wouldn't have caught this. :bow:

I will for now vote: Chaotix27 because Seamus is a good man as any to follow, and again, he is suspicious by the common methodologies gauge (BUT SO IS SEAMUS BY THE SAME METHODOLOGY).

Hope some of this helped. :bow: At the very least, I hope it was interesting in some way that makes the game more fun, which is the main reason to play. :2thumbsup:

P.S: This definitely isn't going to be a habit by the way :laugh4:

A Vote Tally (cause none of you do it anyway ~;p):

Chaotix27: 4 (seireikhaan, Seamus Fermanagh, YLC, Askthepizzaguy)
Askthepizzaguy: 2 (shilin28, Alexander the Pretty Good)
seireikhaan: 1 (White_eyes:D, Ichigo)
YLC: 1 (Mithrandir)
Peasant Phill: 1 (Beefy187)
pevergreen: 1 (Twilightblade)
shilin28: 1 (Chaotix27)

Edit: There is no way that Chaotix27 could be Mafia, unless he really doesn't care about getting lynched (such apathy would be legendary and quite ballsy for Mafia :2thumbsup:). Voting will be closed in an hour or so

Unvote: Chaotix27
Vote: Askthepizzaguy

To try and force a tie to save a pretty clearly innocent townie (though I don't know if Askthepizzaguy is a good lynch either, he's better than Chaotix27).

New Vote Tally:

Chaotix27: 4 (seireikhaan, Seamus Fermanagh, YLC, Askthepizzaguy)
Askthepizzaguy: 3 (shilin28, Alexander the Pretty Good, Reenk Roink)
seireikhaan: 2 (White_eyes:D, Ichigo)
YLC: 1 (Mithrandir)
Peasant Phill: 1 (Beefy187)
pevergreen: 1 (Twilightblade)
shilin28: 1 (Chaotix27)

In this example, we see the lengths Reenk is likely to go to in order to make a point. He is likely to spend a good amount of time typing a single post. Again, much like myself, and not many others. Note the characteristic usage of parentheses more often than the average player, and the complex sentence structure. Check out the usage of quotation marks as well; Reenk is a very "punctual" writer, if I do say so...

Now, lets' examine examples of his style in a non-mafia setting:


Hi Atpg

To address 1)

First, you refer me to an article which essentially has the same idea of what is the objective standard of knowledge as you do. Unfortunately, the article does little to respond to the objections I have raised (your position itself was a bit better at that).

The article already presupposes deductive inferences (and strangely enough it mentions inductive inferences and (though not explicitly) sensory perception which are the basis for observation and experimentation - I suspect as a way to smuggle in a scientific basis rather than keep the definition of rationalism and reason to simply mean deductive inferences which is assuredly better grounded and much more coherent).

It then says something to the effect of "employed by scientists practicing the verification guide scientists to be objective" which is basically a poorly constructed sentence I cannot make any sense of. I think this was to tie in the presupposed standards (of logic and science - the term verification makes me think it was written by someone who follows the school of logical positivism) to an objective conception of knowledge.


This article is merely making the (unwarranted) assertions that these things are THE standard, and then defining objective knowledge based off of it. Thus this account entirely misses my point and talks past my objections raised.

I am not making the case that there is no objective standard of knowledge. I am questioning YOUR account of what that standard is. My questions were twofold at the start of the objective/subjective discussion:

1) What do you mean by the objective standard?
2) How do you know that it is the objective standard?

You answered 1 and have failed to answer 2, quite correctly observing that it is too difficult if not impossible (you call it unreasonable).

You then go ahead and attack subjectivity as self defeating. Very odd as if you interpret that to be my position than you actually are misunderstanding.

However, your attack did give me the idea to pose this question to you.

You would say all beliefs should be grounded in reason, correct? This is why you are so opposed to faith?

I would reply, that belief that "all beliefs should be grounded in reason" is itself a belief and thus by its own standard should be grounded in reason. Yet you cannot justify this belief by your own standard. I thus argue that your "rationalism" is self defeating, not only to an outside standard (such as subjectivity to logic as you claim) but to its very own standard. It is as self defeating as can be.

Lastly and most importantly you are most correct to say that we are an impasse. I would take it further and say that because of your position, because of what you already assume, your debate with Rhyfelwyr will merely flounder into semantics (you will throw around the words "rational" and "reason") and utterly fail to provide anything meaningful. As the very epistemic bases of the two sides are different, there is no way to really discuss. Rather it becomes a series of assertions and talking past each other.

I am sorry to be dismissing 2) so curtly, but your criticisms of faith all depend on the issues raised in 1). You essentially assume that your "rationalism" is the standard and then show how great it is and how faith does not live up to it. That is blatantly circular and vacuous. Essentially Atpg, you are preaching to the choir. Your arguments are only convincing to those who have accepted your position. To me, for example, I can dismiss them easily as they are asserted without justification.

I must say that the case that your "rationalism" is uncertain and allows for error is not a very good one to any person who doesn't already assume the position. Just again an example of the impasse that is arrived.

Why do you think "rational" arguments are so unconvincing to those who have faith?

This one is from my own visitor message page. He took the time to lay out a very learned and passionate case, well-argued in fact, for a very extreme form of skepticism, in contrast to my own objectivist viewpoint. Note that this would be Reenk as Reenk, not a mafia player version of Reenk.

Notice anything? Parentheses unlike anyone I've ever met, over-usage of quotations compared to the average person, and hints of education and brilliance combined with great confidence and eloquence. Indeed, a worthy debater and opponent in any setting. He simply cannot be a stupid man from these writings, whether I agree with him philosophically or not. He's not your average player. I admire him, in fact. But, he is probably the person who wrote the Oswald kills, that's all I wish to say.


Atpg, a couple of comments on your comments, especially on your use of the word 'rational' and its various forms.

You say:

Quote:
Faith is a judgment call that you will believe, unflinchingly, that which has been proven false or cannot be proven true using the scientific method. As such, it is an irrational thing to do, should it result in actions taken on this mortal realm
Here I take you to say that something is irrational if it either cannot be proven true using the scientific method or if it has been proven false.

(You later seem to espouse the opinion that it is "logic" that is the basis of rationality so I sense a bit of incoherence)

Ignoring what exactly you mean by 'scientific method' or 'prove' for a moment, is it correct to state that your position is one that states that the scientific method is the criteria for rationality? If so, please explicate your conception of the scientific method and then I will get back to you with my objections.

You say:
Quote:
Morality does not flow from the supernatural; even in a discussion where people claim that religion causes morality, they must use rational arguments to justify why something is right or wrong. That means rationalism causes morality, not faith.
Your claim of morality not originating from the supernatural is simply false to anyone who believes in any sort of voluntarist ethics.

You then say that one must use "rational arguments" as a justification even for people who claim "religion causes morality" and I wonder how this is so. I could simply assert that supernatural being A said act X was good. You could construe this trivially to be a form of argument, but it would be trivial, as you could construe any statement as such.

Your last statement doesn't even seem to be coherent. Because someone uses rational arguments to promote a case for voluntarist ethics it means that the ethics are "caused" by "rationalism" and not voluntarism? Is this what you are saying?

Quote:
religion is more like a Law which cannot be tested or proven. As such, it is not even allowed to be called a theory; it is an untestable, unprovable, unquestionable tenet which people either believe or disbelieve.
The fact of the matter is, that every foundation of "rationalism" that you have hinted at (the scientific method and logical inferences) are the same. They are unprovable.

The law of non contradiction is the basis for (traditional/classical) logic. Please prove the law of non-contradiction without reference to itself.

