Removing Armourer's as a build requirement

[Kaidonni]

It's not a bad idea at all, but my main concern is that Cegorach reports CTD issues with Pike & Musket, with all the income generating buildings, and I'm worried that any attempt at adding extra income generating abilities here will lead to the same problems.

I'm deciding that the Armourer and Metalsmith lines will be available to factions based on what units they provide. If a faction doesn't get any units AT ALL from the Armourer's Guild or above, for example, they won't be able to build it. I won't apply the same philosophy to Horse Breeders, Spearmakers, and what not, just the Armourer and Metalsmith lines. Also, no income bonus from them (it seems awfully odd that they'd give income but none of the other buildings).

Seems to be the best way to go, more or less. Turns out Scotland, in Early, will only have access to the Metalsmith and up to and including the Armourer's Guild. This will symbolise, in a way, the advancement their buildings provide. Since as higher buildings provide no advancement to them, they have little use for them.

Also, I still need to rename the Metalsmith to the Blacksmith...any tips and advice on that? Plus, should I assign all units with 'AXE' as their weapon type the unit_prod.txt as also requiring the Blacksmith? Some of those units seem awfully un-axe-like, such as Swabian Swordsmen... (and yes, I am aware it's not really to do with the weapon they yield, but the damage it can cause )

[caravel]

I'm deciding that the Armourer and Metalsmith lines will be available to factions based on what units they provide. If a faction doesn't get any units AT ALL from the Armourer's Guild or above, for example, they won't be able to build it. I won't apply the same philosophy to Horse Breeders, Spearmakers, and what not, just the Armourer and Metalsmith lines. Also, no income bonus from them (it seems awfully odd that they'd give income but none of the other buildings).

Most factions require those buildings for something or other. Also what about the master level valour bonuses, would you do away with those to balance it out? Personally I think they're a nice touch and give some incentive/reward for teching up to that level. All other bonuses excluding morale bonuses do imbalance the game and provincial unit specific valour bonuses confuse the AI.

For the Pocket Mod I worked on a flattened tree model for the smithies. The vanilla tree was something like this:


horsebreeder
horsebreeder2
horsebreeder3
horsebreeder4


Fort
-> speamaker, bowyer

Keep
-> spearmaker2, bowyer2, swordsmith, armourer

Castle
-> spearmaker3, bowyer3, swordsmith2, armourer2

Citadel
-> spearmaker4, bowyer4, swordsmith3, armourer3

Fortress
-> swordsmith4, armourer4





The PoM tree is more like this:


Fort (cheap structure, every single province starts with at least one of these)

Keep
-> spearmaker, bowyer, swordsmith, armourer, horsebreeder, blacksmith*

Castle
-> spearmaker2, bowyer2, swordsmith2, armourer2, horsebreeder2, blacksmith2

Citadel
-> spearmaker3, bowyer3, swordsmith3, armourer3, horsebreeder3, blacksmith3

Fortress
-> spearmaker4, bowyer4, swordsmith4, armourer4, horsebreeder4, blacksmith4

*formerly the metalsmith line

This tree works exactly as you see it, without any extra dependencies such as the swordsmith depending on the spearmaker. None of the buildings produce any kind of armour or attack upgrades. The master level produces the +1 valour bonus to units that depend on it. All buildings also produce a small income using cathedral income.

[Kaidonni]

I've decided that the Metalsmith (still need to rename) will be built at Fort level, and combines with the Horse Breeders for cavalry units. The Metalsmith's Workshop and above are available at the Castle, Citadel and Fortress, respectively. I felt needing the workshop for Royal Knights, etc, and numerous cavalry units at Keep level was a bit much, and decided to keep them relying only on the the first level building there. But the more advanced ones are still needed for the units that require more to be built, like the Feudal Knights. I just figured that I'd end up over-thinking the whole situation. Metalsmith deals with Fort and Keep units, Workshop deals with Castle units, Guild with Citadel units, Master with Fortress. Didn't want to spend forever racking my brain with thinking what the metalsmith requirements for units should be...could get overly complicated fast.

