Koinon Hellenon: Athens X Sparta (.org X TWCenter), a participative AAR - Athenai [Archive] - Page 4

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Gaius Sempronius Gracchus

03-08-2011, 23:13

I propose sending a spy to infiltrate Halikarnassos and deliver report on the internal state of affairs of Halikarnassos to our next polis session.

I AGREE with this Rhobrios.

I PROPOSE that we expand the polis of Athenai (i.e. build the next governmental building)

I PROPOSE that we recruit Toxotai Kretikoi in Kydonia (if not possible yet, then expand the barracks there instead)

I PROPOSE that we send a diplomat to Kart-Hadast and on behalf of the Koinon offer peace + trade and also some monetary compansation (2000 mnai)

I PROPOSE that we make Nikaia a Free Allied Kingdom (Type IV)

I AGREE, also, with these proposals.

As for

I PROPOSE that we offer a peace treaty to the new Basileos tou Pontos

I am of a mind to agree with Green Lizard. So, as it stands at the moment I must DISAGREE with this proposal, but if it were amended to include the release of Sinope from Pontic oppression then I would AGREE. What say you, Arthouros?

A few proposals:

1: In the same line, we could send a scout to Sinope, just to see how the city is doing under the rule of Pontus. It would also show if they we're preparing an army.

2: We can improve the shools in Rhodes. Hopefully briliant minds would be drawn to the Island. (This could be done by establishing better contacs with Alexandië. I had heard that Alexandië is thé new center of learning in the known world).

I AGREE with these proposals.

Arthur, king of the Britons

03-09-2011, 16:46

I am of a mind to agree with Green Lizard. So, as it stands at the moment I must DISAGREE with this proposal, but if it were amended to include the release of Sinope from Pontic oppression then I would AGREE. What say you, Arthouros?

I say that the matter of Sinope slipped my mind, and as such I have withdrawn my proposal and changed it to this:

I PROPOSE that we offer a peace treaty to the new Basileos tou Pontos in exchange for Sinope, and if they refuse liberate it by force (in the future).

I also AGREE with Greenlizard0.'s proposals

Greenlizard0.

03-09-2011, 18:12

I PROPOSE that we offer a peace treaty to the new Basileos tou Pontos in exchange for Sinope, and if they refuse liberate it by force (in the future).

In that case I agree.

https://img96.imageshack.us/img96/3669/greenlizardportrait.png

Arthur, king of the Britons

03-10-2011, 11:35

Rhobrios:

1. I propose sending a spy to infiltrate Halikarnassos and deliver report on the internal state of affairs of Halikarnassos to our next polis session.

1. AGREE Arthouros, Greenlizard0, Demosthenes

Arthouros:

1. I PROPOSE that we expand the polis of Athenai (i.e. build the next governmental building)

2. I PROPOSE that we recruit Toxotai Kretikoi in Kydonia (if not possible yet, then expand the barracks there instead)

3. I PROPOSE that we send a diplomat to Kart-Hadast and on behalf of the Koinon offer peace + trade and also some monetary compansation (2000 mnai)

4. I PROPOSE that we make Nikaia a Free Allied Kingdom (Type IV)

5. I PROPOSE that we offer a peace treaty to the new Basileos tou Pontos in exchange for Sinope, and if they refuse liberate it by force (in the future).

1. AGREE Rhobrios, Greenlizard0, Demosthenes

2. AGREE Rhobrios, Greenlizard0, Demosthenes

3. AGREE Rhobrios, Greenlizard0, Demosthenes

4. AGREE Greenlizard0, Demosthenes DISAGREE Rhobrios

5. AGREE Greenlizard0

Greenlizard0:

1: In the same line, we could send a scout to Sinope, just to see how the city is doing under the rule of Pontus. It would also show if they we're preparing an army.

2: We can improve the schools in Rhodes. Hopefully brilliant minds would be drawn to the Island. (This could be done by establishing better contacts with Alexandria. I had heard that Alexandria is the new center of learning in the known world).

1. AGREE Rhobrios, Demosthenes, Arthouros

2. AGREE Rhobrios, Demosthenes, Arthouros

Populus Romanus

03-12-2011, 01:52

I think we are ready for an update.:yes:

Arthur, king of the Britons

03-13-2011, 00:39

Agreed.

Arthur, king of the Britons

03-16-2011, 17:43

Starting to itch for a new update...

jirisys

03-18-2011, 03:46

KABOOM!

Dead...

~Jirisys ()

Arthur, king of the Britons

03-18-2011, 15:06

Have a feeling Molina's not gonna like that...

jirisys

03-18-2011, 18:09

I am apathic to the plight of some voice-in-the-sky...

~Jirisys ()

Molinaargh

03-19-2011, 04:15

Sorry guys, I know it's been a long time since an update, but you'll have to wait some more.

The reason for this is my classes restarted and I'm getting used to the new routine.

There will be a new update soon, don't worry.

I'd say in 24 hours.

jirisys

03-19-2011, 04:16

Bugger :/

Don't worry mate.

~Jirisys ()

Populus Romanus

03-19-2011, 06:54

Molinaargh

03-19-2011, 22:48

The current polis session is now over.

Populus Romanus

03-20-2011, 01:06

The current polis session is now over.

Hurrah! Now, lets hope that people are still checking for an update here...