Please prove the assumptions that is needed for any natural science to proceed. Prove that the external world actually exists beyond our sense perception.

Or are these "unquestionable" axioms that need to be accepted before logic or the scientific method can proceed?

Lastly, please explain why something that is testable has any more epistemic merit than something that is not.

These are basic foundational questions against (what I perceive as) your view of rationalism.

Quote:
But logic exists without faith, in fact, in spite of faith logic exists. And without logic, there can be no morality.
By "logic" I will take you to mean deductive inferences. Is this what you mean?

If so, I have already provided an example of an axiom of deductive logic that is accepted without proof - on 'faith' that is.

Thanks

Reenk is well-versed in the topics which he likes to discuss. If he speaks about Shakespeare, he will know about Shakespeare. If he speaks about philosophy, he will know about philosophy. If he speaks about the fundamentals of logic, he will make sense, from someone's perspective, if not always mine. The bottom line is, I believe that forging Reenk's style would be very difficult, and I've given you several relevant examples of his usage of quotations, parentheses, specific and elite language styles, short, brief paragraphs, and a vast amount of general knowledge and the ability to articulate. Bottom line, this is probably Reenk, or a very good impostor. And would he WIFOM himself to death like this? Yes, yes he probably would. Because he's Reenk; and that's what he does.


Judge for yourself. The only thing missing in the following:
While other men frittered away their lives in the pub, Greyblades spent his time in study. Although he had by nature nothing heroic about him, and preferred running about the country to books—or at least books of information—for, provided that nothing like useful knowledge could be gained from them, provided they were all story and no reflection, he had never any objection to books at all. But he was in training to become a hero; he read all such works as a hero must read to supply their memories with those quotations which are so serviceable and so soothing in the vicissitudes of their eventful lives.

From Pope, he learnt to censure those who

"bear about the mockery of woe."


From Gray, that

"Many a flower is born to blush unseen,
"And waste its fragrance on the desert air."


From Thompson, that—

"It is a delightful task
"To teach the young idea how to shoot."


And from Shakespeare he gained a great store of information — amongst the rest, that—

"Trifles light as air,
"Are, to the jealous, confirmation strong,
"As proofs of Holy Writ."


And that

"The poor beetle, which we tread upon,
"In corporal sufferance feels a pang as great
"As when a giant dies."


So far his improvement was sufficient—and in many other points he came on exceedingly well; for though he could not write sonnets, he brought herself to read them; and though there seemed no chance of him throwing a whole party into raptures by a prelude on the pianoforte, of his own composition, he could listen to other people's performance with very little fatigue. His greatest deficiency was in the pencil—he had no notion of drawing—not enough even to attempt a sketch of his lover's profile, that she might be detected in the design. There he fell miserably short of the true heroic height. Oswald certainly thought so, and laughed to himself at the thought of a little Irish boy attempting to comprehend Shakespeare.

As Greyblades turned the page in his book a note fell out. Penned of course by Oswald, it nevertheless had a light, feminine slant to it and purported to be from an admirer of Greyblade's who, as a fellow admirer of Shakespeare was greatly excited at the prospect of conversing at length about his plays and sonnets. She invited him for a walk along the riverbank outside the village, by moonlight!

The note was signed "Iago". Oswald could barely contain himself when he saw how eagerly Greyblades donned his coat and hurried off to the meeting place.

In the morning, the body of Greyblades was found washed up on the shore near the edge of town. The investigation determined that he had crawled out onto the branch of a willow tree farther upstream and had drowned when the branch broke and dropped him into the river. This determination, read by Oswald in the morning paper, caused him to soak said paper in his morning coffee, drawing disapproving looks from the other patrons as he laughed loud and long at the expense of the people of Inishmore, and of the Irish in general.

"Provincial scarcely describes it" he said, when he had regained his composure. Donny, seated nearby and thinking the comment was addressed to him, nodded his head in agreement, wondering what "provincial" meant. It certainly wasn't a word he'd been taught during the six months he'd spent in school. Of course the vast quantities of cheap beer he swilled every night, even at a young age, had rather impaired his learning abilities.

As the town gathered again in the morning, the talk was not of the murders, but of the current rumour. "Donney's alive and 'ere ta 'elp, watch 'is space"....is the characteristic parentheses, which I doubt Reenk would employ while writing an effective bit of fiction. And I looked and found references to Othello, but I am not skilled enough in "google-fu" as I believe it is called to find any evidence of direct stealing from famous writers. Fiction is not my forte, nor is English literature. One of our better-educated orgahs may be able to detect such thievery. I believe he could have written it himself, or paraphrased, or stolen; but I do not believe a novice player, nor the average person, could achieve such a murder writeup as the above.

I suspect Reenk, and that is my case.


However, I welcome a counter-case from White_eyes, as I believe any knowledgeable Shakespeare lover could write it, and Yoyoma is on my short list of abundantly brilliant players capable of pulling this off. I am listening, White_eyes.


In summary, Reenk has the vocabulary, the tone, the psychological profile, the knowledge of the subject, and the bold attitude required to do the Oswald kill. I think there aren't as many people here would could do that, but I admit Yoyoma is perhaps one of them.

[White_eyes:D]

He said this poem in response to my plan to kill him in "Noble Sons".....Man was I hated in that game...:shame:

I say this to the bad night air that has crept like the stench of a bog upon these castle walls:


What could a serpent ever understand but hunger and venom?



My skin awaits your fangs, that you would came close enough that I could pull the head from your body, as the tick you are.
It is not middle-english so can't tell......


Edit: but if I had to guess 'Hamlet'?

He had this to say about me and Beefy guessing his poems....
You do a great injustice to any writer by attributing my little scribbles to them. Honestly, I just kind of make it up as I go.

It's been a few years since I looked at ol' Willy's work, but it's probably closer to Macbeth than Hamlet. With White Eyes playing the Scotsman. And certainly I'm trying to pull elements from the mood of Henry V, as well as the period in the preceding period where the young Harry spent much time with characters such as Falstaff. With maybe a twist from The Tempest and Merchant of Venice.

I'd say I am also heavily influenced by The Golden Ass, also called The Transformation of Lucius, by Apuleius. Though once again, its been awhile since my eyes swayed across these pages.

A far more recent addition to my library would be The Poem of El Cid. There's a true masterpiece. Far more realistic and honest than either the Nibelungen or the Song of Roland.Basically, this all fits Yoyoma's MO.....he is always like a english King....or something...Vote:Yoyoma

I got all this off a game we played WAY back.....I could give you the link if needed....:yes:

[Askthepizzaguy]

I'll have to take a closer look to the Sasaki-LittleGrizzly duel from the previous round. I really didn't like how they seemed to try to draw attention away from Ituralde.I have a disagreement with your reasoning; in this game, the mafia families seem to be only killing once per night. A henchman dies, it is no big deal. If Sasaki and LittleGrizzly exposed themselves trying to save a henchman, it would make little sense. However, mafia games rarely make sense, so I suppose even though I disagree, anyone's opinion is valid here.


And White_Eyes, the writing style itself is completely different, as is the tone, in your examples.

[White_eyes:D]

And White_Eyes, the writing style itself is completely different, as is the tone, in your examples. .....of course....I hid my writing style from everyone on "Godfather 3"...anyone insane enough to use the same writing style as there posts is a Lynched Mafia.....I knew that as well...but I was pointing out the Motives and how the person(killer) sees himself in the write-ups....and Oswald sees himself higher then those he kills=Yoyoma....:brood:

[Askthepizzaguy]

.....of course....I hid my writing style from everyone on "Godfather 3"

Hiding one's style and forging a much, much more articulate one are two very different animals.


