Capo de Tutti Capi - II [Concluded] [Archive] - Page 3

Pannonian

02-07-2008, 11:13

Oh, Pannonian, you posted my last letter to you!

Everyone, everyone, read them both, and notice how he is answering questions in his, 'reply', post, I didn't ask in the post he gave.

That is because he posted here a PM answering a far earlier post, when Pevergreen started questioning me out of the blue.

I think I'm going to have my coffin made of gyprock, so everyone can see how cheaply I was treated. Ha!
You do know that you can grab the PMs from your sentbox and inbox? Short of posting the entire lengthy PM exchange, you said that I didn't answer your point concerning my connections to pevergreen, so I posted my PM stating my connections (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1825905&postcount=466) to him. You then said (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1825907&postcount=467) there was a PM following this, so I posted that (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1825918&postcount=475) as well, adding at the end the explanation for why I didn't want w&f to kill pevergreen. Capo 1 players will remember that rationale, but I added my explanation, which you don't seem to have noticed, to clarify things further.

Is there anything else you'd like explained?

CountArach

02-07-2008, 11:13

How can you be so sure about that?

Wasn't there a certain Sasaki Kojiro who had a special role (Wolf? Some sort of rogue detective) in CDTC I and whose role pm mentioned the identity of the Mafia Dons?

:inquisitive:
In that case Sasaki knew the identity of all of the Dons, so if Drisos has a similar thing to that, then why single out Sigurd?

Andres

02-07-2008, 11:14

In that case Sasaki knew the identity of all of the Dons, so if Drisos has a similar thing to that, then why single out Sigurd?

Because this is CDTC II and not CDTC I ?

CountArach

02-07-2008, 11:16

Because this is CDTC II and not CDTC I ?
Fair enough, but what could Drisos possibly get out of letting the town know? Chances are if he knows who one of the Dons are then he is involved with some rather anti-town people. I don't know if we should trust him. Still I think you may be grasping at straws here, trying to find some hard evidence with which to pin Sigurd.

The Stranger

02-07-2008, 11:17

Gee Stranger, I wrote two pages and you just dribble and spit and type alot of dots?

Good god man, even I'm better at being defensive than you!
Don't forget my last words! I want them recited!
you call that a defense... gee... you are really aweful at defending... :P

you are a good guy... but... that was really all BS... :laugh4:

PershsNhpios

02-07-2008, 11:18

No, Pannonian, you have explained yourself perfectly.

Tell me, what do you think of gyprock?
I was thinking it might be too cheap, and fragile underground.
Unless you are all going to put me on display?

As long as a building is erected where I shall have adequate shelter, and you all pay for the coffin, I consent.

Don't forget my last words! For the sake of the townies don't!

----------------------------

Stranger, do you have a type impediment?
In all your PMs you spoke like a commentator on a movie promotion, but I thought that was you playing the bad guy - however you really are making alot of pauses there!
Don't draw so much attention to yourself, or you'll end up like me!

Then again, it isn't so bad having all this hullabaloo over my bandwagon.

Hop on, why don't you?

Don't forget, Vote: Glenn - Glenn No. 1
Glenn for Day 2 Lynch 1!!

Oh, and don't forget my last words!

pevergreen

02-07-2008, 11:22

Im so close to putting Glenn on ignore. Its just worse than spam.

Im going to have to start a "Players not allowed in my games" list.

Beefy187

02-07-2008, 11:22

No you couldnt, as it would have been in red?
EDIT: Fixed up Beefy's quote tags. They screwed my quote up.
I think too much red revealing and after death is going on.

Sticking to the rules does enhance the fun.

True... ok..

Unvote: Pever Vote: Sarathos

Valid point? No that was a joke almost :laugh4: Now I vote for you. I have a reason to believe that Glenn or Pever is innocent although I have no evidence supporting this statement. How ever I can understand their scuminess. So I will vote for completely diffrent person. And just incase he misunderstands me this vote is a joke.

My reason of defending Glenn is because he tried to be epic by writing up a poem like thingy which I personally thought was welldone. Furthermore I think he is just a little confused townie being framed by others. And for being confirmed innocent I have a feeling that im going to get targeted. If so Ill say good luck to my mafia friends coz they really needs alot of luck to kill me :yes:

Andres

02-07-2008, 11:23

Fair enough, but what could Drisos possibly get out of letting the town know? Chances are if he knows who one of the Dons are then he is involved with some rather anti-town people. I don't know if we should trust him. Still I think you may be grasping at straws here, trying to find some hard evidence with which to pin Sigurd.

