17er Saints and Martyrs

[Jan]

yea that was a bad gh post iyam

i can see it just being a real post. the perspective is just very different.

but if you are gh and have v reads on visor/logic the post does work tbh.

[Arctic]

siw

gl gamers

[EnderWiggin]

Visor flips green y'all are suckers.

[nebjiamn]

you tried wolves

[Totally not Taffy]

Please stop posting, final vote count inc.

[Totally not Taffy]

Vote Count

Visor (7) : Raskolnikov, Benneh, Hally, Vanta, Arctic, Murska, Ladd
Benneh (2) : Wisdom, Jan
Gemma (2) : Visor, GH
Logic (1) : Dyachei
Arctic (1) : Logic
GH (1) : Ender

Hasn't voted: Gemma


Vote History
If you made a vote that wasn't counted, please link it to me on discord

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Vote: Visor

Vote: Visor

Vote: Dya

Vote: Visor

vote: visor

vote: logic

Vote: Arctic

Vote: Gemma

Vote: Gemma

Vote: Logic

Unvote: Dya

Vote: Arctic

Vote: gemma

Vote: Gemma

vote: Visor

Vote:Benneh

Vote: nebjiamn

Vote: Benneh

Vote: benneh

vote: Visor

Vote: Benneh

Vote: Visor

Vote: Arctic

Vote: gemma

Vote: Gemma

vote:logic

vote:visor

Vote: GH

Post Counts

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

EoD1 post counts for easy math:

Please stand by for flip and flavour.

[Totally not Taffy]

Saint Visour was an unlikely martyr, in that he shunned people and preferred to live in his cave undisturbed. Then, an angel appeared to him in a vision and showed him the impending destruction of a great cathedral in the middle of the heart of the kingdom, leading to the death of thousands who would be buried under its ruins. He left immediately, and foregoing all sleep or nourishment, reached the cathedral one day before it was fated to go down. He tried to warn the authorities about the impending disaster, he shouted from the steps that everyone should leave, he pushed and he shoved trying to get people to listen to him. None would stand close to him fearing he might strike at them, but at the same time nobody wanted to take him seriously either, until the great bell tumbled down from its tower, crashing through the floors, and crushed him like a nut. Thanks to him, all other faithful got out in time.

Visor was a Mafia Martyr



Remember that night actions are due one hour before SoD!

[Totally not Taffy]

Saint Gimmick was an unpretentious clock maker wholly devoted to his craft and to his faith. One day he fashioned a clock so fine that when you spoke someone's name it would count down the hours till that person's time of death. After that, Saint Gimmick kept a watchful eye out for all in his village who seemed close to dying, and on the few occasions when Death was tardy, Saint Gimmick would seek it out and remind it of its duty. And so it happened that on the eve of his own demise, feeling his time draw near, he looked at the clock and spoke his own name, only to find out that he should have been long dead. Ever truthful, Saint Gimmick reminded Death that his time had come, and was welcomed into Heaven.

Jan was a Town Martyr



Five more minutes till SoD!

[Totally not Taffy]

All praise Jan for this glorious and timely SoD!

[GeneralHankerchief]

Alright, here's the deal.

I'm dying today barring PR shenanigans happening. You know it, I know it. No need to spend any of your posts reinforcing this point. I'm not gonna try to save myself today.

Instead, I'm going to work the game. I'll try to find the last pair, see if there's anything that's been overlooked, comment on possible deep wolves, the whole shebang. I will make no guarantees for accuracy, but I will attempt to be productive.

But in return, you have to take my posts at face value today, at least when interacting with me.

I know I can't stop you from solving with the assumption that I'm the third wolf and you only need to find one more. I know that I can't stop you from going back over my old posts and looking for the fourth. I get that. But if you're chatting with me today, you have to treat the theories I'm putting down with the assumption that I'm acting in good faith, at least to my face. I'm not asking for your vote, I'm just asking for your cooperation.

This isn't supposed to be extortion or anything, I just know that if I put forth an actual effort at this only to have every post of mine get immediately hit with five "god you're so wolfy" or "no way this is a real thought" type replies, I'm gonna get super discouraged and stop doing that and it's not gonna help anybody in the long run. If you're still on the fence, think of it as incentive for me to keep spewing or something.

That's the compact. I don't think it's asking for too much. I have a couple of errands to run this morning and then I'll start periodically working through things.

Deal?

[Raskolnikov]

Lol Visor. Not sure how to reat Gemmas slot with that flip

[Raskolnikov]

God, you are so wolfy GH

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

But yes, sure

[Arctic]

that kill makes me think jan was rolecopped

im not sure why they would kill jan otherwise cuz his eod kinda made him ml'able

[Raskolnikov]

Alright, here's the deal.

I'm dying today barring PR shenanigans happening. You know it, I know it. No need to spend any of your posts reinforcing this point. I'm not gonna try to save myself today.

Instead, I'm going to work the game. I'll try to find the last pair, see if there's anything that's been overlooked, comment on possible deep wolves, the whole shebang. I will make no guarantees for accuracy, but I will attempt to be productive.

But in return, you have to take my posts at face value today, at least when interacting with me.

I know I can't stop you from solving with the assumption that I'm the third wolf and you only need to find one more. I know that I can't stop you from going back over my old posts and looking for the fourth. I get that. But if you're chatting with me today, you have to treat the theories I'm putting down with the assumption that I'm acting in good faith, at least to my face. I'm not asking for your vote, I'm just asking for your cooperation.

This isn't supposed to be extortion or anything, I just know that if I put forth an actual effort at this only to have every post of mine get immediately hit with five "god you're so wolfy" or "no way this is a real thought" type replies, I'm gonna get super discouraged and stop doing that and it's not gonna help anybody in the long run. If you're still on the fence, think of it as incentive for me to keep spewing or something.

That's the compact. I don't think it's asking for too much. I have a couple of errands to run this morning and then I'll start periodically working through things.

Deal?

Can you give me your current POE?

[Arctic]

Alright, here's the deal.

I'm dying today barring PR shenanigans happening. You know it, I know it. No need to spend any of your posts reinforcing this point. I'm not gonna try to save myself today.

Instead, I'm going to work the game. I'll try to find the last pair, see if there's anything that's been overlooked, comment on possible deep wolves, the whole shebang. I will make no guarantees for accuracy, but I will attempt to be productive.

But in return, you have to take my posts at face value today, at least when interacting with me.

I know I can't stop you from solving with the assumption that I'm the third wolf and you only need to find one more. I know that I can't stop you from going back over my old posts and looking for the fourth. I get that. But if you're chatting with me today, you have to treat the theories I'm putting down with the assumption that I'm acting in good faith, at least to my face. I'm not asking for your vote, I'm just asking for your cooperation.

This isn't supposed to be extortion or anything, I just know that if I put forth an actual effort at this only to have every post of mine get immediately hit with five "god you're so wolfy" or "no way this is a real thought" type replies, I'm gonna get super discouraged and stop doing that and it's not gonna help anybody in the long run. If you're still on the fence, think of it as incentive for me to keep spewing or something.

That's the compact. I don't think it's asking for too much. I have a couple of errands to run this morning and then I'll start periodically working through things.

Deal?

sounds like a plan

[Raskolnikov]

that kill makes me think jan was rolecopped

im not sure why they would kill jan otherwise cuz his eod kinda made him ml'able

I think a PR read (need to reread what was post about gemmas soft, maybe confusing some of his posts with Bennehs)

[Arctic]

I think a PR read (need to reread what was post about gemmas soft, maybe confusing some of his posts with Bennehs)

i doubt they would risk that just from a read? because jan was definitely ml'able after that eod, maybe even a required ML depending on where the other wolves are positioned
and there was already a claimed PR still hanging around...

dont know how much this discussion matters tho

[Raskolnikov]

Agreed, where is your head at?

[Arctic]

Agreed, where is your head at?

i feel bad saying it after he just made that post but it's basically "kill GH and try to figure out who the other wolf is"

and i actually have no idea who that is

i think if there's a deep wolf it's you, but other than that my main candidates are wisdom (which i don't really believe) or ender (which i don't really believe either - for him to be posting like how he did at eod as mafia he must have already given up, which i guess is possible, idk?) and logic (but if it's him i have no idea what wolves were really doing this game)

[Raskolnikov]

i feel bad saying it after he just made that post but it's basically "kill GH and try to figure out who the other wolf is"

and i actually have no idea who that is

i think if there's a deep wolf it's you, but other than that my main candidates are wisdom (which i don't really believe) or ender (which i don't really believe either - for him to be posting like how he did at eod as mafia he must have already given up, which i guess is possible, idk?) and logic (but if it's him i have no idea what wolves were really doing this game)

I am more or less on the same boat, id have GH/Logic/Gemma as immediate POE, Ender is close to twtbaw but I wouldnt exlude it. Then maybe revisit wisdom or look for Visors bussers (think i need to rereed the context of each votes tbh) but yeah.