...anyone insane enough to use the same writing style as there posts is a Lynched Mafia...

Your point? I argued in Godfather that "Reenk wouldn't do this" or "Reenk wouldn't do that". Bogus reasoning. Reenk will do whatever he darn well pleases, AND GET AWAY WITH IT, TOO.


..I knew that as well...but I was pointing out the Motives and how the person(killer) sees himself in the write-ups.

What is the psychological profile, real or fake, of the writer of the murder? Intelligent, narcissistic, long-winded, etc... again, why I fully expect to be lynched for "wifom" for accusing Reenk, when those arguments could be used against me. Assaulting Reenk is nearly impossible, especially if it's coming from me, because you guys will listen to Reenk over me. Just a fact.


...and Oswald sees himself higher then those he kills=Yoyoma....:brood:Does not follow. I find Yoyoma1910 to act selflessly at times, take note of the Golden Rule game. I find him perhaps to love Shakespeare, but otherwise has nothing in common with the writer of Oswald's kills. Except maybe brilliance.

Oswald could very well be Reenk, and his WIFOM-tactics all game regarding his secret plotting and secret messages and all that nonsense... he knows he can get away with it as a townie, so, he's doing it as mafia. That's all. And yes, Reenk is absolutely prepared to pull off a WIFOM of this magnitude.

[Reenk Roink]

Your point? I argued in Godfather that "Reenk wouldn't do this" or "Reenk wouldn't do that". Bogus reasoning. Reenk will do whatever he darn well pleases, AND GET AWAY WITH IT, TOO.


What is the psychological profile, real or fake, of the writer of the murder? Intelligent, narcissistic, long-winded, etc... again, why I fully expect to be lynched for "wifom" for accusing Reenk, when those arguments could be used against me. Assaulting Reenk is nearly impossible, especially if it's coming from me, because you guys will listen to Reenk over me. Just a fact.


Oswald could very well be Reenk, and his WIFOM-tactics all game regarding his secret plotting and secret messages and all that nonsense... he knows he can get away with it as a townie, so, he's doing it as mafia. That's all. And yes, Reenk is absolutely prepared to pull off a WIFOM of this magnitude

:laugh4::laugh4::laugh4::laugh4::laugh4::laugh4::laugh4::laugh4::laugh4:

Your case is not good Atpg, but I think it is time to get rid of you, you are probably insignificant, but who knows, even insignificant seeming things can be dangerous to my plans.

Vote: Atpg

I will get away with it Atpg, as you said. Don't know why you bothered to try to be quite honest. ~;p

[FactionHeir]

It could be anyone really because whoever wrote the kill knew that people would read the kill and could use it to frame others. Of course they could just write it in their own style to frame themselves but claim that the writer just wanted to make them look guilty when they really are "innocent".

The beauty of WIFOM :yes:

I think it would be more interesting to see who was killed by whom. Certain people have a preference for killing certain other players.

[Sasaki Kojiro]

Vote:LittleGrizzly

@Andres: Your vote on Ituralde was the 8th...

Atpg: I agree that the writeup looks most like reenk. And reenk is the person most likely to write in his own style. But that makes him #1 option for frame. There are few people who could "flowerize" there writing to that extent, I think you left lord winter of your list though. In the end I think it's more fruitful to go of off in thread evidence.

[LittleGrizzly]

So let me see if i can summarie this into one post...

ATPG voted Reenk because he's brilliant
WE voted Yoyoma because he's brilliant
Andres voted for Sasaki because me and him had a big argument whilst we were lynching scum
Reenk is voted for ATPG because hes insignificant and maybe a threat to him...

I have to agree with ATPG's point, i very much doubt sasaki would make such an attempt... because im fairly sure at the time Ithurlude (complete guess at his name) looked like he was going to be lynched... on the other hand maybe sasaki thought he was brilliant enough to pull it off...

Im not going to vote sasaki this round... becuase of ATPG's point he does seem less scummy... though i would still like him to be investigated...

Ill avoid my a place holder abstain vote... as apparently it doesn't involve sticking my neck out... ill wait a little to see what else comes up...

Edit: Sasaki flicked a coin and the result is that i am still a good lynch target... rolling eyes smiley here!

[boudica]

:laugh4:

I'd be happy to vote Reenk again purely because of his blatant threats, but I still don't really have a clue about his playing style that everyone else seems to kowtow to (how exactly is it helpful to town again? Reenk? Anyone? :wall:) - In the meantime, I'm prepared to go out on a limb and guess from the list of the living that Diana Abnoba may very well be capable of the Oswald kill/write up. Which I concur - was beautifully written :2thumbsup:

vote: Diana Abnoba

[Greyblades]

Well that was pretty elaborate for a simple townie but I cant really say I'm ungrateful.

GG and all that.

One thing I would like to know is why they thought I was a better target than say ATPG or Sasaki?

[Reenk Roink]

Just actually read Atpg's full case.

In essence Atpg, you use quotes from the Prometheus game to prove that I taunt Mafia and that I have an "articulate" style.

Nonwithstanding the fact that The Prometheus was my first game back a long time ago and I have been following a decidedly different course of play after the lessons of Fillet Royale, the fact is in the Prometheus, I was happy to be back, I had a lot more time, and the game was very fresh. I did spend some time in that game. I usually taunt the Mafia, but my taunts in the Prometheus are unique, because as you know, I was Mafia.

Essentially you made an already tenuous case on writing style (and I'm going to indulge the parentheses claim and point out that if you bothered to check other games, you would have noticed that I do change my style :laugh4:) and failed to take into account the very special context of the game and the other topic.

As such, I feel that you are trying to obfuscate the fact that you are a bad guy by making long cases and also, feel somewhat insulted by my taunts at the Mafia, suggesting that you are one. :laugh4: :bow:

P.S: I don't like Shakespeare. :laugh4:

[GeneralHankerchief]

Reenk is an expert at changing his style. This writeup, at least somewhat, points to Reenk. Therefore, it is not Reenk.

If we get too caught up in writeup analysis in the midgame then we lose critical information that we can look back on for the endgame. I suggest everybody back off from this angle before it gets us all wrapped up in it.

[Sasaki Kojiro]

In the meantime, I'm prepared to go out on a limb and guess from the list of the living that Diana Abnoba may very well be capable of the Oswald kill/write up. Which I concur - was beautifully written :2thumbsup:

vote: Diana Abnoba

I haven't seen more than two lines from Abnoba?? This accusation is off the wall.

What percentage chance do you think reenk has of getting into hot water over the writeup?

[ULC]

The write up would not point to Reenk, unless, indeed, the person himself knew Reenk well enough to understand Reenk personality and social tendecies, as well as being able to mimic his writing style mentally - the write up is not forced, since it continues to keep the same consistency, meaning either their own writing style is close enough for them to do so, or they themselves have the same writing style.

I'd also like to point out that we switched from Oswald to Mikey Fingers when I died - someone have some form of sentimentality? This reeks to me of someone who can let his own feeling influence the game to an extent, that he enjoys simply playing and playing with people. Few people would expose names or numbers except Reenk.

I'm sorry Reenk, this is my own thoughts, not ATPG, and this is how I feel about what I have read - and yes, I did go over what ATPG posted, and have done my own searches. I am generally complimented on my writing and the level of articulation in it, but you are far beyond even me, and almost all here.

Also, your the only person who understands that since I have been playing mafia since way back in September, I have always been town - always. However, why not, if indeed my reasoning where to hold true, did you not pick me? Simply because I was a very late inclusion, and for all intents and purposes it appeared I would not be in the game, meaning you picked your mafia early on.

