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I think Cuth has to be a wolf PR because of how Cass keeps protecting him. Her attitude toward the case on him was also dismissive.
Also Merry Christmas to those of you in Australia.
:santa2:
There's absolutely no reason not to start the day like this.
Vote: Cuthillius
Monstrdude
12-24-2016, 22:20
It's probably gonna be a while because holidays but I'm gonna reread everyone in the thread and make a big reads post
I work tonight and am walking there as we speak so it's not gonna happen now but I skimmed a bit of d1 and think most of the town core and my town core is pretty solid
If cuth isn't a wolf I'm gonna make sure that we find one that is
Wolf Cass takes you out every time, Zack. Dp101 was voting you and died. Cuthillius wasn't even an option for her last night. El Barto, who was, d
Is mysteriously not top priority. Why?
Montmorency
12-24-2016, 22:23
Tallies for both days, spoilered for size.
For Day 1, I don't think she was around for end of day. Maybe she believed Visor's doublevoter claim, reasoned it meant her vote wouldn't really matter so threw it on a teammate for bussing cred, then came back later to find a three-way tie between her 3 teammates and lynched the least important one.
The on Day 2, after spending Day 1 talking nonstop about how the strategy should be for everyone to vote as normal then the district representatives vote according to their constituents, she completely discards this without discussing it further. Her district overwhelmingly voted for Cuth and she was the only person to vote for Barto. She explicitly asked people if they'd prefer Winston to vote for me or Cuth, multiple people responded with all of them voicing a preference for Cuth, then she instructed him to keep his vote on me anyways. Then despite her voting for Barto again, she decides to break the tie by voting for GH, which came out of nowhere, and he flipped town.
She also was throwing some shade at me, commenting how I seemed unconcerned with a lot of people voting me Chancellor when it would have made her paranoid. First, that is nonsensical. Second, a LOT more people voted her than ever voted me, and not only did she not get paranoid about it (as she claimed she would have), she didn't even seem to acknowledge it whatsoever. When she was the only person around in the thread and I was talking with her, she got really uncomfortable and plain weird, demanding why I was "pressuring" her. It was really odd, and I just kind of brushed it aside at the time as a weird thing not to worry too much about, but combined with everything else I need to talk about it.
I don't really think it's that crazy, because I just don't understand her voting and play on D2 as town. It makes no sense to me.
Is there a vote mutiny option?
OK, I see you're warming on the "Cuth-Cass-Bart-Choxorn" conspiracy I mentioned yesterday. Good effort, but I still think it's nuts and at any rate self-resolving through failure to die or to lynch scum on Cass' part.
I want to see El Barto flip now, since People OK with Barto lynch: Zack, GH, Visor, Schema, Monstr (when Cass was canvassing about it at EOD). But, as I said, I don't see scummy in him atp and Cuth is the best case.
Another note: yesterday
Vote: Cuth
Also, I want to see Pizza's full narrative progression on Cass-as-overlord.
Wolf Cass takes you out every time, Zack. Dp101 was voting you and died. Cuthillius wasn't even an option for her last night. El Barto, who was, d
Is mysteriously not top priority. Why?
Dp voted GH.
Did you read my post or the thread? Winston asked if she wanted him to switch to Cuth, she asked the general population if they wanted that, they said yes, she told Winston to stay on me anyways.
Don't know what the last part is supposed to be.
Montmorency
12-24-2016, 22:23
Wolf Cass takes you out every time, Zack. Dp101 was voting you and died. Cuthillius wasn't even an option for her last night. El Barto, who was, d
Is mysteriously not top priority. Why?
DP was voting GH. Why would scum ever kill Zack while Renata, Cass, DP101, and atheotes are alive. Common
Montmorency
12-24-2016, 22:24
I'm gonna reread everyone in the thread and make a big reads post
Oh dear.
DP was voting GH. Why would scum ever kill Zack while Renata, Cass, DP101, and atheotes are alive. Common
I think she meant why Cass voted GH over me.
Montmorency
12-24-2016, 22:26
This mushroom-chicken slice has almost no mushroom, and they forgot one of the slices.
Montmorency
12-24-2016, 22:27
I think she meant why Cass voted GH over me.
OK, but I don't see that argument either.
This mushroom-chicken slice has almost no mushroom, and they forgot one of the slices.
Please stop spamming. You are ruining the game, singlehandedly.
Also mushrooms are gross, they did you a favor.
It's probably gonna be a while because holidays but I'm gonna reread everyone in the thread and make a big reads post
I work tonight and am walking there as we speak so it's not gonna happen now but I skimmed a bit of d1 and think most of the town core and my town core is pretty solid
If cuth isn't a wolf I'm gonna make sure that we find one that is
This is pretty much where I'm at. Now that dp is dead I'm feeling a bit more pressure looking at those left in my district. I don't want Cuth elected under any circumstance, he's too big of a question mark. And really there needs to be a close eye on who tries to take his place.
My goal with the extended day, which for me actually means extra time since I've got a quiet holiday, is to take a look at these in depth:
Zack -- post quality from beginning to end game. I still lean town on him but I'm keeping an open mind because of how much there is to sift through. I could have my viewpoint challenged, we'll see.
Zack's proposed wolf team -- I had strong town feels on Cass early on, but whereas Cuth had a bad EOD1, she had a less than impressive EOD2 and lynch decision. If she is a wolf, Choxorn being gone as goon buys her credibility and removes no one of consequence from the team. I mean, Choxorn was the obvious choice by the way he popped in and popped out. El Barto still being here makes no sense at this point considering her multiple votes, as he pointed out.
Cuth, again -- There's something in me that doesn't want to let this go because yuck. So many votes headed here. But I've got this nagging suspicion that we've got a deep wolf or two and if Cuth is scummy regardless of alignment, he could be an easy player to push toward lynch. I'm trying to look at actual actions that could mean something, which is why I voted Cuth and not GH.
If anyone with some meta background on Cuth could tell me what we're seeing this game that are CONSTANTS for him, regardless of alignment, that would help greatly. Is he quick to change his mind? Does he give reads without lengthy explanation?
I need to ISO everyone in my district.
http://i.giphy.com/3o6wrebnKWmvx4ZBio.gif
Montmorency
12-24-2016, 22:40
Please stop spamming. You are ruining the game, singlehandedly.
Also mushrooms are gross, they did you a favor.
Apologies.
No.
Vote: Cuthilius
Cass_, please district me with 2 of Renata, Zack, Visor, and yourself. Also, just as critically, this day (D3) and tomorrow (D4) are the only real chances we have this game to run with 5 districts - 3 players per district. Take that into consideration during the drawing. Others may wish to discuss the pros and cons of a temporary increase in the number of districts.
If you don't put me with any of Renata, Zack, Visor, or yourself, and you draw 5 districts, please put me in a district I have a shot at winning.
I was just kidding, Monty. I don't care, personally. But other people do mind and have let me know at every possible opportunity, so I too wanted to feel the power behind a high-handed slap on the wrist.
Why do you want to be with me, Renata, and Visor?
Wolf Cass takes you out every time, Zack.
Because...?
Explain this thought process. Zack had a hard townread on Cass yesterday.
Montmorency
12-24-2016, 22:51
I was just kidding, Monty. I don't care, personally. But other people do mind and have let me know at every possible opportunity, so I too wanted to feel the power behind a high-handed slap on the wrist.
I was not (just) answering about spam. "No" at the comment on mushrooms. I won't be spamming after this.
Why do you want to be with me, Renata, and Visor?
And Cass. Cuz I want to be with the A-team until the dynamic shifts again.
....dynamic shifts again.
From what, to what?
DP was voting GH. Why would scum ever kill Zack while Renata, Cass, DP101, and atheotes are alive. Common
Forget Dp101 voting Zack then and focus on the rest. Tell me why a wolf Cass buries GH over Zack, given the opportunity. Tell me why Zack pushes for Cuthillius to die instead of El Barto despite that he is arguing both are scum in this little theory, and El Barto, not Cuthillius, is the one Cass has twice failed to bury.
Shoot, why is he not voting Cass?
You didn't need this kind of paranoia engenderings theory to get Cuthillius lynched today. It looks like some kind of overkill.
Because...?
Explain this thought process. Zack had a hard townread on Cass yesterday.
Because he is 10x more dangerous than GH has demonstrated in this game.
Am I being ridiculous? I read Zack theory posts and all I kept thinking was BS.
Forget Dp101 voting Zack then and focus on the rest. Tell me why a wolf Cass buries GH over Zack, given the opportunity. Tell me why Zack pushes for Cuthillius to die instead of El Barto despite that he is arguing both are scum in this little theory, and El Barto, not Cuthillius, is the one Cass has twice failed to bury.
Shoot, why is he not voting Cass?
You didn't need this kind of paranoia engenderings theory to get Cuthillius lynched today. It looks like some kind of overkill.
That seems like an unimportant detail, I'm not sure what you're driving at. Why wouldn't she vote GH over me?
I argued that Cuth is much likelier to be a PR. I really doubt she'd play around with voting El Barto if he was an important role. On the other hand, she actively tried to keep Cuth out of the voting entirely yesterday.
Cass is really only a wolf if the team is EXACTLY her/barto/cuth. If either of those two is a villager, it drops the likelihood that Cass is a wolf massively.
Maybe because it's not engineered, lol?
You seem like you're searching for things to pick at.
Montmorency
12-24-2016, 23:05
From what, to what?
I'm talking about districts, and by extension the players left to fill them.
Because he is 10x more dangerous than GH has demonstrated in this game.
Really? Zack works as a prospective lynch and predictable slot, while GH had huge scope to develop.
Also, Cass ruled out lynching Zack and it would look rather bad to blast him amidst the other choices and overwhelming public sentiment.
You didn't need this kind of paranoia engenderings theory to get Cuthillius lynched today. It looks like some kind of overkill.
Zack was talking about Cass, not Cuth.
Shoot, why is he not voting Cass?
Cuz that's useless and dumb, and flipping Cuth is the first step to defeating Cass (if she is scum).
Does make me a little uneasy that Schema and Monty are championing my cause, though I guess I can't really complain.
Montmorency
12-24-2016, 23:11
Does make me a little uneasy that Schema and Monty are championing my cause, though I guess I can't really complain.
I'm just being pedantic. We have relatively-little to discuss today besides who we'd like to be districted with.
Ultimate conspiracy: Cass-Renata-Chox-Cuth-Bart. Monstrbro neutral survivor. Monty amnesiac.
No, I read those posts and was thinking wrf is this. It looks like a Pizza post.
Does make me a little uneasy that Schema and Monty are championing my cause, though I guess I can't really complain.
Championing? Entertaining, nothing more. My priority is making sure that whoever replaces dp is town. I'm a little paranoid that he got killed as a confirmed townie and that a wolf is going to try to take that power. I hope Cass doesn't redistrict.
Does make me a little uneasy that Schema and Monty are championing my cause, though I guess I can't really complain.
Heh, made me paranoid that you voted Cuth right after me, too.
I think we should probably look outside each other. We're both town or everyone can mock me end of game.
Why would that make you paranoid? I've been going after Cuth longer than you have.
Championing? Entertaining, nothing more. My priority is making sure that whoever replaces dp is town. I'm a little paranoid that he got killed as a confirmed townie and that a wolf is going to try to take that power. I hope Cass doesn't redistrict.
She has to, the districts are unbalanced.
Because he is 10x more dangerous than GH has demonstrated in this game.
Am I being ridiculous? I read Zack theory posts and all I kept thinking was BS.
I think GH gets taken out because it's the least revealing maneuver? Idk. People can read into it whatever they want, because there's far less in-thread from him to base reads on.
Hey everyone. I somewhat followed D2 but will need to reread at some point.
Dp101 was almost 100% confirmed town given his D1 voting (and good posts besides), whereas Zack could conceivably be scum. That's reason enough to do away with Dp. Similar reason could apply for lynching GH (+ he was a less controversial candidate than Zack), but that's getting into WIFOM territory and I'm not convinced that Cass is a wolf.
FWIW Cuthillius seems more scummy than El Barto to me despite EB's D2 weird talk about voting.
What are your reads, Renata?
whoops, X-post with #2274.
Hey everyone. I somewhat followed D2 but will need to reread at some point.
Dp101 was almost 100% confirmed town given his D1 voting (and good posts besides), whereas Zack could conceivably be scum. That's reason enough to do away with Dp. Similar reason could apply for lynching GH (+ he was a less controversial candidate than Zack), but that's getting into WIFOM territory and I'm not convinced that Cass is a wolf.
FWIW Cuthillius seems more scummy than El Barto to me despite EB's D2 weird talk about voting.
Hi. You seem reasonable.
Who would you have voted yesterday? Were you following closely enough to give an answer?
Montmorency
12-24-2016, 23:30
Hi. You seem reasonable.
Be careful. Fenn/Csargo is still viable candidate for lolscum.
What are your reads, Renata?
Check out my latest reads post from Thursday. I don't think anything changed while I was AFK. Not that I could determine from just reading through thread anyway.
I would get it myself but am on cell til after christmas.
Why would that make you paranoid? I've been going after Cuth longer than you have.
Length of time is one thing, immediacy of the action afterward is another? With Monty coming in and voting right after that I get paranoid about wagons and wagon speed.
Don't read too much into it. More just dialoguing about votes.
Hi. You seem reasonable.
Who would you have voted yesterday? Were you following closely enough to give an answer?
With who was on the block, of Cuth/El Barto, probably Cuth due to his D1. GH was null to me from what I read, and you were towny and making good points.
I'd like to see any of GH, Cuth and one of the inactives up for lynch. I'd like to say about Csargo that if he comes back to to put in a valid lynch vote, lynch him, because otherwise I think he might be facing wrath of Pizza right now. Not positive though. Otherwise, any of the others is fine by me.
I haven't done the work I need to do on Schema or Zack, to say anything useful about them.
I may not post again today, I'm up against some stressful shit until after the deadline, hopefully thatll be the end of it but I can't be sure. I'll see how it goes.
I guess you mean this post?
With who was on the block, of Cuth/El Barto, probably Cuth due to his D1. GH was null to me from what I read, and you were towny and making good points.