Molinaargh

03-20-2011, 02:49

248 BC

Polis motions:

Athenian motions:
(Yes)-Send a spy to infiltrate Halikarnassos and deliver report on the internal state of affairs of Halikarnassos to our next polis session.
(Not available)-Expand the polis of Athenai (i.e. build the next governmental building).
(Yes)-Recruit Toxotai Kretikoi in Kydonia (if not possible yet, then expand the barracks there instead).
(Conflicting with Spartan interests)-Send a diplomat to Kart-Hadast and on behalf of the Koinon offer peace + trade and also some monetary compansation (2000 mnai).
(Yes)-Make Nikaia a Free Allied Kingdom (Type IV).
(Yes)-Offer a peace treaty to the new Basileos tou Pontos in exchange for Sinope, and if they refuse liberate it by force (in the future).
(Yes)-Send a scout to Sinope, just to see how the city is doing under the rule of Pontus. It would also show if they are preparing an army.
(Yes)-Improve the schools in Rhodes. Hopefully brilliant minds would be drawn to the Island.

Spartan motions:
(Yes)-Agis to be separated from Doros - we would not want them murdering each other, would we?
(Yes)-Agis takes a portion of Spartans within the alliance army and returns to Byzantion, to guard against a possible Getic betrayal.
(Already commanding it)-Akrotatos to take over the Sparte Expeditionary Force.
(Yes)-Wait to attack Messana until we figure out why the hell the Romaioi crossed the Straights.
(Yes)-Train four units of Spartiate Hoplitai.
(Yes)-Raise a Stratia ton Peloponesos: This Stratia is to be raised in Sparte and Korinthos. The four Spartiate Hoplitai will be incuded in this.
(Yes)-Raise a Stratia ton Makedonia: This Stratia is to be raised in Pella, and it shall ideally include at least a few Phalangitai in this Stratia.
(Yes)-Constuct a fort at the place where the borders of Attike, Aitolia, and Thessalia meet.
(Possible)-Influence Rhodes into the Spartan sphere.

Peace of the East

By the end of the year, Agis turned his back on the Alliance Army and retreated to Byzantion, taking some Spartans with him. The Spartan Council feared he might try to take revenge on Doros - and even assassinate him - if he stayed with the Alliance Army.

https://i.imgur.com/wiGX6.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/yGpmP.jpg
Stupid old men! I am tired of being told what to do! First they send me with the Alliance Army under command of Doros to be humiliated, now they demand my retreat! When I am King...

In Rhodos the construction of a school was ordered, but this would not be the most important event to happen in that polis this year. You councilors must be aware of the situation by now, but I will explain the details later.

https://i.imgur.com/F9EEu.jpg

Constructions were finished throughout the hellenic poleis. In Nikaia a government allied to Athenai was established after Doros's conquest of the polis in the previous year.

https://i.imgur.com/wCraU.jpg

In Pergamon, the improved military barracks allowed the recruitment of powerful cavalry.

https://i.imgur.com/eYu8m.jpg

In Kretai, the Athenian council's wish to recruit the island's famously skilled archers led to the construction of a new armory.

https://i.imgur.com/mCLEW.jpg

In Sparte recruitment was already at full potential, as the polis gathered a great number of elite Spartan soldiers.

https://i.imgur.com/WZude.jpg

The same intense recruitment was ordered in Korinthos and Makedonia. But there the troops were far inferior.

https://i.imgur.com/hw3E8.jpg

In an attempt to solve this problem, Damasos used his power as Hegemon to build new barracks and recruit the stratia requested by the Spartan council.

https://i.imgur.com/fHBeJ.jpg

A well trained spy was sent to gather information on the polis of Halikarnassos.

https://i.imgur.com/VPIYn.jpg

But the polis seems to be heavily defended against spies. Perhaps they are hiding something they don't want us to know?

https://i.imgur.com/eg3tu.jpg

We could only gather a little information on Halikarnassos.

https://i.imgur.com/WbgAR.jpg

In Sinope our spies had no success either.

https://i.imgur.com/Nb077.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/8Bzyv.jpg

Peace can only come after war. In order to assert the Koinon's power in Anatolia, Poublios attacked, just south of Ipsos, the last Seleukid stratia in the region.

https://i.imgur.com/MidBC.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/3JKLK.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/0BdZV.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/tIw1q.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/FUwJt.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/NE1t1.jpg

With this victory and the stalemate with Pontos - who didn't dare move any closer to the Koinon Stratia - a peace deal was proposed between us and the other Anatolian powers: Pontos and Seleukeia.

https://i.imgur.com/btNzb.jpg

The experienced diplomat Xanthippos Siphnios led the negotiations. For this reason, the Peace of the East also became known as the Peace of Xanthippos.

https://i.imgur.com/5UrAB.jpg

A small value in reparations was paid so that the enemy Basileioi could return to their people saying they got something out of this war. Our payment was the vast territorial gain in Anatolia.

https://i.imgur.com/lWtIm.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/Nsxhh.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/VR2Pg.jpg

The Spartans decided to construct a fort to control the eastern border of Thermon.

https://i.imgur.com/pJTZv.jpg

The existence of a group of rebel peasants to the north was their excuse, but the Athenians knew the real purpose of the fort.

https://i.imgur.com/rZUv2.jpg

The intense Spartan recruitment was met with an answer from Athenai, which began recruitment of elite infantry themselves.

https://i.imgur.com/tiqMX.jpg

Such was the situation in southern Hellas:

https://i.imgur.com/u7HjV.jpg

In the north, the epeirotes began their final attack against the fort of Serdike.

https://i.imgur.com/dXXAW.jpg

With a force of smelly barbarians:

https://i.imgur.com/pOcuS.jpg

But not content with besieging our fort, they bypassed it and went straight for the heavily defended Serdike, trapping themselves in the process. They could be easily defeated with the help of our Getai allies.

https://i.imgur.com/P35VG.jpg

In the east there was peace after many years of war.

https://i.imgur.com/Zx9R7.jpg

The romans were defeated in Messana, and the strait was blocked once again by our ships. The garrison of the city was still very strong and would prove hard to take, if such order is given to Polemarchos Akrotatos.

https://i.imgur.com/cXy9G.jpg

The Rhodian Crisis

https://i.imgur.com/1hvNS.jpg

The polis of Sparte was already looking at establishing a new government in Rhodos, one favourable to Sparte. An opportunity to do this arose when a Rhodian married into the Agiad royal family. Androkadas married the second daughter of King Akrotatos, who was impressed by the man's popularity.

https://i.imgur.com/1MttP.jpg

The current governor of Rhodos, Eugenios, has remained strong in his position as governor of the island, but that was only because there was no one else to challenge his position. Androkadas could change everything.