Thats if your the "Godfather", which I doubt - More then likely, someone else is Oswald, and your simply writing the kills for the player, which is actually fun for you and a good strategic move.

Once realizing that I was in, it was fine until I said something that made the game unfun for you - that, in it's usual sense, is the only reason you justify sending in the kill order for someone. Mafia is a game for you (as it should be) and your in to have fun, be fun, and make sure everyone else either knows it or has just as much fun as well.

The only thing I've done that might disturb you is name suspects, a small list of people my eye has been all game. I named Ituralde as a suspect, I named Seamus as one as well, and those where the only ones I really looked at before I was removed from voting. Otherwise I am, as usual, no threat to anyone, and actually am helpful to the mafia during the lategame. Obviously, I did something that cancelled my usefullness, I did something that made the game unfun (i.e., at this point make it quickly end).

FoS: Reenk Roink, Seamus

With Seamus as Godfather, and Reenk as a grunt. IMO, Reenk is not a Godfather this game, do not paint him in such a way, he is grunt, helping cover for the Godfather.

[Reenk Roink]

What percentage chance do you think reenk has of getting into hot water over the writeup?

6.27%

On one last note, it frankly smacks of elitism to say that only such and such a person with such and such education, intelligence, whatever would be able to produce such and such writeup. I don't know how any one can infer much about intelligence or education from Mafia games and internet posts.

I am of the opinion, that while there are some really good writers here, that almost everyone here who is a native speaker and old enough to have used the language a lot will be capable of writing up even the best write ups. I am of the opinion that most people can change their writing at will to whatever they want it to be.

I think the entire enterprise of write up analysis with regards to syntax or diction or style is just not worthwhile. All of these things are easily changeable.

Write up analysis with regard to theme is a little better, but again, only in certain contexts (we don't even know if pevergreen is writing most of the write ups or not) and also can be easily masked by just about anyone.

EDIT: Not you too YLC! I need someone to take up my banner. :cry:

[ULC]

Then your sense of equality does not apply to me Reenk, because I am not capable of it. I cannot change my writing style at all, because of how I think of the words. My thought process, not the thoughts themselves, cannot change, or are extremely hard to change. So in essence, allow me to refine my post slightly - There is a slight chance that someone else is writing it because they want to go to either A) extreme effort to frame you, or B) extreme effort to win, both of which are pointless in my eyes, and I am not one of those capable of doing so.

Also, please continue to ignore the rest of my statements and invalidate my emotional status. It makes me feel like Sasaki.

[Seamus Fermanagh]

I have a disagreement with your reasoning; in this game, the mafia families seem to be only killing once per night. A henchman dies, it is no big deal. If Sasaki and LittleGrizzly exposed themselves trying to save a henchman, it would make little sense. However, mafia games rarely make sense, so I suppose even though I disagree, anyone's opinion is valid here.


And White_Eyes, the writing style itself is completely different, as is the tone, in your examples.


Interesting case on Reenk, za-man. One of the better written ones you've done.

Remember, in assessing this mafia game, that it is a mafia battle. If you are limited to one kill and you are the only mafia, then protecting the Godfather is all. If you have to battle another mafia team, then numbers matter a lot in the endgame. You might not risk the GF to protect a member, but that doesn't mean you wouldn't put some kind of effort into it.


EDIT: Sasaki, you are correct that Boudica's case against Diana is thin. However, she has been pulling a pretty thorough lurk so far. This being the last phase of the midgame, getting our lurkers in play is worth a

Vote: Diana Abnoba.

What say you colleen?

[GeneralHankerchief]

What we need is some mafia crossfire to happen. Otherwise, the town will have to go six-for-six on the lynch, and I seriously doubt that happening.

[ULC]

EDIT: Not you too YLC! I need someone to take up my banner. :cry:

Why should I take up anyone's banner but my own? Why should I champion another player at all? I am not part of nay team, I am and have always worked alone, always doing what a group should be doing, as a single person.

Every one is suspect, there is no reason to champion anyone unless you have something to lose - I've already lost everything, and therefore have nothing more to lose. I have nothing to lose, I have no need to champion anyone.

This includes you Reenk, and anyone else I so :daisy: well choose. Unlike Sasaki, I am bitter, biting, and sarcastic without the humor. I am insane and cruel without being fun like you. I am emotional and rational without the logical side of ATPG. I follow people along like Seamus, but am never as insightful or to the point.

So Reenk, before asking me to pick up your flag without justification, where the :daisy: is my flag? Where is my banner, where is my champion?

[White_eyes:D]

What we need is some mafia crossfire to happen. Otherwise, the town will have to go six-for-six on the lynch, and I seriously doubt that happening.

Come on GH.....anyone else???? and for reference on GH's scum detector....It's "gut instinct" and it WORKS:grin2:

[Askthepizzaguy]

I knew it. I just knew, waking up, I would be the only vote on Reenk. Reenk could show up, declare that he wanted out of the game, post his actual mafia role pm, vote for himself, and you guys would think it was just Reenk being Reenk. It is possible, given his amazing skills, his ability to survive, that the English Godfather could choose him to be a henchman, you know.

But, since Reenk is getting a pass to survive the game, and it seems likely to me he's a henchman, not the Godfather, I say it's time we lynched a Godfather.

unvote,
vote: Yoyoma1910

In my estimation, Yoyoma, you are no townie. And Reenk is trying to pull of the big distraction to cover your butt, since you haven't posted here since the 23rd. And you voted for seireikhaan when he was an easy target, and Reenk (though I agree with Reenk) back when he was an easier target as well.

Lots of jokes, but no substance. Just trying to increase your post count, I'd suspect. You were here all yesterday, the 25th, and the 24th, and no posts here? Avoiding this thread, are we?

Yoyoma1910

votes FH
joke post 196
joke post 205
voted AVSM 250
joke post 334
vote Reenk 343 (easy target)
345... makes bolder case than I'd expect.
437- joke post
445- joke post
486- thinks "two blind mice" means the ira lost a member, when there is no other indication of that.
491- joke again
638- joke again
nothing page 9 votes for seireikhaan?

Reenk, you may well be a henchman, and well done. But I'm only interested in hitting the godfather. Since we're obviously not lynching you, let's take a shot at not only wiping out you, but your entire family.

[ULC]

I knew it. I just knew, waking up, I would be the only vote on Reenk. Reenk could show up, declare that he wanted out of the game, post his actual mafia role pm, vote for himself, and you guys would think it was just Reenk being Reenk. It is possible, given his amazing skills, his ability to survive, that the English Godfather could choose him to be a henchman, you know.

But, since Reenk is getting a pass to survive the game, and it seems likely to me he's a henchman, not the Godfather, I say it's time we lynched a Godfather.

unvote,
vote: Yoyoma1910

In my estimation, Yoyoma, you are no townie. And Reenk is trying to pull of the big distraction to cover your butt, since you haven't posted here since the 23rd. And you voted for seireikhaan when he was an easy target, and Reenk (though I agree with Reenk) back when he was an easier target as well.

Lots of jokes, but no substance. Just trying to increase your post count, I'd suspect. You were here all yesterday, the 25th, and the 24th, and no posts here? Avoiding this thread, are we?

Yoyoma1910

votes FH
joke post 196
joke post 205
voted AVSM 250
joke post 334
vote Reenk 343 (easy target)
345... makes bolder case than I'd expect.
437- joke post
445- joke post
486- thinks "two blind mice" means the ira lost a member, when there is no other indication of that.
491- joke again
638- joke again
nothing page 9 votes for seireikhaan?