Well you already said that more or less.
I meant more if you could have chosen anyone.
Oh, well probably Cuth still, plus his flip would shed light on the people who had pushed/not pushed/defended him, which a lynch of a lurker (Riedquat for example) would not have done.
MERRY CHRISTMAS EVERYONE!!!!!!!!!!
I'm just finishing a 15hr Christmas Eve Saturday Night Shift (spew) so bear with me. I'll be here for a bit and then I need to sleep, and then drive home to see my hubby and kids and do Christmas stuff from there. One kid and hubby are apparently out for the count with gastro and I'm feeling nauseated so :/ things are likely to be fun.
Quick takes on new day stuff I've read to here.
The 24hrs to redraw districts is going to be a b**** for me given the above. Strategic advice - with reasoning explained I can evaluate pros and cons would be appreciated.
I was going to suggest we look at DP / Cuth today for lynch given their votes but lolme. Cuth drops lower in my PoE given the flip. The rest of my reasoning on him stands for now, whether it is right or wrong.
I voted GH over El Barto essentially because lolme, specifically because I found GH more wolfy and less likely to be an easy mislynch just because. There were considerable differences between GH's last Town game and how he played here, and that felt more concrete alignment-wise than Barto playing generally scummy. On top of that a general vibe that people were either really eager or hedgey on Barto in the last countdown at EoD, and the fact that GH and Zack were among the most fine with it/had him top scum, but were not voting there kind of made it feel like a setup/distancing for if/when he flipped Town.
Zack's wigging me out pushing me for not voting Barto twice as if it's a big thing, when yesterday voted Cuth on earlier stuff, but then put Barto as lowest read and was 'happy' to lynch him when I asked for consensus and still stuck with the earlier vote on Cuth.
Here, he's again directed attention/alluded to Barto Scum but redirected the vote to Cuth.
IF Barto IS scum and Cuth is Town, I'd say this looks bad for Zack.
Montmorency
12-25-2016, 00:03
IF Barto IS scum and Cuth is Town, I'd say this looks bad for Zack.
Then lynch Cuth.
Strategic advice
Wilco.
Am i only allowed to have one scum read?
I told you to lynch barto and voiced disagreement with a gh lynch. My vote doesn't even matter anyways so lol.
You ignored my problems.
Why do you keep voting barto if you didn't want to lynch him?
Why have you spit on the idea of democracy?
I feel like i can never engage with you, you're always talking around me cass. Asking me questions, commenting on things I've done, but ignoring my own answers and questions.
I guess you mean this post?
I had a full list somewhere I think, updated from a previous one.
I want to talk about how we can coordinate a lynch to make it more cohesive/representative for Town.
I'm sorry that I was wrong, but that's the way it went.
If I take my guilt feels out of it and look at it root cause-analysis-wise I think there were a couple of things in particular that contributed to a bad result and have the potential to keep doing so in the future.
1. Lolmyreads. I'm glad I caught Chox with my method n1, but my personal gut and methods aren't infallible or perfect as an approach to reading someone, and as much as I'd like to be awesome and read everyone correctly, statistically it's not going to happen every time.
2. Allowing ties with the mandate that the lynch be decided by one player. Regardless of who's Chancellor, making the lynch decision theirs subjects it to the problems in point 1 and makes potentially makes it more difficult to draw conclusions about everyone else.
3. Allowing the deciding player to deviate from strategy discussed. See points above.
Allowing ties at lynch and the mandated practice of the Chancellor deciding limits the strategic/collective power of the Town to one person. At a gut level, I don’t think this is a good thing for Town, or the game as a whole.
Regardless of who's Chancellor, making the lynch decision theirs subjects it to the problems in point 1 and makes potentially makes it more difficult to draw conclusions about everyone else.
All mafia have to do is push votes towards townies and hope one person gets it wrong.
So I think this needs to change. Have been thinking about/putting more thoughts together about this overnight but #lolstrategyishard
What do people think about making things more truly representative/following majority vote?
If you made more districts than three a tie becomes much less likely.
Only problem with voting according to district will is timing. Well plus potentially reduces influence of rep who is hopefully towns.
Why do you keep voting el barto then lynching someone else
I've spent all night wondering if it makes sense for the wolf team to be exactly choxorn/El Barto/Cuth/Cass
I think it kinda does
See previous post - I've voted for El Barto because he seems scummy on general play, I've lynched Chox and GH him because there were considerable differences in their play here and their play in games where they were Town and that made it more likely to me that they were actual scum than just El Barto hinging on randomness and self-reference, which I've seen him do in both alignments.
TLDR He's still scummy on general principle and I'd like to see him lynched.
Tallies for both days, spoilered for size.
For Day 1, I don't think she was around for end of day. Maybe she believed Visor's doublevoter claim, reasoned it meant her vote wouldn't really matter so threw it on a teammate for bussing cred, then came back later to find a three-way tie between her 3 teammates and lynched the least important one.
The on Day 2, after spending Day 1 talking nonstop about how the strategy should be for everyone to vote as normal then the district representatives vote according to their constituents, she completely discards this without discussing it further. Her district overwhelmingly voted for Cuth and she was the only person to vote for Barto. She explicitly asked people if they'd prefer Winston to vote for me or Cuth, multiple people responded with all of them voicing a preference for Cuth, then she instructed him to keep his vote on me anyways. Then despite her voting for Barto again, she decides to break the tie by voting for GH, which came out of nowhere, and he flipped town.
She also was throwing some shade at me, commenting how I seemed unconcerned with a lot of people voting me Chancellor when it would have made her paranoid. First, that is nonsensical. Second, a LOT more people voted her than ever voted me, and not only did she not get paranoid about it (as she claimed she would have), she didn't even seem to acknowledge it whatsoever. When she was the only person around in the thread and I was talking with her, she got really uncomfortable and plain weird, demanding why I was "pressuring" her. It was really odd, and I just kind of brushed it aside at the time as a weird thing not to worry too much about, but combined with everything else I need to talk about it.
I don't really think it's that crazy, because I just don't understand her voting and play on D2 as town. It makes no sense to me.
Is there a vote mutiny option?
This is a lot of theory-crafting based on things that don't take into account I could/have still completed each action as Town. Some of it I can see how you might think that way as Town, the rest I'm not so sure.
FTR though
1. I voted Chox because I found inconsistencies in his play and things about his actual game here that pointed to him being decidedly wolfy.
2. I did try to encourage talking about mechanics and how we make this setup work best for Town, and it went nowhere cohesive / got shut down. The suggestion that we hunt D1, strategise later was not a bad one. Last night's result suggests we need to strategise more and address flaws in our approach. I haven't given up on the idea of properly representative votes, but if we're going that way it needs to be concrete.
3. I didn't instruct Winston one way or the other - I stated that personally I'd prefer you in the pool to Cuth, but regardless, Barto was a more decidedly scummy read for me than the two he was suggesting.
4. Breaking the tie by voting GH came out of the same process as the one I used to correctly lynch Chox. I then had to decide whether to stick with the strategy we'd half-discussed despite paranoia that I couldn't trust the players who'd been discussing it, or to go with my stronger read. I went with my read and it was wrong, probably on many levels. One of the reasons why we need to get more concrete about what is expected of everyone, and why this system/approach needs to change.
5. I did get paranoid about being voted towards Chancellor, and I'm pretty sure that's even ITT, so you've either misrepped it or missed it in your read. Either it's nonsensical or it isn't though. Don't tell me it's nonsensical to consider you might react that way and then tell me that I'm wolfy for reacting the opposite way.
6. The question about why you were pressuring was because it felt like shade. Still does.
Oh, and FTR I already asked Pizza if we could change Chancellor if I decided to step down.
He said no.
My only option would be to not submit a vote in the event of a tie and be modkilled / a matyr for the cause.
I considered it as an option for n3, but ultimately it leaves us with a Townie down.
Better option is to figure out a way for Town to get cohesive and for us to get more collectively gud.
If you made more districts than three a tie becomes much less likely.
Only problem with voting according to district will is timing. Well plus potentially reduces influence of rep who is hopefully towns.
Yes to all of this.
I'm considering more districts as a general thing. Input into how many and grouping ideas appreciated.
Timing I believe we can manage if we get motivated.
I still lean towards putting scummy people in one to limit their influence on the lynch as a possibility but lolreads and stuff makes this hard to achieve.
I think we need to focus influence of the rep thing. Problem is you're effectively multiplying the problems of the Chancellor if you leave it all up to them, and you're at risk if they happen to be scum/scum are grouped enough together to put one of themselves into power.
So the nights results have put Zack more into my town column, as much as I hate to admit it. Dp was heavily on Zack's case, and only backed off because he didn't want to cause more drama in the thread. There was an implication however, I felt, that he still thought Zack was scummy and would be revisiting it. Leaving Zack alive in this instance presents the image of protecting Zack from a valid scumhunt, and it sounds like something I would do if I were scum. Zack has also been a lightning rod for a lot of people's attacks over the last two days. These all make valid reasons for leaving him alive, regardless of his efficacy as a wolf hunter.
Cass_
MERRY CHRISTMAS EVERYONE!!!!!!!!!!
I'm just finishing a 15hr Christmas Eve Saturday Night Shift (spew) so bear with me.
You work for the Society for the Protection of Elvish Welfare!?!? That's awesome. Say hi to Hermione for me.
The 24hrs to redraw districts is going to be a b**** for me given the above. Strategic advice - with reasoning explained I can evaluate pros and cons would be appreciated.
The one thing I was thinking, that Renata touched on in another post, is that 5 districts likely leads to less power for you personally. With 5 people, you are less likely to end up with a tie, meaning you will be less likely to be called on to cast the final ballot. I think most of us find you to be trustworthy. You could I suppose be playing a deep game by throwing one of your d1 wolves to the gallows, perhaps someone who just wasn't into playing wolf, but that still seems pretty unlikely to me. The point of that observation is that I think most of us trust that while your decision may not necessarily be right, it's coming from a town perspective. You however don't seem thrilled with the prospect of casting that vote, so perhaps you would be more inclined to give up that power.
Splitting up the districts also gives scum a greater chance of being in a voting position. At the same time however, as others have noted, we get to track more people's decisions. I think I would weigh in on the idea of 5 districts personally. First, it will be a one night thing, because after today we won't have the numbers to pull it off again, so it doesn't put wolves into long term positions of power. Second, it will mitigate some of the issues some players are having with feeling ineffective in the game, and a boost in morale probably isn't a bad thing for the health of the game. Finally it does give us more people to read and judge, and gives fewer people a safe place to hide with an ultimately meaningless vote.
Glad it's not me having to make the decision though. Have fun with that.
Fenn
With who was on the block, of Cuth/El Barto, probably Cuth due to his D1. GH was null to me from what I read, and you were towny and making good points.
Hey Fenn, glad you could join us man.
xpost with the previous two posts.
Montmorency
12-25-2016, 01:04
DISTRICT ONE
Schema
Cuthillius
Renata
Choxorn Lynch1
Dp101 NK2
Jabbz
dicetosser1
DISTRICT TWO
Winston Hughes
BSmith
Visor
Csargo/Fenn
Riedquat
El Barto
Monstrbro
DISTRICT THREE
Montmorency
Al Sipsclar
Sooh NK1
Cass_
GeneralHankerchief Lynch2
Zack
atheotes
There are two basic options: 3 districts of 6-6-5 or 5 districts of 3-3-3-4-4.
Chancellor: Cass
Power-players/Senatores: Zack, Visor, Renata
Equites: atheotes (TOWN CRED), Winston Hughes, Monstrbro
Plebes: Montmorency, Cuthilius, El Barto, dicetosser, Schema, Jabbz
Inactives/Lurkers/Silentiarii: Riedquat, BSmith, Al Sipsclar, Fenn/Csargo
There are 17 of us, 16 minus Chancellor, 10 in the lower classes, 6 in the higher.
3-District Draft
Here power is still concentrated, so you may or may not recuse yourself from representation and leave administration to the high nobility.
Either way, spread the nobility so that the commoners are kept in check and so that it is more difficult for the powerful themselves to unite and form factions against your rule.
If you do retain a home district (expected Reps at top):
Cass
Monstrbro
Winston Hughes
Cuthilius
Jabbz
Riedquat
Zack/Visor
atheotes
Montmorency
dicetosser
BSmith
Fenn/Csargo
Renata
Zack/Visor
El Barto
Schema
Al Sipsclar
If you don't retain a home district (expected Reps at top):
Zack
Monstrbro/Visor
Atheotes
Schema
Cuthilius
Al Sipsclar
Visor/Monstrbro
Cass
Montmorency
dicetosser
BSmith
Renata
WinstonHughes
Jabbz
El Barto
Riedquat
Csargo/Fenn
5-District Draft
With 5 districts, you absolutely must take personal leadership of a home district, and elevate atheotes to power as a new man for his towniness. Two of Visor, Zack, Monstrbro, and Winston should be placed so as to be elected Reps. Pick who to exclude from power, and place one of those individuals in your own district
Cass
Visor/Zack/Winston/Monstrbro
Montmorency
Riedquat
Visor/Zack
dicetosser
Schema
Winston/Monstrbro
Winston/Monstrbro
Fenn/Csargo
Atheotes
Jabbz
Al Sipsclar
Renata
Cuthilius
El Barto
BSmith
Montmorency
12-25-2016, 01:07
I think I would weigh in on the idea of 5 districts personally. First, it will be a one night thing, because after today we won't have the numbers to pull it off again, so it doesn't put wolves into long term positions of power.
Today (17) and tomorrow (15), unless we lose a lynch or an extra nightkill pops up.
Wolf Cass takes you out every time, Zack. Dp101 was voting you and died. Cuthillius wasn't even an option for her last night. El Barto, who was, d
Is mysteriously not top priority. Why?
Bold is assuming I'm Wolf and Zack is Town? Why assume Zack is Town? Why no option for WW?
The other good points are good/fair/unfinished - El Barto/Why what?
I think Renata's assessment of the situation is on point, but can see Zack questioning my moves as either alignment.
Dp voted GH.
Did you read my post or the thread? Winston asked if she wanted him to switch to Cuth, she asked the general population if they wanted that, they said yes, she told Winston to stay on me anyways.
