Huge Mafia Game Capo di Tutti Capi IV [Concluded] [Archive] - Page 5

Askthepizzaguy

09-18-2011, 05:19

2400 Plaza del Universo
Radio City building, Suite 501
Fatlington, New Jersey

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=liuCTk2nPG8

Gotta make a move to a town
That's right for me
Town to keep me movin'
Keep me groovin' with some energy

Well, I talk about it, talk about it
Talk about it, talk about it

Talk about, talk about
Talk about movin'

Gotta move on
Gotta move on
Gotta move on

Won't you take me to
Funkytown
Won't you take me to
Funkytown
Won't you take me to
Funkytown
Won't you take me to
Funkytown

The Anachronism Hour with Saucy Slice

"And we're back, somehow. The events of last night were shocking to me, as we lost many dear friends in the rampage."

DJ Slice was quite shaken.

"I don't really know what to say. But I will find whoever was responsible, and...."

He trailed off.

"This is The Anachronism Hour. I'm DJ Slice. You know, I have an interview with an FBI agent today, and while I was wary of the idea before, now I'm starting to think it's a really good idea. You'll want to stay tuned for that, because... I'm quite frightened. Now it's time for the News Cruise! with Askthepizzaguy."

*VROOOOOOOOOOOMMMMMM*

"So, Ask.... what can you tell us?"

Askthepizzaguy: "Well Saucy, there's a lot to get into tonight. Pharaoh, Warman, and Moros are all dead, killed by various assorted armed hoodlums, gangsters perhaps, and possibly a rogue or serial killer. More than that, several other Fatlings were attacked, but they all survived thanks to the vigilant work of some of Fatlington's finest."

"Thank god, it worked. It worked..... what I mean to say is, the people of this town have done an excellent job, in spite of setbacks. People have saved lives. And full credit goes to whoever has been secretly organizing their efforts. I'm not really in a jovial mood, given the large upswing in violence. I'm also dismayed I.... we, couldn't stop all those killings."

Slice paused.

"I'll take song requests. They'd better be uplifting, but they will happen AFTER I interview the man from the government. Stay tuned."

Phone lines are not open yet. Please hold all your calls.

Askthepizzaguy

09-18-2011, 05:21

Select: GH
Vote: ACIN

And yeah, who protected him last night anyway? Some people he conned into believing his "I'm a townie, honest!" story apparently.

No, that would be some vigilant people that it seems we can actually rely on in a crisis. :wink:

They should be commended. And promoted.

As for ACIN, he can die....

Vote: ACIN For the wall-to-wall nonsense.

Select: GH

classical_hero

09-18-2011, 05:41

The police couldn’t explain the map of the Alaska territory that had been nailed to the door of the saferoom, nor the writing – ‘Seward’s Folly’ – on the fringe of the map. All of the four women were moved to tears, only one asked about a will.This bit about th death of Moros does not make any sense at all. There is a clue in Seward's folly and the map of Alaska, but that is not telling much.

GeneralHankerchief

09-18-2011, 05:41

Don't know if I can select myself or not (since I can't vote), but...

Select: GH

And Montmorency should receive some votes, at least put him into lynch consideration if not the outright lead.

White_eyes:D

09-18-2011, 05:49

Won't select GH just yet, he might not want it.
You must be joking...GH not wanting a leadership position?:laugh4:
Select:GH

Nazi's huh? I guess Seamus did switch it up.
Vote:Montmorency

Visor

09-18-2011, 05:54

Montmorency mistakenly revealed as a Nazi mason on N1.

This is the part that gets me... Masons are protown roles. I'm guessing if they're not protown, they're at least neutral, aim to survive, etc.

So I say ACIN is a better lynch.

Askthepizzaguy

09-18-2011, 05:54

I wish to shed some light. Montmorency mistakenly revealed as a Nazi mason on N1. I found a hit squad and wrote a detailed kill description for seamus, but forgot to include an actual kill order in there. I am revealing this to avoid accusation amongst my group.

vote: montmorency

Missed this one.

I will probably switch to Monty then. Let's hear what Monty has to say.

Populus Romanus

09-18-2011, 05:59

vote: montmorency

Okay, another accidental reveal, lol

El Barto

09-18-2011, 06:01

This is the part that gets me... Masons are protown roles. I'm guessing if they're not protown, they're at least neutral, aim to survive, etc.

So I say ACIN is a better lynch.
Masons are protown roles? No, no. Masons are people who know each other's roles. That's the only requisite for masonhood. In Camikaze's LotR game there were two masons (Merry and Pippin) who were really one each of Mordor and Isengard.

vote: montmorency

Okay, another accidental reveal, lol
What'd be the odds of that?

classical_hero

09-18-2011, 06:06

unvote; vote:Montmoency

Montmorency

09-18-2011, 06:16

Woah, hold on there.

Being one of the only people to select Yaropolk for director on D1, I thought there might be some good will between us that I might take advantage of.

It went like this:

Strength through Joy, brother?

,revs his Volkswagen.

Get a load of this Xenon fella, he must think he's the Organizer of Victory or something. Such indiscriminate Community Outreach might lead to unpleasant consequences for the man - or the Town. And I hear some might be marching to a different beat altogether - the Center Beat. Dig?

How do you want to do this?

Depends. How's your relationship with the guy?

You trouble me. There will be a wedding before long. :flowers:

So, Strength through Joy. I used that for a reason, yes. But mostly it was because I have a strange fixation on Nazism, and I'd recently seen this footage in a documentary. Note the subtitles please.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bEYfl-X2Jcc

Next one seems very suspicious, but this veiled threat is actually just a comment on the danger in which Xenon was putting himself. That "-or Town" addendum referred to the possibility that Xenon might be ballsy scum. There's no malicious innuendo. Anyway, notice that phrase - "Center Beat". I thought this was a pretty obvious ploy. I was using this to see if he were neutral as well. At that point in the game, my inclination was to go Lawful Neutral. I didn't really think it through beyond that. I had no idea what this neutral bloc was supposed to do in the game.

Next item. I wanted to see what Yaropolk already knew about Xenon. I would have liked to get in among Xenon's recruits and spread the neutral contagion (no, this is NOT a reference to a cult conversion power).

Final item. Yaropolk hadn't replied in almost an hour. I used a line from the clip as a vague threat to get him to speak up once again. This was the extent of our correspondence up to this point. It all took place on the night of Sept. 12.

Montmorency

09-18-2011, 06:22

And to clarify "up to this point": I sent this soon after he posted the accusation.

Oh lol. So that's why you were acting so strange. But I'm not actually a Nazi in this game. I just enjoy inappropriately referencing Nazism IRL.

I contacted you because I was one of like two people who supported your election bid D1. I thought maybe it would give me some sort of leverage. Good will, at least.

What a lol. And here I'd even asked a detective to investigate you for N3. Perhaps you'd like me to call that off?

Choxorn

09-18-2011, 06:28

Masons are protown roles? No, no. Masons are people who know each other's roles. That's the only requisite for masonhood. In Camikaze's LotR game there were two masons (Merry and Pippin) who were really one each of Mordor and Isengard.

No, Merry was innocent, although Pippin was a cover role for an Orc.

You're thinking of Eothain and Freda, a.k.a, Wormtongue and a Nazgul.

Back on topic, is anyone else getting the impression that the people who have, or at least appear to have, a self-confessed third party role are just being used to distract us from the scum, such as a certain scumbag with a name that is completely inoffensive?

El Barto

09-18-2011, 06:32

I see some Suspiciously Specific Denials (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/SuspiciouslySpecificDenial) in yon post (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?137953-Capo-di-Tutti-Capi-IV&p=2053375503&viewfull=1#post2053375503) above.

Montmorency

09-18-2011, 06:36

Specific? I thought I was covering the broad range of implications here. Bring up any that I don't seem to have addressed, and I'll do so. :/

Askthepizzaguy

09-18-2011, 06:56

I'm not sure I completely understand your defense. Can you restate what you mean, in plain language, such as:

"I am not a nazi mason, it just so happens I make nazi references during capo games".

If that's the case, it's really odd.

Montmorency

09-18-2011, 07:00

I explained why I said what I said. The clip should be enough, really. :shrug:

Also note that I am a Nazi in another Mafia game here.

Askthepizzaguy

09-18-2011, 07:07

I explained why I said what I said. The clip should be enough, really. :shrug:

Also note that I am a Nazi in another Mafia game here.

Really?

Okay, that would actually be more convincing. I don't buy that you're just so happen to be a Nazi fan. But if you're actually a Nazi in a concurrent game, that's quite different. Which game, the Vengeance thing?

Visor

09-18-2011, 07:08

All players are Nazis in Vengeance.

B-Wing

09-18-2011, 07:15

I don't know what to make of that exchange. It's not the sort of conversation I would have with anyone... ever.

FoS: Yaropolk, Montmorency

vote: ACIN

elect: GH

GeneralHankerchief

09-18-2011, 07:31

Right, and that totally explains Yaro's "Volkswagen" line that came out in the exchange. :rolleyes:

Jarema

09-18-2011, 07:54

Select: GH
Vote: ACIN

Case on Montmorency is ... interesting, but not as compelling as ACIN's

Askthepizzaguy

09-18-2011, 08:10

Right, and that totally explains Yaro's "Volkswagen" line that came out in the exchange. :rolleyes:

Well, I got a solution for you.

Yaropolk looks at what was posted and admits he said that; no issue.

Yaropolk looks at what was posted and says hey! I never said that. YOU LIE!

Then we has a guilty between the two of them, at least.

And if Yaropolk admits he said volkswagon, then wouldn't the incriminated party be Yaropolk? Or perhaps he has an explanation.

Askthepizzaguy

09-18-2011, 08:55

2400 Plaza del Universo
Radio City building, Suite 501
Fatlington, New Jersey

"Hold the Phone!" with Saucy Slice

DJ Saucy Slice: "We're back on the air. Now it is time for our interview segment, Hold the Phone! We do have locks on the doors of this studio, right Frankie? Okay. We actually have a guest in the studio today, so no phone this time. Allow me to introduce a man who needs no introduction, mister...."

FBI Agent: "Don't call me mister. It could give away my identity."

Mr. Slice: "A lady who needs no introduction, Miss..."

FBI Agent: "Listen, I ain't no dame, either. Do I sound like a dame to you?"

Mr. Slice: "A human being.... (I can say that, right?) ....a human being who does human things for a group of humans. Let's call you Mister or Missus...."

FBI Agent: "Human."

Mr. Slice: "Okay Mister or Missus... Human. I have some questions for you, if that's all right?"

Mr. Human: "That will be acceptable."

Mr. Slice: "What is the FBI doing in Fatlington?"

Mr. Human: "First of all, let me thank you Mr. Saucy Slice for having me on the show, I'm sure it'll be a good opportunity for me to further explain what the Bureau is looking to accomplish. What's that? Call you Slice? Excuse me Mr, I didn't realize we were on first name basis. Very well. The Bureau has been informed of certain dealings in this area and we are looking into it. There seems to have been a substantial lack of discipline in some areas. There seems to be almost no clear records over citizens vocations. The Bureau hates unclear records. How is one to go to the doctor if no one knows who the doctor is? Why is there no phone book in this forsaken... Oh right.. As I said, there are things to be cleared up here and we're confident that we can do it with minimal to no civil discord."