Reenk, you may well be a henchman, and well done. But I'm only interested in hitting the godfather. Since we're obviously not lynching you, let's take a shot at not only wiping out you, but your entire family.

Way to acknowledge the premise of my theory, without actually acknowledging me for it.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Way to acknowledge the premise of my theory, without actually acknowledging me for it.

I didn't read your posts. I woke up and checked the vote tally to see if anyone, anywhere, anyhow, would ever vote for Reenk, even when a good case was made on him. They didn't.

Forgive me, YLC, but I do have my own brain and my own thoughts, and sometimes they are similar to yours without actually being yours.

[ULC]

I didn't read your posts. I woke up and checked the vote tally to see if anyone, anywhere, anyhow, would ever vote for Reenk, even when a good case was made on him. They didn't.

Forgive me, YLC, but I do have my own brain and my own thoughts, and sometimes they are similar to yours without actually being yours.

Or vice-versa. For some odd reason I tend to wait until the next page to read your posts sometimes.

[Reenk Roink]

I didn't read your posts. I woke up and checked the vote tally to see if anyone, anywhere, anyhow, would ever vote for Reenk, even when a good case was made on him. They didn't.

Forgive me, YLC, but I do have my own brain and my own thoughts, and sometimes they are similar to yours without actually being yours.

Your case wasn't really good Atpg. I already replied to it. Although you have really tried hard for the past couple games to hammer home a theory that I "get away" with things, perhaps the reason the town leaves me alone is because there is no good evidence against me? :idea:

I know you think there is, but that is because you made the case.

[Askthepizzaguy]

It was a good case. The writing style is nearly identical to yours, the tone is "upturned nose", the content, vocabulary, and literary references are those easily found by someone of your caliber.

The sad part is, I can actually pay you a compliment Reenk, and you still find ways to belittle my efforts. I consider that in-game, though, so I of course forgive you and shrug it off as best I can. But I see now how you were able to make it through Prometheus by yourself. You are indestructible.

[Reenk Roink]

You are merely repeating the points that have been refuted.

The tone is certainly not "upturned nose" rather it is taunting the Mafia to a greater degree (because it was me, usually I would not go as far as I did).

The writing style is nearly identical to MANY players, not just me. Every stylistic point you brought up is a characteristic of several players styles.

The entire point of content has been savaged earlier in my post about how any one familiar with the language could do the same.

Literary references is the worst point. I already said I don't like Shakespeare.

Vocabulatry? :laugh4: Already replied to in content.
Again, not a good case at all. You frankly did better in the GF3.

[Lord Winter]

Vote: YLC

Your last posts come off as too agressive.


@AtPG/Reenk

The only part that links the kill to Reenk is the clear Weenx imitation. That is all it is though an imitatioin. Look at the finer points it is missing the characteristic Wanax commentary that would Reenk put in on the Wenex kills. I'm not buying the match.

[ULC]

Vote: YLC

Your last posts come off as too agressive.


How about this as agressive - I AM :daisy:ING DEAD! Pay attention to the game more!

[Lord Winter]

Sorry didn't look at the status list.

Unvote: YLC

[Andres]

Checked the thread, Sasaki started his case against LittleGrizzly before GH asked us to vote Ituralde.

Unvote : Sasaki

[LittleGrizzly]

and funnily enough that invalidates my reason not to vote for him...

Vote sasaki

[Andres]

I have a disagreement with your reasoning; in this game, the mafia families seem to be only killing once per night. A henchman dies, it is no big deal. If Sasaki and LittleGrizzly exposed themselves trying to save a henchman, it would make little sense. However, mafia games rarely make sense, so I suppose even though I disagree, anyone's opinion is valid here.


And White_Eyes, the writing style itself is completely different, as is the tone, in your examples.

This doesn't sound like the usual ATPG to me.

Also, basing votes on the write-ups is usually not a good idea. And you're a more than decent writer yourself, ATPG.

[Askthepizzaguy]

You are merely repeating the points that have been refuted.

The tone is certainly not "upturned nose" rather it is taunting the Mafia to a greater degree (because it was me, usually I would not go as far as I did).

The writing style is nearly identical to MANY players, not just me. Every stylistic point you brought up is a characteristic of several players styles.

The entire point of content has been savaged earlier in my post about how any one familiar with the language could do the same.

Literary references is the worst point. I already said I don't like Shakespeare.

Vocabulatry? :laugh4: Already replied to in content.
Again, not a good case at all. You frankly did better in the GF3.

Oooo "savaged" nice. No "upturned nose" there. :laugh2:

You can say you don't like Shakespeare all you like; I believe you're pulling off a very ballsy tactic, which is again not uncommon for you. The point is that very few people here would bother trying to imitate you, and very few people could pull off such a stunning fake.

I'll even humor you. Which player's styles are you referring to? Give me names.

[Seamus Fermanagh]

Winter:

Lurk much?

Both you and Diana need to be more active at this point or you should be slain out of hand.

[Askthepizzaguy]

@Seamus-

She worked last night and she's working tonight. When she gets out of the shower, I'll prod her to contribute more here. :smash:

[Lord Winter]

Winter:

Lurk much?

Both you and Diana need to be more active at this point or you should be slain out of hand.

I know, I got behind in my reading here and I'm trying to catch up. To be honest I don't have a complete idea of what's going on.

[seireikhaan]

Vote: Diana Abnoba

Lurking is bad.

[Sasaki Kojiro]

Vote: Diana Abnoba

Lurking is bad.

:laugh4:

[Reenk Roink]

[QUOTE=Askthepizzaguy;2189816]Oooo "savaged" nice. No "upturned nose" there. :laugh2:

Um, Ok... :inquisitive: :rolleyes:


You can say you don't like Shakespeare all you like; I believe you're pulling off a very ballsy tactic, which is again not uncommon for you. The point is that very few people here would bother trying to imitate you, and very few people could pull off such a stunning fake.

I'll even humor you. Which player's styles are you referring to? Give me names.

TinCow, YLC, seireikhaan, General Hankerchief, Silver Rusher, Kommodus, Pannonian, Lord Winter, Caius, Jolt, boudica, Ichigo, Proletariat, Husar, Leet Erikson, disco, Ice, Crazed Rabbit, Xiahou, Seamus Fermanagh, pevergreen, Andres, Sasaki Kojiro, Yoyoma, CountArach, Askthepizzaguy, taka, Beefy.

Only really Aries and White eyes have distinct styles from what I see, and White eyes was EASILY able to mask his.

The fact is, the evidence you have given that this write up is mine is based off non write up posts from one game and a non Mafia game context.

One of your major points in analysis (the use of parentheses) was not even present. :wall: :wall: :wall:

[Diana Abnoba]

I am a nurse(pool and on call, at several hospitals) and I usually work 12 plus hours on the night shift. I can get called last minute to go into work, so I haven't been able to participate as much as I would like.

Vote: Yoyoma

I tend to believe that Yoyoma could be mafia, as pizza suggests. By the way, I appreciate the compliment but I can't type at all, haven't used a computer since 1995. If I sent such a kill, someone else would have wrote it. I was at work, I could not send the kill.

[FactionHeir]

ATPG could have written/sent it for you, seeing how you live together it seems.

[Askthepizzaguy]

[QUOTE=Askthepizzaguy;2189816]

Um, Ok... :inquisitive: :rolleyes:



TinCow, YLC, seireikhaan, General Hankerchief, Silver Rusher, Kommodus, Pannonian, Lord Winter, Caius, Jolt, boudica, Ichigo, Proletariat, Husar, Leet Erikson, disco, Ice, Crazed Rabbit, Xiahou, Seamus Fermanagh, pevergreen, Andres, Sasaki Kojiro, Yoyoma, CountArach, Askthepizzaguy, taka, Beefy.