Don't know what the last part is supposed to be.
See point about me not directing Winston either way, that the point was Barto being a higher scum read to me than you or Cuth.
DP still had pressure on Zack, and was likely to be elected Rep again wherever he ended up if he lived. He changed his vote from Zack to GH. Knowing he's Town (I questioned it after GH's flip) and with GH gone, Zack may have been his next target /shrug.
Why was he shot any of the other consensus Towns despite the fact he could have been seriously suspicious for putting GH into the PoE after the flip?
Montmorency
12-25-2016, 01:16
Why was he shot any of the other consensus Towns despite the fact he could have been seriously suspicious for putting GH into the PoE after the flip?
Not really. TBH your position on towncred is mechanically strongest, but from meta DP has always been the top of the heap of the lock-towns. Natural first choice to kill, especially if you aren't yet prepared for the upheaval resultant from the death of the Chancellor.
I think she meant why Cass voted GH over me.
OK, I see you're warming on the "Cuth-Cass-Bart-Choxorn" conspiracy I mentioned yesterday. Good effort, but I still think it's nuts and at any rate self-resolving through failure to die or to lynch scum on Cass' part.
I want to see El Barto flip now, since People OK with Barto lynch: Zack, GH, Visor, Schema, Monstr (when Cass was canvassing about it at EOD). But, as I said, I don't see scummy in him atp and Cuth is the best case.
Another note: yesterday
Vote: Cuth
Also, I want to see Pizza's full narrative progression on Cass-as-overlord.
Failure to lynch scum on my part has two contributors - the system and my own reads. How do you propose to tell the difference? Essentially me lynching Town by mistake could be caused by either/both at the same time.
I think Barto's flip will be difficult to decipher interactions-wise regardless of his alignment.
Why don't you see scummy? I see a couple of mentions/hints/possibilities that he could be Town, but his play is not pro-Town by any stretch and hasn't improved in that regard. How long do we let 'could' cancel out his current play?
Montmorency
12-25-2016, 01:31
Failure to lynch scum on my part has two contributors - the system and my own reads. How do you propose to tell the difference? Essentially me lynching Town by mistake could be caused by either/both at the same time.
If you are town, then for scum to not kill you the whole game and to rely on luck and guile to build you up as a mislynch would require nerves of steel. I have never heard of a player whom I believe capable of even considering such a strategy, let alone executing it. To say nothing of how such a player's partners would need to operate. If you remain alive and scum are not being lynched by you up to LYLO, then you're almost certainly scum.
I don't think it will come to that, however.
How long do we let 'could' cancel out his current play?
Not before Cuth is lynched, at least. No policy lynches are unilateral gut reads until we have this clarified.
This is pretty much where I'm at. Now that dp is dead I'm feeling a bit more pressure looking at those left in my district. I don't want Cuth elected under any circumstance, he's too big of a question mark. And really there needs to be a close eye on who tries to take his place.
My goal with the extended day, which for me actually means extra time since I've got a quiet holiday, is to take a look at these in depth:
Zack -- post quality from beginning to end game. I still lean town on him but I'm keeping an open mind because of how much there is to sift through. I could have my viewpoint challenged, we'll see.
Zack's proposed wolf team -- I had strong town feels on Cass early on, but whereas Cuth had a bad EOD1, she had a less than impressive EOD2 and lynch decision. If she is a wolf, Choxorn being gone as goon buys her credibility and removes no one of consequence from the team. I mean, Choxorn was the obvious choice by the way he popped in and popped out. El Barto still being here makes no sense at this point considering her multiple votes, as he pointed out.
Cuth, again -- There's something in me that doesn't want to let this go because yuck. So many votes headed here. But I've got this nagging suspicion that we've got a deep wolf or two and if Cuth is scummy regardless of alignment, he could be an easy player to push toward lynch. I'm trying to look at actual actions that could mean something, which is why I voted Cuth and not GH.
If anyone with some meta background on Cuth could tell me what we're seeing this game that are CONSTANTS for him, regardless of alignment, that would help greatly. Is he quick to change his mind? Does he give reads without lengthy explanation?
What about El Barto being here as per my rational?
What's your own view on El Barto?
Meta I have on Cuth of the top of my head as Town - Goes at Visor, Posts in streams of thought without punctuation, Draws attention to himself.
Caveat: I have no idea if he does any/all of those above as scum. I only recall playing him as Town. Potentially a biased read. Note to self, look at Bandicoot, not just Rappers.
What are your reasons/the actions that make you think he's scum, and how do they line up against that?
Also, grain of salt and all that, but I generally detest bussing as scum.
Montmorency
12-25-2016, 01:33
No policy lynches or unilateral gut reads until we have this clarified.
If you are town, then for scum to not kill you the whole game and to rely on luck and guile to build you up as a mislynch would require nerves of steel. I have never heard of a player whom I believe capable of even considering such a strategy, let alone executing it. To say nothing of how such a player's partners would need to operate. If you remain alive and scum are not being lynched by you up to LYLO, then you're almost certainly scum.
I don't think it will come to that, however.
Not before Cuth is lynched, at least. No policy lynches are unilateral gut reads until we have this clarified.
Why for the bold?
I am essentially the perfect target for this if you have played with me enough. I get Townread early as either alignment, and then things fall to s*** for a bit before I either pick myself back up or crumble/paint myself into a wall with paranoia.
Second bold - almost certainly, but not entirely, and this discounts the idea that Scum have a hand in pushing Town candidates towards options I have to pick between in a tie. /shrug
No policy lynches or unilateral gut reads until we have this clarified.
I like this idea.
Failure to lynch scum on my part has two contributors - the system and my own reads. How do you propose to tell the difference? Essentially me lynching Town by mistake could be caused by either/both at the same time.
I think Barto's flip will be difficult to decipher interactions-wise regardless of his alignment.
Why don't you see scummy? I see a couple of mentions/hints/possibilities that he could be Town, but his play is not pro-Town by any stretch and hasn't improved in that regard. How long do we let 'could' cancel out his current play?
Mont, please answer the bold, you skipped it.
Not really. TBH your position on towncred is mechanically strongest, but from meta DP has always been the top of the heap of the lock-towns. Natural first choice to kill, especially if you aren't yet prepared for the upheaval resultant from the death of the Chancellor.
What's your take on the Zack focusing mostly on sideline comments and self-defence/whymefryme D1/D2 argument, and is it indicative to you that it's changed considerably after he was a contender for lynch?
Montmorency
12-25-2016, 01:44
Why for the bold?
I am essentially the perfect target for this if you have played with me enough. I get Townread early as either alignment, and then things fall to s*** for a bit before I either pick myself back up or crumble/paint myself into a wall with paranoia.
Second bold - almost certainly, but not entirely, and this discounts the idea that Scum have a hand in pushing Town candidates towards options I have to pick between in a tie. /shrug
As I said, because great luck, skill, and discipline are required, and exemplary team work. Scums have to work and maneuver the town as you describe unflinchingly and unfailingly. If cracks don't show in the process of such a titanic endeavor, then heck, we're probably wrong about Bart and Cuth and it's actually Visor-Winston-Jabbz-dicetosser or something.
I don't see anything Barto's done as scummy for him or in itself so far, beyond "not helpful" as some may complain. That's usually not good enough to entertain, unless it's a lazy day with no prospects.
Montmorency
12-25-2016, 01:46
What's your take on the Zack focusing mostly on sideline comments and self-defence/whymefryme D1/D2 argument, and is it indicative to you that it's changed considerably after he was a contender for lynch?
Changed not really. What's my take? I'm keeping an eye out. Conditions are changing. So far it's appropriate.
Montmorency
12-25-2016, 01:49
One problem in this game is that we have talked so much that we've run out of meaningful things to say for the actual activity. This will reflect in the slump of all but the most indefatigable 'content-creators'.
You ignored my problems.
Why do you keep voting barto if you didn't want to lynch him?
Why have you spit on the idea of democracy?
I feel like i can never engage with you, you're always talking around me cass. Asking me questions, commenting on things I've done, but ignoring my own answers and questions.
I think I've answered these two things sufficiently this day phase. Any issues with it still let me know but I think that debate will go in circles if you can't see where I'm coming from already.
The last point is mutual, and part of the reason why I asked you why you were on at me D2 when we were both ITT.
I get I latch onto early paranoia, I get that the you not voicing suspicion is a thing that may go either way, I ask about this sort of stuff early on because it stands out to me.
WRT your later play, you didn't encourage interaction with me until you started pushing me. Until then you deflected things I said or shut me down with whymefryme/snarky attacks. You didn't give input or opinions on any of the things I said or asked people for input on. You didn't push anything I wouldn't see you doing as wolf (Why is Visor even Wolfy for that, Monty??) (Hedge on Cuth, but egg Visor on).
Coming at me for not sticking with representative voting, when as far as I recall you did nothing to give your actual opinion on that, or encourage Towny cohesion on figuring out strategy early on, not working to offer options, only working to shut them down.
You weren't the only player that did this, but you're one who's still not contributing there and I can't figure out why/how that comes from Town.
I gave you a day because your alignment should become clearer if you pick up your style, and regardless of what it is, it should be helpful for Town later on.
At least that's the way I've interpreted it. Your style the beginning of this day is more what I'd expect from Town you, but it has the problem that you're using it (seemingly) to throw shade at me after you were a candidate for the lynch.
Also, your volume and the game in general. I'm on limited time, I specifically signed up for this game expecting it to be slow and quiet. My capacity to play at this level is hugely reduced.
what in the hell does "whymefryme" mean
I think I've answered these two things sufficiently this day phase. Any issues with it still let me know but I think that debate will go in circles if you can't see where I'm coming from already.
Unfair to paint me this way when the comment you quoted is from before you actually explained anything... which is part of my frustration, you are always playing a page or two behind and writing huge tomes that are difficult for me to parse. I actually think it's sorta funny you and others have complained about how many posts I have making it hard to read through my stuff, when your word count is much higher.
The last point is mutual, and part of the reason why I asked you why you were on at me D2 when we were both ITT.
I get I latch onto early paranoia, I get that the you not voicing suspicion is a thing that may go either way, I ask about this sort of stuff early on because it stands out to me.
WRT your later play, you didn't encourage interaction with me until you started pushing me. Until then you deflected things I said or shut me down with whymefryme/snarky attacks. You didn't give input or opinions on any of the things I said or asked people for input on. You didn't push anything I wouldn't see you doing as wolf (Why is Visor even Wolfy for that, Monty??) (Hedge on Cuth, but egg Visor on).
Coming at me for not sticking with representative voting, when as far as I recall you did nothing to give your actual opinion on that, or encourage Towny cohesion on figuring out strategy early on, not working to offer options, only working to shut them down.
You weren't the only player that did this, but you're one who's still not contributing there and I can't figure out why/how that comes from Town.
I gave you a day because your alignment should become clearer if you pick up your style, and regardless of what it is, it should be helpful for Town later on.
At least that's the way I've interpreted it. Your style the beginning of this day is more what I'd expect from Town you, but it has the problem that you're using it (seemingly) to throw shade at me after you were a candidate for the lynch.
Also, your volume and the game in general. I'm on limited time, I specifically signed up for this game expecting it to be slow and quiet. My capacity to play at this level is hugely reduced.
Have you ever played a game with town me? Honest question, I'm baffled why you would "expect from Town you" when you have never seen town me afaik.
It's hard for me to engage with you when it's always huge walls. :shrug:
Mildly annoying that you seem to call anything I do "shade".
Wrt the paranoia thing, I was just going from my recollection of it, and was more annoyed that you were calling me suspicious for something I viewed as meaningless and hypocritical.
So the nights results have put Zack more into my town column, as much as I hate to admit it. Dp was heavily on Zack's case, and only backed off because he didn't want to cause more drama in the thread. There was an implication however, I felt, that he still thought Zack was scummy and would be revisiting it. Leaving Zack alive in this instance presents the image of protecting Zack from a valid scumhunt, and it sounds like something I would do if I were scum. Zack has also been a lightning rod for a lot of people's attacks over the last two days. These all make valid reasons for leaving him alive, regardless of his efficacy as a wolf hunter.
I appreciate the sentiment but I don't quite understand it. It seems like a roundabout way of saying you think I'm town because I'm still alive, but I don't think any combination of wolf team would have killed me so it should be a null point?
As I said, because great luck, skill, and discipline are required, and exemplary team work. Scums have to work and maneuver the town as you describe unflinchingly and unfailingly. If cracks don't show in the process of such a titanic endeavor, then heck, we're probably wrong about Bart and Cuth and it's actually Visor-Winston-Jabbz-dicetosser or something.
I don't see anything Barto's done as scummy for him or in itself so far, beyond "not helpful" as some may complain. That's usually not good enough to entertain, unless it's a lazy day with no prospects.
And yet, at least two players have publicly pushed me about not deciding that way twice in a row already today. Zack is one and Schema is another.
You defend Barto directly, they push shade on me for it, call him Scum, but look set to vote a different way.
IF Cuth is Town and Barto's Scum. This looks bad.
Current tinfoil thoughts with a grain of rice.
AoRN I think strategically Cuth/Barto/Zack/?Schema-other today are good options both for possi-scum and information either way. Not 100% on this, just current racing thoughts.
And I'd prefer it to happen in a style as close to possible as a normal lynch.
As I said, because great luck, skill, and discipline are required, and exemplary team work. Scums have to work and maneuver the town as you describe unflinchingly and unfailingly. If cracks don't show in the process of such a titanic endeavor, then heck, we're probably wrong about Bart and Cuth and it's actually Visor-Winston-Jabbz-dicetosser or something.
I don't see anything Barto's done as scummy for him or in itself so far, beyond "not helpful" as some may complain. That's usually not good enough to entertain, unless it's a lazy day with no prospects.
And yet, at least two players have publicly pushed me about not deciding that way twice in a row already today. Zack is one and Schema is another.
You defend Barto directly, they push shade on me for it, call him Scum, but look set to vote a different way.
IF Cuth is Town and Barto's Scum. This looks bad.
Current tinfoil thoughts with a grain of rice.