Due to the Rhodian inclination towards Athenai, this marriage turned out to be yet another source of conflict between the poleis: Androkadas, as a Rhodian citizen, supposedly supports Athenai, but as a husband of a Spartan princess he has to be loyal to Sparte.

In reaction to this threat to his power, Eugenios has taken Eurythion Sybarites under his wing, a Spartan, hoping to use this friendship to avoid a challenge to his rule.

https://i.imgur.com/qdtht.jpg

Eugenios Rhodios has also written a letter to Strategos Doros, his friend, who is eager to wage a war...

https://i.imgur.com/X2NA4.jpg

Map of the Koinon by the end of 248 BC:

https://i.imgur.com/RbyaA.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/9106g.png
Polis session open!

Tyrfingr

03-20-2011, 12:24

Rhobrios takes the stand

Halikarnassos still refuses Athenian hegemony, and they go great lengths to hide their secrets from us, whatever they may be.

I propose that the army commanded by strategos Poublios to be re-trained and re-equipped at Pergamon, and then marched southwards for Halikarnassos. The weak must suffer the rule of the strong.

On to other matters, the peace of Xanthippos is a mockery to our rule. The treaty was nothing more than the beggings of cowards, "please stop hitting us", and we even gave them money to stay away! Such is the methods of the carthaginians, and not proud greeks! I will however honour the treaty and not agitate on further war with the pontic princes. It is however of note that no treaty has been reached with the seleukids, and that Side is but a few days march from our borders.

propose fortifications be erected in the mountain pass south of Ipsos, to check all seleukid armies from Side.

http://img.ihack.se/images/15129837156215.gif

Arthur, king of the Britons

03-20-2011, 14:49

I find your proposals to be very wise indeed Rhobrios, I AGREE

I PROPOSE that we continue to recruit elite troops in Athenai

I PROPOSE that as a response to Spartan fortifications we build fortifications in Attike, (one blocking entry to Attike from the Peloponnesos, and one north of Athenai).

I PROPOSE that we oppose any attempts on the part of the Spartans to gain control over Rhodes

I PROPOSE that we recruit heavy cavalry in Pergamon, and ship them over to Athenai to be part of our reserve force there

I PROPOSE that (if the other fleet is completed) we increase our naval strength by building a fleet of Trireme in Rhodes and when that fleet is completed, merge it with our fleet of Triereis.

I PROPOSE that our ships that are part of the Spartan fleet in the west return to our control and be part of our Athenian fleet (merge with our other fleets)

I PROPOSE that we build a fleet of Penteconterai when possible, in order to complement our fleet's heavier ships and giving it much needed numbers

Greenlizard0.

03-21-2011, 00:28

I agree to all proposals laid out, and would like to propose that we retreat our lend out groundtroops as wel. And we must think on how we are going to sooth the situation, the Koinon must survive.

https://img96.imageshack.us/img96/3669/greenlizardportrait.png

Populus Romanus

03-21-2011, 00:44

The Boule shall burn.Burn, I say! BURN!

jirisys

03-21-2011, 04:56

The Boule shall burn.Burn, I say! BURN!

I agree.

~Jirisys ()

Populus Romanus

03-21-2011, 05:48

I agree.

~Jirisys ()

http://www.sk8dork.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/01/wonder.jpg

Gaius Sempronius Gracchus

03-21-2011, 20:50

Rhobrios, I agree, Halikarnassos are being very secretive about their position. Much as it is generally against my nature to propose war against a free Hellenic polis, their actions leave a bad smell in the air. Is there treachoury afoot in that place? We cannot allow our hard won gains in Asia to be undermined by the possibility of their double-play.

I agree also that the peace of Xanthippos is a weak one. I thought that we here gave orders for peace with the Kingdom of Pontos only if Sinope was given over to our protection.

I AGREE with all of the proposals put before this council. With regards to my last pointy, I PROPOSE, once again, that spies and saboteurs be infiltrated into Sinope to undermine the infrastructure of Pontic rule therein.

I am also concerned as to the play being made by Sparte with regards to our allies in Rhodos. My good friend Eugenios is concerned also. I think we should watch very carefully the actions of Sparte from here on. If anything untoward should occur to Eugenios....any 'accidents' that might befall him, then I would take this not only as a threat to our freedom, but also as a personal matter - as I believe all good Athenai should.

Populus Romanus

03-23-2011, 22:07

Yes, the peace of Xanthippos does not look like it shall last particularly long. I would recommend not letting your guard down in Mikra Asia.:wink:

Tyrfingr

03-25-2011, 21:03

The room had gone silent for several minutes before Rhobrios once more took the stand.

- The passive mood of this polis session is somewhat frightening. I agree to Arthorious propositions, as well to Green Lizard's.

http://img.ihack.se/images/15129837156215.gif

Populus Romanus

03-26-2011, 00:45

I think that is enough to make an update, no? We have plenty at TWCenter, and enough here to scrape together an update.

Molinaargh

03-27-2011, 04:26

248 BC
In times of trouble, a question arises.

https://i.imgur.com/O7YTz.jpg

Danger looms the Koinon. The retreat of Agis with the Spartans, the construction of fortifications in Hellas, the Athenian intentions of ending the war with Carthage - a war fought by Sparta - and, if all that wasn't enough, the Rhodian Crisis that puts Athenai and Sparte in direct confrontation over the island, all those factors have contributed to times of trouble in the Koinon.