Only really Aries and White eyes have distinct styles from what I see, and White eyes was EASILY able to mask his.

The fact is, the evidence you have given that this write up is mine is based off non write up posts from one game and a non Mafia game context.

One of your major points in analysis (the use of parentheses) was not even present. :wall: :wall: :wall:

1. You've been playing head games all game, but not really going after suspects.
2. WIFOM, WIFOM, WIFOM all game.
3. The players you mention aren't in this game, and your case is exceedingly weak that some of those players could have or would have written it.
4. If you were a townie, you wouldn't be so single-mindedly focused on just a couple people, myself included.
5. Pick a stance; I am guilty or innocent. First you defend me, then you accuse me, then you seem to think I am innocent, then you OMGUS vote. Frankly, it's inconsistent play. I won't argue with you Reenk, because no one besides me will ever vote for you anyway.

Why not drop your vote against me, seeing as it is useless, and do something constructive or productive with it?

[Reenk Roink]

Seamus, Yoyoma, it seems that Yoyoma is about to get the axe. Let us have revenge on one of those who voted for him.

I will send you a kill shortly where The Wanax will appear and summon the 1975 Philadelphia Flyers to kill whoever. Bobby Clarke will start things off with a two handed chop to the ankle and then Bernie Parent will go between the legs with his goalie stick for a hard blow to the groin. Dave Schultz will finish the victim off with a hammer. Of course Bill Barber will be diving the entire time.

[Askthepizzaguy]

ATPG could have written/sent it for you, seeing how you live together it seems.

You're suggesting she is Oswald, the henchman? You believe the Godfather picked her AND ME as henchmen. So that if one of us dies and is guilty, the other is a suspect.

I've already accused you of being less than a townie, FactionHeir, and you seem to be going for the easy targets. I don't think you care if we lynch townies at all, so long as it's not you.

[Reenk Roink]

1. You've been playing head games all game, but not really going after suspects.
2. WIFOM, WIFOM, WIFOM all game.
3. The players you mention aren't in this game, and your case is exceedingly weak that some of those players could have or would have written it.
4. If you were a townie, you wouldn't be so single-mindedly focused on just a couple people, myself included.
5. Pick a stance; I am guilty or innocent. First you defend me, then you accuse me, then you seem to think I am innocent, then you OMGUS vote. Frankly, it's inconsistent play. I won't argue with you Reenk, because no one besides me will ever vote for you anyway.

Why not drop your vote against me, seeing as it is useless, and do something constructive or productive with it?


1) So?
2) WIFOM is a myth.
3) Most of the players mentioned are in the game, the case is 1000000x stronger than yours.
4) Says who? How can you define townie behavior?
5) I'm not going to be constricted by how you want the game to be played. People don't vote for me because there is no reason, this shtick is kinda getting annoying to be honest.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Sorry I annoyed you, Reenk.

But since I'm provoking an emotional response where there should be none, as a townie you should be laughing at my ineptitude, instead you're getting defensive again... I'll drop it. I think you're a henchman, and there will be no bandwagon on you, and so I am looking for your Godfather.

That's all. Pleasant day. :bow:

[Reenk Roink]

Sorry I annoyed you, Reenk.

But since I'm provoking an emotional response where there should be none, as a townie you should be laughing at my ineptitude, instead you're getting defensive again... I'll drop it. I think you're a henchman, and there will be no bandwagon on you, and so I am looking for your Godfather.

That's all. Pleasant day. :bow:

I don't mind the accusations of WIFOM, the writeup analysis, or being called a henchman, but it's really unfair to repeatedly say that "the other players don't vote for me" when it's false. Like it's my fault people aren't thinking I'm guilty or believing your case.

[Askthepizzaguy]

It's not, but I am allowed to point out that you do get away with things that others would not. That's not a criticism of you, it's a compliment, and a scolding of the town. Which, I feel is deserved, but I doubt that they would agree.

I'm still entitled to my opinion and I don't really feel like arguing with anyone anymore about it.

[FactionHeir]

You're suggesting she is Oswald, the henchman? You believe the Godfather picked her AND ME as henchmen. So that if one of us dies and is guilty, the other is a suspect.

I've already accused you of being less than a townie, FactionHeir, and you seem to be going for the easy targets. I don't think you care if we lynch townies at all, so long as it's not you.

What I am saying is that RL is not a good excuse. Ever.

[Askthepizzaguy]

LOL

Ah, but it's not a good excuse only in cases where it suits you, FactionHeir. Sigurd has gotten a total pass this game even though he's posting elsewhere. But let the WOGs commence on that. Looking at the lurker chart, Askthepizzaguy 211
Sasaki Kojiro 73
pevergreen 56
Greyblades 53
Beefy187 44
Reenk Roink 44
YLC 42
GeneralHankerchief 40
LittleGrizzly 38
A Very Super Market 37
White_eyes:D 34
Seamus Fermanagh 30
FactionHeir 26
777Ares777 24
Andres 23
F.C is the bees knees 23
Ituralde 18
taka 18
boudica 16
Yoyoma1910 16
El Diablo 13
Captain Blackadder 12
Diana Abnoba 12
Shinseikhaan 11
Lord Winter 8
gaelic cowboy 7
Jolt 7
shlin28 6
Alexander the Pretty Good 3
CountArach 3
Psychonaut 3
Polemists 2
Sigurd 2

I see Sigurd, I see Lord Winter, I see Shinseikhaan. One of them has given a real life excuse. Wait, Lord Winter said he's got a lot of catching up to do. So that's two. I haven't heard much from Diana, but I know why, even though I shouldn't know why, I do, and perhaps thats why we shouldn't play games together, and yoyoma is intentionally avoiding the game as well. Boudica's posts aren't up to snuff, she's gone after me on bogus reasoning and also now Diana for suspect reasoning. Andres has been out of town for a while, but he's also done not a whole lot due to what? Real life excuses.

The list goes on. :medievalcheers: Cheers though. That writeup did not come from me, and I know it didn't come from her. And contrary to Reenks increasingly suspect opinion, not everyone here is capable of writing that Oswald kill. The few people who would be crazy enough to try it include him, and some other brilliant players. But the tone... the boldness... the psychology behind it... sounds so much like Reenk that I will be embarrassed if I am wrong. And if I am wrong, that will narrow down who Oswald is even further.

[Reenk Roink]

It's not, but I am allowed to point out that you do get away with things that others would not. That's not a criticism of you, it's a compliment, and a scolding of the town. Which, I feel is deserved, but I doubt that they would agree.

I'm still entitled to my opinion and I don't really feel like arguing with anyone anymore about it.

*points to the many times Reenk has been so very close to being lynched in both games where you brought this "observation" up*

[Askthepizzaguy]

close to being lynched is not the same as being lynched. I was close to being lynched round one; didn't mean squat. I got away with calling for my own head. That's a fact. You escaped the lynch too; near the mark is still off the mark.

Listen Reenk, I like you and respect you, even when we disagree. Since town isn't going to lynch you this round, and I'm done arguing with you, can we drop it amicably?

:bow:

[Sasaki Kojiro]

I don't get why grizz is getting a free pass here. Boudica either with her continued poor reasoning.

Yoyoma, I noted earlier, was suspicious of AVSM, who got killed by oswald. I dropped that because he followed up the next day bragging about how he'd known avsm was a bad guy, which seemed to bold for mafia. He's a better choice for reenk if you must lynch based on the writeup. But frankly the I don't see why it's been the focus of this round.

edit: Here's (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=2187034&postcount=814) the case I made on Grizz yesterday.