Mr. Slice: "Who are you looking for?"

Mr. Human: "I'm pretty certain it's obvious to anyone that there is a threat to this country and to our very lives, what with the rise of sympathies for the east. Of course I can't go into detail on what we are doing here, that would ruin the point of the bureaucracy. We are here to protect what is sacred to this country and all it's inhabitants. Unfortunately some individuals are not in favour of the freedom and god given rights we have in the greatest country on Earth. These people will go to any length to instill fear into our hearts and tremor in our souls. The Bureau is what keeps them at bay, and we will continue to do so for aslong as we are allowed."

Mr. Slice: "What can citizens do to help?"

Mr. Human: "Excellent question.. Slice? American citizens, as well as being the lambs we must protect, are also the most vigilant lambs on the planet. Any and all suspicious left-wing activity is to be reported in public. No one of us wants a criminal to escape our sight because information failed on a weak link. Information as you probably know is the most valuable commodity we have here in Fatlington. If you know something, please report it in public or contact the local police if you have the ability to find them."

Mr. Slice: "Have you been spying on us without a warrant?"

Mr. Human: "The US government has given the FBI clear guidelines on what is to be done and with what methods. We have never and will never break US law or defile the constitution with criminal acts. Rest assured that anything the Bureau does or does not do is for your own safety and protection, we are the first and last frontier of defense for the American citizen."

Mr. Slice: "Anything else you want to tell us?"

Mr. Human: "Do you mind if I get another sugar in this? I'm sort of a softie when it comes to coff... Oh... Are we still on? More information? Ehm... Sure, I can do that. The Bureau wishes everyone to know that we are not a threat to you unless you first have decided that you want to be a threat to the US government. We are working day and night to ensure you can sleep at night. I myself haven't slept since 3 days ago, bah! They're killing us I tell you! "Send more operatives" I say. "Fatlington is not high-prio".. Ehm.. Let's leave it at that, I have the night shift."

Mr. Slice: "Okay, thank you for the interview, Mister or Missus Human. You may now fade back into the shadows and snoop on law-abiding citizens and legitimate businessmen at your leisure. But you do me one favor? You find out who is trying to kill me. It's getting very unnerving."

If you want to request a song, or request to be interviewed LIVE on the air, dial 1-855-DJ-SLICE (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/private.php?do=newpm&u=23872). He'll serve your ears something hot and fresh in thirty minutes or less.

Askthepizzaguy

09-18-2011, 09:11

"Legitimate businessmen" who wish to be interviewed but wish to maintain anonymity, send a message to my yahoo mail inbox (askthepizzaguy@yahoo.com). I will ask you questions via email, you can answer them via email, and I'll post the responses.

Fun times will be had by all, I assure you. The FBI are great, but a little boring. :bounce:

gnarlycharlie

09-18-2011, 09:42

This bit about th death of Moros does not make any sense at all. There is a clue in Seward's folly and the map of Alaska, but that is not telling much.

well wasn't Seward's Folly the purchase of Alaska from the USSR/Russia? if there are commies (because apparently SF wouldn't rehash them) could they have a hit?

TheLastDays

09-18-2011, 09:43

Well, let's get Yaropolk to speak up aboiut this PM conversation, should be fun.

vote: Yaropolk
select: GH

Moros

09-18-2011, 09:46

Gah!

God Emperor

09-18-2011, 10:08

Vote: VisorSlash :stare:

This is a personal matter.

Unvote: Visorslash

As for the serious part of this post: I really don't like the look of following quotes

What? You select him as Director,giving him power over lynches, and vote him for the lynch? fos:Xenoneb.

Yeah, right, your forgot that tiny little detail and whoopsadaisy! you quickly select whoever's been selected right before you. fos not withdrawn from you.

Are you actually serious about this FOS? To me this seems completely far-fetched

Visor

09-18-2011, 10:10

We meet again. :bow:

Unvote; Vote: God Emperor

Visor

09-18-2011, 10:12

Unvote; Vote: ACIN.

Death is yonder

09-18-2011, 10:41

Monty's odd explanation behind his references to Nazism are very suspicious. Yaro's response with the volkswagon phrase is also odd and he should definitely explain more.

Vote: Montmorency

I find his queer defense of his usage of the nazi references especially the flailing reference to vengeance:

Also note that I am a Nazi in another Mafia game here.

In which Yaropolk isn't even playing, to be really peculiar, as to how it could possibly be significant. More like scum tossing out every vaguely relevant defense to cover his tracks.

Erebus

09-18-2011, 10:47

You guys are way too focused. Why does it have to be commies? Why can't it be the Russian Mob trying to muscle in on Mafia terriotory?

Haven't had a chance to read it over in detail (visiting relatives) but it could be a mob calling card (to throw us off) or a legitimate 3rd party faction. Someone who knows more or has time to do some research could shed some light on this.

And what about Subotan? Is the accomplise getting off the hook or did I misss something?

Visor

09-18-2011, 10:47

Have you seen the way Monty plays games? Not the standard style.

Askthepizzaguy

09-18-2011, 10:53

Yeah he even admitted to being mafia in one game where he was townie.

You know, he is the next The Spartan, because of that. He is now Spartmorency.

Death is yonder

09-18-2011, 10:57

Definitely doesn't excuse odd behavior though, I'd draw the line between "not the standard style" and outright scrambling for 'reasoning'.

However, Yaro should still definitely explain further what was going on and how he arrived at that conclusion besides the implied.

Visor

09-18-2011, 10:58

Arjos

09-18-2011, 11:04

Vote: ACIN

Select: GH

Subotan

09-18-2011, 11:23

Select: GH
Vote: ACIN

Case on Montmorency is ... interesting, but not as compelling as ACIN's

Select:GH

Vote:The_Stranger

FoS: Jahoma and everybody else who voted for ACIN

Case on Montmorency is so interesting that I was part of the squad Yaropolk organised last night, but if there's anyone whose case is more compelling than him it's The Stranger. ACIN has been exposed as a lying crook, but not scum; this makes him an easy lynch for all the scum to vote for and coo at how scummy and "compelling" his case is.

Subotan

09-18-2011, 11:24

And what about Subotan? Is the accomplise getting off the hook or did I misss something?
Evidently you missed something, as I'm neither an accomplice, nor was ever on anyone's hook.

TheLastDays

09-18-2011, 11:34

I'm still waiting on the proof that The Stranger promised me or was that supposed to be what you said in thread instead? Weak.

I agree with Subotan that there's scum hiding on the ACIN wagon, that doesn't clear ACIN or Subotan though. Even if The_Stranger turns out to be scum, there's wuite a few Mafia Families in this game and probably some other parties with conflicting interests. Even someone who is town right now could become Mafia later, so yes, Subotan, you're still on my hook, even though I currently agree with your reasoning.

Death is yonder

09-18-2011, 11:37

It does.

And Yaro does.

I would definitely like to persist in my belief that Monty is a rational person who gives well-explained and detailed reasoning should he desire to be absolved of any false guilt. Unless you're saying that Monty likes to play with his life because he doesn't have any stake in the situation (referring to pizza drawing the example of him falsely claiming scum) and saying that it explains everything away every time.

And Yaro does what?

@Subo

I believe he's referring to your part in the happenings as opposed to being role-wise an accomplice, though that may be his implied accusation as well.

TheLastDays

09-18-2011, 11:44

I believe he's referring to your part in the happenings as opposed to being role-wise an accomplice, though that may be his implied accusation as well.

(Emphasis mine)

There is a role, called accomplice? What do you know about that, DiY?

Moros

09-18-2011, 11:51

Death is yonder

09-18-2011, 11:52

I implied his meaning as literally an accomplice in crimes (or a partner in crime if you want to put it as such)

For example, TLD was the accomplice to Chaotix in the latest murder spree in Netherworld :tongue:

In a game-wise context, this would refer to a possible accusation of the two being mafia buddies (and not suggestion that a role literally called the accomplice exists, which would be quite the odd role indeed)

TheLastDays

09-18-2011, 12:02

I implied his meaning as literally an accomplice in crimes (or a partner in crime if you want to put it as such)

For example, TLD was the accomplice to Chaotix in the latest murder spree in Netherworld :tongue:

I'm just ridiculously sucsicious :tongue:

In a game-wise context, this would refer to a possible accusation of the two being mafia buddies (and not suggestion that a role literally called the accomplice exists, which would be quite the odd role indeed)

Fair enough.

Diamondeye

09-18-2011, 12:09

Vote: Montmorency
Select: GH

Death is yonder

09-18-2011, 12:24

Ah yes, almost forgot.

Select: GH

It is in times like this that Fatlington need strong leaders and I for one welcome our new hankerchief overlords!
Well at least until he fails to deliver on his campaign promises, which in other words means he stops providing amusing methods of death :stare:

I'm just ridiculously sucsicious

I know :beam:

Beefy187

09-18-2011, 12:49

All those who want to post anonymous pm's on the .org or messages in this topic can contact me if they like. I'm dead and can't play anymore anyway. At least this way I can be of some use in this game in which I only could be active for one turn.

Is that allowed?
Though right now I cannot see much use of this except posting stuff for lulz.

Anyhow

Vote: The Stranger

To balance the votes a bit.

Select: GH

Cahoma

09-18-2011, 12:49

Select: GH
Vote: The Stranger This could easily change to ACIN or Montmorency though.

guiri

09-18-2011, 13:00

Select: GH
Vote: The Stranger

Xehh II

09-18-2011, 13:13

Vote: ACIN Because text walls hurt me eyes
Select: Xehh II Because I am still awesome

And please, please, ATPG for the love of all that is good and right in this world stop playing terrible music on your radio. How about a little Stargazer by Rainbow? Then everyone can me as cool as me after they hear it.

edse

09-18-2011, 13:25

Vote: ACIN It's just the toss of a coin right now, neither ACIN nor The Stranger is confirmed to be guilty but one of them is getting executed.

Select: GH Death and food, two of my fetishes combined, keep up the good work :bow:

Moros

09-18-2011, 13:38

Is that allowed?
Though right now I cannot see much use of this except posting stuff for lulz.

It is not allowed for me to pass on any information I collected during the game, that's correct. But using other members to anonymously contact people on the .org should be legal, it has been done before. As I'm dead I can't use the information for my own purposes anymore and you have at least my guarantee that I will forward the message to the person(s) you want, and only those who you want. I will add however that I will not be avaible next weekend (from friday to sunday) as I will be in Paris then.

Edit: pro-town, anti-town,... doesn't matter.

naut

09-18-2011, 14:12

Select: GH

Vote: Beefy

Balance the votes?! :laugh4:

TinCow

09-18-2011, 14:12

My take on the write-up:

ACIN: 3 attackers and 3 defenders. Unsuccessful vig attack due to low numbers, successful townie protection. Though, do the protectors get credit if the attack was not going to succeed anyway?