Troubles even greater than those of the beginning of the hellenic union, when the still young and fragile alliance was shaken by the Athenian decision of not letting Spartans through Attike. The Koinon survived those confrontations and those times are past us, but there is still much disunity between the poleis.

Now more than ever.

https://i.imgur.com/NiIza.jpg

In these troubled times we live, a great philosophy debate has been called all around the Koinon to celebrate the anniversary of the death Sokrates, 150 years ago.

It is being sponsored by the cultured athenian Nikanor Aithalidos, brother of Strategos Doros. Thinking of the the two hegemonic powers of the Koinon, the rivalries between strategoi, and the differences between polis parties, he puts forth the very relevant question:

https://i.imgur.com/KDAG8.jpg

Why are men divided?

It is up to the great men of the Koinon to answer. You, of course, herculean councilors and assemblymen!

The answers may be as short as a phrase and as long as the writer wishes. Although Athenai is famous for its philosophical abilities, citizens from all poleis of the Koinon may participate in the debate. The Spartan martial wisdom may prove valuable as well.

Nikanor, an avid reader of epic poems, socratic dialogues and a fan of greek plays, is expecting much creativity from the participants. He is particularly fond of our Koinon's history and would love to see some of our great men as characters, as examples included in the writings. Those in Hades, Elysium, and those still with us, councilors and strategoi, governors and assemblymen, Athenians and Spartans.

Results

As a true Athenian, Nikanor has said that the winner will be decided through a grand voting. This voting will be held a week from now (Saturday, April 2), at which time the debate will end.

The winner will receive the title of Megas Philosophos, given by the authorities of the Koinon Hellenon, and will join the Koinon Hellenon Pantheion, to be remembered throughout history.

May the debate begin!

jirisys

03-27-2011, 05:02

(...)when the still young and fragile alliance was shaken by the Athenian decision of not letting Spartans through Attike. The Koinon survived those confrontations and those times are past us(...)

I'd like to point out that those are thanks to me. My lasts post could apply to this, as I do not wish to say it again. Though if you wait 5 more years, my participation might become less sporadic.

Also I want to reccomend that you use Megas Methuselah's civil war method (having the battles on custom battle and removing the men from their armies).

~Jirisys ()

Populus Romanus

03-27-2011, 06:16

Molinaargh

03-27-2011, 15:47

I'd like to point out that those are thanks to me. My lasts post could apply to this, as I do not wish to say it again. Though if you wait 5 more years, my participation might become less sporadic.

Also I want to reccomend that you use Megas Methuselah's civil war method (having the battles on custom battle and removing the men from their armies).

~Jirisys ()
Do not take full credit for something you have no full credit for. Even if it was your proposal, proposals need approval, so it is not your sole doing, but of the Boule.

I disagree with your recommendation and will use my own method as I see it as better.

Also, I wouldn't wait a second for you. You can try to catch up if you want.

Gaius Sempronius Gracchus

03-27-2011, 17:08

Why are men divided? Can there be an answer? There are many sides to this question. If one takes the Socratic position, then only through conflict can truth be reached. Perhaps it is because the gods no longer speak to us directly, as they did in the time that Homer wrote about, and our connection to them is through the oracles - where they couch their advice to us in tongues and riddles. Is there conflict between us because the gods will it so? Or is there conflict between men because we will our own laws and, by doing so, usurp the divine law? When Creon left Polyneices to rot in the streets, as Sophocles' tragedy would have it, did he not usurp divine law? Did he not cast his own vision of law and place it above those of the gods?

Populus Romanus

03-27-2011, 17:55

the Socratic position...Sophocles' tragedyThis has my vote.

jirisys

03-27-2011, 22:18

Do not take full credit for something you have no full credit for. Even if it was your proposal, proposals need approval, so it is not your sole doing, but of the Boule.

It was my idea, my credit, their assistance, their credit.

I disagree with your recommendation and will use my own method as I see it as better.

It's not a matter of disagreeing, I was just voicing what it seemed fit.

Also, I wouldn't wait a second for you. You can try to catch up if you want.

I didn't ask you to wait, and it seems you should learn to watch your tone. I said that when you reached 5 more years I would join again. That means hurry up.

~Jirisys ()

Molinaargh

03-27-2011, 23:15

and it seems you should learn to watch your tone.
Nope.

I'm adding you to my ignore list, you're out of this AAR.

Maybe you should have watched your tone all along?

jirisys

03-27-2011, 23:38

Nope.

I'm adding you to my ignore list, you're out of this AAR.

Maybe you should have watched your tone all along?

Not really, unless you can convince people that vote and propose that they ignore me, then it is done. If not, well, people will get upset that their proposals, proposals they voted on and possibly their vote on prytaneis be ignored.

My tone has been of having fun, yours has been of conflict. I know why men are so divided, because you wanted them to be divided and therefore have something interesting (such as a civil war or an island dispute) might happen again.

~Jirisys ()

Molinaargh

03-28-2011, 00:07

The Banishment of Leumenes

https://i.imgur.com/lYXkM.jpg

The Dikastai, supreme judges of the Koinon Hellenon, have banished the Athenian citizen Leumenes (jirisys) from all poleis of the Alliance, as well as his son and the rest of his family. His lands and belongings have been confiscated.

Leumenes will undergo a permanent Ostrakismos, sent in exile to an unknown location, from which he can never return.

He is now an enemy of the state. Any who aid him to return or in any way influence the decisions of the assemblies are subject to trial, exile and death. Leumenes and his family are also subject to death should they be found in Koinon territory and brought to the authorities.