[Seamus Fermanagh]

I'm after thinking that we need a duel function in this game too.....Reenk v Pizza at 10 paces. Do you choose crossbows shooting rubber chickens or slingshots and grapes?

[Askthepizzaguy]

@Seamus and Sasaki

I'll tell you what!

If you lynch Reenk, I will suicide. I'm that convinced he needs to go. I know no one believes me, but I will bet my life on it.

[Reenk Roink]

Who is Maired or whatever?

Edit: Pizza, why are so intent on killing me? By the way you said nobody ever votes for me, not that nobody ever lynches me. I will fight tooth and nail to preserve my life, I need to be alive so my side can win.

[GeneralHankerchief]

Bill Barber didn't dive!!! :furious3:

Anyways, I think both of you guys are off in your accusations. I'm working on something that will relate to this game, will post it later.

[Askthepizzaguy]

I don't know, I can't be bothered to find Mairead. I am looking for Godfathers. But lynching a henchman reduces voting ability for the mafia, so... I'll take a chance to find the Godfather, failing that, I want to destroy as many henchmen as possible.

[Sasaki Kojiro]

Pizza. Reenk was tied 6-6 with taka on round two. You think he's the godfather?

[Askthepizzaguy]

Sasaki: I think he's a henchman, as I said.

[GeneralHankerchief]

Pizza. Reenk was tied 6-6 with taka on round two. You think he's the godfather?

It did happen with Beefy.

[White_eyes:D]

It did happen with Beefy.

That was over grammar errors.....and Beefy got off the hook, even though I put something like "BEEFED" in TinCow's kill write-up....:laugh4:

[GeneralHankerchief]

I apologize for not contributing more this round, I said I was going to look into things greater but today's been a really long day.

Vote: Abstain

Will try to get more into this tomorrow.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Tally


yoyoma: 3 (White_Eyes, Pizza, Diana)
Diana: 3 (boudica, Seamus, Shinsei)
Pizza: 1 (reenk)
Grizz: 1 (Sasaki)
Sasaki: 1 (Grizz)


Abstain: GH

[Yoyoma1910]

vote:yoyoma


For lurking everywhere.

[Askthepizzaguy]

:inquisitive:

There's only a couple hours left. I highly doubt you'll leave your vote there. Why the WIFOM?

[Lord Winter]

Vote: Abstain

I don't have the understanding of the game to even hope to start drawing meaningful conclusions. I will try to catch up tommarow and get try to establish some context.

[Askthepizzaguy]

unvote: Yoyoma1910
vote: LittleGrizzly

The discussion this round was ok at the beginning, but it's pretty poor at this point. I am also noticing a lot of abstains. Could it be possible that people are waiting to save their leader from the massive WIFOM? In the meantime, the more likely scenario, is we have bubkes. I am willing to give Sasaki's call on LittleGrizzly a try.

[Yoyoma1910]

:inquisitive:

There's only a couple hours left. I highly doubt you'll leave your vote there. Why the WIFOM?

You don't think I'll leave my vote there?


Watch me.

[Yoyoma1910]

If you really think I'm scum, then why did you change your vote?

FOS:Pizza

Something smells a bit fishy in here... must be the anchovies.

[A Very Super Market]

You totally should of quoted Pierre Trudeau right there

"Just Watch Me"


Anyways, the bigger games are so confusing at times...

Mike Fingers is dead, and now Oswald is back. So three blind mice WAS a ruse...

Other than that, I am completely lost.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Yoyoma1910:

First, a kind of WIFOM which I've not seen often... a capper self-vote. That's either extremely ballsy mafia play, or it's very cunning townie play. I simply don't have the heart to let you die for such a move. There is always next round. That is, if you actually keep your vote where it is. But then, intense suspicion on me for trying to save your life after that bold move. That's very interesting. And all these non-voters ready to swoop in at the last second to save you if you are mafia... very impressive strategy either way.

I applaud this tactic. Makes the game interesting. I just want to know, if you're willing to answer the question, why you've been deliberately avoiding posting here?

[Yoyoma1910]

:beatnik:

I like to watch from afar sometimes.

[Askthepizzaguy]

Any reason you're not willing to choose someone to vote for besides yourself? Instead of trying to prove your innocence, you could always vote for a suspect. Do you have any suspects, since you've been watching the thread?

Or is this all an act to save yourself? Time will tell.

[Yoyoma1910]

I wanted to see if you'd flinch.

[Askthepizzaguy]

You know what? I think that warrants a toast (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TUee1WvtQZU). :medievalcheers:

This is why I come here. You're indeed a challenging opponent, yoyoma, no matter what the game may be.




edit: By the way, I am definitely the bald guy in that scene. :bow:

[pevergreen]

Mike Fingers is dead, and now Oswald is back. So three blind mice WAS a ruse...

Other than that, I am completely lost.

Except Brendan is the one placing the cards.

[A Very Super Market]

Gah!

*Brain asplodes in my coffin

[pevergreen]

round extended for 90 minutes.

Going out to dinner with the family.

[Askthepizzaguy]

unvote: LittleGrizzly, vote: Yoyoma1910

For the Wine in Front of Him instead of actually trying to find suspects. I waited and waited and no one seems to want to make the choice. I gave you as much time as I could; townies should be willing to make the choice. A runoff would be fine, but I sent a message to pevergreen and he's not online at the moment. I do not know if there would be a double lynch.

I'm attempting to keep my personal life/knowledge/feelings out of this, but seriously, I never expected this situation. Sorry yoyoma... given the options, I am not very happy.

[pevergreen]

Voting closed, writeup coming.

[pevergreen]

The town was in tatters. The focus was among a few people, just namecalling. The biggest namecaller of them all got no votes at all. pevergreen just shook his head. People were just so stupid. Especially that yoyoma guy. He put the deciding vote on himself.

With reluctance, but with obvious enthusiam from Yoyoma, pevergreen called him up.

"How would you like to die?"

"Die? DIE? I'LL KILL MYSELF. YEEEE-HAAAWWWWW"

Yoyma ran around the group in circles, acting like a real cowboy. pevergreen was disgusted.

"I hate to waste ammo, but this guy is just too much"

A single shell downed Yoyoma, but it didnt shut him up. He kept on yee-haw'ing.

pevergreen sighed and dragged Beefy's dead body and put his arse into Yoyoma's mouth.

Yoyoma suffocated from the long-dead body of beef.



yoyoma: 4 (White_Eyes, ATPGuy, Diana, Yoyoma)
Diana: 3 (boudica, Seamus, Khaan)
ATPGuy: 1 (RR)
LG: 1 (Sasaki)
Sasaki: 1 (LG)
Abstain: 1 (Lord Winter)

Alive:
Andres
Askthepizzaguy
LittleGrizzly
Reenk Roink
GeneralHankerchief
Sasaki Kojiro
Lord Winter
White Eyes
Seamus
Factionheir
serierkhaan
Diana Abnoba
boudica
Sigurd
El Diablo

Dead:
Publius Aelius Hadrianus
A Very Super Market
Jolt
taka
Polemists
gaelic cowboy
Alexander the Pretty Good
CountArach
Psychonaut
YLC
Captain Blackadder
greyblades
shlin28

Lynched:
Beefy187
F.C is the bees knees
777ares777
Ituralde
yoyoma1910

It is now Night 6. Orders within 22 hours please.

[Askthepizzaguy]

I took a shower to wash the stink of failure off of me.