I'd like to keep all options open.

You call it grasping at straws, I call it a (non allowed) reveal after death from somebody who's most likely a detective :shrug:

Oh, and we still don't know a) who protected Glenn b) who attacked him.

Jimbob, in your pm to pevergreen you say that no Luca protected Glenn. Can you tell us then, who did protect Glenn last night? Was it you?

PershsNhpios

02-07-2008, 11:29

It could of been a Luca, but I wouldn't of been his Don, but then why would a Luca protect someone ELSE's Don?

Because I've got to be a Don haven't I?

Otherwise we'd all be lynching an innocent here, and golly wobbles that would just be some shame.

Unless everyone who voted for me is Mafia!

But that's about as likely as my role requiring 15 lynch votes before I can reveal and kill every one alive and dead.

Then again.. you never know. 00o0o0o0

Last words! Check them!

pevergreen

02-07-2008, 11:33

PROTIP: Glenn is claiming to be a rogue detective (Investigates and then can kill the investigated) but he claims that he needs 3 people to kill the person.

Andres

02-07-2008, 11:34

Glenn, just reveal your role.

Anything else you say will be ignored or will make you look even more scummy.

Do you know more about Jimbob? Was he the one who protected you?

PershsNhpios

02-07-2008, 11:35

No, I'm claiming my interest in psychotic old cult movies.

It's a jump to the left - and a step to the riiiiiight!

It thought I had revealed my role, Andres?

CountArach

02-07-2008, 11:39

PROTIP: Glenn is claiming to be a rogue detective (Investigates and then can kill the investigated) but he claims that he needs 3 people to kill the person.
Do you have the PM? Glenn, can you post your PM?

PershsNhpios

02-07-2008, 11:43

Of course I can't post my PM Caracticus - you silly man, can you post yours?

I thought I had revealed though?

Put your hands on your hips! Fold your knees in tiiiiiiiiiiight!

CountArach

02-07-2008, 11:45

Alright that's it - I'm giving up reasoning. Let's just lynch him and get it over with.

PershsNhpios

02-07-2008, 11:48

CountArach, you aren't listening. I can't post my PM.

Don't worry, Andres and others, I will only post with full compositions from here in.

Beefy187

02-07-2008, 11:50

Yup.. Sorry Glenn.. I cant support you anymore..

But I used to do that on my early days.. "Sucked in!! Im a townie and you guys lynched me!! HAHAHA!!" :sweatdrop:

Unvote, Vote: Glenn

Good bye my friend

PershsNhpios

02-07-2008, 11:55

Since when I was ever your friend Beefy?
You haven't given me much support in any case, do me a favour and stop tainting my moment of attention - I've worked pretty damn hard for it.

Husar

02-07-2008, 12:08

Unvote: Sigurd
Vote: Glenn

I hope you die* of attention overdose.

*in the game

PershsNhpios

02-07-2008, 12:12

Andres

02-07-2008, 12:16

No, I'm going to die when my neck is broken as I swing from a large rope.

I thought that was well known thus far.

Very quiet in here.. It can't possibly be that I made myself look so guilty that nobody wants to rant and rave about how suspicious I am anymore?

With the amount of votes on you, you're fate already has been decided.

You've had your moment of glory, I hope you enjoyed it ~;)

Now please, allow us to find the other 14 mafiosi.

Husar, tell me, I see you unvoted Sigurd. Are you no longer suspicious of him?

Moros

02-07-2008, 12:38

I haven't slepped this night, but I'm sober (to my own suprise, I've gon,e trough a few pm's and the last pages of this thread)

A few remarks:

Glenn did tell the truth about the protection groups.
The stranger tried to organize two protecting groups as far as I know.
One which was mainly formed with the dutch members of the Tyolt, protecting sigurd. TS suggested him and Louis, who was protected by dutch guy and some other guys. I didn't really thurst everyone, but I tought that protecting one couldn't hurt that much, and tought if we're with four, we would have needed two men not to actually protect. And protecting couldn't hurt town much in anyway.

I guess TS and Glenn look suspicious. But personally I don't think they are mafia or anything. I might be wrong, like with sasaki last time. (Who I trusted and sended my rogue detective role, which he later stole, while him being the wolf.)

Anyway I'm going to abstain voting. TS and Glenn look innocent to me. (They just don't get understood to well, I'm under the impression. Remember TS during the previous CTDT I). Only Pevergreen is somewhat suspicious to me. However I'm not going to vote for him as I'm only somewhat suspicious. And I probably missed out some parts of discussion so.

vote: abstain

PershsNhpios

02-07-2008, 12:38

No, I think he is jealous because he hasn't got as many people quoting his name as I do - that's a nasty reason to kill someone Husar!

I now call upon my role's special powers - the ability, (Hope I don't break the rules Seamus), to undo all votes against me and place them against a player of my choice!

**Bzzzzzzzzzzwwaaaaaaaooooooooopop!**

Ha ha ha, you're going down Pevergreen - your name rhymes with Pevert been!

Husar

02-07-2008, 12:38

Husar, tell me, I see you unvoted Sigurd. Are you no longer suspicious of him?
I am still suspicious of him, same reasons as before.
It's just that Glenn seems to be more annoying judging by all the new posts this morning, most of which I skipped anyway to be blunt.
This could even be a reaction due to him being guilty, hoping for a nice game as mafia which might now be destroyed on day one -> shattered dreams of a teenager in puberty etc, they can be that way then.

edit: Glenn also grabs all the attention, causing most players to ignore other suspicious people which is always a bad idea. But maybe that's his plan, to keep us busy until his mafia buddies have won the game.

sapi

02-07-2008, 13:18

Just a quick note to say that I do exist, but that I'm buried under piles of work with barely enough enthusiasm for it to stay above the surface :grin2:

I'll sit down to the mammoth task of reading hundreds of posts once I've got this stuff out of the way, whenever that is ~;)

Husar

02-07-2008, 13:45

There's no need to read tons of spam, just vote Glenn, he'll die anyway. :dizzy2:

Charge

02-07-2008, 14:28

Dunno was it joke or not about Glenn's ability, but I will vote: abstain anyway. He looks like myself in christmas mafia except I think I did better than that though.. Not sure in his guilt, and too hard to find truth in others statements..

+ that's a LOT of posts for me.. :dizzy2:

Chimpyang

02-07-2008, 14:35

Vote : Abstain

Not going to actively support the bandwagon. But then again, there's not a lot of untoward suspicion towards anyone else either....am gonna wait upon the report of Drisos and any true detective reports that come on offer for now.

Sigurd

02-07-2008, 14:36

Now, tell me, how is that scummy? Drisos revealed after dead. He broke the rules, but Sigurd quoted it, the information is there for all to see. Why would Drisos say that he knows for sure that Sigurd is a Don? What reason would we have not to believe him? Why not tieing Glenn and Sigurd and ask Kommodus to lynch them both? What's wrong with lynching a) somebody who is very likely to be a Don b) a very supsicous player? It saves us time, since we wouldn't have to focus on Sigurd anymore in the next round.

You accuse me of quoting Drisos’ post, yet do it yourself… what should I make of that?

Glenn has been cluttering this thread with his self pity… and some have suggested the reason for this is to drown other relevant clues…
The one I am most interested in is the connection Glenn – JimBob. I think it was pever who posted a lengthy pm exchange between himself and JimBob.
How about JimBob confirms this publicly.

ARE we doing the town a bear service of lynching Glenn? Or could it be Glenn is trying to drown this connection to JimBob?
Answers would be appreciated as there is time enough to change the votes.

Andres

02-07-2008, 14:39

You accuse me of quoting Drisos’ post, yet do it yourself… what should I make of that?

Don't twist my words. I just said that you quoted Drisos' rule breaking post. No more no less. That's not an accusation.

The Stranger

02-07-2008, 14:50

[QUOTE=Glennieboy]INo, Pannonian, you have explained yourself perfectly.

Tell me, what do you think of gyprock?
I was thinking it might be too cheap, and fragile underground.
Unless you are all going to put me on display?

As long as a building is erected where I shall have adequate shelter, and you all pay for the coffin, I consent.

Don't forget my last words! For the sake of the townies don't!

----------------------------

Stranger, do you have a type impediment?
In all your PMs you spoke like a commentator on a movie promotion, but I thought that was you playing the bad guy - however you really are making alot of pauses there!
Don't draw so much attention to yourself, or you'll end up like me!

Then again, it isn't so bad having all this hullabaloo over my bandwagon.

Hop on, why don't you?

Don't forget, Vote: Glenn - Glenn No. 1
Glenn for Day 2 Lynch 1!!

Oh, and don't forget my last words!/QUOTE]

me and not drawing attention... whahahahhaha :laugh4:

The Stranger

02-07-2008, 14:52

Seamus Fermanagh

02-07-2008, 15:09

Looks like it'd be a bit pointless for me to vote at this stage, so:

Vote: Abstain

The thread got away from me a bit; I'll review when I have more time, but for now I'll ask this question in case someone said it and I missed it: has anyone stepped forward to acknowledge protecting Glenn?

Anyway, Glenn: how would you prefer to die? Your options are:

1. Commit seppuku (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Seppuku) and die in an honorable (albeit painful) way.

2. Eat a scrumptious meal, and wash it down with a glass of wine laced with strychnine (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Strychnine).

3. Strapped to a chair along with a block of TNT (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TNT_%28explosive%29). Quickest method I could think of.

The Director may not vote for lynches while serving as director. The Current director may participate in the selection of a new director.

KukriKhan

02-07-2008, 15:31

Glenn 34
The Stranger 32
Sasaki Kojiro 27
Ichigo 26
Andres 21
pevergreen 20
Pannonian 19
Moros 17
Sigurd Fafnesbane 16
Drisos 15
GeneralHankerchief 14
CountArach 14
norwegian nerd 12
Seamus Fermanagh 10
Omanes Alexandrapolites 8
Kagemusha 8
scottishranger 7
Husar 7
KukriKhan 6
Sarathos 6
Zorg 6
Craterus 6
Louis VI the Fat 6
Chimpyang 5
Tiberius of the Drake 5
RoadKill 5
Big King Sanctaphrax 5
woad&fangs 5
TinCow 4
Dutch_guy 4
Twilightblade 4
Myrddraal 4
Rythmic 4
TruePraetorian 4
kamikhaan 4
Brave_Sir_Robin 4
Xdeathfire 3
Xehh II 3
Elite Ferret 3
Joe Monks 3
Charge 3
Hannibalbarc 3
LittleGrizzly 3
Proletariat 3
Kommodus 2
Draco Leman 2
Northnovas 2
Makanyane 2
shlin28 2
Lt. Pinard 2
Crazed Rabbit 2
Tran 2
ajaxfetish 2
Alexander the Pretty Good 2
Xiahou 2
Evil_Maniac From Mars 2
Leet Eriksson 1
johnhughthom 1
Hiji 1
Warmaster Horus 1
gibsonsg91921 1
Motep 1
Caeser The III 1
taka 1
Cowhead418 1
Warluster 1
FactionHeir 1
Beefy187 1
Lord Winter 1
Caius 1

So, about 80 potential posters, about 540 posts made, averages 6.7 posts.

If you haven't made 7 posts yet: you're lagging! :laugh4:

(Full disclosure: This will be my 7th post).

Andres

02-07-2008, 15:42

So, about 80 potential posters, about 540 posts made, averages 6.7 posts.

If you haven't made 7 posts yet: you're lagging! :laugh4:

(Full disclosure: This will be my 7th post).

How about giving us your thoughts about what happened so far in this game in your 8th post?

Do you have any suspects? Some posts that drew your attention? An interesting pm exchange to share? Surely, you must have something more to say than "this thread has almost 540 posts"...

Seamus Fermanagh

02-07-2008, 15:44

Just a few reminders from the host.

1. Keeping a running tally helps. I am doing my own, but the double-check is both useful and appreciated.

2. The voting deadline is 2300 EST tonight, 7 Feb 8, which is equivalent to 0400 GMT. There is a goodly time to vote in this block as we have a lot of players in many time zones and I wanted to give folks time to read, think, post, and vote. More than 12 hours remain. :yes:

All of you "Oxbridge" types will simply have to set the alarm for 3 ack emma, hop online, and zing your votes in at the last second....:cheesy:

Capo will return to a 24 hour cycle fairly soon, but experience suggests that it should not do so yet.

3. ALL players have at least one para of red info on their sheets. Some have more. :deal:

4. I liked the suggestion about posting the "post number" for the info summaries at the top of the piece so that someone can read the summary thread and jump straight to where they wish. :yes: Good idea and so mote it be hereafter. :yes:

5. Reminder to those abstaining. A vote to "abstain" translates as: "go ahead and lynch someone, but I do not wish to choose who gets the chop." If your goal is actually to prevent a lynch, you must vote for "no lynch."

--- Thought for the moment. This is post #537, without sign-up posts or anything, and so far there has been only 1 death.

KukriKhan

02-07-2008, 16:08

How about giving us your thoughts about what happened so far in this game in your 8th post?

Do you have any suspects? Some posts that drew your attention? An interesting pm exchange to share? Surely, you must have something more to say than "this thread has almost 540 posts"...