The charges for which he was condemned were of: possible participation in the murder of Strategos King Areus of Sparta, at which event Doros of Athens became Strategos; direspect towards Koinon officials, therefore disrespecting our beloved Koinon itself; delusions of greatness that threatened Athenian democracy and all of the alliance; and a dangerous and volatile personality that led him to serve his own interests rather than those of the Koinon Hellenon.

From now on, any citizen of any polis of the Koinon Hellenon is authorized to kill Leumenes or any other man under his command in allied territory.

jirisys

03-28-2011, 00:55

Hello. Kill me. Now...

You can't? Too bad, I want my party and my party logo be removed inmediately from each of your posts.

~Jirisys ()

Populus Romanus

03-28-2011, 01:07

Too bad for you. He can't see what you wrote!

Molinaargh

03-28-2011, 01:14

IC (In-Character): Leumenes is dead. He was found trying to sneak into Sparta and killed by the Spartan Krypteia, the polis's secret police. None shall mourn his death.

OOC (Out-of-character): All posts made by jirisys in this thread, as well as any posts related to him, will be completely ignored for the purpose of this AAR. This means that his agreements/disagreements will not count, and his proposals will not count, and any attempts of his participation will not count, in order to reflect the IC condition above.

jirisys

03-28-2011, 01:26

Too bad for you. He can't see what you wrote!

Then quote it...

~Jirisys ()

The_Blacksmith

03-28-2011, 01:49

"Men are divided by the different ways Apollos rays shine though our eyes and thus eluminates our worlds differently"

(sorry if there is any typos, im very tired)

Walle

03-28-2011, 08:51

Oh snap Molinaargh, that was kind of harsh :tongue: However, I agree with your decision, jirisys has been pretty obnoxious.

Tyrfingr

03-28-2011, 11:31

Ludens

03-28-2011, 16:26

jirisys

03-28-2011, 18:31

If that's IC, shouldn't you use his IC name? :inquisitive:

@ Jirisys: please refrain from further posts in this thread. It is not worth starting a fight over.

@ everyone else: don't turn this into a bash-Jirisys thread, please.

Yes he should.

Yeah, ok. So sad it had to end this way. But hey... You know me Ludens :grin:

Too bad you ended it so... Ungloriously, anyways.

Don't worry, I won't hold a dumb grudge against anybody.

~Jirisys ()

Pyrrhus The Great

03-30-2011, 05:40

Hello everyone. Nice AAR Ive been following for a while and enjoy it very much. :)

Pyrrhus The Great

03-30-2011, 05:51

Just felt like I would comment on what happened. I think (for whoever cares) Jirisys was treated a little bit rudely for how he acted on previous occassions (which he has apologized for). It seems like he was just having fun saying it was him who saved the alliance which isnt totally incorrect. The civil war comment was just his opinion on how it should be handled. Of course he does act childish at times but he has contributed a lot to the AAR and he seems like a nice fellow. Just a newbies two cents.

Populus Romanus

03-30-2011, 06:01

Hello everyone. Nice AAR Ive been following for a while and enjoy it very much. :)

Hello Pyrrhus The Great, and welcome to the .Org and EB AARs!

Greenlizard0.

03-30-2011, 12:26

(IC): The sudden bannishment and death of Leumenes was not expected. It shocked our party so much, that there was no chance of recovering. As the current Party Leader I officialy demolish the party.

(OOC): - I am sorry for you Jirisys. I liked to be in your party.
- (To Napoleon The Emperor Of Europe): I hadn´t seen earlier that you wanted to join the group. My apologies to you.
- (To Phyrros): Welcome.

Arthur, king of the Britons

04-03-2011, 15:38

Let the update begin! Uhm hi, I'm Arthur, king of the Britons/Arthouros by the way (changed my user name)

Molinaargh

04-04-2011, 14:35

The entries for the Great Philosophy Debate are now over. The voting to decide the winner, who will receive the title of Megas Philosophos, will begin shortly, once I present all the answers and explain the voting rules.

Molinaargh

04-04-2011, 15:02

https://i.imgur.com/NiIza.jpg
VOTING

Entries:

https://img819.imageshack.us/img819/3720/spartasmall.pngSpartan entries:

Alexandros of Sparta (♔Agamemnon♔)

People are divided because their race, class and ethnicity require it. We are Spartans, of good Heraclidae and Dorian blood. Athenians are Ionians, thus making them inferior to the master race.

Uh-oh...
People are divided because of wealth. People are greedy, for money, for power, for status, anything, and that causes conflict among people. In their own regions, like-minded people form groups to reach their goals, while people that disagree form other groups to oppose them. In this way division starts, and then people just continue the rivalries of their fathers.

Heliokles (Populus Romanus)

Men are divided for protection of their own interests. First, a person will band together with a group of individuals who share their own ambitions and concerns. Together, they work together towards common goals. Over time, these groups grow strong bonds of community, friendship, trust, and eventually, nationhood. With nationhood, people recognize that their interests are different from others not part of their circle, often times even in conflict with theirs. Because outsiders may not share the same morals and desires, people fear outsiders and those who are different. They soon compete with other nations, and this leads to mistrust. And with mistrust, the possibility for being united vanishes like wisp of smoke.

Agis (savage feat)

People are divided cause some suck(*cough*Athenians*cough*) and others(Spartans *cough**cough*) are awesome.

Eshmunkilletz (scutarilegion)

Men are divided, because of ethnics and/or ideals. Different people see things differently, and it can be hard to form a common view. These differences and misunderstoodings may lead them to despise each other and see the other group as untrustworthy. This will eventually lead to hostility, if it's not intercepted. In our koinon, we are being lead to a civil strife, because the lack of communication between the councils. Sure, people from one council tend to visit the other, but we aren't planning as one.This can be most evidentally seen in atheneans attempting peace with carthageneans, even though spartans started the war. We should start acting commonly right away, by deciding the best situation for the rhodian crisis, instead of fighting for the control of the island, which will soon brings us to civil war.

Fellow hellenes! Let us work as one, and not bicker amongst ourselves!

Areos (|Sith|2|Lazyo)

Pride

Nikolas (ArtoriusRex)

Nikolas entered the Council with a bright smile, a scroll in hand. He said "Men of Sparta! I promised you a great tale, and here it is, settle back and listen to my tale."

'The night, long in the coming, settled like a great cloak and I, praying for guidence over our division, fell to sleep, still on guard. When my eyes opened, I was standing before the judgement place, Hades presiding on the throne, blind Justice to his right, and Thanatos, sickle bright, on the left. "Dread Lord," I said "Am I dead?" The lord of death stared at me with cold eyes, and gave a smile which could send most fleeing in terror "No, brave Spartan. This day I do you a favor. Athena has spoken with me, and has decided that only by speaking to those who are past will you see the origin of Mankind's division." I stammered through my thanks and Hades waved to Justice who came to my side and took my hand, and walked me to the Elysium Fields, where Areas and Cherimodes sat side by side, drinking nectar and laughing in merriment. Areas looked up, and seeing me, smiled "Nikolas, old friend, welcome to Elysium, how goes things in the land of the living?" and so I told all that had gone on since his death. Cherimodes sat up straight when he heard of the death of Leumenes and swore that it must be a mistake. I shook my head "No good Athenian, Leumenes is dead, slain by trying to enter Sparta and recover his wife and son, who now live in exile." He swore and demanded he be set free to take revenge. Justice shook her head "Leumenes has done much wrong-doing in his life, but Lord Hades cannot decide his fate, for now he awaits in the Dread Lord's cells, to find his fate."

Areas shook his head "I swear to the gods that I wasn't poisoned, and if I was then it wasn't Leumenes." Justice gave a sly smile "I cannot say, but answer this Spartan, why don't you quarrel with this Athenian?" Areas shrugged "He is a man, and I shall treat him as such. Being from Athens makes no difference." Justice smiled and tugged my hand but I had one last question to ask "Wait! Where are my comrades?" Areas shook his head "Gone to the river Leeth to be reborn, they couldn't stand to be in the company of Athenians in Elysium, thought that there was a mistake, and the Athenians thought the same." He shook his head "Poor fools..." And before I could say anything else Justice took me along to go meet with the Titan Prometheus, the Lord of Fire and the Maker of Man. Justice smiled up at him and said "The time has come to tell of the Division." The Titan Lord smiled "Ah, a tale I have never told, listen well Spartan, and heed my words. Long ago, when I gave fire to man, I realized that they would use it without thinking, would destroy the world- so I summoned the wisest of men, led by Ionas, and told them to administer judgement and to distribute the flame. But these men were weak, and easily threatened so Doros the warrior came, and his men guarded the fire so the Judges could do their job without threat, understand if you will that neither group was better than the other. Eventually though, man grew restless and men muttered and complained, saying that I favoured those who were good at a certain craft, and that they must be better than they, and so men began to fall away into the Barbaroi tribes while the Judges and Warriors stayed together in Hellas. Eventually though, they too fell for the poisonous lies, and began to argue as to who was greatest. Soon war tore Hellas apart, and the sons and followers of Ionas and Doros have been enemies ever since. Do you understand how men are divided, small one? They are divided by arrogance and pride, by the belief that a single duty is superior to another, let not this wisdom fall to darkness." And then I woke.'

"Men of Sparta, heed these words, let us offer friendship to Athens and see how we are to be consoled! Also, I request for the repeal of charges against the wife and son of Leumenes, who did nothing wrong."

https://img59.imageshack.us/img59/6530/athenssmall.pngAthenian entries:

Demosthenes (Gaius Sempronius Gracchus)

Why are men divided? Can there be an answer? There are many sides to this question. If one takes the Socratic position, then only through conflict can truth be reached. Perhaps it is because the gods no longer speak to us directly, as they did in the time that Homer wrote about, and our connection to them is through the oracles - where they couch their advice to us in tongues and riddles. Is there conflict between us because the gods will it so? Or is there conflict between men because we will our own laws and, by doing so, usurp the divine law? When Creon left Polyneices to rot in the streets, as Sophocles' tragedy would have it, did he not usurp divine law? Did he not cast his own vision of law and place it above those of the gods?

(The Blacksmith)

"Men are divided by the different ways Apollos rays shine though our eyes and thus eluminates our worlds differently"

Voting Rules

Votes will take place here in the assemblies just like proposals and agreements.

You may vote for 1 entry that is not your own.

You may vote for an entry from any city, which means an Athenian can vote for a Spartan or an Athenian and vice-versa.

Also, to make the process easier, begin your post with "I VOTE for X". You can then justify your vote if you wish.

Please read all the entries before voting and may the voting begin!

Arthur, king of the Britons

04-04-2011, 19:22

I VOTE for Demosthenes' entry.

Gaius Sempronius Gracchus

04-04-2011, 19:41

I VOTE for Nikolas' entry. I nearly voted for Areos', just because it was so....Spartan, but Nicolas' entertained me and was well conceived and written.

Greenlizard0.

04-04-2011, 20:29

I also vote for Demosthenes . (Almost had I voted for Eshmunkilletz or Nicolas, yet I changed my mind).

Populus Romanus

04-04-2011, 23:10

My name is Heliokles. :P

Tyrfingr

04-13-2011, 22:01

I fear for the life of this AAR...

Populus Romanus

04-14-2011, 03:46

It is weird. On the TWC thread Molina posted saying in as many words that it would be a long time before the next update, but he never posted that here.

fomalhaut

04-15-2011, 07:16

this AAR is very cool, let us hope it lives yet.