El Barto: Two separate attacks. One attack of 4 people and one of 2 people. Attack of 4 people appears to be an unsuccessful vig due to low numbers. Attack of two people results in El Barto surviving by, apparently, pure luck. This reminds me of a red text trait from Capo 3, which would also mean that the 2 person attack was otherwise successful, otherwise the red text survival trait would not have triggered. Thus, it seems to me the 2 person attack was a mafia attack.

Master Necromanver: Attacked by 1 person and survived. Obviously, this was ATPG.

Warman: Killed by 5 attackers. Successful vig attack.

Cahoma: Attacked by 4 attackers. Not entirely clear if this was an unsuccessful vig attack due to numbers, or whether Cahoma survived for other reasons. However, the 'surprised to find the alley deserted' bit makes me think he would have died if there had been a 5th person in the alley. Thus, more likely it was a failed vig.

Choatix: Unclear if this was one attack by 5 people or two attacks, one by 4 people and one by 1 person. Again, Chaotix appears to have survived by pure luck, thus red text. This means the attack was otherwise successful. So, it was either a successful 5 person vig or a failed 4 person vig due to low numbers and a successful 1 person attack, which I guess would indicate a serial killer or something. Probably just a 5 person vig though.

Montmorency: Attacked by 4 people and survived. Unsuccessful vig due to low numbers.

Moros: Attacked by 5 people and killed. Successful vig. The map of Alaska and the reference to "Seward’s Folly" are not flavor text, that's some kind of role info. Seward's Folly refers to the Alaska Purchase, where the US bought Alaska from Russia. If there is a communist faction in this game, Moros likely had something to do with it.

ATPG: Attacked by 1 person, and it appears successfully protected, though not clear by how many people. Maybe 1 person per armor plate? Which would indicate 5 people. Again, though, do defenders get credit for a protection if the attack would not have succeeded due to low numbers anyway?

Bit between ATPG and Pharoah: Same as yesterday, looks like some kind of recruitment attempt or recruitment investigation. Probably something to do with special roles.

Pharoah: Killed by 5 attackers. Successful vig.

Beefy187

09-18-2011, 14:22

Select: GH

Vote: Beefy

Balance the votes?! :laugh4:

Closer to tie so vote changes could be made when something else pops up.
Voting for me works too :curtain:

TinCow

09-18-2011, 14:25

Alright, got through reading all the posts. We're already getting overloaded with people who need lynching. Time to start keeping a list.

FoS Lynch List:
ACIN - Odd involvement in the Subotan/Stranger situation.
Subotan - Argument with The Stranger
The Stranger - Argument with Subotan
Montmorency - Odd conversation with Yaropolk (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?137953-Capo-di-Tutti-Capi-IV&p=2053375503&viewfull=1#post2053375503). Possibly special role up to something, or mafioso making a recruitment feeler.
Major Robert Dump - Scummy overreaction when he was investigated as criminal.

All of these people are decent lynches, though the ACIN/Subotan/Stranger trio is too headache inducing for me to bother trying to sort out. Thus, my own attention turns to Monty and MRD. MRD is worse to me, because of his behavior. We have time to get more info on Monty via conversation, but scummy behavior is scummy behavior and deserves a lynching.

Vote: Major Robert Dump
Select: GH

ELITEofWARMANGINGERYBREADMEN88

09-18-2011, 14:38

Four more attackers appeared from the crowd and started swinging socks – each one with a 4 ounce can of salted cashews in the toe – at Elite. The blows rained down, hammering his head, ribs, neck and face, punctuated every so often with a swinging smash from the 1st attacker’s golf club. In a minute, Elite was a battered wreck; in three he was singing in the choir eternal.

One of the attackers went over to the hot nuts cart, rolled it toward Elite’s body, and dumped the steaming hot cashews onto his fresh corpse. The first attacker produced a bottle of milk, smashing it over the corpse with his golf club.

:laugh4::laugh4::laugh4::laugh4:

I like this write up, I really do. If I'm going to die, especially early, this is how I want to die!

Good write-up.

TheLastDays

09-18-2011, 14:40

My take on the write-up:

ACIN: 3 attackers and 3 defenders. Unsuccessful vig attack due to low numbers, successful townie protection. Though, do the protectors get credit if the attack was not going to succeed anyway?

Might be a Mafia attack including one or more wiseguys as well. It didn't look like they would have been unsuccesful if the bus hadn't shown up. The comment about being too few came after the arrival of defenders.

El Barto: Two separate attacks. One attack of 4 people and one of 2 people. Attack of 4 people appears to be an unsuccessful vig due to low numbers. Attack of two people results in El Barto surviving by, apparently, pure luck. This reminds me of a red text trait from Capo 3, which would also mean that the 2 person attack was otherwise successful, otherwise the red text survival trait would not have triggered. Thus, it seems to me the 2 person attack was a mafia attack.

Might well be a succesful vig attack and survival out of "red text" trait. Could be a vig attack with six killers.

Master Necromanver: Attacked by 1 person and survived. Obviously, this was ATPG.

Warman: Killed by 5 attackers. Successful vig attack.

Cahoma: Attacked by 4 attackers. Not entirely clear if this was an unsuccessful vig attack due to numbers, or whether Cahoma survived for other reasons. However, the 'surprised to find the alley deserted' bit makes me think he would have died if there had been a 5th person in the alley. Thus, more likely it was a failed vig.

Choatix: Unclear if this was one attack by 5 people or two attacks, one by 4 people and one by 1 person. Again, Chaotix appears to have survived by pure luck, thus red text. This means the attack was otherwise successful. So, it was either a successful 5 person vig or a failed 4 person vig due to low numbers and a successful 1 person attack, which I guess would indicate a serial killer or something. Probably just a 5 person vig though.

Montmorency: Attacked by 4 people and survived. Unsuccessful vig due to low numbers.

Agreed.

Moros: Attacked by 5 people and killed. Successful vig. The map of Alaska and the reference to "Seward’s Folly" are not flavor text, that's some kind of role info. Seward's Folly refers to the Alaska Purchase, where the US bought Alaska from Russia. If there is a communist faction in this game, Moros likely had something to do with it.

Not sure the four girlfriends are actually involved in the kill. Any reason you think so? The writeup looks more like they aren't.

ATPG: Attacked by 1 person, and it appears successfully protected, though not clear by how many people. Maybe 1 person per armor plate? Which would indicate 5 people. Again, though, do defenders get credit for a protection if the attack would not have succeeded due to low numbers anyway?

Bit between ATPG and Pharoah: Same as yesterday, looks like some kind of recruitment attempt or recruitment investigation. Probably something to do with special roles.

Pharoah: Killed by 5 attackers. Successful vig.

Agreed.

Subotan

09-18-2011, 14:43

TALI (http://ns223506.ovh.net/rozne/0ade7d2f71d120c46195d6d15ceebf13/wallpaper-538506.jpg)

13 - ACIN: (landlubber, gibsong, Visorslash, Craterus, Choxorn, sturmhauke, Sprig, ATPG, B_Ray, Jarema, Arjos, Xehh II, edse)
9 - The Stranger: {Xenoneb, qlyphz, Seon, Memnon, El Barto, Commander Subotan, Beefy187, Cahoma, guiri}
8 - Montmorency: {Yaropolk, Sasaki, White_eyes:D, Populous Romanus, hero di classico, Death is yonder, Diamondeye}
1 - Yaropolk: {Oh! TheLastDays!}
1 - Beefy187: {Psychonaut}
1 - Major Robert Dump: {TinCow}

~~~

22 - GH: {landlubber, gibsong, Memnon, El Barto, sturmhauke, GamezRule, ATPG, GH, White_eyes:D, B_Ray, Jarema, Oh! The LastDays!, Arjos, Commander Subotan, Diamondeye, Death is yonder, Beefy187, Cahoma, guiri, edse, Psychonaut, Tincow}
3 - Craterus: {Craterus, Xenoneb, Choxorn}
1 - Xehh II: {Xehh II}

Thoughts:

For future reference, this is the set of players who voted for ACIN before I called them out on it. Let's see how many of them turn out to be scum: {landlubber, gibsong, Visorslash, Craterus, Choxorn, sturmhauke, Sprig, ATPG, B_Ray, Jarema, Arjos}

The current balance of votes is unstable. I notice that hardly any of the votes have been backed up with much thinking on display; evidently, we're playing SheepMafia.

TinCow's vote for MRD seems too late in the phase to be a wholly serious one.

I for one welcome our old insect overlord.

Also, what happened to that vig attempt on ym life that everybody was demanding? I was looking forward to putting bullets inbetween the eyes of all my would-be-viggers.

TheLastDays

09-18-2011, 14:47

For future reference, this is the set of players who voted for ACIN before I called them out on it. Let's see how many of them turn out to be scum: {landlubber, gibsong, Visorslash, Craterus, Choxorn, sturmhauke, Sprig, ATPG, B_Ray, Jarema, Arjos}

The current balance of votes is unstable. I notice that hardly any of the votes have been backed up with much thinking on display; evidently, we're playing SheepMafia.

It's what happens when there's a comfortable bandwagon to join. Also, I'm sure there's scum on the wagon for TS as well :yes:

TinCow's vote for MRD seems too late in the phase to be a wholly serious one.

Hardly. Here's a timer for your convenience:

landlubber

09-18-2011, 15:10

I thought the plan was to balance out votes between ACIN, The Stranger, and Subotan, and then let whoever becomes Director decide. What happened to that? When I voted ACIN, I expected everyone else to at least attempt to balance the tally.

shlin28

09-18-2011, 15:18

I've been gunning for ACIN for a while... not going to stop now - Vote: ACIN

Also, Select: Craterus, welcome back to Capo :)

Subotan

09-18-2011, 15:19

It's what happens when there's a comfortable bandwagon to join. Also, I'm sure there's scum on the wagon for TS as well :yes:
Of course, but the ACIN bandwagoners seem to be particularly prone to justifying their votes along the lines of "oh noes I dont understand whats happening I'm just going to vote for that noisy guy please don't lynch me"

I thought the plan was to balance out votes between ACIN, The Stranger, and Subotan, and then let whoever becomes Director decide. What happened to that? When I voted ACIN, I expected everyone else to at least attempt to balance the tally.
Things happened, plan changed. Read the thread.

The Stranger

09-18-2011, 15:22

lol you are trying very hard to save ACIN from getting lynched while not so very long ago you voted for him yourself (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?137953-Capo-di-Tutti-Capi-IV&p=2053374197&highlight=#post2053374197), after which you then switched to earthling when he got put on the bandwagon. you then tried to cover for his reveals with some lies and now you 2 are big buddies... weird :S

Subotan

09-18-2011, 15:27

WIFOM. Had I not done so, you would certainly be pointing out the oh-so-suspicious fact that I've refused to vote for him.

The Stranger

09-18-2011, 15:31

not at all i just find it suspicious that you vote for your mate then switch when you can do so without being noticed cuz there is a major bandwagon going on. can you explain that? what has caused you to change your mind about ACIN from vote material to save at all cost candidate?

you still havent explained why you even bothered to cover up ACINs fake reveal about me being 3rd party that made, in your own words, your life so much more complicated. If you did it cuz hes your mate, why did you vote for him? If you didnt, then you mustve had a reason to change your mind about ACINs allegiance.

also its not wifom, not voting for acin isnt scummy many ppl havent done so, including myself. but voting for acin then switch to someone bandwagoned and then later protect acin and even lie for him, that is kinda weird, dont you agree? tho you yourself just said that ppl who have been voting for acin are suspicious, so would you include yourself in that category?

Ibn-Khaldun

09-18-2011, 15:33

Vote: ACIN
Select: GH

Riedquat

09-18-2011, 15:41

FoS: Subotan, ACIN, The Stranger ... solely for the damn wall of texts we should be lynching the three of you

Select: GH
Vote: The Stranger

The Stranger

09-18-2011, 15:48

last day-phase i received this pm from woad & fangs, however i didnt read it untill the deadline had expired because i was asleep. do with this as you plase.

According to ACIN you are scum. If that is the case I would like you to pass on some info to your luca/don. I'll be a wiseguy after the next night phase and am willing to be recruited into your family. If they would prefer email to remain anonymous at first they can reach me at [instert email]
~Woad

i doubt i have to point at the succesrate of vigilante killers. too bad for him he didnt read acins reveal right, because acin said i was 3rd party and not mafia at all.

here is the rest of our conversation

i have no clue what you are talking about but acin is wrong. but if it is true that you will be a wg after next night it means you killed someone. so you better come clean before i spill this in the thread.
I was just fishing for some more mafia to throw under the bus and made up the night kill to sound more legitimate. If you do feel the need to post the message in the thread, please redact my email address.

TheLastDays

09-18-2011, 15:54

More PMs, more private reveals, I'm getting a bit tired of it. I like the atmosphere it creates though. Will make Mafia recruiting a bit harder when potential recruits cannot trust the ones they contact for recruitment.

Double A

09-18-2011, 16:10

I'm at page 19. :cry:

vote: abstain till I get caught up to some degree

(I did skim a few other pages to get a general feel, but right now I feel like I'm in the dark)

Monk

09-18-2011, 16:13

Events of other kinds kept me from keeping up on this game over the weekend, so I'm afraid I'll have to:

Vote: Abstain
Select: Abstain

With the continued shenanigans (apparently) still at a high point, i don't feel comfortable casting a vote without having the time to actively follow things. :bow:

ULC

09-18-2011, 16:15

Select: GH
Vote: Yaropolk
Fos: Montmorency

The Vote and FoS will reverse when Yaro actually further explains his case, and explains the PMs. This is the 50s, bringing Nazi's into it seems rather absurd. This is the era of McCarthyism, the second red scare, Nazi's are extremely unrelated to this to the point of "wat". If Seamus wanted to mix it up, make sense, and stay within theme, there would be a legitimate Mason group that's protown and liberal, being hunted by essentially an anti-town group of government agents who work for McCarthy, such as HUAC.

As for ACIN, Subotan, and TheStranger - after this round, IGNORE THEM. It's not hard, and they are being a mere distraction and producing nothing positive. I FoS anyone who continues to give as much effort into paying attention to them this round as they do rounds after.

Peasant Phill

09-18-2011, 16:17

Vote ACIN
Select: abstain

And now I remember again how much work participatin in such a massive game is.

TheLastDays

09-18-2011, 16:22

Can we have some more votes on Yaro to bring him to speak up? I want to find out what the Monty/Yaro business is about so we need some talk here.

Lewwyn

09-18-2011, 16:30

I'll keep to my vote from last day and try to help balance the votes there. Though I agree that Yaropolk is suspicious... One thing at a time unfortunately.
Vote:The Stranger
Select:abstain

TheLastDays

09-18-2011, 16:34

I'm not saying he should be lynched. I want pressure votes on Yaropolk and if he throws out an accusation like that and doesn't show up to talk to pressure then, yes, he deserves a lynch.

The Stranger

09-18-2011, 16:49

vote subotan

you were online but didnt reply to my questions...

Diana Abnoba

09-18-2011, 16:51

Can we have some more votes on Yaro to bring him to speak up? I want to find out what the Monty/Yaro business is about so we need some talk here.

I agree so therefore; Vote: Yaro
Select: GH

seireikhaan

09-18-2011, 17:03

Which scummy person to start with...Eenie meenie minie moe....

Vote: Subotan

And naturally, I must continue my support for my General.

Select: GH

Sasaki Kojiro

09-18-2011, 17:17

Select: GH

We are waiting on Yaro to expand now, but these ACIN votes are looking pretty sketchy. TS or montmorency are the way to go today.

SisterCoyote

09-18-2011, 17:25

Vote: Subotan
select: GH

Montmorency

09-18-2011, 17:28

Alright, if there is any confusion over my explanation, submit a question.

Askthepizzaguy

09-18-2011, 17:43

Hey guess what folks.

I know what The Stranger was doing last night, and he wasn't killing. :eyebrows:

All the votes on him are the equivalent of horse poopy in my view. He successfully protected someone and it is in the writeup for all to see. I won't out who his partners were, but they got credit for a successful protection.

Yeah. Yeah. That's right. Uhhh. I freaking rule.

Askthepizzaguy

09-18-2011, 17:46

He successfully protected someone and it is in the writeup for all to see.

Whoops, forgot to add:

This was the group with three people in it. In other words, the exact bare minimum, no margin for error, nobody missing from the group. In other words, iron-freaking-clad.

DaveShack

09-18-2011, 17:51

Select: GH

Yesterday I voted for ACIN because I thought tossing out a PM reveal looked scummy. As the vote is already going that way, I'd like to pressure another who tosses out PMs.
Vote: Yaropolk

Winston Hughes

09-18-2011, 17:57

Askthepizzaguy

09-18-2011, 17:59

Not sure the four girlfriends are actually involved in the kill. Any reason you think so? The writeup looks more like they aren't.

As for the Moros thing: You can tell there are actually either 2, or 6, people involved.

The four girlfriends appear to have nothing to do with it.

The initial car accident seems to be the driving force, sort of like sets of gunmen herding someone to their death. The car accident from behind indicates one part of a two-person team.

The sniper being the second part. Then, there's a calling card.

Therefore, Moros was executed by one of the mafia families.

Winston Hughes

09-18-2011, 18:00

:laugh4: Didn't see pizza's evidence on TS before I posted. Not sure how it changes things, though.

Xenoneb

09-18-2011, 18:05

Unvote;Vote: Yaropolk
I trust pizzaman, and agree with OTLD, I want an explanation from Yaro.

Askthepizzaguy

09-18-2011, 18:07

:laugh4: Didn't see pizza's evidence on TS before I posted. Not sure how it changes things, though.

Well, doesn't make him innocent. But, I can tell you this much, he's not going to be any of the vigilantes or murderers or serial killers or whatever else is violent in the write-up. He wasn't killing last night, which means....

Which means ladies and gentlemen if anyone bothered to scan him, and they got a guilty result, that means he would be a townie or wiseguy who has killed.

If they scanned him as criminal, then he would be a wiseguy who has never killed (not sure about that, plz confirm) or a gangster.

Good luck, maybe that will help someone out there.

Beskar

09-18-2011, 18:10

Select: Major Robert Dump

Vote: El Barto

Best suspects are him and ACIN. Though ACIN is simply trollface.jpg as usual, so rather try to vote off a real suspect and allow ACIN to be vigged.

GeneralHankerchief

09-18-2011, 19:01

Thank you for your continued confidence everyone, I've just submitted today's execution to Seamus, hope you all like it. :bow: Really looking forward to doing tomorrow's lynch as it's Halloween, I'll have to think of something really good for that one.

Frozen In Ice

09-18-2011, 19:02

So I can't understand what is actually be said in those PMs by Montmorency and Yaropolk, other than those are apparently Nazi references. I think Montmorency is probably telling the truth that he is kidding.

so I will vote: El Barto instead.

Seon

09-18-2011, 19:03

Unvote. Vote: El Barto.

I still love you buddy :2thumbsup:

God Emperor

09-18-2011, 19:05

Removing either ACIN or El Barto seems like a decent plan to me. However, El Barto is a good deal behind with the votes on him I think. So Vote: El Barto

Kennigit

09-18-2011, 19:05

Vote: Present for the time being.

Johhog

09-18-2011, 19:19

VOTE: El Barto

TheLastDays

09-18-2011, 19:23

Yay for votes without reasoning!

Montmorency

09-18-2011, 19:25

I would Vote: Subotan; not many seem to feel that he came off badly in the exchange with Stranger, though.

What is the case on El Barto?

Select: GH

Just keep in mind the latest amendment ratified by the States: no more than 2 terms for GH.

TheLastDays

09-18-2011, 19:26

Ironside

09-18-2011, 20:08

What is the case on El Barto?

Winston claims that he's been dodging out of 2 groups on night 1 without any particular reason, and being dodgy on why.

Better case than The_Stranger and you on the basis that you two are claimed to be third party at best (for a lynch). You'll be better to funnel the vigi on I suppose.

Vote: El Barto . I do want to hear this reason.

Winston, what type of groups did he drop out from? I assume that the second was a vigi based on the writeups, correct me if I'm wrong.

Select: GH

Cahoma

09-18-2011, 20:15

Ah, it makes a bit more sense now.

Unvote; Vote: El Barto

thefluffyone93

09-18-2011, 20:37

Vote: Seon
for teh lulz

Select: Chaotix
for teh lulzors

GamezRule

09-18-2011, 20:51

These games take so long to read that virtually any vote is a bandwagon vote.

Anyway, vote: El Barto for being Takhisis. He probably won't get lynched this round, but at least this puts some pressure on the subject.

Xenoneb

09-18-2011, 20:56

Yay for band wagons!

Populus Romanus

09-18-2011, 21:09

Select: Askthepizzaguy

Erebus

09-18-2011, 21:11

Originally Posted by Erebus
I think you got an inconclusive PM on [Name Deleted] because myself and [Name Deleted] sent our orders with your name on it as well. I had sent in my orders before I realized you had left the group.

Erebus.

Yes, well… at least i have someone to back me up.

Right?

The scummy PM to start it off. El Barto contact or was contacted by Xenoneb, and got thrown into a protection group of nearly anyone who said hello to Xenoneb. We were a 4 man protection group that El Barto dropped out of claiming that the redundancy was Stupid. However, 2 of our 3 still including his name on the PM, so he got a results PM as well.

However, when I tried to explain why he got it, he seemed to want me to back up some sort of Alibi story. I nodded my head yes, and told a few people that I was VERY suspicious. Other stories of similar things come up, so the agreement was that El Barto needed to die. He dropped out of two groups (One protection and I believe on vigilante) and then tried to use me as an alibi.

Vote: El Barto

Also a detective has pmed me, I personally trust the source.

Subutan investigated as Guilty
TheStranger as unclear

Use this information how you will.

Erebus

09-18-2011, 21:12

Select: GH

Populus Romanus

09-18-2011, 21:14

GeneralHankerchief

09-18-2011, 21:17

Subotan is guilty because he was trying to vig Montmorency last night.

TheLastDays

09-18-2011, 21:18

Correct me if I'm wrong but I think only succesful kills make you show up as guilty.

God Emperor

09-18-2011, 21:21

from the rules : If investigated by a detective, the Wiseguy will appear “criminal” if they have not been involved in a killing and “guilty” if they have…even if that killing was a while back. If investigated by a made, they will appear either as “criminal” or “unclear.”

This at least suggests that he needs to have performed a kill before showing guilty

Silver Jan

09-18-2011, 21:21

Vote Subotan

Specially seeing as he's been found guilty.

Erebus

09-18-2011, 21:22

Detective

May investigate two persons per night phase. The investigation will list the individual as innocent (Townie, Don), criminal (Luca, Made not killing, Wise Guy not having killed at all, and some townies), or guilty (Luca or Made on the night of kill, Wise Guy or Townie who has killed – you either get the current kill or their whole track record as well). Acts as a Townie in other respects. Reads as “innocent” if investigated.

Winston Hughes

09-18-2011, 21:22

Winston, what type of groups did he drop out from?

The group he dropped from was supposed to conduct a vig attack against a protected target (for doctor creation), while the group he failed to show up to was protecting me. I knew all about the former group (and its matched protection team), while I'd been told that the latter group existed, but was not informed of the personnel.

Seon

09-18-2011, 21:24

I thought that you showed up guilty on the nights you tried to kill somebody.

The Stranger

09-18-2011, 21:24

The scummy PM to start it off. El Barto contact or was contacted by Xenoneb, and got thrown into a protection group of nearly anyone who said hello to Xenoneb. We were a 4 man protection group that El Barto dropped out of claiming that the redundancy was Stupid. However, 2 of our 3 still including his name on the PM, so he got a results PM as well.

However, when I tried to explain why he got it, he seemed to want me to back up some sort of Alibi story. I nodded my head yes, and told a few people that I was VERY suspicious. Other stories of similar things come up, so the agreement was that El Barto needed to die. He dropped out of two groups (One protection and I believe on vigilante) and then tried to use me as an alibi.

Vote: El Barto

Also a detective has pmed me, I personally trust the source.

Subutan investigated as Guilty
TheStranger as unclear

Use this information how you will.

owyeah subo HOW YOU RESPOND TO THAT? i knew u were dirty :P

Subotan is guilty because he was trying to vig Montmorency last night.

weak attempt to cover for him, it was an attempt not a succesfull kill, so it wouldnt show up as guilty? anyway he has alot of explaining to do

from the townie pm

2. You will register as “guilty” only if you participate in a successful killing, and will continue to register as “guilty for the remainder of the game or until you change roles.

you shouldve known that GH! the speed with which you cover for subo is amazing. kinda weird. you say he was trying to kill montmerency, but clearly he wouldnt appear guilty in that case. so either he has participated in the n1 vig kill or in the n2 vig kills. or perhaps more interesting in the weird kill of moros, which seems to be a mafia kill.

in any case GH, why would you lie about Subos whereabouts?

Montmorency

09-18-2011, 21:28

No one seems to have noticed that Chaotix was stabbed by the Blu Spy. What's up with that?

The Stranger

09-18-2011, 21:34

I thought that you showed up guilty on the nights you tried to kill somebody.

apparantly not

2. You will register as “guilty” only if you participate in a successful killing, and will continue to register as “guilty for the remainder of the game or until you change roles.

ULC

09-18-2011, 21:43

The scummy PM to start it off. El Barto contact or was contacted by Xenoneb, and got thrown into a protection group of nearly anyone who said hello to Xenoneb. We were a 4 man protection group that El Barto dropped out of claiming that the redundancy was Stupid. However, 2 of our 3 still including his name on the PM, so he got a results PM as well.

However, when I tried to explain why he got it, he seemed to want me to back up some sort of Alibi story. I nodded my head yes, and told a few people that I was VERY suspicious. Other stories of similar things come up, so the agreement was that El Barto needed to die. He dropped out of two groups (One protection and I believe on vigilante) and then tried to use me as an alibi.

Vote: El Barto

Also a detective has pmed me, I personally trust the source.

Subutan investigated as Guilty
TheStranger as unclear

Use this information how you will.

I don't personally trust sources that give unclear investigations results.

Made Gangster:

A Made is one of the two initial “Made” gangsters in a crime family. Their objective is to lead up the “wet-work” efforts on behalf of their crime family, eventually controlling the town. If investigated by a Detective or another Made, a Made gangster appears “criminal.” If investigated by a Detective during a “night” phase in which the made gangster is actively involved in a killing, they appear “guilty.” In addition, a Made gangster can conduct one “recruiting” investigation per “night” phase. This investigation will determine if the individual is “criminal,” “innocent,” or “unclear.” The initial made gangster of a family is automatically aware of the identity of the family Don. In addition, a group of mades may provide protection for another Mafioso.

Since detectives are not listed as able to obtain unclear results, you are either in contact with a third party or a mafioso, and none of them are nominally town aligned. Cough them up.

Unvote:, Vote: Erebus

Seon

09-18-2011, 21:43

@Montmorency: probably a TF2 fan was amongst the vig team. You can choose how to appear in the write-ups after all.

Pizza appears in the writeup every night with his pizza and a Tommy gun after all. Somebody also used a rocket launcher, I believe.

ULC

09-18-2011, 21:45

For clarities sake, because I forgot my colons.

Unvote:, Vote:Erebus

Montmorency

09-18-2011, 21:47

The Stranger

09-18-2011, 21:49

I don't personally trust sources that give unclear investigations results.

Since detectives are not listed as able to obtain unclear results, you are either in contact with a third party or a mafioso, and none of them are nominally town aligned. Cough them up.

Unvote:, Vote: Erebus

detectives also register as unclear so your mistrust is misguided.

from my townie pm

1. If you are investigated by a detective, it is likely that you will be evaluated as “innocent.” A minority of townies, however, will register as “unclear,” while an even smaller percentage will register as “criminal” because of a mis-spent youth or poor choice of associates.

God Emperor

09-18-2011, 21:49

untrue.. from the rules: A townie has no special abilities – at least at the start. Most Townies will appear as “innocent” if investigated by a detective, though a minority will appear as “unclear” and a very small minority as “criominal.” If investigated by a made, the most will be “innocent,” some “unclear,” and a minority “criminal.”

ULC

09-18-2011, 21:51

detectives also register as unclear so your mistrust is misguided.

from my townie pm

And yet the rules state that Detectives obtain Innocent, Criminal, and Guilty. Nothing is made mention of "Unclear". I standby my statements, especially since being in contact with two detectives when the vast majority of those capable of investigating are Mades and third parties...yea, no.

The Stranger

09-18-2011, 21:53

And yet the rules state that Detectives obtain Innocent, Criminal, and Guilty. Nothing is made mention of "Unclear". I standby my statements, especially since being in contact with two detectives when the vast majority of those capable of investigating are Mades and third parties...yea, no.

so if you are proven wrong on that point you will reconsider? because you are wrong!

you obviously dont have a townie pm or havent read it correctly. go read it -_- if you want one pm me and ill send it to you... or check the rules townie pms are posted there i guess.

God Emperor

09-18-2011, 21:53

To me there is only one way to procede from here: Subotan must inform us of which kill(s) he is responsible for. Or if anyone can do this for him

ULC

09-18-2011, 21:58

you obviously dont have a townie pm or havent read it correctly. go read it -_-

I've read it, and I can potentially appear as unclear, but the rules, which are plastered in the summary thread, state that Detectives do not get unclear results. SECOND, Erebus essentially claims being in contact with two detectives, which I find extremely unlikely. The weight of numbers says that ONE of his contacts is an anti-town investigator, likely the one that came up with an unclear result.

Technically, it could be cleared up with another night of investigation - the investigators switch, and the results should come up the same IF they are the same role. Differing roles will obtain different results, but any single type of role will always obtain the same investigation results. My only issue is - how do I trust Erebus to report back truthfully?

Montmorency

09-18-2011, 22:00

To me there is only one way to procede from here: Subotan must inform us of which kill(s) he is responsible for. Or if anyone can do this for him

Last night, he claims to have attacked me. Must be Blackadder if he did kill.

Now why would he want to kill Blackadder on N1? What's the rationale? :inquisitive:

The Stranger

09-18-2011, 22:04

I've read it, and I can potentially appear as unclear, but the rules, which are plastered in the summary thread, state that Detectives do not get unclear results. SECOND, Erebus essentially claims being in contact with two detectives, which I find extremely unlikely. The weight of numbers says that ONE of his contacts is an anti-town investigator, likely the one that came up with an unclear result.

Technically, it could be cleared up with another night of investigation - the investigators switch, and the results should come up the same IF they are the same role. Differing roles will obtain different results, but any single type of role will always obtain the same investigation results. My only issue is - how do I trust Erebus to report back truthfully?

i dont see the problem. this mightve been a good idea in the case of criminal but guilty is unifrormly and there never is a mistake. as a towny you are scanned guilty ONLY when you have killed someone.

so the problem is yes, is the source valid, but this has nothing to do with the other detective...

the rules seem to conflict then. but i think what is in the townie pm is what we should go with. maybe a pm to seamus can solve this matter.

Xenoneb

09-18-2011, 22:04

Last night, he claims to have attacked me. Must be Blackadder if he did kill.

Now why would he want to kill Blackadder on N1? What's the rationale? :inquisitive:
He doesn't like Mr. Bean? :shrug:

ULC

09-18-2011, 22:04

Last night, he claims to have attacked me. Must be Blackadder if he did kill.

Now why would he want to kill Blackadder on N1? What's the rationale? :inquisitive:

Or he is a wiseguy, and needs to be forced into a protection group to prevent being turned into a made.

The Stranger

09-18-2011, 22:04

Last night, he claims to have attacked me. Must be Blackadder if he did kill.

Now why would he want to kill Blackadder on N1? What's the rationale? :inquisitive:

no he is also listed as guilty on the night of the kill so he can also be listed guilty for any of the n2 kills.

ULC

09-18-2011, 22:08

so if you are proven wrong on that point you will reconsider? because you are wrong!

Somewhat, I'll move from outright suspicion to leery, simply because being in contact with two detectives so early is heavily improbable, with one likely being mafia or third party by sheer weight of numbers.

i dont see the problem. this mightve been a good idea in the case of criminal but guilty is unifrormly and there never is a mistake. as a towny you are scanned guilty ONLY when you have killed someone.

the rules seem to conflict then. but i think what is in the townie pm is what we should go with. maybe a pm to seamus can solve this matter.

I don't see an issue with the detectives switching around to confirm themselves and Erebus as being legitimate sources. Unclear is the worst result you can get and anything to further clarify that is a good thing. Are we being evasive about having your alignment checked again?

Montmorency

09-18-2011, 22:09

no he is also listed as guilty on the night of the kill so he can also be listed guilty for any of the n2 kills.

See below.

Or he is a wiseguy, and needs to be forced into a protection group to prevent being turned into a made.

Or? That has nothing to do with what I said. If he read as guilty, then he must have killed someone. He claims to have participated on the vig on me N2. Ergo, he could only have killed N1. The only player killed N1 was Blackadder, ergo Subotan helped kill Blackadder.

The Stranger

09-18-2011, 22:11

no. i dont mind being checked again. i have nothing to hide.

but if the result on subo is genuine and he is not a townie but a made or sumthing he wont show up as guilty next night if he doesnt kill. if he is a townie he should show up as guilty again i guess.

Suburban Plankton

09-18-2011, 22:14

So we've got Subotan being investigated as "guilty", ACIN still a liar from Yesterday, and MRD suspicious for his overreaction to being found "criminal".

I'm still unclear what to make of the dustup between Subotan and The Stranger overNight, and I'm not a fan at all of the bandwagon on Montmorency.

For the moment I'll stick with my first instinct:

Vote: ACIN

Does anyone have a current vote count?

Kennigit

09-18-2011, 22:14

Unvote; Vote:Subotan

I think the scan result is solid to warrant him answering whats up.

ULC

09-18-2011, 22:15

Or? That has nothing to do with what I said. If he read as guilty, then he must have killed someone. He claims to have participated on the vig on me N2. Ergo, he could only have killed N1. The only player killed N1 was Blackadder, ergo Subotan helped kill Blackadder.

Yes, but looking at the kill on Blackadder would still likely make him a Wiseguy, likely going for Made - thus actually answering your question. He's not mafia now but likely going for mafia, which puts him and ACIN in the same traitorous boat.

Winston Hughes

09-18-2011, 22:18

The Stranger

09-18-2011, 22:18

Yes, but looking at the kill on Blackadder would still likely make him a Wiseguy, likely going for Made - thus actually answering your question. He's not mafia now but likely going for mafia, which puts him and ACIN in the same traitorous boat.

that is if he was involved in that. i doubt it cuz GH who seems to know what he has done and it was GH who claimed he was vigging montmerency, it wasnt subo himself who hasnt said a thing yet. anyway GH said he was guilty cuz he tried to kill montmerency, this is clearly wrong. but if he also vigged blackadder, then why didnt GH just say that?

Xenoneb

09-18-2011, 22:19

Detective:

May investigate two persons per night phase. The investigation will list the individual as innocent (Townie, Don), criminal (Luca, Made not killing, Wise Guy not having killed at all, and some townies), or guilty (Luca or Made on the night of kill, Wise Guy or Townie who has killed – you either get the current kill or their whole track record as well). Acts as a Townie in other respects. Reads as “innocent” if investigated.
Guys, he only needs to now one detective to name two people. He would need to know two Mades to do any other way.

TinCow

09-18-2011, 22:21

Unvote; Vote: Subotan

Erebus' detectives deserve some scrutiny, but that doesn't really invalidate the results. The rules say that Mades get innocent, criminal, and unclear; no mention of guilty. There's no real reason for scum to falsify detective results at this point. Plus, if the results are faked we will know it when Subotan explains what he was doing, plus we'll get the full autopsy on him in three days. At that point, and falsifications by the detective claimer will be apparent and the person can be exposed and lynched. This lynch is win-win.

ULC

09-18-2011, 22:23

Where does Erebus say he has two detectives reporting to him?

Also, you're wrong about the unclear thing; it's stated quite clearly:

A guilty result means it wasn't an FBI detective since there has only been two nights and you can't get guilty until you have killed, correct me if I am wrong. So I am assuming he is not in contact with anything other then different sources. Also, those are odd choices to make on N1, that happen to be pertinent choices on D2/3.

And back to this again - look at the Detective role, it does not state the detective can get unclear, and if it's an FBI detective, then it's even less likely to get unclear if at all. Finally, I've already shot Seamus a PM to clarify.

GeneralHankerchief

09-18-2011, 22:26

The Stranger

09-18-2011, 22:27

i think the unclear thing is new and so doesnt list in the old pms. tho its weird that townie pms about detectives conflict with what detective pms say about townies... must be some mix up.

ULC

09-18-2011, 22:28

The Stranger

09-18-2011, 22:28

To be fair, I was only trying to put what I thought was two and two together, since Subo told me he was going Nazi hunting last night and then the whole thing with Monty coming out and being a Nazi mason. I was also under the assumption that one got a "guilty" result even if the kill had failed, which clearly isn't the case.

now you are backing up on something you put forward rather easily as a sure claim. isnt it odd that subo knew already about montmerencys nazi thing but hasnt said a thing about it during the entire discussion?

it seems u and subo are kinda close, care to elaborate?

GeneralHankerchief

09-18-2011, 22:30

Not to brag, but I figured out the SSV thing was a code word about five seconds after Subo posted it the second time, and PM'd him saying to keep me in the loop. He has, to an extent.

TinCow

09-18-2011, 22:30

I don't think Subo's investigation is wrong, perse, but that whomever investigated TS is questionable.

Agreed.

The Stranger

09-18-2011, 22:35

Not to brag, but I figured out the SSV thing was a code word about five seconds after Subo posted it the second time, and PM'd him saying to keep me in the loop. He has, to an extent.

subo claims it was no code but that he has been using it even before mafia started. and that he kept using it so he might draw some 3rd parties...

so is a code? or is he just pretending that it is a code?

Beskar

09-18-2011, 22:35

Cecil XIX

09-18-2011, 22:38

select: GeneralHankerchief

GeneralHankerchief

09-18-2011, 22:39

I suppose he could be pretending, but he also told me that he was vigging a Nazi last night before any of this broke. Make what you will out of that.

Xenoneb

09-18-2011, 22:40

I suppose he could be pretending, but he also told me that he was vigging a Nazi last night before any of this broke. Make what you will out of that.
Who? Sub?

GeneralHankerchief

09-18-2011, 22:41

Yes.

God Emperor

09-18-2011, 22:43

Meh.. I really fail to see the problem with the scans :shrug: The rules clearly says that a detective can scan a person as 'unclear' .. As I said a few posts back ..

What is more important: Does anyone know if there was a reason behind the murder of Captain Blackadder?

Winston Hughes

09-18-2011, 22:44

I don't think Subo's investigation is wrong, perse, but that whomever investigated TS is questionable.

Maybe I've misunderstood this, but...

Erebus is saying he has spoken to one detective, who has two investigations per night (as per the detective role in the rules). And while the detective role does not mention that townies can scan as 'unclear', the townie role does say that some townies will come up as 'unclear' when investigated by a detective. (Presumably there are other roles that can also come up as unclear, or else 'unclear' would actually mean 'guaranteed innocent'. Thus the result does not clear The Stranger of suspicion.)

The Stranger

09-18-2011, 22:44

I suppose he could be pretending, but he also told me that he was vigging a Nazi last night before any of this broke. Make what you will out of that.

well that still wouldnt explain his guilty result. apart from the fact i find this rather odd. its odd to say im going nazi hunting and that then suddenly some nazi reveals come next phase. or in the other case its weird that if he knew about it he then didnt say anything about the reveal.

but ok i guess we just have to wait for the man himself.

Xenoneb

09-18-2011, 22:47

OKay. So there is Nazis, and Commies? Next thing you know there will be Hippies! :p

Montmorency

09-18-2011, 22:48

SSV

Well, that's one thing I didn't get. If it's Mass Effect related, why did he say he was using it to fish for 3rd parties? Why was The Stranger the first to post about it in-thread? Why was Subo so hesitant to mention it himself?

Does it follow that Subotan was looking for a Mass Effect 3rd-party? :confused:

ULC

09-18-2011, 22:52

Maybe I've misunderstood this, but...

Erebus is saying he has spoken to one detective, who has two investigations per night (as per the detective role in the rules). And while the detective role does not mention that townies can scan as 'unclear', the townie role does say that some townies will come up as 'unclear' when investigated by a detective. (Presumably there are other roles that can also come up as unclear, or else 'unclear' would actually mean 'guaranteed innocent'. Thus the result does not clear The Stranger of suspicion.)

I check the rules again and yes, apparently detectives do investigate twice per night. Once Seamus clarifies then I will make my decision on whether or not to back off.

I am sadface, I thought I was on to something D:

Montmorency

09-18-2011, 22:59

What are these words that you speak, ULC of the dark helm? Ever do the lords of town seek your counsel, which in previous times has proven best.

Winston Hughes

09-18-2011, 23:01

I am sadface, I thought I was on to something D:

As did I, when I first saw what you posted. Still, it's always worth working these things through. :bow:

Erebus

09-18-2011, 23:02

To clarify, the detective can in fact investigate two people a night. These investigations were made last night.

I realize the source is suspect, but I'd rather be in the spotlight then an actual detective. Based on other information provided by this source I believe their claim. So if you want to be suspicious of me that's fine.

However, you are voting for me, based on an interpretation of the rules from your perspective. Obviously the townie role conflicts with the Detective write-up. Only the Detective role-pm can state for sure the rules. And that doesn't put it out of human era.

The best way to be certain, check the final write-up for the other Capo's I remember one of them having a unified list of reads.

We can ask Seamus about the detective rules for unclear, but apparently only ULC seems to have an issue.

Why is so hard to swallow ULC?

FoS:ULC

Erebus

09-18-2011, 23:06

cross-post with Winston and ULC.

I'll unFoS:ULC for not knocking a better safe then sorry approach.

God Emperor

09-18-2011, 23:17

If the results are from this night, then he cannot have joined a mafia team yet, if I read the rules correctly.
If he did kill Blackadder, which seems very likely, then He is either a wiseguy or a town (not counting third party roles as I don't really know those)
If he did not kill Blackadder then he should ofc die right away.

ULC

09-18-2011, 23:18

Why is so hard to swallow ULC?

You'll learn quickly how dogmatic and demagogically I am. I'm quick to judge and hammer if for no other reason then to be aggressive and see what comes of it. think of it as compensation for lurkers.

Unvote:, Vote:Subotan

Neri

09-18-2011, 23:22

Vote: Subotan as overcomplicated plots do make one suspicious, and I would rather not have a blackmailer stay in the game.

Select: GH since he's been doing a good job having a voice in the game without becoming spammy.

Romanic

09-18-2011, 23:25

Alright, vote: Subotan

Subotan

09-18-2011, 23:27

Subotan is guilty because he was trying to vig Montmorency last night.
This is correct. The previous night I was trying to set up a sabotaged vigging with Yaropolk upon a protected target, in order to help create doctors. However, this fell through for a number of reasons, including: the fact that everybody was working through Pizza; leaving it too late in the phase to organise; and IRL stuff which prevented me from having the time to organise a group of six people. I therefore took part in no actions on the first night, and a vigging on the second which fell through due to Yaropolk's failure to send in a pm.

not at all i just find it suspicious that you vote for your mate then switch when you can do so without being noticed cuz there is a major bandwagon going on. can you explain that? what has caused you to change your mind about ACIN from vote material to save at all cost candidate?

also its not wifom, not voting for acin isnt scummy many ppl havent done so, including myself. but voting for acin then switch to someone bandwagoned and then later protect acin and even lie for him, that is kinda weird, dont you agree? tho you yourself just said that ppl who have been voting for acin are suspicious, so would you include yourself in that category?
Let's remind ourselves of the context surrounding my vote on ACIN - I explicitly said that I was happy with the Earthling lynch, but that I wanted to press ACIN in public for what he had done in N1. Soon after, a bandwagon latched on to me like a cluster of irrational barnacles. I then switched back to Earthling, as he was the better lynch.

TL;DR Don't take my quotes out of context in order to make me look bad, as I will pick you up on it.

Well, that's one thing I didn't get. If it's Mass Effect related, why did he say he was using it to fish for 3rd parties? Why was The Stranger the first to post about it in-thread? Why was Subo so hesitant to mention it himself?

Does it follow that Subotan was looking for a Mass Effect 3rd-party? :confused:

I could have used anything. It just so happens I like Mass Effect, and decided it would be fun to continue the Mass Effect theme I've been nurturing. I needed something that was enough of a signal to attract third parties, whilst not being obvious enough to make townies aware I was doing so. It worked perfectly, and the town is daft to ignore its results.

Also a detective has pmed me, I personally trust the source.

Subutan investigated as Guilty
TheStranger as unclear

Use this information how you will.

Of course you trust them, you're probably part of the same third party as The Stranger. You've been like a monkey on my back the whole time since Stranger's guilt broke. In any case, these are irrelevant; either the results are a fabrication, or my attempted vigging was enough to make me "guilty".

I suppose he could be pretending, but he also told me that he was vigging a Nazi last night before any of this broke. Make what you will out of that.
My sources do not lie. Let me repeat that, as some of you will insist on reading that to mean something completely different.

My sources do not lie.

As it happens, in addition to Montmorency's Nazi connection, and Stranger's third party shenanigans, I also possess knowledge of a mafia scum who has attempted to recruit wise guy(s). And no, before you butt in, I wasn't the one asked. Since the town seems particularly feral today, know that that if you lynch me, I will take this secret with me to the grave - once you've all calmed down a bit and pursued some serious candidates, then I will be co-operative and reveal it.

Montmorency

09-18-2011, 23:32

:laugh:

If you were good town, you'd just reveal it.

God Emperor

09-18-2011, 23:34

Meh.. You shouldn't turn up guilty when failing to kill someone..

Unvote; Vote: Subotan

thefluffyone93

09-18-2011, 23:46

2
Exactly. So who here like TF2?

Are you referring to the hat-trading simulation?

Subotan

09-18-2011, 23:53

TALI (https://i.imgur.com/q09um.jpg)

17 - ACIN: (landlubber, gibsong, Visorslash, Craterus, Choxorn, sturmhauke, Sprig, ATPG, B_Ray, Jarema, Arjos, Xehh II, edse, shlin28, Ibn-Khaldun, Peasant Phil, Suburban Plankton)
12 - Subotan: {The Stranger, issaikhaan, Sister Coyote, Montmorency, Populus Romanus, Silver Jan, Kennigit, TinCow, ULC, Neri, Romanic, God Emperor}
9 - El Barto: {Winston Hughes, Beskar, Frozen In Ice, Seon, Johhog, Ironside, Cahoma, GamezRule, Erebus}
8 - The Stranger: { qlyphz, Memnon, El Barto, Commander Subotan, Beefy187, guiri, Riedquat, Lewwyn}
7 - Montmorency: {Yaropolk, Sasaki, White_eyes:D, hero di classico, Death is yonder, Diamondeye}
4 - Yaropolk: {Oh! TheLastDays!, Diana Abnoba, DaveShack, Xenoneb}
1 - Beefy187: {Psychonaut}
1 - Abstain: {Double A}
1 - Seon: {thefluffyone93}

If you were good town, you'd just reveal it.

I've been treated very badly by all you mean boys and girls, so I'm not in a mood to play nice.

Montmorency

09-18-2011, 23:57

You're playing with your life, this ain't no truth or dare!

Askthepizzaguy

09-19-2011, 00:05

Citizens of Fatlington, the Fatlington Police Department accepts Askthepizzaguy's explanation of his previous actions. Mr. smokingunman also told us that his message was delayed as well. So we will continue to use the radio station to broadcast our information. We would like to inform you that woad&fangs was found guilty last night. The Fatlington Police Department authorizes appropriate citizen deputies to deal with him as they see fit.

If this hasn't been posted yet; apologies for the delay again.

shlin28

09-19-2011, 00:05

Getting tired of this "we deserve better" nonsense from 'townies'. Being town is all about making sacrifices and doing things for no recognition or rewards, if you can't do these simple things for the greater good, you better get out of the way :smoking:

Unvote: ACIN
Vote: Subotan

DOUBLE LYNCH! DOUBLE LYNCH! DOUBLE LYNCH!

TinCow

09-19-2011, 00:12

I also possess knowledge of a mafia scum who has attempted to recruit wise guy(s). And no, before you butt in, I wasn't the one asked. Since the town seems particularly feral today, know that that if you lynch me, I will take this secret with me to the grave - once you've all calmed down a bit and pursued some serious candidates, then I will be co-operative and reveal it.

This makes you more lynch-worthy than ever.

Visor

09-19-2011, 00:15

I tried that move before Subotan, it doesn't work. :tongue:

Erebus

09-19-2011, 00:19

Unvote:, Vote: Subotan

Woe is me?

AggonyKing

09-19-2011, 00:19

blech, that took a while to catch up @_@ vote: Subotan

Arjos

09-19-2011, 00:20

Unvote; Vote: Subotan

Guilty and he didn't kill anyone, scummy and textwalling: Gah!

Cahoma

09-19-2011, 00:23

What TinCow said. That is a very anti-town thing to say.
Unvote; Vote: Subotan

Visor

09-19-2011, 00:24

Textwalling: The worst crime of all.

Askthepizzaguy

09-19-2011, 00:25

Announcement:

Bad things are going to happen to inactives and lurkers.

Very bad things.

This is your only warning. Checking for a pulse.... no pulse, no more sunrises.

Visor

09-19-2011, 00:28

What about people who post too much?

Populus Romanus

09-19-2011, 00:29

What about people who post too much? Me likey

Cahoma

09-19-2011, 00:29

Announcement:

Bad things are going to happen to inactives and lurkers.

Very bad things.

This is your only warning. Checking for a pulse.... no pulse, no more sunrises.
Is this why I was attacked? :/

Winston Hughes

09-19-2011, 00:30

What about people who post too much?

Most of them seem to be digging their own graves.

Askthepizzaguy

09-19-2011, 00:31

What about people who post too much?

I lynched him yesterday.

Visor

09-19-2011, 00:31

Looks at ATPG's over 100 post count....

Askthepizzaguy

09-19-2011, 00:32

Is this why I was attacked? :/

No, I was not involved in that. You've posted more than zero or one times.

Askthepizzaguy

09-19-2011, 00:32

Looks at ATPG's over 100 post count....

It's over 9000.

/obligatory.

Except my posts are informative and entertaining.

Montmorency

09-19-2011, 00:37

And thus the blameless Guy of the hot Pizza speaks strongly to us, nor do we fail to heed his words.

Seon

09-19-2011, 00:49

Unvote, Vote: Subotan

You disappoint me, master Subo. :no:

GamezRule

09-19-2011, 00:50

Clearly the problem lies within.

(idk, i'm just saying crap that sounds smart)

Memnon

09-19-2011, 01:03

Clearly the problem lies within.

(idk, i'm just saying crap that sounds smart)

I felt that statement was shallow and pedantic
<iframe width="560" height="315" src="https://www.youtube.com/embed/ctf260qnDeU" frameborder="0" allowfullscreen></iframe>

On topic, I will Unvote,Vote: Subotan

Raskolnikov

09-19-2011, 01:05

Textwalling: The worst crime of all.

Vote: Subotan

scottishranger

09-19-2011, 01:07

Selection Tally:

GH: 34
Craterus 4
Xehh II: 1
MRD: 1
Chaotix: 1
ATPG: 1
Abstain: 3
Present: 1

As to my votes and selections, well I just got back from a trip but Im caught up with my reading now.

Vote: Subotan for being guilty without having killed anyone

GH seems to be a dead lock for director so Select: GH

classical_hero

09-19-2011, 01:11

It's over 9000.

/obligatory.

Except my posts are informative and entertaining.And normally short, except for that Radio guy, you have allowed to use your forum ID for. Brilliant job of that.

woad&fangs

09-19-2011, 01:38

select:GH
vote: Subotan

Renata

09-19-2011, 01:49

A guilty result with no kills should be impossible. I question why we're selecting a Director whose first impulse after the accusation was to try to deflect that.

vote: Subotan

Zack

09-19-2011, 02:13

Someone tell me who to vote for.

Frozen In Ice

09-19-2011, 02:14

A guilty result with no kills should be impossible. I question why we're selecting a Director whose first impulse after the accusation was to try to deflect that.

vote: Subotan

It could have been an honest mistake. And it was ULC that pushed much harder to discredit the scans. We still have enough time to mess with votes a bit, shall we go for the ACIN, Subotan double lynch? GH, would you agree to such a thing?

Chaotix

09-19-2011, 02:16

Some WiseGuys are supposed to show up as naturally guilty, right? That's not impossible.

If it is impossible, we should be voting for the mafia investigator for the obvious blunder, not for Subotan for having a fake scan result thrust on him.

Vote: Abstain

At least until I can figure out what's going on.

To Mr. Blue Ski Mask: This means war. You made the mistake of attacking me, and now you're going to suffer.

Frozen In Ice

09-19-2011, 02:21

Some WiseGuys are supposed to show up as naturally guilty, right? That's not impossible.

If it is impossible, we should be voting for the mafia investigator for the obvious blunder, not for Subotan for having a fake scan result thrust on him.

Wiseguys only show up guilty after a successful killing. I'm also not sure that we should jump to conclusions about the scan being wrong after some of the shenanigans Subotan was involved in yesterday.

GeneralHankerchief

09-19-2011, 02:28

I'll kill whoever you want me to kill. I'm your guys' servant, after all.

Chaotix

09-19-2011, 02:29

Wiseguys only show up guilty after a successful killing. I'm also not sure that we should jump to conclusions about the scan being wrong after some of the shenanigans Subotan was involved in yesterday.

You just contradicted yourself.

I know for certain that Subotan was not involved in the only kill on Night 1 (didn't somebody else bring that up already?). There are no roles that show up as guilty without a successful kill.

Therefore whoever investigated him is lying. And likely a Made, because Mades do not normally get "guilty" results from investigations- only "innocent", "criminal", and "unclear". So Mr. Made made a mistake, and now we should lynch him. Simple.

Seon

09-19-2011, 02:30

I still say that we throw him into the shark infested water to test for his sins.

If he sinks, then he must be being weighed down by sins and thusly he will be arrested by deputy sharks.

If he floats, he's a witch that must be killed immediately by fire.

If he swims, then he's making our jobs difficult and should be immediately shot.

Montmorency

09-19-2011, 02:37

Regarding Chaotix:

Alright, whoever wants to start killing people and become mafia should PM me so we can get right on that.

Guys, I totally can't form a new mafia group with only like 3 people.

Much as I wish it wasn't the case, I need a group of five to kill dudes tonight.

Anyway, the Blu Spy will be seeing you.

Frozen In Ice

09-19-2011, 02:37

You just contradicted yourself.

I know for certain that Subotan was not involved in the only kill on Night 1 (didn't somebody else bring that up already?). There are no roles that show up as guilty without a successful kill.

Therefore whoever investigated him is lying. And likely a Made, because Mades do not normally get "guilty" results from investigations- only "innocent", "criminal", and "unclear". So Mr. Made made a mistake, and now we should lynch him. Simple.
I thought that only applied to wise guys, but i shall reread the past page to check bc that's where people were claiming it could be done.

Lewwyn

09-19-2011, 02:38

Hope you're not a patsy Erebus.
Unvote:, Vote:Subotan

B-Wing

09-19-2011, 02:45

I'm so confused! So if Subotan is to be lynched, what do we make of Yaropolk? And does that imply that ACIN is off the hook?

ByzantineKnight

09-19-2011, 02:50

Announcement:

Bad things are going to happen to inactives and lurkers.

Very bad things.

This is your only warning. Checking for a pulse.... no pulse, no more sunrises.

Bring it.

Vote: Chaotix I haven't paid enough attention to the ongoing bandwagons to know which leading candidate to vote for and he had a scummy post early game.

Select: GH

Frozen In Ice

09-19-2011, 02:55

Detective:

May investigate two persons per night phase. The investigation will list the individual as innocent (Townie, Don), criminal (Luca, Made not killing, Wise Guy not having killed at all, and some townies), or guilty (Luca or Made on the night of kill, Wise Guy or Townie who has killed – you either get the current kill or their whole track record as well). Acts as a Townie in other respects. Reads as “innocent” if investigated.
To me it seems like the wording here is unclear if a Made's kill as to be successful to scan as guilty. But if the kill has to be successful then:
1. Subotan is lying about not doing anything night one
OR
2. The detective is lying, and is probably scum.

Either way the scum lose if we follow the lead.

Xenoneb

09-19-2011, 02:57

To me it seems like the wording here is unclear if a Made's kill as to be successful to scan as guilty. But if the kill has to be successful then:
1. Subotan is lying about not doing anything night one
OR
2. The detective is lying, and is probably scum.

Either way the scum lose if we follow the lead.
Or, they got back an incorrect answer. (You spelled my name wrong)

Seamus Fermanagh

09-19-2011, 03:00

It is not allowed for me to pass on any information I collected during the game, that's correct. But using other members to anonymously contact people on the .org should be legal, it has been done before. As I'm dead I can't use the information for my own purposes anymore and you have at least my guarantee that I will forward the message to the person(s) you want, and only those who you want. I will add however that I will not be avaible next weekend (from friday to sunday) as I will be in Paris then.

Edit: pro-town, anti-town,... doesn't matter.

Moros is still playing, and has a victory condition interest in the role he died playing. He cannot add anything or comment on anything not in the public thread, but can forward stuff.

That said, serving as a conduit -- provided he is circumspect as noted above -- is within the rules.

classical_hero

09-19-2011, 03:03

Some people need to read the roles. There is just too much conversation about the scans, when they don't show too much, especially this early in the game. Guilty does not mean too much, just means that someone has killed, we don't know why they have done it, since it could be a wiseguy doing it. later on it will mean something more important, but not right now.

Xenoneb

09-19-2011, 03:06

:2thumbsup: Good post, Hero.

Seamus Fermanagh

09-19-2011, 03:13

slashandburn

09-19-2011, 03:39

Select: GH
Vote: Subotan
taking it to your grave still means your dead whereas if you tell and it proves true then you will live, threatening people who can easily kill you is not generally a bright idea.

El Barto

09-19-2011, 04:01

While it looks pretty likely that The Stranger is guilty here, I must agree with him that Subotan's willingness to lie for ACIN's sake is deeply suspicious. As others have suggested, we'd be better shot of all three of them as soon as possible. However, in the meantime, I have another matter that needs attending to...

vote: El Barto

After the trouble you caused on N1, and the evasive nature of your explanations yesterday, you're very lucky to get another chance here. I strongly urge you to give full and frank answers to the following questions:

1) What happened on N1, and how was it that you came to ditch one group, then failed to show up to the group you ditched them for?

2) Referring to the quote below, did you really mean to imply that you didn't realise you had to send a PM to Seamus in order to participate in a group action? And, if not, then what were you trying to say?

3) Why have you been lampshading this stuff so heavily?

I didn't 'go with' anyone, Ii had a few orders sent in my name by a few people and apparently that's the one that got through.

(I received the PM quoted above in response to my demand for an account of what El Barto had ended up doing after dropping from a group I had helped to organise.)

ps. While I was not involved in the attempts on your life (RL commitments forced me to make myself unavailable last night), I am quite happy to admit that I encouraged others to attack you.
Night One… Xeno recruited a lot of people into groups, then three or four protectors didn't make any difference, then suddenly the protect group that was supposed to be formed with jht and Zack became a vig group and i said I hadn't signed in for any killing. Before I could log back on RL had taken hold and I came in back in to find myself accused left and right.

I'm 'trying' to say that I sent no action PMs. That's all.

Lampshading… what? If it's my sig, then you know I'm the scummiest townie ever. Isn't that so, Mr. Backwards Logic, my former GM? Is my aura of scumminess so great that everything I say must be doubted?

P.S. You filthy cat-hating Englishman! Now that the natural order of things has been reestablished I can side with johnhughthom against you. Or, rather, agree with him, since he's a cat strangler.

The scummy PM to start it off. El Barto contact or was contacted by Xenoneb, and got thrown into a protection group of nearly anyone who said hello to Xenoneb. We were a 4 man protection group that El Barto dropped out of claiming that the redundancy was Stupid. However, 2 of our 3 still including his name on the PM, so he got a results PM as well.

However, when I tried to explain why he got it, he seemed to want me to back up some sort of Alibi story. I nodded my head yes, and told a few people that I was VERY suspicious. Other stories of similar things come up, so the agreement was that El Barto needed to die. He dropped out of two groups (One protection and I believe on vigilante) and then tried to use me as an alibi.

Vote: El Barto

Also a detective has pmed me, I personally trust the source.

Subutan investigated as Guilty
TheStranger as unclear

Use this information how you will.
Yes, see here, I did say the redundancy was stupid. Lowercase s, mind you.
This was our full dialogue:

I think you got an inconclusive PM on Winston Hughes because myself and Double A sent our orders with your name on it as well. I had sent in my orders before I realized you had left the group.

Erebus.
Yes, well… at least i have someone to back me up.

Right?

If anyone asks, I'm with you.
Alibi? Not exactly.

Have this detective person you know scan me then.

Citizens of Fatlington, the Fatlington Police Department accepts Askthepizzaguy's explanation of his previous actions. Mr. smokingunman also told us that his message was delayed as well. So we will continue to use the radio station to broadcast our information. We would like to inform you that woad&fangs was found guilty last night. The Fatlington Police Department authorizes appropriate citizen deputies to deal with him as they see fit.If this hasn't been posted yet; apologies for the delay again.
woad&fangs, interesting.

Some people need to read the roles. There is just too much conversation about the scans, when they don't show too much, especially this early in the game. Guilty does not mean too much, just means that someone has killed, we don't know why they have done it, since it could be a wiseguy doing it. later on it will mean something more important, but not right now.Guilty doesn't mean it's just a wiseguy, it's implied in the Surgeon description that doctors can come up 'guilty'. Surgeons can passively kill, too.

Montmorency

09-19-2011, 04:17

[Oops misread nvm.

Montmorency

09-19-2011, 04:22

Guilty doesn't mean it's just a wiseguy, it's implied in the Surgeon description that doctors can come up 'guilty'. Surgeons can passively kill, too.

Ah, well: It says that "unlike Doctors, Surgeons always register as innocent."

And so what? Doctors presumably register the whole gamut of states from innocent to guilty, depending on what they do. If Subo is a murdering doctor, we are better off without him, no?

And why would Subo say "I know the identity of Mafia scum," when "I am a doctor" sounds a lot better. Come now.

Xenoneb

09-19-2011, 04:28

But there is some uncertainty with all investigations.

El Barto

09-19-2011, 04:34

Yes, Xeno, there's always a chance that investigations are inconclusive. Or that you get Innocent on a Don. Or Criminal/Guilty on a townie.
Ah, well: It says that "unlike Doctors, Surgeons always register as innocent."

And so what? Doctors presumably register the whole gamut of states from innocent to guilty, depending on what they do. If Subo is a murdering doctor, we are better off without him, no?
Murdering doctors? No connection to Mengele by any chance?

And why would Subo say "I know the identity of Mafia scum," when "I am a doctor" sounds a lot better. Come now.'Cos a doctor is an obvious target and 'knowing the identity of scum' can be acting as a front for a real, FBI investigator?

Montmorency

09-19-2011, 04:36

With roles. Where does it say that detected statuses may be inaccurate?

Are you thinking of this?

A townie has no special abilities – at least at the start. Most Townies will appear as “innocent” if investigated by a detective, though a minority will appear as “unclear” and a very small minority as “criominal.” If investigated by a made, the most will be “innocent,” some “unclear,” and a minority “criminal.”

But that's specific to individual players.

If all players with investigative powers investigate the same player, they should all find the same status.

Besides which, guilty is guilty is guilty. Where does it say in the rules that someone may be misread as guilty?

Montmorency

09-19-2011, 04:37

'Cos a doctor is an obvious target and 'knowing the identity of scum' can be acting as a front for a real, FBI investigator?

In the context of his particular situation, the latter claim would have been far more - helpful to him, I feel.

naut

09-19-2011, 04:44

With roles. Where does it say that detected statuses may be inaccurate?

Are you thinking of this?

But that's specific to individual players.

If all players with investigative powers investigate the same player, they should all find the same status.

Besides which, guilty is guilty is guilty. Where does it say in the rules that someone may be misread as guilty?
Wrong. In a Capo game any given investigation may bring back any of those three. If a detective investigates a townie, and the first night they get unclear so they decide to investigate again the next night they may get innocent, unclear or criminal that second time.

Guilty is not 100%, it shows anyone who killed. Including townies in vig groups. Just as criminal is not 100% an indicator, as it could be a townie misidentified as Mafioso.

Diana Abnoba

09-19-2011, 04:53

Well I guess that Yaro is not going to show up, we can deal with him the next lynch. I don't want to waste my vote, and I would really like to have a double lynch today, to get rid of some of these distractions. I think that Subo is now ahead in votes, so Unvote; Vote: ACIN to try and even the score between them.

Montmorency

09-19-2011, 04:54

Perhaps I should rephrase this?

If a particular townie that is predisposed to criminal readings from the get-go is investigated by everyone capable of doing so, they will all get unclear or criminal the first time out, no?

If a particular townie that is predisposed to unclear readings from the get-go is investigated by everyone capable of doing so, they will all unclear the first time out, no?

If a particular townie that is predisposed to innocent readings from the get-go is investigated by everyone capable of doing so, they will all get unclear or innocent, no?

Assuming the least-powerful investigative abilities on the parts of all.

Now, this below I didn't disupute. You missed the point.

Guilty is not 100%, it shows anyone who killed. Including townies in vig groups. Just as criminal is not 100% an indicator, as it could be a townie misidentified as Mafioso.

If this investigation result was not fabricated, it 100% definitively proves that Subotan has killed. To see why that might be important, reread the last 20 pages. :/