AoRN I think strategically Cuth/Barto/Zack/?Schema-other today are good options both for possi-scum and information either way. Not 100% on this, just current racing thoughts.
And I'd prefer it to happen in a style as close to possible as a normal lynch.
I don't see a scum team going to great lengths to implicate Cass when they could just NK her.
Going back over D2, I don't like dicetosser's history. Flipped town GH and Zack/Renata who I have townreads on think he is town, but between the posts on mechanics and his own meta, and the pointless arguments with El Barto and Montmorency, there's a lot of what feels like driving up the postcount without contributing much. Seemed oddly insistent that we not be too sure of Dp101/Renata/Cass/atheotes's innocence too.
Unfair to paint me this way when the comment you quoted is from before you actually explained anything... which is part of my frustration, you are always playing a page or two behind and writing huge tomes that are difficult for me to parse. I actually think it's sorta funny you and others have complained about how many posts I have making it hard to read through my stuff, when your word count is much higher.
The last point is mutual, and part of the reason why I asked you why you were on at me D2 when we were both ITT.
I get I latch onto early paranoia, I get that the you not voicing suspicion is a thing that may go either way, I ask about this sort of stuff early on because it stands out to me.
Have you ever played a game with town me? Honest question, I'm baffled why you would "expect from Town you" when you have never seen town me afaik.
It's hard for me to engage with you when it's always huge walls. :shrug:
Mildly annoying that you seem to call anything I do "shade".
Wrt the paranoia thing, I was just going from my recollection of it, and was more annoyed that you were calling me suspicious for something I viewed as meaningless and hypocritical.
You were Town in Star Fox, and like I already said, your attitude there and here in some comments was similar so that's a possi-point towards Town.
It is possible I have a biased/poorly formed read from that game given its size and my inability to be across all things. 'Expect from you' is probably something that flows either way - the games I watched you scum in impressed me greatly, I don't see a reason why you wouldn't give me the same impression of you if you were Town but hmmm.
Fair point that I need to consider my expectations/your meta of you as Town.
In a vacuum though, I find your D1, D2 play generically scummy, and your push on me is sus to me knowing my alignment as I do.
what in the hell does "whymefryme" mean
Not answering questions with anything other than emo 'Why me?' 'They're picking on me'/'Nobody reads my posts' type stuff. Ergo, your D1/D2 play.
Someone continually defends with 'Why me??' you 'Fry' them. They could be Town, but it's not helpful and in the first/one of the early games I played? it was described as a go to scum excuse.
At least that's my understanding and regardless, it fits with my feels? <.<
Unfair to paint me this way when the comment you quoted is from before you actually explained anything... which is part of my frustration, you are always playing a page or two behind and writing huge tomes that are difficult for me to parse.
Wasn't painting you, I mean if the debate continued after you've read those points.
I get the frustration. I'd like to get gud. Doin what I can with what I have. /Shrug
Hey everyone. I somewhat followed D2 but will need to reread at some point.
Dp101 was almost 100% confirmed town given his D1 voting (and good posts besides), whereas Zack could conceivably be scum. That's reason enough to do away with Dp. Similar reason could apply for lynching GH (+ he was a less controversial candidate than Zack), but that's getting into WIFOM territory and I'm not convinced that Cass is a wolf.
FWIW Cuthillius seems more scummy than El Barto to me despite EB's D2 weird talk about voting.
Can you explain why, on Cuth?
A new set of eyes on this, when I'm ITT might make it easier to see the case if I'm wrong.
And hi!
Today (17) and tomorrow (15), unless we lose a lynch or an extra nightkill pops up.
And this is why I want to teach communication, math is not my strong point.
Cass_
You work for the Society for the Protection of Elvish Welfare!?!? That's awesome. Say hi to Hermione for me.
I'm a Paramedic. I work for the society of Sat-Xmas-Eve-Night-Shifts-are-the-pits.
Don't get/agree with the logic behind progression with Zac,
Agree with redistribution of power.
Aorn, my reads are much the same as the last list I posted.
Things that have changed in gut are Schema and Cuth possibly go down.
Montmorency, please explain the reasons why you have people in each tier when districts are set into 5 lots. I don't get what you mean about distributing nobles/commoners etc. I think I like the theory?/it sounds good anyway until I dissect it. I want reasons/explanations based on your own leans too pls.
I appreciate the sentiment but I don't quite understand it. It seems like a roundabout way of saying you think I'm town because I'm still alive, but I don't think any combination of wolf team would have killed me so it should be a null point?
The point is more in regards to who was chosen to die. While Dp was definitely a top option for nuking, he wasn't the only one. His death paints you worse than it paints anyone else, and I'm taking my read from that. Keep in mind, its not like I'm reading you from scum to town, I had already pretty much decided you were unlikely to be scum.
We need to be cohesive so
Thoughts on how to best do this are appreciated.
Currently I'm thinking
Every player votes in their own district as if it is a direct lynch. Call it a preliminary lynch if you will.
District reps vote for the main lynch according to the majority in their district.
Chancellor votes according to the majority of votes for players if there is a tie.
Can everyone agree to this?
We specifically need to get ordered about what happens with District Reps.
Imo, if we don't make them follow the majority, we're compounding the limitations of the game (restricting Town decisions to limited number of players).
But they deserve to have considerable input in the case that they're Town/Town read.
We need to be cohesive so
Thoughts on how to best do this are appreciated.
Currently I'm thinking
Every player votes in their own district as if it is a direct lynch. Call it a preliminary lynch if you will.
District reps vote for the main lynch according to the majority in their district.
Chancellor votes according to the majority of votes for players if there is a tie.
Can everyone agree to this?
I think that would work fairly well. Town should have a rather substantial majority at this point, so it's unlikely scum end up with a majority of the rep's.
We specifically need to get ordered about what happens with District Reps.
Imo, if we don't make them follow the majority, we're compounding the limitations of the game (restricting Town decisions to limited number of players).
But they deserve to have considerable input in the case that they're Town/Town read.
If we could reach a consensus on who those towny folks were, we could give them an artificial double vote.
"Every player votes in their own district as if it is a direct lynch."
FTR I think this managing this properly is really important to Town.
Making individual votes count by being truly representative of democracy vs. dissent has the twofold benefit of playing to collective rather than individual Town power (more heads are better than three, or one) and making scum votes more accountable to trace.
I propose District Reps lead this by
Voting Twice.
First to kick off the preliminary lynch.
Second to represent the view of their District/Mini-Town.
I further propose that those who elect the winning representative vote with them as a consolidated core, leaving those outside the core to vote where they like and justify their dissent.
If we could reach a consensus on who those towny folks were, we could give them an artificial double vote.
Kind of my line of thinking.
How do you propose that work?
What do you think of below?
Montmorency
12-25-2016, 02:56
We need to be cohesive so
Thoughts on how to best do this are appreciated.
Currently I'm thinking
Every player votes in their own district as if it is a direct lynch. Call it a preliminary lynch if you will.
District reps vote for the main lynch according to the majority in their district.
Chancellor votes according to the majority of votes for players if there is a tie.
Can everyone agree to this?
Chancellor should make final calls, especially if owner of one of the districts. Just keep in mind that the position of Chancellor requires a political touch, not just lynching by their own or someone else's stated scum-lean.
@Montmorency, please explain the reasons why you have people in each tier when districts are set into 5 lots. I don't get what you mean about distributing nobles/commoners etc. I think I like the theory?/it sounds good anyway until I dissect it. I want reasons/explanations based on your own leans too pls.
I don't want to think to much about most of the non-rep allocations as I didn't put much thought into that when I made up the drafts; I just wanted a good mix of "social class" for each district. The main thought went into who to appoint as rep (and I guess into avoiding districts that would contest their appointment), and how highest-level contenders should be grouped relative to each other.
On social classes, Chancellor is the position, the Senators are the strongest players, Equites are those behind them who are present, towny, and or well-liked. Those are the upper classes. The lower classes have the plebeian group, the commoners of the player population, and then the final group of 'flunkies' (:sweat:) who as-of-yet don't have much presence or clout in the political arena. The highest nobility (i.e. Visor, Zack, Renata) are the top candidates for district Rep in a 3-er scenario, and in a 5-scenario leadership positions are opened to the lower nobility (i.e. Winston, atheotes, Monstrbro). Generally you don't want to concentrate a district with members of a single class. If you have questions about specific allotments ask, though as I said in many cases which (non-Rep) player I put where is semi-random and isn't meant to translate verbatim into your plan of action.
Montmorency
12-25-2016, 02:59
I further propose that those who elect the winning representative vote with them as a consolidated core, leaving those outside the core to vote where they like and justify their dissent.
You may be getting too involved with thread activity here. I'm not sure I want to keep track of this. Especially as we come to see days where both district consensus vote, district dissent vote, individual votes, and private Rep votes all fluctuate by the hour.
Chancellor should make final calls, especially if owner of one of the districts. Just keep in mind that the position of Chancellor requires a political touch, not just lynching by their own or someone else's stated scum-lean.
What's the fluff of the bold mean in practical terms? Stuff like I should have lynched El Barto regardless of the fact I was more confident GH was directly scum? How do you propose that be managed fairly? As long as I'm alive it's always coming down to my understanding of the game, I have to work with what I have.
Why should a Chancellor be automatically elected to District Rep simply because they were Town read early in the game? Game States change, people in the Chancellor's District should be able to challenge the Chancellor directly if they wish.
I don't want to think to much about most of the non-rep allocations as I didn't put much thought into that when I made up the drafts; I just wanted a good mix of "social class" for each district.
Non-rep allocations essentially relates to the votes from the majority of players in the game.
Not counting it is ... unrepresentative.
Discounting lends itself to scummy bias (or direct scum influence), considering that the majority of players in the game are Town.
Montmorency
12-25-2016, 03:22
What's the fluff of the bold mean in practical terms?
Apply scum-mindset disingenuity. Consider how lynches will affect or divert future day discussions and cases. Ask the hooded guy always standing at attention next to you.
Discounting lends itself to scummy bias (or direct scum influence), considering that the majority of players in the game are Town.
What I'm saying is that I'm not going to carefully sift through all the players and their relationships to create individualized optimum districts. I just made some crude outlines. You can do with that as your conscience demands - good luck.
I think I started on the right strategic track yesterday, asking everyone for the consensus on where to go/how to decide the tie, but the plan didn't feel solid, and I got paranoid about other players, and I backtracked on it, and it's bad. All this needs to change.
We need to maximise the power of Town forming the majority of the player base right now.
Essentially, I think things need to get more ordered, and I think the order of things should be:
1. District Representative Elections before everything else.
- Everybody in the District votes BLUE for their Representative preference;
(This can be based on read or specific agreement with who that player wants to lynch)
- Most consensus BLUE vote is officially elected to power.
2. District Scum Candidate Preliminary Lynch Votes - Led by District leader Vote.
- District leader votes RED for their number one lynch
- Those that voted for that District leader vote RED with them/for the same player
- Those that voted against the District leader vote RED for their own preferred lynch
- The representative vote is finalised by the District leader keeping or changing their vote according to the majority rule
3. End of Day Lynching occurs as close to a normal game as possible - with the majority of votes reflecting the majority of common opinions.
IMO, this:
- Represents majority of opinions as much as possible
- Gives individual/majority interests more direct weight and makes it more fun by electing the consensus read to Rep with more consequence.
It also
- Tests the rep; and
- Challenges scum to be active at all levels if their interests don't align with majority Town - Which I don't think the current system does.
What I'm saying is that I'm not going to carefully sift through all the players and their relationships to create individualized optimum districts. I just made some crude outlines. You can do with that as your conscience demands - good luck.
Yeah that part is fine. I'll nut that out as best I can/appreciate/consider input where people have it.
You haven't commented on the option of voting reps to power and then following that through with those who voted them into power consolidating with them on their vote. I see this creating more meaningful competition for District rep and final vote count then we currently have.
Anyway all.
If you're Town, let's pull together and find a way to make the vote more accurately representative.
I'll get to District redistribution tonight.
Merry Xmas \o/
Montmorency
12-25-2016, 03:37
You haven't commented on the option of voting reps to power and then following that through with those who voted them into power consolidating with them on their vote.
Those that voted for that District leader vote RED with them/for the same player
You may be getting too involved with thread activity here. I'm not sure I want to keep track of this. Especially as we come to see days where both district consensus vote, district dissent vote, individual votes, and private Rep votes all fluctuate by the hour.
What's the benefit over your original design of voting reps to power and keeping individual votes? The new design just creates more work for everyone and doesn't give any new information or security.
- Everybody in the District votes BLUE for their Representative preference;
Well, we shouldn't speak of player "preferences" - they should be districted such that they have a one or two options per district - or else you lose control of the Reps.
That's a lot of talk to say basically
WOULD YOU CONSOLIDATE YOUR VOTE WITH THE PERSON YOU CHOSE TO REPRESENT YOUR DISTRICT?
Theoretically, you shouldn't want anyone in Power who's lynching outside your top scum reads so I think this makes sense.
(As a mandatory thing, fight to put your Top Town read in Power and consolidate with them to have more actual votes on the players you both want lynched, if they are actually put in Power).
Bah. Wordsarehard.
Montmorency
12-25-2016, 03:49
That's a lot of talk to say basically
WOULD YOU CONSOLIDATE YOUR VOTE WITH THE PERSON YOU CHOSE TO REPRESENT YOUR DISTRICT?
Theoretically, you shouldn't want anyone in Power who's lynching outside your top scum reads so I think this makes sense.
Practically-speaking, this requires people to come in later on and change their vote. This is effort for what? If they don't change the vote, then - so what? What do we learn from their violating a meaningless formality? What do we learn from their complying with it?
Montmorency
12-25-2016, 03:54
It also negates the representative process in the first place, since, if everyone for a candidate changes their vote to the majority vote, it obscures what people's actual, original, votes were and how the consensus was generated.
Can you explain why, on Cuth?
A new set of eyes on this, when I'm ITT might make it easier to see the case if I'm wrong.
And hi!
His switch from wolf-reading to town-reading Jabbz on EoD1, plus apparently trying to avoid having Choxorn on the lynch block which looked bad in light of the mafia flip, and his response to D2 pressure sounded wolfy to me. I need to ISO him tomorrow and see if that impression is accurate.
But for now, good night and merry christmas all.
atheotes
12-25-2016, 06:59
can we just focus on redrawing the districts.
Definitely need 5 districts. is there anyone who doesnt want this?
atheotes
12-25-2016, 07:00
i am thinking something like this.
<tbody>
Renata
Cass
atheotes
Winston
Visor
Montrbro
Schema
Jabbz
Zack
dice
Riedquat
Al sips
Cuth
El barto
Monty
Bsmith
Fenn
</tbody>
thoughts?
Kind of my line of thinking.
How do you propose that work?
What do you think of below?
Didn't I mention math is hard? Jack is trustworthy, we credit him with two votes. Jim is trustworthy, we give him two votes. Jameson, Jose, and Johnnie are not, so we give them 1 vote each. Jack votes bob, Jim votes Alex, Jameson votes bob, Jose votes will, and Johnnie votes Jane. Because of the extra points we credit Bob with 3 votes, Alex with 2, Will with one vote, and Jane with one vote. Jim, trusting the (modified) majority vote switches to Bob, leaving 3 (real) votes for Bob and 1 each for Jane and Will. Even if that only garners us a tie, you break it. If someone breaks from this agreement, they single themselves out and we have a solid place to look on the morrow.
If this comes across a double post, my bad. It posted then disappeared. Or maybe I've had too much Tullamore. Whatever. I'm cool being grouped with Atheotes. I haven't gotten a scum vibe from him and others seem to trust him, so I'd be down to support him for rep. I'd offer to do it myself with Dp gone, but I doubt I'm inspiring much in the realm of town confidence after being absent most of the last day.
Double posting is quite okay
Monstrdude
12-25-2016, 08:31
So many words
So much Christmas
It is 1:27 am Christmas morning and I have elected to play mafia
I have a problem
Voting setup sounds good to me, I still haven't gotten my full read through yet but don't hold your breath on it or anything still
The district setup atheotes put is fine but I'm not really sure I have the ability to weigh in properly on that without my reread
Anyway I should get to bed. Merry holidays happy Xmas people enjoy being with your families and stuff yay stuff
Cuthillius
12-25-2016, 09:00
Cuth, again -- There's something in me that doesn't want to let this go because yuck. So many votes headed here. But I've got this nagging suspicion that we've got a deep wolf or two and if Cuth is scummy regardless of alignment, he could be an easy player to push toward lynch. I'm trying to look at actual actions that could mean something, which is why I voted Cuth and not GH.
If anyone with some meta background on Cuth could tell me what we're seeing this game that are CONSTANTS for him, regardless of alignment, that would help greatly. Is he quick to change his mind? Does he give reads without lengthy explanation?
everyone voting for =/= deep wolf, even if i was scum
also everything i'm posting is stuff i'd post as town
you can tell because i'm town
that's how you can tell and i need sleep
Cuthillius
12-25-2016, 09:02
I want to talk about how we can coordinate a lynch to make it more cohesive/representative for Town.
I'm sorry that I was wrong, but that's the way it went.
If I take my guilt feels out of it and look at it root cause-analysis-wise I think there were a couple of things in particular that contributed to a bad result and have the potential to keep doing so in the future.
1. Lolmyreads. I'm glad I caught Chox with my method n1, but my personal gut and methods aren't infallible or perfect as an approach to reading someone, and as much as I'd like to be awesome and read everyone correctly, statistically it's not going to happen every time.
2. Allowing ties with the mandate that the lynch be decided by one player. Regardless of who's Chancellor, making the lynch decision theirs subjects it to the problems in point 1 and makes potentially makes it more difficult to draw conclusions about everyone else.
3. Allowing the deciding player to deviate from strategy discussed. See points above.
Allowing ties at lynch and the mandated practice of the Chancellor deciding limits the strategic/collective power of the Town to one person. At a gut level, I don’t think this is a good thing for Town, or the game as a whole.
Regardless of who's Chancellor, making the lynch decision theirs subjects it to the problems in point 1 and makes potentially makes it more difficult to draw conclusions about everyone else.
All mafia have to do is push votes towards townies and hope one person gets it wrong.
So I think this needs to change. Have been thinking about/putting more thoughts together about this overnight but #lolstrategyishard
What do people think about making things more truly representative/following majority vote?
i don't think that's a good idea
because i think you know why
Cuthillius
12-25-2016, 09:03
i don't think that's a good idea
because i think you know why
also can't trust majority, but i am p confident in trusting you're town
and usually easier for wolves to mislead sheep than one person per se
when the person is intelligent
i say keep power
abut meh
Cuthillius
12-25-2016, 09:06
One problem in this game is that we have talked so much that we've run out of meaningful things to say for the actual activity. This will reflect in the slump of all but the most indefatigable 'content-creators'.
i disagree
i don't think we've talked everything over
perhaps, and i don't think so, but PERHAPS mechanically
but definitely not as far as interaction
Cuthillius
12-25-2016, 09:08
We need to be cohesive so
Thoughts on how to best do this are appreciated.
Currently I'm thinking
Every player votes in their own district as if it is a direct lynch. Call it a preliminary lynch if you will.
District reps vote for the main lynch according to the majority in their district.
Chancellor votes according to the majority of votes for players if there is a tie.
Can everyone agree to this?
no, because town gets lynched aorn
Cuthillius
12-25-2016, 09:10
His switch from wolf-reading to town-reading Jabbz on EoD1, plus apparently trying to avoid having Choxorn on the lynch block which looked bad in light of the mafia flip, and his response to D2 pressure sounded wolfy to me. I need to ISO him tomorrow and see if that impression is accurate.
i have literally said nothing about jabbz this entire game
i have no idea how you got that
also i didn't avoid chox, like i said
that would assume chox was a higher level of publicity than he was
and it was part of a mistaking of the rules of the game
but that's like saying oh you didn't talk about the fourth most popular topic even though it was the most important shame on you you just talked about the top two
Cuthillius
12-25-2016, 09:11
anyway i have no original thoughts rn
i want to tomorrow though
right now my me is tingling
because i have ~no sleep and just ate a bunch of chocolate covered coffee beans
night all
c'est la vie
and merry christmas
Cuthillius
12-25-2016, 09:13
cass i think the strat works better when you can delineate groups better as far as majorities
in this case there may be a fairly high, comparatively speaking, number of scum left
and as a result a more majority based thing could be very easily skewed unless properly distributed
i really don't know
and dont care at this moment
Montmorency
12-25-2016, 12:08
i am thinking something like this.
<tbody>
Renata
Cass
atheotes
Winston
Visor
Montrbro
Schema
Jabbz
Zack
dice
Riedquat
Al sips
Cuth
El barto
Monty
Bsmith
Fenn
</tbody>
thoughts?
Personally rather Monstr were Rep than Winston (District 4), and Zack (or whoever in the upper class that doesn't have blessing to become Rep) should sit under Cass (District 2).
So on those terms simply, switch Monstr and Winston, and switch Zack and one of Schema/Al Sips/Barto.
i disagree
i don't think we've talked everything over
perhaps, and i don't think so, but PERHAPS mechanically
but definitely not as far as interaction
Players never evenly distribute their interactions with each other, and not even the Chancellor's fiat can make it transpire. We've talked over all these things between so many people, and we're not going to rehash them but with different people for the sake of completeness.
everyone voting for =/= deep wolf, even if i was scum
also everything i'm posting is stuff i'd post as town
you can tell because i'm town
that's how you can tell and i need sleep
Lol.
can we just focus on redrawing the districts.
Definitely need 5 districts. is there anyone who doesnt want this?
I'm leaning 5, but limiting scum leans to as few Districts as possible those as possible, under strongest Town leans.
i am thinking something like this.
<tbody>
Renata
Cass
atheotes
Winston
Visor
Montrbro
Schema
Jabbz
Zack
dice
Riedquat
Al sips
Cuth
El barto
Monty
Bsmith
Fenn
</tbody>
thoughts?
Where are your scum reads in here? Are they grouped together or spread across districts?
Why?
I'm leaning 5, but limiting scum leans to as few Districts as possible those as possible, under strongest Town leans.
If anyone sees/has problems with this, speak up now or forever hold your peace.
And Merry Christmas, Slower side of the world!!
Montmorency
12-25-2016, 14:31
If anyone sees/has problems with this, speak up now or forever hold your peace.
And Merry Christmas, Slower side of the world!!
Sort by classes, not by leeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaa...
My previous reads list. Move dicetosser up above Jabbz, Zack up a couple slots maybe?, Schema down a couple mostly by virtue of not having anything towny to add since day one.
Oh, move monstrbro up some, but there's still that one post with regards to choxorn that really bugs. I'll see if I can find it.
Did you find that monstr-chox post?/What came of it? Where you at with Monstr?
Can you explain your progression on Cuth/Where you're at wrt him now?
In the quoted list you have him/monstr as the equivalent of your strongest Scum reads?
This EoD you seem to be defending him against Zack?
Cuthillius
12-25-2016, 18:05
Personally rather Monstr were Rep than Winston (District 4), and Zack (or whoever in the upper class that doesn't have blessing to become Rep) should sit under Cass (District 2).
So on those terms simply, switch Monstr and Winston, and switch Zack and one of Schema/Al Sips/Barto.
Players never evenly distribute their interactions with each other, and not even the Chancellor's fiat can make it transpire. We've talked over all these things between so many people, and we're not going to rehash them but with different people for the sake of completeness.
exactly
the strat is awesome if distributed properly
if not, which is more likely, i'd rather just have someone i'm sure is town make the pick
Cuthillius
12-25-2016, 18:06
more later, busy
merry christmas everyone
Ok. Here's what I'm thinking of submitting for districts.
Group scum/confine as many of them as possible to the largest district
- Minimises the number of Rep votes the scummy/iest players can directly influence;
And then counter the leftover scummies with a balance of the strongest Townies where we can
- avoiding divide and conquer
If I'm missing significant early votes (on players who've flipped) pls let me know.
DISTRICT
1
2
3
4
5
Cass/Renata
Monty
Winston
Atheotes
AlSips/Visor
Jabbz/Zack
BSmith/Dice
Schema/(Csargo)Fenn/Riedquat/Cuth
Monstr/Barto
Total
4
4
3
3
3
Vote History
(Csargo)Fenn:
D1
Sooh
D2 -
Schema
D1 GH
D2 Cuth
Riedquat
D1 Visor
D2 GH
Cuth
D1
Sooh
D2 GH
Cass
D1 Barto /
Choxorn
D2 Barto/GH
Renata
D1
Choxorn
D2 Monty
Monstr
D1 Winston
D2 GH
Barto:
D1 Winston
- - -
Monty
D1 Visor
D2 Cuth
Al Sips
D1 Bsmith
D2 Monty
Visor
D1 Cuth
D2 *Self
Winston
D1 Barto
D2 Csargo -->Zack
Jabbz
D1 Zack
D2 Bsmith
Zack
D1 Jabbz
D2 Cuth
Atheotes
D1
Chox--> El Barto
D2 GH
Bsmith
D1 Al Sips
D2 Cuth
Dice
D1 Monty
D2 Barto
Pizza Tallies for Reference
Person District/Chancellor/Lynch
Schema Renata Cass GH
Cuthillius Cuth Zack Sooh
Renata dp101 Cass Choxorn
Choxorn Cuth Zack Al Sipsclar
Dp101 dp101 GH choxorn
Jabbz dp101 Cass Zack
Dicetosser1 Dice Cass Monty
Winston Visor Cass El Barto
Bsmith Visor Visor Al Sips
Visor Visor Visor Cuthillius
Csargo Winston Cass Sooh
Riedquat Visor Visor Visor
El Barto El Barto El Barto Winston
Monstrbro Monstr Monstr Winston
Montmorency GH Cass Visor
Al Sipsclar Zack Cass Bsmith
Sooh Cass Cass atheotes
Cass_ Cass Renata El Barto
Generalhank GH Zack Sooh
Zack Zack Zack Jabbz
Atheotes Cass Winston El barto
District Representative:
Dp101: Representative for District 1 (3/7 votes, winner)
Visor: Representative for District 2 (4/7 votes, winner)
Cass: Representative for District 3 (3/7 votes, winner)
Chancellor: Cass (9/21 votes, winner)
Zack: 4
Visor: 3
Lynch vote: Tie.
Dp votes for Choxorn
Visor votes for Cuthillius
Cass votes for El Barto
choxorn-Cuth-ElBarto tied.
Pop vote:
El Barto: 3
Sooh: 3
choxorn: 2
Al Sips: 2
Visor: 2
Winston: 2
Zack: 1
Monty: 1
GH: 1
Cuth: 1
Bsmith: 1
atheotes: 1
Jabbz: 1
Cass, in her position as chancellor, decides tie.
She can lynch her own suspect, El Barto, or lynch choxorn or Cuth. It’s up to her. But it must be between those three.
This is what I have. Double check me, send corrections via PM or mention me here.
Person District/Lynch
Schema dp101 / ---
Cuth dp101 / GH
Renata dp101 / Monty
Dp101 dp101 / ---
Jabbz dp101 / ---
Dice --- / Barto
Winston Winston / Csargo
Bsmith Winston / Cuth
Visor Winston / Cuth
Csargo Winston / ---
Riedquat Winston / GH
Barto Visor / ---
Monstr Monstr / GH
Monty Cass / Cuth
Al Sipsclar Cass / ---
Cass_ --- / ---
GH Cass / Cuth
Zack --- / Cuth
Atheotes Cass / GH
Tally looks like this, checking for discrepancies. PM me with any.
Person District/Chancellor/Lynch
Schema dp101 / Cuth
Cuth dp101 / GH
Renata dp101 / Monty
Dp101 dp101 / GH
Jabbz dp101 / Bsmith
Dice --- / Barto
Winston Winston / Zack
Bsmith Winston / Cuth
Visor Winston / Visor
Csargo Winston / ---
Riedquat Winston / GH
Barto Visor / ---
Monstr Monstr / GH
Monty Cass / Cuth
Al Sipsclar Cass / Monty
Cass_ Cass / Barto
GH Cass / Cuth
Zack Zack / Cuth
Atheotes Cass / GH
Dp would be re-elected district 1, is voting GH
Winston would be elected district 2, is voting Zack
Cass would be re-elected district 3, is voting Barto
Cass would decide tie-break.
Or
District 1
Fenn/Schema/Riedquat/Cuth
District 2
Cass/Renata
Monstr/Barto
District 3
Monty/Al Sips/Visor
District 4
Winston/Jabbz/Zack
District 5
Atheotes/BSmith/Dice
- Each Member votes for Repand [B]Lynch
- Prior to EoD, District Rep changes their vote to reflect the majority in the district.
- Lynch occurs due to the highest number of red votes.
Thoughts?
Cuthillius
12-25-2016, 20:21
I'd switch monstr with someone from d5
i think he's town
i don't have >thin town reads on anyone in d5
Montmorency
12-25-2016, 20:48
District 1 is the crucial disagreement. Those people should be spread out. Put Renata to govern them.
El Barto
12-25-2016, 20:50
Where does the idea for five districts rather than four come from? A mislynch plus a well-placed kill would mean you could have two districts with 2 voters each with one summioso, and if there's more scummos there they'd be overrepresented, each having 25-33% of the vote in their districts.
This mushroom-chicken slice has almost no mushroom, and they forgot one of the slices.
You should have a half-and-half pizza, one-half provolone and ham, the other mozzarella and anchovies. Both with some tomato sauce under it, plus oregano and garlic.
Also mushrooms are gross, they did you a favor.
No they are not, they did him a disfavour.
OK, I see you're warming on the "Cuth-Cass-Bart-Choxorn" conspiracy I mentioned yesterday. Good effort, but I still think it's nuts and at any rate self-resolving through failure to die or to lynch scum on Cass' part.
I'm just being pedantic. We have relatively-little to discuss today besides who we'd like to be districted with.
Ultimate conspiracy: Cass-Renata-Chox-Cuth-Bart. Monstrbro neutral survivor. Monty amnesiac.
what is this i don't even
See previous post - I've voted for El Barto because he seems scummy on general play, I've lynched Chox and GH him because there were considerable differences in their play here and their play in games where they were Town and that made it more likely to me that they were actual scum than just El Barto hinging on randomness and self-reference, which I've seen him do in both alignments.
TLDR He's still scummy on general principle and I'd like to see him lynched.
I'm always scummy, lass. Even atpg or Backwards Logic have trouble reading me. See my sig!
El Barto
12-25-2016, 20:51
Where does the idea for five districts rather than four come from? A mislynch plus a well-placed kill would mean you could have two districts with 2 voters each with one scummioso, and if there's more scummos in other districts they'd be overrepresented, each having 25-33% of the vote in their districts.
Fixed (pseudoedit).
Askthepizzaguy
12-25-2016, 20:54
District 1
Fenn
Schema
Riedquat
Cuth
District 2
Cass
Renata
Monstr
Barto
District 3
Monty
Al Sips
Visor
District 4
Winston
Jabbz
Zack
District 5
Atheotes
BSmith
Dice
This is the version of districts I received within the allotted time. It is now official.
Askthepizzaguy
12-25-2016, 20:56
There are roughly 48 hours remaining, minus one half hour.
El Barto
12-25-2016, 21:09
There are roughly 48 hours remaining, minus one half hour.
#timerfeature
Montmorency
12-25-2016, 21:48
Vote: Cuthilius
Visor, do you want to be Rep, or can I be Rep? If you're Rep today I want to be Rep tomorrow.
Askthepizzaguy
12-25-2016, 21:48
http://www.pending.me.uk/cd/gre_1482867000.png
El Barto
12-25-2016, 21:55
Vote: Cuthilius
Visor, do you want to be Rep, or can I be Rep? If you're Rep today I want to be Rep tomorrow.
#powergrab
http://www.pending.me.uk/cd/gre_1482867000.png
:smitten:
i have literally said nothing about jabbz this entire game
i have no idea how you got that
also i didn't avoid chox, like i said
that would assume chox was a higher level of publicity than he was
and it was part of a mistaking of the rules of the game
but that's like saying oh you didn't talk about the fourth most popular topic even though it was the most important shame on you you just talked about the top two
My bad on the Jabbz thing, I dunno where I got that from...must have confused you with somebody else. wrt choxorn even if you misunderstood the rules you still tried to direct the lynch away from him and I don't buy your explanations. And maybe I'm missing something but how is "who will get lynched in ten minutes" not important??
Oh and the districts are out. D1 doesn't look ideal which I guess is the point, but wouldn't it have been better to have spread out all the people who seem scummy?
Anyway, Vote: Schema for being the towniest + not a lurker. I like their progression on D1, generally get a towny vibe from their posts.
District 1
Fenn
Schema
Riedquat
Cuth
District 2
Cass
Renata
Monstr
Barto
District 3
Monty
Al Sips
Visor
District 4
Winston
Jabbz
Zack
District 5
Atheotes
BSmith
Dice
This is the version of districts I received within the allotted time. It is now official.
Well, District 4 should be interesting. Zack doesn't trust me or Winston, Winston doesn't trust zack, though I'm not sure how he feels about me. I trust Zack to be town, but not to have good decision making, and I'm unsure of how I feel about Winston.
Vote: Jabbz
Cuthillius
12-26-2016, 00:01
My bad on the Jabbz thing, I dunno where I got that from...must have confused you with somebody else. wrt choxorn even if you misunderstood the rules you still tried to direct the lynch away from him and I don't buy your explanations. And maybe I'm missing something but how is "who will get lynched in ten minutes" not important??
lol no i didn't
you can argue that i should have known he was wolf because ???? and therefore i should have pushed him
but blaming me for not talking about him when he had fewer votes than the people i was talking about, when it was not like i was avoiding him from my pov of the vote at that time
Is anyone else going to point out that all cuth does is reply to things against him and he never takes active steps towards solving the game?
El Barto
12-26-2016, 00:23
Is anyone else going to point out that all cuth does is reply to things against him and he never takes active steps towards solving the game?
I haven't paid him that much attention, having had to defend myself and with limited time.
btw read my post above, regarding the gerrymandering reapportionment of districts.
I'd switch monstr with someone from d5
i think he's town
i don't have >thin town reads on anyone in d5
Done now but could be considered for later/next round.
Rest of your leans, and thoughts on top scum please.
Your vote combination plus D3 start and read of your ISO considering hunting effort over relaxed toan has you moving down for me. Ie you sound chill, but apart from push at Visor/Zack, defending yourself and then backing off giving them VV leans, I don't see you pushing/eager to solve. I also read in one of your ISOs a comment where you mention playing bold D1 is a good thing for scum, so you having that view/being aware of it and your Sooh/Visor start here now make me go :| rather than 'scum wouldn't do THAT!'
District 1 is the crucial disagreement. Those people should be spread out. Put Renata to govern them.
How do you govern them if you spread them out?
Way I see it, spreading them out makes it easier for them to influence more lynch candidates, putting a Towny in with the biggest bunch of them likely just wastes the Towny's vote.
I considered adding Renata/I there but decided it would be better to replace with another scummy so that the next District over/Leftover ?scummland has a better chance of Townier balance.
Fixed (pseudoedit).
Districts must have minimum 3 members. So immediately after your scenario Districts would need to be redrawn/that imbalance could be avoided.
And I KNOW you're always scummy in tone etc.
Not going to let that alone wash for a continued excuse of poor Town/anti Town play though. Lenience for that is pretty much up.
Reality is your ISO is still entirely fluff or hinging on the 'I'm scummy' meta and though there are hints you may be working more than you show, you haven't actually come through with the/any goods and I think there is possibly a difference between that, which was your scumStyle in Snake Cult, and Rappers where you were Town and got more widely involved.
El Barto
12-26-2016, 02:44
Districts must have minimum 3 members. So immediately after your scenario Districts would need to be redrawn/that imbalance could be avoided.
Fine by me if you can keep it under control.
And I KNOW you're always scummy in tone etc.
Not going to let that alone wash for a continued excuse of poor Town/anti Town play though. Lenience for that is pretty much up.
Reality is your ISO is still entirely fluff or hinging on the 'I'm scummy' meta and though there are hints you may be working more than you show, you haven't actually come through with the/any goods and I think there is possibly a difference between that, which was your scumStyle in Snake Cult, and Rappers where you were Town and got more widely involved.
Rappers… wasn't that atpg's game where we had 2k posts on D1 and he gave us a weeklong phase of fluff which I never bothered to read? If you want to compare with that I'm town. >_<
So, what do you want me to do? Tomorrow I should be out of the post-Christmas daze by tomorrow at around this same time and I should be in time to post, thanks to atpg's great decision to extend the phase (still not gonna be around for EoD as IRL that's a very bad time of day).
There are roughly 48 hours remaining, minus one half hour.
Renata, Monstrbro - I will be on days off/should be able to be around to Rep/change my vote to the majority for our District towards EoD.
Happy to let one of you Rep if you can do the same - what will your movements be in last couple of hours of EoD?
Oh and the districts are out. D1 doesn't look ideal which I guess is the point, but wouldn't it have been better to have spread out all the people who seem scummy?
Anyway, Vote: Schema for being the towniest + not a lurker. I like their progression on D1, generally get a towny vibe from their posts.
What particularly do you like about the progression D1?Schema pushed and voted a now-confirmed Towny.
Why trust this over knowing your own alignment? You don't seem the lurker type either, so far.
Gun to head, who are your top choices for lynch right now?
And just ftr D3 Schema's jumps on Zack's 'Cass could be scum' consideration are making my skin crawl. Need to go back and look at *what happened with GH progression and if reasons were given for shifting to Cuth.
I'm leaning towards anyone from Cuth/Barto/Schema /District 1 aorn, *need a closer look at you and Riedquat.
Fine by me if you can keep it under control.
Rappers… wasn't that atpg's game where we had 2k posts on D1 and he gave us a weeklong phase of fluff which I never bothered to read? If you want to compare with that I'm town. >_<
So, what do you want me to do? Tomorrow I should be out of the post-Christmas daze by tomorrow at around this same time and I should be in time to post, thanks to atpg's great decision to extend the phase (still not gonna be around for EoD as IRL that's a very bad time of day).
Promises, Promises... but good.
If you're Town I want you to use the time you have to hunt and clear yourself through action rather than self defense. Go ahead and continue what you're doing if you're Scum :p
The context of Rappers is much like here imo. I disagree you're more Towny here so far. Iirc you started same as both here and Snake cult, but picked up your game and branched out after the beginning phase in Rappers to a point where it was plausible you were Town.
My debate with you is the same discussion we've had ?there/before. If you're Town, drop the 'I'm always scummy'/random talk and a)focus on finding/pushing/hunting wolves; b)give your alignment-related opinions/reasons on the play of other players - form opinions and make them known more than you focus on self pres. Until that happens in a way that furthers/is relatable to Town agenda you stay scum-lean/WTL for me.
El Barto Monstrbro Renata
Also need to know your top WTL for D3
See previous posts for mine.
For now COLOR=Blue]Vote: Cass[/COLOR] though happy to change to Towny/Deepwolf there if are no strong disagreements on reads/leans and a) you want it b) can be around at EoD to represent the popular vote.
Let's catch some wooooolves!
Lame.
Vote: Cass
Also gonna appreciate the longer phase to recover and holidays. Will pop in tonight when fam goes to bed, but won't be on all night.
Riedquat
12-26-2016, 04:33
Oh... my... :( This district sucks!!!
Vote: Riedquat because I do not trust anybody else in the district!
Monstrdude
12-26-2016, 05:12
El Barto Monstrbro Renata
Also need to know your top WTL for D3
See previous posts for mine.
For now COLOR=Blue]Vote: Cass[/COLOR] though happy to change to Towny/Deepwolf there if are no strong disagreements on reads/leans and a) you want it b) can be around at EoD to represent the popular vote.
Let's catch some wooooolves!
Aorn anyone who's not my villagers
But it will be narrowed down eventually
I'm stuck in perpetual Christmas right now
dicetosser1
12-26-2016, 09:49
"Every player votes in their own district as if it is a direct lynch."
FTR I think this managing this properly is really important to Town.
Making individual votes count by being truly representative of democracy vs. dissent has the twofold benefit of playing to collective rather than individual Town power (more heads are better than three, or one) and making scum votes more accountable to trace.
I propose District Reps lead this by
Voting Twice.
First to kick off the preliminary lynch.
Second to represent the view of their District/Mini-Town.
I further propose that those who elect the winning representative vote with them as a consolidated core, leaving those outside the core to vote where they like and justify their dissent.
the problem with this is you take away all responsibility for their vote.
Vote: Cuthilius
Visor, do you want to be Rep, or can I be Rep? If you're Rep today I want to be Rep tomorrow.
Don't like this at all. Scum setting up to get power while trying not to look like it
My apologies to the game and pizza. Ive been crook as a dog and unable to focus enuff to play. Again my apologies. im many pages behind but will see what I can do about catch up
dicetosser1
12-26-2016, 09:52
vote Dice wont change. I KNOW im town I don't know that about the other two
vote Montmorency may change pending reread
Renata, Monstrbro - I will be on days off/should be able to be around to Rep/change my vote to the majority for our District towards EoD.
Happy to let one of you Rep if you can do the same - what will your movements be in last couple of hours of EoD?
I will probably be here.
vote: Renata
El Barto Monstrbro Renata
Also need to know your top WTL for D3
See previous posts for mine.
For now COLOR=Blue]Vote: Cass[/COLOR] though happy to change to Towny/Deepwolf there if are no strong disagreements on reads/leans and a) you want it b) can be around at EoD to represent the popular vote.
Let's catch some wooooolves!
I think Cuth needs to die today. Visor's right that he's not solving.
If Cuth is town, lynch El Barto. If Cuth is wolf, lynch him too, I don't know.
I have significant paranoia about Zack right now, but I hope it can wait.
Championing? Entertaining, nothing more. My priority is making sure that whoever replaces dp is town. I'm a little paranoid that he got killed as a confirmed townie and that a wolf is going to try to take that power. I hope Cass doesn't redistrict.
This statement bothers me.
The other issue I'd like to see addressed is Schema's popin at SOD and EOD and ignoring the entire middle. She shows up at SOD has her little spiel, goes away and then comes back at EoD and has another little spiel. I'm finding it harder and harder to let that keep going.
Ha! Great minds eh? :laugh4:
:p
I had made note of one more post asking me questions that I wanted to respond to, but heck if I can find it now.
What particularly do you like about the progression D1?Schema pushed and voted a now-confirmed Towny.
Why trust this over knowing your own alignment? You don't seem the lurker type either, so far.
Gun to head, who are your top choices for lynch right now?
And just ftr D3 Schema's jumps on Zack's 'Cass could be scum' consideration are making my skin crawl. Need to go back and look at *what happened with GH progression and if reasons were given for shifting to Cuth.
I'm leaning towards anyone from Cuth/Barto/Schema /District 1 aorn, *need a closer look at you and Riedquat.
If I was playing D1 I would have pushed Sooh too, at least until the PR claim (and IIRC Schema backed off at that point). APart from that I thought Schema did pretty well explaining her reasoning for her reads. And of course I'd like to be the rep, but I don't forsee getting elected. SOmebody has to vote for another person.
Top lynch choice right now is Cuthillius. El Barto maybe, but I think he can wait for later and he is less suspicious if Cuth is a wolf. I still haven't gotten around to doing the D2 reread like I was planning, need to ISO Riedquat and Schema too and compare them.
ok well the riedquat ISO didn't take long at all. Not a fan of the self-effacing tone, but points for being clear and direct I guess. I could be persuaded to elect him. Riedquat who would you lynch if you had your way?
Who are your top villagers and wolves, fenn?
atheotes
12-26-2016, 16:34
vote Dice wont change. I KNOW im town I don't know that about the other two
vote Montmorency may change pending reread
What is your take on Cuth & El Barto?
Montmorency
12-26-2016, 16:39
Vote: Visor
How do you govern them if you spread them out?
Way I see it, spreading them out makes it easier for them to influence more lynch candidates, putting a Towny in with the biggest bunch of them likely just wastes the Towny's vote.
I considered adding Renata/I there but decided it would be better to replace with another scummy so that the next District over/Leftover ?scummland has a better chance of Townier balance.
I think that's wrong in the first place, unless you expect 2 or more of District 1 to be scum. But that's not even the thrust of my argument, which is that there is a select group of acceptable candidates and only people from that group should be getting elected by your grace. At the very least, if you think a given district is scummy, then put someone like Renata or yourself over them because they'll have no excuses not to elect you. Your justification for grouping your scum leans (or whatever those guys are) was to avoid their gaining power, but if you are correct in your reads then giving them power is precisely what you accomplish by giving them a district. As for gaining information from votes, there are plenty of good Rep candidates - Winston, Monstr, Visor, Zack - whom we need such information on. Fenn or Riedquat as Rep over one of those is clearly suboptimal.
By the way, your vote was invalid.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Due5R99GmYE
Don't like this at all. Scum setting up to get power while trying not to look like it
:laugh4::laugh4::laugh4:
How's that, then? I demand an explanation. Frivolous sussing is out of vogue atp.
Riedquat
12-26-2016, 16:55
ok well the riedquat ISO didn't take long at all. Not a fan of the self-effacing tone, but points for being clear and direct I guess. I could be persuaded to elect him. Riedquat who would you lynch if you had your way?
Vote: Cuth to start with, later the rest of our district, as I said yesterday to me zack and Barto are town, so I prefer any of us before any of those, Bsmith perhaps after Barto...
Honestly I would be a terrible rep but at least I know I'm townie ;)
Riedquat
12-26-2016, 17:01
I think that's wrong in the first place, unless you expect 2 or more of District 1 to be scum. But that's not even the thrust of my argument, which is that there is a select group of acceptable candidates and only people from that group should be getting elected by your grace. At the very least, if you think a given district is scummy, then put someone like Renata or yourself over them because they'll have no excuses not to elect you. Your justification for grouping your scum leans (or whatever those guys are) was to avoid their gaining power, but if you are correct in your reads then giving them power is precisely what you accomplish by giving them a district. As for gaining information from votes, there are plenty of good Rep candidates - Winston, Monstr, Visor, Zack - whom we need such information on. Fenn or Riedquat as Rep over one of those is clearly suboptimal.
I strongly agree with this, but now is to late to do something about it. Suboptimal...lol
Montmorency
12-26-2016, 17:04
Cass_
Regarding Barto btw, I don't think Barto is playing like in Snake Cult, where he seemed much more direct and engaged. If you'll recall, having read it, I found him scummy from the beginning and tunneled him until LYLO, at which point I saw something alarming in GH and pushed his lynch, at which point Town lost.
Riedquat
12-26-2016, 17:06
Vote: Cuth to start with, later the rest of our district, as I said yesterday to me zack and Barto are town, so I prefer any of us before any of those, Bsmith perhaps after Barto...
Honestly I would be a terrible rep but at least I know I'm townie ;)
I meant after Cuth, not Barto... scummy me! :P
Cass_
Regarding Barto btw, I don't think Barto is playing like in Snake Cult, where he seemed much more direct and engaged. If you'll recall, having read it, I found him scummy from the beginning and tunneled him until LYLO, at which point I saw something alarming in GH and pushed his lynch, at which point Town lost.
What does this mean, for those of us who haven't been following along? He was scum there and more direct and engaged?
How do you feel his play is this game compares to his play in Visor's?
atheotes
12-26-2016, 17:21
Well, this game he hasnt showed any intent to solve.
Right now, i find it very difficult to look past El barto and Cuth.
Riedquat's reminding me of town-Riedquat from last game. Not that that's a particularly high bar to clear, but :shrug:.
Montmorency
12-26-2016, 17:27
What does this mean, for those of us who haven't been following along? He was scum there and more direct and engaged?
How do you feel his play is this game compares to his play in Visor's?
The closest to Bart last game here is dicetosser.
Bart is dissimilar from last game in activity and intensity (so far), but the difference in content (i.e. single-issue voting, commenting to distraction) may be more driven by his specific strategy vis-a-vis Pizza-partner, so that may come out null. More or less as I said before, nothing towny but not really scummy atp.
Scenarios for that could be one scum partner under heavy criticism or engagement, with the rest UTR. It begs more data, surely.
I think dicetosser's got a bit more that says town than El Barto ever did.
Cuthillius
12-26-2016, 18:08
BSmith. Sorry about quoting all of his posts but they're few enough for 'em to be of significance.
Ugh. I was offline this weekend. Doing my best to get caught up... but 30 pages already ?!
Please tell me they are all worth reading.
Just in case..
Vote: Winston
Vote: Visor
Vote: Al Sips
I have read absolutely nothing of the game so far, so take the above with a massive grain of salt…
Not sure my expectations have risen with this statement... :laugh4:
yeah, not keeping up today at all. :shame:
I will give unvote; vote: Visor a chance to test the double vote claim. (at least I think that is still a thing?)
Above is just [people are posting a lot, i can't]
Not gonna lie. This game is taxing my ability to keep up. Sad thing is that I am probably spending more RL time on this game than one I am able to participate in more. I don’t like posting without being caught up on the thread, and just getting caught up is taking more time than I have in a day.
Anyway, no more excuses.
I’m fine with either Visor or vote: Winston for our rep. Renata, DP and Cass all obvious town at this point (or at least clear enough to focus elsewhere). Town lean on Visor and Winston, mainly based on tone and what I would expect from them. Note that they are good at looking town, so not ready to go all in on that assessment. Csargo and Al I can’t really get on too much as I am in the exact same boat wrt to keeping up. Reid has I think one post, so basically null, but I would have expected at least some more “I can’t keep up” types of posts if that was indeed the case.
I agree that the vote: Cuth transition on the Sooh case is odd.
El Barto and Zack aren’t really being helpful at this point, Barto mainly being his normal self, and Zack started helpful but Zack’s mood seems to have gotten in his way. Monty is making some good cases. Many other new names here that I just don’t have a lot of history on.
I thought about this one for a bit. Yes, it's consensus'y for the most part, but I have a very hard time finding any sort of scum alignment in it. I agree with what it says about Barto and Zack. Disagree on the quality of Monty's cases, but that's nothing new and I get what he's trying to say.
Basically, unless somehow he's teamed with a deep wolf and has 0 agendas to advance whatsoever, I don't see this coming from scum.
I actually understand his point is what I was trying to get at. Usually that is not so easy. I can see his logic.
That said the case on Cuth resonates with me more.
mild solvy attitude and i do think it feels genuine
Mildly confident on town here, actually.
Cuthillius
12-26-2016, 18:14
csargo
Vote: Montmorency
Vote: Winston Hughes
Vote: Sooh
was on page 5 for me
unvote, Vote: Cass_
and then switches to cass, allegedly to prevent zack/visor chancellor
I would probably post more if it was possible for me to keep up with this game, and not have to spend most of my time reading the thread. I feel like a thousand posts is a lot for day 1.
I thought they were town enough in my opinion for day one. I was going to vote BSmith, but he hadn't shown up yet.
Same reason as above, and to avoid a Zack/Visor Chancellor. Mostly the latter though if I'm honest...
Why haven't you voted at all? The deadline is soon, so you probably should. Just saying.
I'm not going back to find it, but Visor doesn't strike me as scummy compared to the other times I've played with Visor. Most cases at this point are feelers in the dark really...
I'd just prefer them not to be Chancellor is all, both seem to be town to me from previous experiences with them.
It's early on in the game, so I'm just winging it really.
Here have this Vote:Winston He seems alright...
I'm not even going to bother voting to lynch someone, because that seems pointless. The shear volume of posting would make that irresponsible of me anyways. i.e. I can't keep up.
not really much to comment on
this is really easy content
and could be anything
next: fenn
Cuthillius
12-26-2016, 18:20
Hey everyone. I somewhat followed D2 but will need to reread at some point.
Dp101 was almost 100% confirmed town given his D1 voting (and good posts besides), whereas Zack could conceivably be scum. That's reason enough to do away with Dp. Similar reason could apply for lynching GH (+ he was a less controversial candidate than Zack), but that's getting into WIFOM territory and I'm not convinced that Cass is a wolf.
FWIW Cuthillius seems more scummy than El Barto to me despite EB's D2 weird talk about voting.
His switch from wolf-reading to town-reading Jabbz on EoD1, plus apparently trying to avoid having Choxorn on the lynch block which looked bad in light of the mafia flip, and his response to D2 pressure sounded wolfy to me. I need to ISO him tomorrow and see if that impression is accurate.
cliffs: no i did not
1)He has not ISOd me
2)Both of those points are completely invalid and yet he's still been in a Cuth Tunnel this game
Fenn
i'd like you to do that ISO
This one is touchier because he has been more or less focused on me, which does change my perspective. That said it gets a scum lean from me simply for not seeming to care about why his primary target gets lynched as long as they do, and not really seeming to try to find town.
That said, I thought the bit with riedquat where he said "i don't really have a lean but points for being clear and rational and i could be convinced to elect him" was a little bit towny.
Montmorency
12-26-2016, 18:25
Interesting theory: Bart-Monstr. Monstr townread Bart early D2 and hasn't addressed him or on him since then according to my records. Bart spent late D1 and early D2 scum-reading Monstr with a few sentences and minimal reasoning. By last game's standards, this could be indicative. Or at least, if you are one to scumread Bart here then you have to seriously consider the possibility of Monstr being his partner.
Only other substantive activity from Bart (on D2) was questions on hard-clear townies; OMGUS policy-vote and mutual-unvote game with Winston, Zack (threat and suss apropos of nothing), and dicetosser; interpret criticism from Renata as accusation of Bart-dicetosser team; question me on sus "Why specifically Csargo [Fenn]?";
Other stuff for accountability:
*Assume 5 start scum
*If Cuth town, Visor back on agenda, Schema townier
*If Cuth scum, revisit Al Sips, Jabbz - distortion on Zack?
*Someone said Cuth flips scum clears Barto - who? Cuth for his part scumleaned Bart D2 (along with GH and Zack)
*Winston looks better?
*Damaging to Monstr for early Cuth scum read, since then townread Cuth? Both Cuth and Monstr insist lynch low-posters first? Cuth reads Monstr town.
*People I would lynch before Barto if Cuth is scum: Schema, Fenn,
*If Cuth is not scum: Fenn, Winston
Montmorency
12-26-2016, 18:26
double post
Cuthillius
12-26-2016, 18:28
Al.
From town to scum:
Cass_
Renata
Dp101
atheotes
dicetosser1
Jabbz
Visor
Monstrbro
Zack
Winston
BSmith
CSargo
Riedquat
Monty
GH
El Barto
Schema
Cuthillius
Need to ISO the last group to make up my mind.
again, you haven't ISO'd anything
Al Sipsclar
Similar to Fenn, says will/wants to do stuff that he does not. "Needs to figure stuff out by ISOing", but usually just makes up mind some other way.
Maybe 5% lean towards scum. I have no strong feelings on him.
Cuthillius
12-26-2016, 18:30
My contributions? Whaaaat?? Are you all already drunk? I've not contributed anything except a few opinions here and there, I did the bare minimum to not get wogged... and lets say it, I'm scummy as heck! :stare:
And Vote: GH for the hell of it!
I also don't have much on Riedquat, but I think this is slightly scummy? Maybe.
I mean, his posting comes across as disengaged town, but that really isn't very hard to fake.
Cuthillius
12-26-2016, 18:32
red wanna bet?? I was part of a 4 man scum team and my teammate Zander bussed the living hell out of our other teammate lenlo. D1`. Like EXTREME bussing. Dont EVER say never.
and how can you POSSIBLY have them at 99.9%? seriously. They are either 100 % cause of clearing night actions or they are at best like 75%? The only people who can claim that level of confidence on a bunch of people is a) the cop who cleared them b) someone who REALLY knows how to read them like 100 % of the time or c) scum. Are you a or B?
And dont think i didnt notice you trying to squirrel away from this convo with that whole Im not covering this again thing. I will just keep bringing it up and pounding away at you.
Im leaning town. There are differences between his scum game and town game but for me they are mainly tone and behaviour things.
Vote El Barto
dice has a very pure confident aggressive towny feel
i'm giving him a reasonable town lean
Cuthillius
12-26-2016, 18:39
If I'm lynched and flip scum then my entire rationale completely falls apart.
lol
anyway
gh is still my top scum
for example, the last (only?) time he posted a readlist, he explained that it was not his, but rather consensus, which ???
i fail to see how that's exactly important or helpful for town
apart from that there's a lot of commentary and talking about how many posts there are and very little solving of any sort, even though he has over 50 posts
vote: generalhankerchief
since i haven't gotten around to that today
Cuthillius
12-26-2016, 18:43
Errrrrrrrr wtf
i told you i would
no complaining :P
Cuth I want you to iso gh and shoe me how he is scum
Montmorency
12-26-2016, 18:46
GH was lynched yesterday.
No points toward derpclear. :thumbsdown:
Cuthillius
12-26-2016, 18:46
I do think El Barto is a bit towny
I feel the way in which the thread is consensusing against him
in particular
and the way people talk about him
i personally get the sense the scum team is sitting back and enjoying the ride because everyone's going to talk about me and el barto until we're dead unless something changes
apart from that i can't really say how i feel about his posts
in a vacuum i'd say the tone is maybe sliightly towny
but there are some meh posts
Cuthillius
12-26-2016, 18:47
GH was lynched yesterday.
No points toward derpclear. :thumbsdown:
...
ah right
Montmorency
12-26-2016, 18:47
We must interpret Cuth's latest as running interference in face of impending lynch.
Cuthillius
12-26-2016, 18:48
I do think El Barto is a bit towny
I feel the way in which the thread is consensusing against him
in particular
and the way people talk about him
i personally get the sense the scum team is sitting back and enjoying the ride because everyone's going to talk about me and el barto until we're dead unless something changes
apart from that i can't really say how i feel about his posts
in a vacuum i'd say the tone is maybe sliightly towny
but there are some meh posts
as i was writing this i was thinking and was like "hey gh really hasn't posted much today has he"
lolme
Ffs Monty I wanted to see if it was genuine
Cuthillius
12-26-2016, 18:49
We must interpret Cuth's latest as running interference in face of impending lynch.
i was starting to type out an angry and annoyed response to that
but i realized i don't care (that much)
so whatever
Cuth coming in here pushing gh
A g e n d a
Also lolderpclears, you deserve to die on that alone
Cuthillius
12-26-2016, 18:49
i told you i would
no complaining :P
i told you i'd vote the dead guy
in scumchat amiright
lol
anyway
gh is still my top scum
for example, the last (only?) time he posted a readlist, he explained that it was not his, but rather consensus, which ???
i fail to see how that's exactly important or helpful for town
apart from that there's a lot of commentary and talking about how many posts there are and very little solving of any sort, even though he has over 50 posts
vote: generalhankerchief
since i haven't gotten around to that today
This is a blatant misconstruction of his post anyway
Goodbye cuth
Cuthillius
12-26-2016, 18:52
woah ath has 64 posts
hmm
his posts read genuinely to me
i would put it as a solid town if it didn't concern me a little
i don't remember playing with him when he was scum
the fact that he's been posting so much more than typically weirds me out
but a townread on tone things
stuff like this
"I was a little suspicious of Renata. But once i saw her response to Choxorn's post, it was a mindmeld which made me change my read on her. So yes, i thought Choxorn was wolfy. "
Cuthillius
12-26-2016, 18:55
i think schema's fairly towny
she has hedged quite a lot the last two days
but i did like her posts d1
and there's nothing that's stood out to me as overly scummish
also Schema
you said you'd iso your district
(lol for some reason people like to say that)
(also to be completely fair i did say it and didn't get around to it for ~2 days)
(so hypocrite blah blah blah)
mild town for now
Montmorency
12-26-2016, 18:55
Ffs Monty I wanted to see if it was genuine
Well, if the shoe fits...
Cuth I want you to iso gh and shoe me how he is scum
JNRR
Interesting theory: Bart-Monstr. Monstr townread Bart early D2 and hasn't addressed him or on him since then according to my records. Bart spent late D1 and early D2 scum-reading Monstr with a few sentences and minimal reasoning. By last game's standards, this could be indicative. Or at least, if you are one to scumread Bart here then you have to seriously consider the possibility of Monstr being his partner.
Only other substantive activity from Bart (on D2) was questions on hard-clear townies; OMGUS policy-vote and mutual-unvote game with Winston, Zack (threat and suss apropos of nothing), and dicetosser; interpret criticism from Renata as accusation of Bart-dicetosser team; question me on sus "Why specifically Csargo [Fenn]?";
Other stuff for accountability:
*Assume 5 start scum
*If Cuth town, Visor back on agenda, Schema townier
*If Cuth scum, revisit Al Sips, Jabbz - distortion on Zack?
*Someone said Cuth flips scum clears Barto - who? Cuth for his part scumleaned Bart D2 (along with GH and Zack)
*Winston looks better?
*Damaging to Monstr for early Cuth scum read, since then townread Cuth? Both Cuth and Monstr insist lynch low-posters first? Cuth reads Monstr town.
*People I would lynch before Barto if Cuth is scum: Schema, Fenn,
*If Cuth is not scum: Fenn, Winston
Start off with theory Bart-Monstr, work your way to naming several people you'd vote before Barto. Why does nobody want to bury El Barto this game?
Montmorency
12-26-2016, 18:58
Start off with theory Bart-Monstr, work your way to naming several people you'd vote before Barto. Why does nobody want to bury El Barto this game?
I don't agree with the theory, I brought it up because it's something that Barto scumreaders need to come to grips with. IMO.
Why does nobody want to bury El Barto this game?
Holy disingenuous.
Cuthillius
12-26-2016, 18:58
winston comes across very purely to me
i worry a little bit about the zack push
and how long he went after it
but since i do see the points he made being viable
and meh
p sure he's town
Cuthillius
12-26-2016, 18:59
cass is town, next
lol
anyway
gh is still my top scum
for example, the last (only?) time he posted a readlist, he explained that it was not his, but rather consensus, which ???
i fail to see how that's exactly important or helpful for town
apart from that there's a lot of commentary and talking about how many posts there are and very little solving of any sort, even though he has over 50 posts
vote: generalhankerchief
since i haven't gotten around to that today
Oh for fuck's sake. This on top of the "I wouldn't post any different if I was town" (or whatever the wording was) post?
Cuthillius
12-26-2016, 19:00
Renata: solving, makes new reads, pretty clearly town
has been prodding people and following up on it
cass is town, next
And you're not keeping up with the thread now while you do all your isos either?
Cuthillius
12-26-2016, 19:01
Oh for fuck's sake. This on top of the "I wouldn't post any different if I was town" (or whatever the wording was) post?
out of curiosity, what in particular did you dislike about the other post?
Cuthillius
12-26-2016, 19:01
And you're not keeping up with the thread now while you do all your isos either?
i am
Montmorency
12-26-2016, 19:02
i am
Why , Cuth, do you need separate posts to townread Renata and Cass?
Most clearly evil thing he's done.
Cuthillius
12-26-2016, 19:06
condensing into one post
-monty if i had to pick a scum out of the >200 posters, he would be it
has said/made a lot of pushes that don't make sense
not been overtly scummy by any means, mind you
but eh
however am still meh on that because he was scum the last two games i played with him
and i think there are tonal differences?
and probably a bit of gambler's fallacy but idk
-visor
tone am faairly confident is town
-zack same, but do have some more concerns
would lynch over visor
-monstr's tone is super pure
his opinions have adjusted in a logical sense
his posts make sense
admittedly he could be pocketing me
but i do think his posting is by far the towniest in thread
I don't agree with the theory, I brought it up because it's something that Barto scumreaders need to come to grips with. IMO.
Holy disingenuous.
No. First Cass not going after him twice, then Zack calling her out on it but still somehow not putting El Barto as his lynch choice (because obv Cuth is the PR or some transparently rationalizing shit), now you putting out a theory of El Barto scum but somehow there's others to vote before him. It's giving me the creeps.
Yeah, I get where you're coming from now I guess, but geez.
out of curiosity, what in particular did you dislike about the other post?
Not even going to answer this. Please be scum.
Cuthillius
12-26-2016, 19:08
anyway
i half regret making this effort already
but i'm going to go do other things with my life
Cuthillius
12-26-2016, 19:10
Not even going to answer this. Please be scum.
...
ok whatever lol
can't say this doesn't annoy me but i did bring it on myself
that said i'm still curious about the connection between me lolsayingthatallmypostsarewhaticandoastownbecauseiamtown and forgetting gh died
Seem to have all these town reads and no scum reads
Lay em out
Montmorency
12-26-2016, 19:18
Seem to have all these town reads and no scum reads
Lay em out
Cuth scumread Fenn on not caring about reasoning for primary lynch target, and not trying to find town; Cuth tiny scum lean on Al Sips; Cuth small scum lean on Riedquat, esp. for post on GH; Cuth has me top scum;
FWIW I think the read on Fenn is not bad.
Cuthillius
12-26-2016, 19:26
cuth
cass
monstr
visor
winston
renata
zack
dicetosser
atheotes
BSmith
schema
riedquat
el barto
monty
al sips
fenn
i just realized i missed jabbz in the iso
gimme a sec
Cuthillius
12-26-2016, 19:27
cuth
cass
monstr
visor
winston
renata
zack
dicetosser
atheotes
BSmith
schema
el barto
monty
riedquat
al sips
fenn
i just realized i missed jabbz in the iso
gimme a sec
misplaced ried
Montmorency
12-26-2016, 19:28
cuth
cass
monstr
visor
winston
renata
zack
dicetosser
atheotes
BSmith
schema
riedquat
el barto
monty
al sips
fenn
i just realized i missed jabbz in the iso
gimme a sec
Why is Al Sips and Riedquat suddenly at the bottom? What happened to "5% scum"?
FWIW I think the read on Fenn is not bad.
Yay
Cuthillius
12-26-2016, 19:29
idk about jabbz
a lot of mechanical talk
i'm not sure how much credit to assign to the DP lock town read on him
Jabbz have you played with dp before if so how much
also was out for a while because of the neck thing
null to me
Cuthillius
12-26-2016, 19:30
"Maybe 5% lean towards scum."
@monty this is over rand
not of 100%
Cuthillius
12-26-2016, 19:32
vote:schema
vote:fenn
Montmorency
12-26-2016, 19:35
"Maybe 5% lean towards scum."
@monty this is over rand
not of 100%
So you mean he's close to null? That's what I'm pointing out.
Monstrdude
12-26-2016, 19:46
Start off with theory Bart-Monstr, work your way to naming several people you'd vote before Barto. Why does nobody want to bury El Barto this game?
Barto's one post a while back makes me almost want to bury him
I'm gonna quote the post and give 75k town points to anyone who tells me why
Monstrdude
12-26-2016, 19:47
I'm not even sure why the hell I continue to bother to read your posts.
vote: Monstrbro
What specifically about this post makes me want to murder El barto?
Answer this and become the clearest villager in the thread
Fail to and I'll answer for you
Monstrdude
12-26-2016, 19:48
What specifically about this post makes me want to murder El barto?
Answer this and become the clearest villager in the thread
Fail to and I'll answer for you
Whoops that's not the quote
Monstrdude
12-26-2016, 19:48
Freaking x-posts.
If yu want to convey that I'm a villager then say so. Stop to think before posting random segments of your internal monologue. Your posts are hard to read.
This one
Monstrdude
12-26-2016, 19:49
I'll give you a hint
It has to do with the words he used
Monstrdude
12-26-2016, 19:51
I reread not the whole thread but like half of d1 and I didn't change my mind on anyone except I was fully expecting to scumread Winston because I was sure I had to be correct somewhere and when I picked out his ISO I actually found him pretty villagery except for the two posts I pointed out ages ago, so he's probably a villager
I feel like the villagers are being really obvious this game
Monstrdude
12-26-2016, 19:54
idk about jabbz
a lot of mechanical talk
i'm not sure how much credit to assign to the DP lock town read on him
Jabbz have you played with dp before if so how much
also was out for a while because of the neck thing
null to me
He and Zack are never on a team and I have a tinfoil one of them might be scum but otherwise I agree with this assessment
I also still think Cuth is a villager
Monstrdude
12-26-2016, 19:57
I am wiped from the holiday I was in perpetual Christmas from 9 am to 1:30 in the morning pretty much non stop and I had only slept four hours the night before
I'll be around but i need a break
See you guys in a while
Cuthillius
12-26-2016, 19:58
So you mean he's close to null? That's what I'm pointing out.
yes
Cuthillius
12-26-2016, 19:58
This one
getting people to make more posts that townread him?
Monstrdude
12-26-2016, 19:59
getting people to make more posts that townread him?
Partially but no, there's two specific words that set off my alarms
Monstrdude
12-26-2016, 20:01
Oh also fun fact Barto and Winston are an unlikely scumteam (but not impossible!) Because of the massive amount of "kill each other" that comes from both the slots
I mean yeah bussing but at first glance it looks really good for one if the other flips w
Monstrdude
12-26-2016, 20:04
Oh also fun fact Barto and Winston are an unlikely scumteam (but not impossible!) Because of the massive amount of "kill each other" that comes from both the slots
I mean yeah bussing but at first glance it looks really good for one if the other flips w
I kinda wish Barto had flipped yesterday because I sort of agreed with him needing to die by EoD yesterday
I had him as a villager for his post about how he wasn't sure what specifically about me pinged him (I touched on this earlier) because it struck me as a strange way to approach my slot for a wolf given that it was pretty non-committal and by that point I kind of thought I wasn't being the purest I've ever been in my life
Him responding to me saying he was a villager by omgus voting me is top 5 weirdest things I have experienced in a thread
Montmorency
12-26-2016, 20:07
yes
So why did you put him lower in the corrected post?
Cuthillius
12-26-2016, 20:10
Partially but no, there's two specific words that set off my alarms
mm
not seeing it
i can make guesses but meh
Cuthillius
12-26-2016, 20:10
So why did you put him lower in the corrected post?
because i remembered that i still read him >rand scum?
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