I apologize, everyone. Especially to Yoyoma, who I honestly thought had a shot at being a mafioso. I asked people for their advice on who else to vote for, and I didn't get diddley squat. I saw people lurking, people abstained, and the dead aren't even talking that much. I'd ask you guys to throw me a bone, but I know it will fall on deaf ears, like my repeated requests for tallies and tally rechecks.

When I wake up, I'll give thread a fresh look.

[boudica]

If everyone threw you a bone every time you asked, you could open a glue factory.:beam:

[Greyblades]

Dead musing: maybe ATPG is getting it wrong on purpose?

[Andres]

This doesn't sound like the usual ATPG to me.

Also, basing votes on the write-ups is usually not a good idea. And you're a more than decent writer yourself, ATPG.

ATPG ignoring an accusation?

:inquisitive:

What is this world coming to? O tempora, O mores!

[Askthepizzaguy]

If everyone threw you a bone every time you asked, you could open a glue factory.:beam::laugh4: Well, see here's the problem though. How many times have I asked you guys to throw me a bone? No, actually, I am being serious. Think about it. How many times? This goes out to everyone out there. I've asked and asked, but I've ended up ignored or dead most of the time. I can ask until I am blue in the face, but I usually end up blue and green and bloated and rotting.

Dead musing: maybe ATPG is getting it wrong on purpose?:wall:I assure you, I am trying my best. That's the sad part. I don't see a whole lot of effort from others, though, and when you guys give me abysmal choices like last round, you can't exactly blame me for the results.


ATPG ignoring an accusation? :inquisitive:
What is this world coming to? O tempora, O mores!Since you're never here, I didn't see the point. I've dealt with my fair share of accusations this game, and I'm done. You've had two chances to lynch me. Round one, and the round where I asked people not to vote for boudica when she and I were tied. You'll get another chance next round. Either make good on your accusations, or direct them towards some people who haven't been pressured all game. Have a pint. :medievalcheers:

To respond to your point; I am a good writer, but there are limits to what I can do. When I was reading those writeups, I had to keep an online dictionary handy in a second tab just to figure out what some of the words mean. They were put in there deliberately, because even educated people don't use them in casual conversation. However, someone who already is versed in high-level concepts (and I will admit, is on a higher intellectual plane than myself) could easily have produced the writeup. Since I know I did not do it, I felt it was actually more productive to accuse the people I felt were responsible. Someone in the English mafia knows his stuff, so kudos. But at the same time, I believe you guys did narrow down the list of suspects, because people who speak English as a second language did not write it, and people who have never ever spoken with that level of sophistication, I tend to rule out as the authors as well. Why is that such a stretch?

If you guys keep not lynching me, eventually one of the mafia families will get tired of me and murder me. So I still fail to see the point of responding to every accusation, especially the accusations I consider rather lazy, to be frank. No offense intended.

[Andres]

To respond to your point; I am a good writer, but there are limits to what I can do. When I was reading those writeups, I had to keep an online dictionary handy in a second tab just to figure out what some of the words mean. They were put in there deliberately, because even educated people don't use them in casual conversation. However, someone who already is versed in high-level concepts (and I will admit, is on a higher intellectual plane than myself) could easily have produced the writeup. Since I know I did not do it, I felt it was actually more productive to accuse the people I felt were responsible. Someone in the English mafia knows his stuff, so kudos. But at the same time, I believe you guys did narrow down the list of suspects, because people who speak English as a second language did not write it, and people who have never ever spoken with that level of sophistication, I tend to rule out as the authors as well. Why is that such a stretch?

If you guys keep not lynching me, eventually one of the mafia families will get tired of me and murder me. So I still fail to see the point of responding to every accusation, especially the accusations I consider rather lazy, to be frank. No offense intended.

You need a dictonary to understand your own language?

:inquisitive:

[ULC]

You need a dictonary to understand your own language?

:inquisitive:

The dictionary is close to one of the most useless collections of paper because you must know how to spell the word before you actually look it up, to spell it correctly ~;p

However, if there is a word your not familiar with, it's good for that.

So, Andres, where do you go to figure out what a word means when you yourself are not articulate with it or understand it's underlying concepts?

[Askthepizzaguy]

You need a dictonary to understand your own language?

:inquisitive:

You know how messed up the English language is. And yeah, I do, sometimes.

YLC, you started with a suspect list before you had to leave one day. I'm listening.

[Andres]

So, Andres, where do you go to figure out what a word means when you yourself are not articulate with it or understand it's underlying concepts?

My native tongue is Dutch and I understand it perfectly. If I stumble upon an unusual word (and that happens seldomly), then I can make up the meaning out of the context.

It just strikes me as strange that one has to look up words from his own native tongue, that's all :shrug:

[Askthepizzaguy]

Perhaps people put some thought into it when they were creating the Dutch language. :laugh2:

English, especially the kind spoken in the USA, is a butchered hodgepodge of all kind of various languages, themselves butchered hodgepodges of other more ancient languages. And some of the more advanced words, which I sometimes cannot understand from context, I have to look up.

Example; made up word.

"On the table there was a snarfledingle. It was perhaps the most unusual one I've ever seen."

I'd pull a dictionary for that one.

[Sasaki Kojiro]

My native tongue is Dutch and I understand it perfectly. If I stumble upon an unusual word (and that happens seldomly), then I can make up the meaning out of the context.

It just strikes me as strange that one has to look up words from his own native tongue, that's all :shrug:

What does "vicissitudes" mean?

However, I would say that words that have to be looked up in the dictionary while reading, can just as easily have been looked up while writing.

Pizza, I don't think pursuing writeup leads is a good idea at this stage of the game. Last round stagnated in part because of it imo, and it's much more effective in the late game. Plus, now that you've told the mafia who you think is capable of writing it, if you're wrong they're sure to leave that person alive.

edit: well, I understand if you think Reenk is the only person who could have written it. I don't think you can prove that though.

[Askthepizzaguy]

What does "vicissitudes" mean?

I looked it up, and I have to say, I'm still fuzzy on the concept.


However, I would say that words that have to be looked up in the dictionary while reading, can just as easily have been looked up while writing.

If they were totally random, perhaps... but then you'd notice a completely off-the-wall word stuck in there deliberately without flowing naturally from the context. For example:

"I was out all day, and after work, I returned home to my house and ordered a pizza. No one else was there. And so, I felt forlornness."

If someone who does not naturally use the words in question tries to accomplish the fake of appearing more intelligent or well-read than they are, there would be obvious, or perhaps less obvious but still apparent, signs. Do you really get from that writeup that the person was faking their knowledge? I don't. And I never, ever, speak with such eloquence, even when I am trying to do so. Call it WIFOM if you wish, it's just a fact. I could never reproduce the writeup in question, even if I had a thousand monkeys working at a thousand computers until the end of time.


Pizza, I don't think pursuing writeup leads is a good idea at this stage of the game. Last round stagnated in part because of it imo, and it's much more effective in the late game. Plus, now that you've told the mafia who you think is capable of writing it, if you're wrong they're sure to leave that person alive.

Sorry, I disagree. You have your methods, and they work. I have mine, they work sometimes. Best to have at least two different approaches. Better chance of success that way.


edit: well, I understand if you think Reenk is the only person who could have written it. I don't think you can prove that though.

Now that's interesting, Sasaki. You know full well there is no such thing as proof in a mafia game. Even detective reveals can be false. Even detectives can be insane, and get false results. No one is sure of anything, and in my games, people have roles they aren't even aware of.

Sasaki, you know better than to ask for proof. All I can offer is evidence.


edit: post 1000 woo hoo!~ :balloon3: