Dragon Age: Origins gameplay and discussion thread.

[frogbeastegg]

Ahem the second.

Mark the spoiler with a brief spoiler free description so people can tell whether they have seen that part of the game yet!

[Lemur]

Having dabbled a bit, experimenting with different races and classes, I've concluded the following:

• You always want to have direct control of the offense mage, especially if s/he has area effects. Healer can be adequately programmed from the tactics menu, as can the warriors.
• It's just mean and cruel that the devs didn't include a knock or unlock chest spell. I would love to have a two mage/two warriors party, but the need to include a $%#(&! useless rogue always trips me up.
• There are more than twice as many warrior companions as rogues or mages. This is irritating. In my (incomplete) experience, companions are 56% warriors, 22% mages and 22% rogues.
• There are places where your PC will be forced to go solo, or jumped in front by a dialogue, making him/her the prime target of every mob on the map. This means that mages and rogues are going to be forced to tank at times whether they want to or not.
• That said, it's best to take control of your tank when opening doors or rounding corners. There are other factors, but the first/nearest person a mob sees tends to be the target.
• I would happily do with two fewer warrior companions in exchange for more rogue/mage variety.

These is my thoughts.

[Mailman653]

2nd playthrough, city Elf, final thoughts:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

I gave Alister his wish to not become king and take the throne myself unfortuntely the queen refused which made sense. I was disapointed though, had I know that would of happend, id of done it on my first playthrough as a human I supported her still instead of Alister who didn't take it well compared to my first playthrough which leads to my second point.

What's up with Logane being a PC? That just blew my mind when it happend, just when I thought things would end up similiar to my first playthrough as a human, the game surprised me big time.

I take it my Elf's bethroed died in slavery? She didn't appear after I freed the Alienage plus she never appeared in the throne room after the queen took the crown and what not.

I'm wondering who to make for my 3rd playthrough, I think I might try out a Human mage and hope that when I make to the end, I can carry out the plan my Elf failed to do I'm very glad to see that the Humans are not limited to being nobels and that mage's have their own background story.

Has anyone done Morrigan's bidding? I haven't so far and it worries me to see what the prologue might say lol.

[Meneldil]

Having dabbled a bit, experimenting with different races and classes, I've concluded the following:

• You always want to have direct control of the offense mage, especially if s/he has area effects. Healer can be adequately programmed from the tactics menu, as can the warriors.
• It's just mean and cruel that the devs didn't include a knock or unlock chest spell. I would love to have a two mage/two warriors party, but the need to include a $%#(&! useless rogue always trips me up.
• There are more than twice as many warrior companions as rogues or mages. This is irritating. In my (incomplete) experience, companions are 56% warriors, 22% mages and 22% rogues.
• There are places where your PC will be forced to go solo, or jumped in front by a dialogue, making him/her the prime target of every mob on the map. This means that mages and rogues are going to be forced to tank at times whether they want to or not.
• That said, it's best to take control of your tank when opening doors or rounding corners. There are other factors, but the first/nearest person a mob sees tends to be the target.
• I would happily do with two fewer warrior companions in exchange for more rogue/mage variety.

These is my thoughts.

I second your thoughts about the companions. Most of them are warriors, which make the whole thing quite meh (which is even made worse by the fact they're all human looking except for Shale, the Dog and the dwarf). I think the game seriously lacks more playable characters, though I understand they're more fleshed out than they used to be in BG or even NWN.

As for the main character being put in front after dialogues and cutscenes, it has been that way since the days of NWN1. And it's been annoying since then, for whoever plays a caster or ranged class. I wish they'd start thinking about it someday. I personnaly always take control of the tank (Alistair or Shale), because otherwise my mage would end up dying whenever he'd meet archers or casters.

[Krusader]

Having dabbled a bit, experimenting with different races and classes, I've concluded the following:

• You always want to have direct control of the offense mage, especially if s/he has area effects. Healer can be adequately programmed from the tactics menu, as can the warriors.
• It's just mean and cruel that the devs didn't include a knock or unlock chest spell. I would love to have a two mage/two warriors party, but the need to include a $%#(&! useless rogue always trips me up.
• There are more than twice as many warrior companions as rogues or mages. This is irritating. In my (incomplete) experience, companions are 56% warriors, 22% mages and 22% rogues.
• There are places where your PC will be forced to go solo, or jumped in front by a dialogue, making him/her the prime target of every mob on the map. This means that mages and rogues are going to be forced to tank at times whether they want to or not.
• That said, it's best to take control of your tank when opening doors or rounding corners. There are other factors, but the first/nearest person a mob sees tends to be the target.
• I would happily do with two fewer warrior companions in exchange for more rogue/mage variety.

These is my thoughts.

NWN had "bash open chest" skill/ability I recall. Would have been fine having that too, as I've been forced to drag Leliana along just to disarm traps & open locks. Got Zevran too late.

Yes. Can't really see the difference between Oghren & Sten, except that

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Oghren can teach you Berserker. I'd love to have seen Drunken Fighting of some sorts with him, but they probably used that up in Jade Empire.

Also, I'm wondering if I have to beef up Cunning past 16 for Persuasion attempts as Mage...haven't really seen any Mage-specific persuasion dialogue options.

[Mailman653]

Also, I'm wondering if I have to beef up Cunning past 16 for Persuasion attempts as Mage...haven't really seen any Mage-specific persuasion dialogue options.

Nothing like talking yourself out of a situation

[Crandaeolon]

I solved the party-forming problem (to get 2 or even 3 mages + rogue with enough tanking power) by making a tank mage with Spellpowered Arcane Shield, Rock Armor and Heroic Defense. 33 armor and 126 defense in spellcasting mode is nothing to sneer at, more than enough to survive putting up Storm of the Century, Force Field on self, and watching enemies get electrocuted.

And in Arcane Warrior mode... 63 armor, 153 defense, mental & physical resistance 100, others at 75%. Not bad for a flimsy little mageling. He doesn't have Taunt talents of course, but he's tough enough to get into the thick of it and whack away at things to generate threat, then you can send in the other dudes.

Still, playing a tank gets retarded pretty fast. I'd really like to shoot the guy who invented "threat" mechanics...

[Kekvit Irae]

Having dabbled a bit, experimenting with different races and classes, I've concluded the following:

• It's just mean and cruel that the devs didn't include a knock or unlock chest spell. I would love to have a two mage/two warriors party, but the need to include a $%#(&! useless rogue always trips me up.

These is my thoughts.

Leliana, properly equipped and with the archery talents (notably Arrow of Slaying and Scattershot), is one of the best damage-dealing characters in the game. Not only that, but she has skill in lockpicking and disarming traps.
For my Arcane Warrior playthrough, I use Zevran. Momentum + Flaming Weapons + Frost Weapons + paralyze runes in each hand + backstabs = ouch.

Personally, I think the game does fine with just two mage companions. Three mages (two companions + you) can lock down any fight into a one-on-one battle. Six words: Force Shield, Crushing Prison, Blood Wound.

[Crandaeolon]

Agree wholeheartedly with Kek. Force Field, Crushing Prison, Blood Wound, Scattershot and AoS are among the best skills in the game. I'd probably rank FS the best.

[Krusader]

Got annoyed with having two rogues in party (Leliana was in solely because I needed her trap/locks skills) so downloaded the toolset and editted my Mage savegame. Swapped around on Zevran a bit so now he has Master Traps and Master Deft Hands (did not add any skills or talents, just removed some and added back, so Zevran has all the skills & abilities as a Level 14 Rogue). I would not call it cheating as Zevran himself said he was good with locks & traps (but as previously said, he didnt have a single point in eithre Trapmaking or Deft Hands when he joined my party)...but main reason is because I don't want Leliana in my party. Had her entire time last playthrough.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

And annoying that it takes time to get Oghren too. Would have been nice with him on Carta cleanout quest. At least he is a straightforward warrior so he probably will have skills & talents pre-selected that are good.

Warden Commander Armor:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

The set is actually leveled. If you get it at level 9 its tier4 armor stats, but at later levels on its higher. You can sell the armor to either Bodahn in party camp or Levi Dryden at Warden's Keep and then you can buy it back at higher tiers when you gain levels.

[Meneldil]

So, I actually had to use Morrigan's shapeshifting abilities today, which hadn't happened for quite some time (actually, since something like 10 hours in my first play through).

She turned into a bear (not yet dire bear), jumped on some mob, and hit it for...1. Slam hit for 8. Needless to say she got ran over.

Are the shapeshifting abilities tied to strenght and dexterity, or did I just happen to be fighting some heavily armored dude (though I'm pretty sure my other guys hit as strong as they used to)? That would really be a letdown for me, I'm not going to waste any point in these stats with Morrigan, or any other mage, for that matter.

[FactionHeir]

Never used them myself. Didn't seem worth investing in.

Regarding opening locks, after 1.5 playthroughs doing all sides, I can safely say that outside of a few rogue-main character only missions, you won't ever need a locksmith as there's nothing useful in locked crates outside of a few golds along the way and experience (which you get cheaply via elfroots/deep mushrooms).

Trap removal is more useful of course, but something anyone with a decent cunning score can do.

[seireikhaan]

Never used them myself. Didn't seem worth investing in.

Regarding opening locks, after 1.5 playthroughs doing all sides, I can safely say that outside of a few rogue-main character only missions, you won't ever need a locksmith as there's nothing useful in locked crates outside of a few golds along the way and experience (which you get cheaply via elfroots/deep mushrooms).

Trap removal is more useful of course, but something anyone with a decent cunning score can do.

I believe rogues are the only one's who can actually spot the traps, however. Personally, after not having a rogue the first playthrough, I have to say that having one the second go through has made things quite a bit easier, since I'm not bumbling into every trap laid out for me. Stealth, of course, helps disable the irritating buggers so you can safely disable any/all traps, then setting your own.

EDIT: Particularly fun moment when I bombed an emissary with flasks, slowly leading him away from his buddies and down a hallway as he chased a path of fruitlessness straight into a claw/soulrot/freeze trap combo for insta-death.

[al Roumi]

I believe rogues are the only one's who can actually spot the traps, however. Personally, after not having a rogue the first playthrough, I have to say that having one the second go through has made things quite a bit easier, since I'm not bumbling into every trap laid out for me. Stealth, of course, helps disable the irritating buggers so you can safely disable any/all traps, then setting your own.

EDIT: Particularly fun moment when I bombed an emissary with flasks, slowly leading him away from his buddies and down a hallway as he chased a path of fruitlessness straight into a claw/soulrot/freeze trap combo for insta-death.

AFAIK trap disabling is bundled with the lock-picking skill. I also read somewhere (on the interweb don'tcha know) that the lock pick/trap disable algorithm is based on a combination of both the skill level (1 to 4) and and the "cunning" attribute.

So this means that although a character of any class can train up to pick locks and disable traps, unless they invest in a suitable (not sure what level guarantees opening all chests) cunning score, they won't be that great at it. Of course, you also have to increase cunning to (afaik) 16 before you can unlock the tier 4 lockpick skill.

[rajpoot]

BTW has anyone managed to learn shape shifting from Morrigan yet? I had her disposition at 100 and even then she simply refused....

[Krusader]

BTW has anyone managed to learn shape shifting from Morrigan yet? I had her disposition at 100 and even then she simply refused....

I gave up and used my first character and bought the manual instead.

EDIT: For anyone interested Steam has 25% off Dragon Age: Origins (and lots of other games) now. Its only up for the next 26 hours.

[FactionHeir]

BTW has anyone managed to learn shape shifting from Morrigan yet? I had her disposition at 100 and even then she simply refused....

I got it when she was at warm. I think second time I asked her about it.
When you then ask her after that she will alwys refuse if she already taught you.

[frogbeastegg]

I got it when she was at warm.

Likewise.

[Beskar]

I bought the book. That is why she always refuses.

[Meneldil]

BTW has anyone managed to learn shape shifting from Morrigan yet? I had her disposition at 100 and even then she simply refused....

She's at 5 and taught me shapeshifting

[Vladimir]

Well I finally got Easy Lover. Poor Liliana. My character is always sleeping around on her and she always gives me the 5 year old very stern look. Thank God for reloading.

Is anyone else having a problem suspending disbelief? I've gathered a good understanding of what goes for the passage of time in the game. I'm crawling through the Deep Roads thinking that the Darkspawn could have built a Sistine Chapel by now.

Again, there is no sense of urgency and the main plot quests detract from the main plot itself. In Morrowind the side quests and richness of the world detracted from the main plot but there was so much else.

[Meneldil]

Is anyone else having a problem suspending disbelief? I've gathered a good understanding of what goes for the passage of time in the game. I'm crawling through the Deep Roads thinking that the Darkspawn could have built a Sistine Chapel by now.

Again, there is no sense of urgency and the main plot quests detract from the main plot itself. In Morrowind the side quests and richness of the world detracted from the main plot but there was so much else.

I agree in a way. The fact that the player can leave Orzammar, go back to the Warden Keep to unload his inventory, then spend some time in the camp to chatter and cure his injuries, than travel all the way back to Orzammar and to the Deep Roads, while the world is supposedly about to collapse is an immersion killer.

But then, honestly, this is not something specific to DA:O. It felt just the same in NWN2 when you had to gather your allies before fighting the thing-that-is-strangely-similar-to-the-Blight-but-is-not-the-Blight.
BG2 : Holy crap, we have to rescue Imoen right now! Gods know what Irenicus might be doing to her. But first let's go on some sidequesting, dragon-killing and exploring.


Onto another topic:
Something that really bothers me with modern RPGs, and especially with Dragon Age, is that everything has a purpose. Longs are gone the days of BG1 and its dozen of useless map. I remember that exploring the world took quite some time in BG1. You could rush in for the main plot, or decide to wander around and explore everything, the several maps (some of them didn't even have a single sidequest), the dozens of houses and buildings.
Things changed with BG2 already, as every single map had a purpose (possibly with a whole subplot: you knew you'd find some guy handing you quests and what not).
Now, with DA:O, you don't even have subplot anymore. If you can open a door, it means that there's something to do inside the building. If you can talk to some guy, it means he's going to give you a quest (that's going to be completed while following the main plot) or a Codex entry. The only things similar to a subplot is the choice between good and evil you're given every once in a while (side with these guys or those guys) and the two DLC's (which are both subpar compared to BG1 or 2 subplots). And that's about it.

I understand a game could hardly offer as many "useless" areas nowadays as it did for BG1, mostly because it was easier to develop an area in 2D with poor graphics than it is to with 3D badassness. But I mean, what about a few of those? At least so I can get the feeling that the world is somewhat open.

[Vladimir]

True. I still remember the surprise, excitement, and a bit of terror in the original Baldur's Gate when the main character was poisoned. There was a hard deadline and if you didn't make it and made a bad decision on saves, the game was over.

While the tactical quests are done well they don't fit well into the overall mosaic. Still, I'm having fun "vivisecting" rooms with my rogue. I've thought about using the XP exploit so I can wade through rooms of baddies on the hardest level.

Oh; does anyone else feel the sexual tension between Alister and Morganawhatshername? It would be nice to see NPC's hook up and develop a relationship.

[Mailman653]

Hmm....well I had Sten on my second playthrough, and Morrigan was deffintely coming on to him (eventhough she was with me) but Sten spooked her which is an accomplishment.

[Ja'chyra]

I got to admit, I got bored with the game very easy. A few things that bugged me are that you can't go back to areas once they are complete, the "There's no reason to go here" message was particularly annoying.

I also don't see the point of sex in computer games, that's just one step to far towards geek to me.

[Vladimir]

Hmm....well I had Sten on my second playthrough, and Morrigan was deffintely coming on to him (eventhough she was with me) but Sten spooked her which is an accomplishment.

Interesting. I will create a warrior/mage character soon, maybe before the first playthrough is ended, and won't have her next time.

IRL my heart would bleed for that woman.

[Meneldil]

Hmm....well I had Sten on my second playthrough, and Morrigan was deffintely coming on to him (eventhough she was with me) but Sten spooked her which is an accomplishment.

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Orlhen : "Oh girl, what I would do with you"
Morrigan : "Eww, it's staring at me. Again."
Orlhen : "Oups, did I say that out loud?"

That's not the exact quote, but it was something like that.

[Vladimir]

(It's a slow day)

Has anyone found a use for the massive, slow weapons? When I see that old dwarf swing a massive axe I'm able to get in a yawn before he strikes. All that armor must really slow him down. I do love drakeskin armor, daggers, and backstab. You can land so many hits in such a short period of time. Alister is only there to take damage while I backstab. That big softie always dies and my faithful hound has carried me through many a fight.

[Chaotix]

That's not the exact quote, but it was something like that.

I got that conversation yesterday in Caridin's Cross. I also got one between Oghren and Leliana:

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Oghren basically asks Leliana if the Chantry sisters wear any clothes under their robes.

I love this guy. He's so obsessed about his wife, and yet he's constantly making drunken remarks about all the other female party members.

[Monk]

Put Oghren and Wynne in a party together. You'd be surprised.

spoilers on their first conversation

Spoiler Alert, click show to read: 

Ohgren makes a special brew and demands Wynne try some, thinking it'll be too much for her. To his surprise, she loves it. Not only that but she can identify nearly every ingredient. Turns out drinking is almost a hobby of hers, of which Ohgren is quite surprised by.


"I'm gonna take you behind that rock there and..!"