I'll keep the valour bonuses in, and will look into using Cathedral income for all of those buildings. That said, limiting the Armourer and Metalsmiths to the highest any particular faction requires seems awfully silly...unless the income isn't a great deal, so...

[bondovic]

The master level produces the +1 valour bonus to units that depend on it.

So the Kwarazmian cavalry, for example, requires the master h.breeder + master s.maker but gets the valour bonus?

[caravel]

So the Kwarazmian cavalry, for example, requires the master h.breeder + master s.maker but gets the valour bonus?

Nope I should have rephrased that sorry. What I mean is that units that depend on the line gain the valour bonus from the master level building, but any unit that actually depends on a master level building itself does not gain the bonus from it.

[Kaidonni]

I want to try to keep the tech tree in XL Tyberius similar to the original, so I've removed the dependencies of the Armourer and Swordsmith on other buildings, but I haven't changed their placement on the tech tree. It'd mean messing with lots of unit requirements, which I, er, really don't fancy doing...

EDIT: Okies, that part is done. Town Watch...er...okay, will remove that dependency too. The Bowyer, Spearmaker, Swordsmith, Armourer, Metalsmith and Horse Breeder line of buildings also produce income (15 florins, 31, 46, then probably 62 or something).

EDIT 2: Can someone please tell me how to bypass that damned can_not_translate!!! issue? It appears it only happens for the Blacksmith's Workshop and Blacksmith's Guild. I've tried editting DESCRIPTIONS.TXT in Loc\Eng...

Besides, ALL cavalry units now need the Blacksmith...or is that excessive? I think it isn't, really, considering...shoeing of horses and all that...unless I put the Blacksmith to begin from Keep, and all units below are free from Blacksmith requirement? Ooooh...decisions, decisions, decisions...shoot the person who decided not to release MTW back in 2002 like I'm modding it to be!

EDIT 3: I've decided that any AXE units that don't require the Bowyer, Spearmaker or Swordsmith (or any combination) will require the Blacksmith. Urban Militia, Militia Sergeants and Halberdiers for example. Chivalric Foot Knights also fit the bill (before they only needed ROYALCOURT3 and ARMOURER3, according to the unit_prod.txt for XL Tyberius...not many foot units will require the Blacksmith, then. The starpos for early will feature plenty of these Blacksmiths, so no worries there.

EDIT 4: Okay, decided to keep dependencies in. Metalsmith needed for Townwatch line and Horse Breeder line. Townwatch needed for Spearmaker and Bowyer line, either for Armourer line. Spearmaker needed for Swordsmith line. Nice progression, forcing the player to build the Metalsmith to get the other buildings and units. Startpos has been altered for Early so that anywhere with a Townwatch or Horse Breeder at the very least has a Metalsmith. Siege Engineer doesn't need any special pre-requisite (except a Fort ). Just need to get that damned translation error sorted (it includes the description not being translated...).

Are there any guarantees the AI will build the Metalsmith line properly, or at all? I would like the AI to prefer to build it so it doesn't...sit there and do nothing at all. That's my thing.

[Kaidonni]

I need help on the translation error thing. I've tried fixing it, and it doesn't seem to work. For some reason. Otherwise, the entire idea behind this modification is ruined...

[bondovic]

I need help on the translation error thing. I've tried fixing it, and it doesn't seem to work. For some reason. Otherwise, the entire idea behind this modification is ruined...

Couldn't help you with that, sorry. I'm only doing tweaking and balancing, not construction.

Some other thoughts, though:

Why the need for a blacksmith line? If horse units in general require that line can't it just be "imagined" to be an inherent part of any fort, therefore making actually building them a non-matter? For the purposes of adding or, simply, rearranging unit dependancies wouldn't the armourer line alone fulfill that function?