Arthur, king of the Britons

04-15-2011, 14:37

Yeah, let's hope it stays with us for some time.

Vaginacles

04-20-2011, 00:45

This is why god is a dictator and not a democrat

Populus Romanus

04-20-2011, 00:48

If God had to be pagan, he would be Spartan. Beat that.

Arthur, king of the Britons

04-20-2011, 16:24

Okay... I have no idea what you two are talking about. :shrug:

Molinaargh

04-23-2011, 17:51

248 BC
The Last Drop

https://i.imgur.com/ZywTh.jpg

A letter from Molinas Hermaios, former messenger of the Koinon Hellenon

There was something wrong that night. The stars were fading out in the sky. The wind was blowing low, warm in our feet.

It was like the gods had abandoned us.

https://i.imgur.com/UVA2P.jpg

We were stationed in Bythinia. I was going to deliver the orders of the athenian assembly to the strategos. But I knew something was going to happen.

I knew the orders were never to be delivered.

When I got to Doros's tent, there was a mob around it and the men ran for their weapons and armor. I heard screams, one of them: "Doros has been assassinated!"

Another: "By the Spartans!"

Fighting began soon after. This was the encampment of the Koinon Stratia: there were Athenians and Spartans, Rhodians and Korinthians. The Strategos was dead. The athenians did not take his death lightly, and so did not the spartans towards the accusations.

I apologize to the brave readers of this letter, but I had to flee.

The civil war began that night.

Molinas Hermaios,
Alexandreia, 247 BC

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5FSFOT0UR94

Due to his grudges with Doros and his involvment in the Krypteia, Agis was rumored to have been the murderer.

https://i.imgur.com/W4oIK.jpg
Yes! I killed him! It was me! I did it! HAHAHA!

Meanwhile, a Spartan coup attempt was intercepted in Rhodos. Private troops, rumored to be financed by the Spartan royalty, landed secretly in Rhodos in an attempt to coup the polis. After a night of fighting in the streets and in the palace, Eugenios Rhodios and the loyalists emerged victorious. The Rhodian Crisis was solved by blood.

https://i.imgur.com/W4oIK.jpg
It was me! I killed them too! I killed everyone! HAHAHAHA!

Agis had not taken well the lack of support by his own polis to him in the last elections, when he wanted support to be re-elected as Strategos. The accusations, even by his friends, after the death of Doros where the last drop. The heir to the Spartan Eurypontid throne has gone mad.

https://i.imgur.com/ugToz.jpg
Which is why you need me, fellow Spartans. I am Damasos Souniakos of Sparte, Tyrannos of Makedonia and husband of Hermine Agiados of the royal famliy. The civil war is coming now, it is inevitable. And in these times Sparta cannot afford to have a mad man in the throne!

https://i.imgur.com/ugToz.jpg
Make me heir to the throne in this madman's place. It is the only good thing you can do for your polis.

My only wish is to serve Sparte. If you refuse this, I will have to find another way to serve my polis: I will have to side with the Athenians to rise to the Spartan throne after this war is over.

https://i.imgur.com/ugToz.jpg
You must do the right thing for Sparte.

https://i.imgur.com/NVxtS.jpg

A group of richly ornamented infantry triumphantly entered Athenai.

Leading them was a man wearing bloody robes and a war helm.

His name?

Doros Aithalidos Attikos.

https://i.imgur.com/x094O.jpg
I live!

https://i.imgur.com/x094O.jpg
The people have acclaimed me as a hero in my journey back to my home Athenai! They need me, they know I am the last great man in Athenai - they cried with the news of my death, but now that they see the Spartans have failed to kill me, they see hope!

I ask you: could some Spartan assassinate Herakles? Could one assassinate Odysseos? Likewise, they could obviously not assassinate me!

https://i.imgur.com/x094O.jpg
I am here to save Athenai. There will be a war, one like never before, and I will lead our polis to victory.

With the support of the people, I declare myself Tyrannos of Athenai.

Men of the Assembly, I am the only Athenian strategos able to win this war.

You must support me!

https://i.imgur.com/eEj35.jpg

Some claimed Doros staged his own assassination in order to start the civil war and rise to power in Athens as a tyrannos. "You'd think he had plenty of time to clean those bloody robes, or wear new ones!" said the philosophers.

Will the Athenians side with their Strategos, risking a tyranny that could destroy Athenian democracy?

Will the Spartans remain loyal to a mad king, or will they replace the rightful heir with Damasos, who will otherwise betray Sparte and side with the Athenians in the Civil War?

The future is in your hands, wise men of the assemblies!

https://i.imgur.com/A6rGS.png

The Koinon Hellenon is no more. Those times are past us.

These are times of civil war.

https://i.imgur.com/SjZZ3.jpg

OOC NOTES:

Hello. This update ends the first part of this AAR, "Koinon Hellenon", and thus ends this thread.

The AAR will continue in a second thread that will be made in the future. When? I'm not sure. I'd say July is a good estimate, so that's 2 months from now. I apologize to those who want it sooner.

You guys may of course continue to discuss plans for the next moves in this thread.

I will not be gone at all during this break time as well, I'll be here talking to you guys. I can answer any questions you might have.

I'd like to thank everyone who read and participated in this AAR so far, especially:

Sparte (TWC forums):

Populus Romanus
savage feat
Diomede
MIDN Mainolfi
Arthur, king of the Britons
scutarilegion
ArtoriusRex
Cannibalking
♔Agamemnon♔
|Sith|2|Lazyo
Maiar93
_Augustus_
Ranger Blue
Phalangites
Cassibellane
Gotenus
Vercingetorix King of Gauls
Beckitz
Xoxoman
ReD_OcToBeR
lmt96
Zarniwoop
Paltmull
Greenlizard0.
XxAndrewxX2525
Beer Money
HUtH
Wulfburk
dezikeizer

Athenai (.org forums):

Sir Ian Kevin Curtis
Gaius Sempronius Gracchus
Paltmull
Walle
Vaginacles
Greenlizard0.
fireblade
Jaertecken
The_Blacksmith
Biowulf
Drag0nUL
Enyalio
Rahl
Titus Marcellus Scato
pockettank
Lazy O
Unintended BM
Antinous
Octavian I
Iron Fist
Hotseat_User
Pyrrhus The Great
G. Septimus
fomalhaut
Ludens
huth
Sdragon

Thanks everyone!

Populus Romanus

04-23-2011, 18:21

You're going down, :daisy:es! Muwahahahahaha!

Arthur, king of the Britons

04-23-2011, 18:34

Athenoi! I have created a usergroup for us, as a place where we can discuss the battle plans in secrecy: https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/group.php?groupid=157

You're going down, :daisy:es! Muwahahahahaha!

We'll just have to see about that, binky boy!

Walle

04-23-2011, 21:09

Thanks Molinaargh for putting me on the "thanks" list, even though I haven't been around much lately. I'll try to be more involved once you start updating again!

Arthur, king of the Britons

04-24-2011, 11:52

Molinaargh

04-24-2011, 14:14

Molina, I was thinking of advertising this AAR in the Gameroom (or whatever place these sorts of things are normally advertised), to gather more active members here at the org. Silly as it may sound; I wonder is that okay with you?

Also, the last update was awesome, epic video etc. Thank you very much for this AAR, and know that we will look forward to its follow-up AAR. :bow:
Sure, I'd be honored. It's a bit unfortunate timing since the AAR is on hold, but I guess people can still read the previous updates. There's the summary in the TWC for easy browsing and reading, I've linked it in the first post of this thread.

Glad you liked the video, I spent way too much time in it just because I was having so much fun. But I should've recorded better battle footage, more epic shots of the armies perhaps.

Arthur, king of the Britons

04-25-2011, 10:51

Update regarding the usergroup: I've changed it to an invite only group temporarily, but it will relatively soon be open to all other orgah's (with the exception of Spartan spies. I've invited all who've posted/proposed in this thread, and for those invited; please accept the invitation as soon as possible. Thank you.

Sure, I'd be honored. It's a bit unfortunate timing since the AAR is on hold, but I guess people can still read the previous updates. There's the summary in the TWC for easy browsing and reading, I've linked it in the first post of this thread

Oh, okay.

Paltmull

04-25-2011, 16:25

Although I haven't been very active lately, I've still followed this thread. I hope I can be more active when it starts again. As I said earlier, I was a bit sceptical towards the idea of a forced civil war, but I've changed my mind. This will surely make things very interesting, and hopefully bring new life to this amazing AAR.

The Spartathenian of Corinth

04-27-2011, 01:32

Hey, I'm really new here, but I like EB and Greece, so here goes:
My name is Pericles of Korinthos, I am a loyal citizen of Athenai (I moved), and I love to make war plans.

I propose that instead of trying to make peace with the spartan scum, we defend our lands around Athenai, and instead wear them down on the frontier.

jirisys

04-27-2011, 07:41

Welcome Spartathenian of Corinth (:laugh4:)

I am but a ghost, not to be remembered here, though I wish I could have even been included in the list for at least, one last honor. Molina won't read my messages but anyways. As one of the first members and stirring-uppers, I welcome you on behalf of all the guys.

Also, do me the favour of at least quoting this bit here, in order for Molinhaarg (aka Molina) to know something important.

I guess you will take the "control faction" method, but if not; I suggest you use the "kill_character" to ward off the old guys to the Hades, of course, even if I'm not allowed to say anything, I would still follow this as the first day.

Good look SpAthoCor :smile:

~Jirisys ()

Populus Romanus

04-27-2011, 07:58

do me the favour of at least quoting this bit here,

~Jirisys ()

Sure. :laugh4:

Arthur, king of the Britons

04-27-2011, 15:09

The Spartathenian of Corinth

04-27-2011, 22:44

Thanks guys, it's nice to see some good guys here. For Athenai!

Arthur, king of the Britons

05-08-2011, 18:54

I would like to remind the following people: Walle, Drag0nUL, fireblade and Jaertecken - that they are invited to the 'Athenai War Room' user group. For convenience please accept the invitation, so that I can make it into a moderated group (allowing other orgah's to join).

Thanks in advance. :bow:

Molinaargh

07-17-2011, 17:32

As announced in the TWC thread, this AAR will be returning soon!

I fear we do not have much activity over here at the .org, though. Once we do come back I'll try to "advertise" around the forums (just let people know, really) so that our fellow .org members can join in, considering how easy it is to participate in this AAR (just hop in, propose and agree!). So tell your friends and get ready! Soon the civil war will finally be fought.

Arthur, king of the Britons

07-17-2011, 18:47

I'll try and poke as many Athenoi as possible and tell them the good news.

fireblade

07-20-2011, 19:54

good, I'm looking forward to it.

Populus Romanus

07-21-2011, 04:28

Prepare to die, Athenoi! You should have stayed in you place, in the home knitting. You shall all perish for this transgression.

Arthur, king of the Britons

07-21-2011, 16:55

And you Spartiatai should have stayed home and enjoyed being beaten daily by your muscular wives. :clown:

Memnon

09-13-2011, 04:35

So what's going on with this? It's what first brought me to this forum, and I wanted to join the Athenian Council as it prepared for war with the Spartiatai bumpkins.

Arthur, king of the Britons

09-13-2011, 13:51

I'm pretty sure it's dead. Try asking Moolinaargh, though he hasn't been online here on the .Org since "5th Aug 2011 01:54". :/