[nebjiamn]

i feel bad saying it after he just made that post but it's basically "kill GH and try to figure out who the other wolf is"

and i actually have no idea who that is

i think if there's a deep wolf it's you, but other than that my main candidates are wisdom (which i don't really believe) or ender (which i don't really believe either - for him to be posting like how he did at eod as mafia he must have already given up, which i guess is possible, idk?) and logic (but if it's him i have no idea what wolves were really doing this game)

its logic, lol

[Wisdom]

Apologies for leaving like that, wanted to test Visor a bit but then life happened. Well done yeeting him!

[dyachei]

I'm at kill logic then gh then figure out if there's another wolf. Both logic and gh have been very wolfy and inexplicably v read visor

I want logic first though

[nebjiamn]

this is not actually a ordered reads list but lets assume worst case scenario:

Murska
Ladd
Hally
Benneh


Raskolnikov
Dyachei
Vanta Black


Arctic
Wisdom


Gemma
Ender


Logic
GH




11:2 Kill GH
10:2 NK one of murska/ladd/hally/benneh
9:2 Kill Logic
8:2 NK one of murska/ladd/hally/benneh
7:2 One of Gemma/Ender
6:2 NK one of murska/ladd/hally/benneh
5:2 One of Gemma/Ender
4:2 NK one of murska/ladd/hally/benneh
3:2 F5 w/ Rask/dya/vanta/arctic/wisdom

i feel like that f5 with 2 wolves alive is extremely unlikely

i feel like you could still reasonably clear rask/wisdom within that f5 (pending changes in villageryness and whatnot over 4 game days)

if the wolves alive in that world killed outside the 4 i called out then they just lose lol

[nebjiamn]

I'm at kill logic then gh then figure out if there's another wolf. Both logic and gh have been very wolfy and inexplicably v read visor

I want logic first though

i don't really care on the order, they just both must absolutely die this game before we consider anything else imo

GH in particular i think is a more likely hit because his eod was far more unreasonable than anything that should ever come from v!him but again, idrc what order we go as long as no one even considers not lunching him for a second if he doesnt die today, no matter what logic flips

[nebjiamn]

i suppose there is the caveat about murska not dying yet as a protective but i think they look pretty clear from visor's eod1 push

[EnderWiggin]

... Can we go back to 36 hours into last day phase when I had Visor at the bottom of my POE and then forget the last 12 hours existed?

Thanks. Appreciate it.

[EnderWiggin]

Also officially stating that GH/Logic as an immediate POE is definitely okay with that last flip.

No more wild vote chains for me.

(For now. )

[dyachei]

i don't really care on the order, they just both must absolutely die this game before we consider anything else imo

GH in particular i think is a more likely hit because his eod was far more unreasonable than anything that should ever come from v!him but again, idrc what order we go as long as no one even considers not lunching him for a second if he doesnt die today, no matter what logic flips

I don't really think this is gh playing this poorly so he has to be a wolf.

But logic feels like a wolf pr to me

[nebjiamn]

Raskolnikov
Dyachei
Vanta Black
Arctic
Wisdom

ok, from this f5 we need 3 villagers. again, in the worst case world. and i think that is very unlikely to have 2 wolves but i could definitely see 1 deep wolf in it

before rereading my thoughts are basically:

dya - most sustained villagery from this pack. if either of gh/logic flip wolf then dya should just be clear. logic from how they pushed on eachother day 2. GH has a few not w/w posts with dya that i dont feel like i need to point out. would be very surprised if they can be a wolf here but in the worst case scenario you probly have to consider it

rask - fell off a bit yesterday but still really likely v from d1

vanta - mostly vibe reads. i think visor's read on them yesterday was probly made with intent to pocket/earn trust/earn vote but, again, would want to reread. could be a wolf for sure.

arctic - probly just town for how yesterday went down and even day 1. the worlds where he can be a wolf and advancing his wincon are slimming down as each wolf flips and i dont see it with him

wisdom - could be a wolf. i had some microtells that were towny for them d1 but i think wisdom not really noticing my posts or having an extensive read on me and then trying to get me mislunched yesterday is a bad look. the only reason i'm hesistant on a wolf read here is because i feel like we would have caught wisdom 2 days ago. blame ladd if wisdom wolf basically