I did that in my Post #411 (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1825707&postcount=411), analyzing what I thought had happened so far, based mostly on the Seamus' write-ups. I voted for Glenn, suspecting he is a Don, protected by his Luca, and acknowledging pevergreen's 'sort-of' reveal of being a wiseguy. (=suspect #2).

My PM box has been lonely for the past 24 hours. If you subtract Glenn's posts since my #411, there's not a whole lot more going on than idle speculation, IMO.

Myrddraal

02-07-2008, 16:14

Ok, I've been reading through this thread now, and I'm currently on page 14. However, I just saw the number of pages increase, and I don't know if I have time to read the whole thread now (I've been reading for hours!), so I'll give my thoughts as they are atm.

Drisos is killed on night 1, so even if he was the detective, how could he possibly know for sure that Fafnesband and Stranger were guilty? He clearly had a special role, perhaps it was detective, but something doesn't add up.

Glenn has made a lot of claims. His protection does point strongly to a Luca protection. It could be a doctor trying to get promoted though. However, Glenn's attitude suggests that it's not, he's been very defensive, and I think he's a good lynch choice.

I think I believe Pevergreen when he says he's a wiseguy. His attempted doctor creation scheme is backed up by the events. However I think I remember him saying that his protection scheme failed. Nobody was promoted. Therefore something else saved Beefy that night.

However, if pevergreen is a wiseguy, he certainly isn't trying to become a townie. He joined the killing group, which sets him down the road to either joining the mafia, or creating his own family. Perhaps he isn't a priority, but I think he's a good lynch choice, his intentions don't seem to be pro town.

However, apart from Glenn I am most suspicious of The Stranger. He has given no explanation for forming these protection groups, and as soon as he was accused he posted a lot, and all of them defensive posts. I've never seen The Stranger be so consistent in his posting as when he was accused.

Also, as CA pointed out, The Stranger joined two protection groups, but joined neither, what was he doing last night?

So, since Glenn already has loads of votes, Vote:The_Stranger

Sorry I don't have the up-to-date tally, I'm lagging back on page 14. Catch up with you later...

Sigurd

02-07-2008, 16:15

Don't twist my words. I just said that you quoted Drisos' rule breaking post. No more no less. That's not an accusation.

Drisos revealed after dead. He broke the rules, but Sigurd quoted it, the information is there for all to see
I took the bolded part as a disproval of my actions... I must have have been wrong?

Andres

02-07-2008, 16:20

I took the bolded part as a disproval of my actions... I must have have been wrong?

Yes, you were wrong. I meant in as in a constation: Sigurd quoted Drisos' post. It wasn't intended to sound as an accusation.

Husar

02-07-2008, 16:45

My PM box has been lonely for the past 24 hours. If you subtract Glenn's posts since my #411, there's not a whole lot more going on than idle speculation, IMO.
And that's why I say you can skip a whole lot of posts. ~D

Chimpyang

02-07-2008, 16:52

PM also has been pretty lonely of late....the only CDTC posts i've had are recruitment PM's from various sources. Wonder what other stuff is going on in the background?

Moros

02-07-2008, 17:25

Sorry TS! you are correct, you indeed did not choose both.
I guess the amount of pm's confused me. (Looking back I can't remember that we posted so many.)

The Stranger

02-07-2008, 17:31

The Stranger

02-07-2008, 17:38

originally from andres... and the proof it was not my idea to protect sigurd...
it is dutch but there are enough dutch members to translate it... i wont... let them do it... so you will believe it is not lied.

Kommo is director, heeft geen bescherming nodig...

Sigurd Fafnesbane is misschien ook een goeie optie. K zou het graag vandaag nog weten ~;p

Moros

02-07-2008, 17:44

Yeah, I guess I was somehow confused...

You did chose Louis. right?

The Stranger

02-07-2008, 17:45

nope not either

Haudegen

02-07-2008, 17:51

3. ALL players have at least one para of red info on their sheets. Some have more. :deal:

Ok, perhaps JimBob (in the pm quoted by pevergreen) was telling the truth. But I´d like to hear a statement from JimBob himself.

vote: abstain

because it doesn´t make a difference now anyway.

shlin28

02-07-2008, 18:01

300 posts since I last came back online??? This is crazy...

Anyway, it seems to me that with all these Glenn bashing, that everyone has forgot something that someone said about someone on post 13...

https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1823416&postcount=13

Indeed. Rumour has it, Fahad, that you have already been tentatively probing players with the intent of recruiting them.

What say you to this?

Another potential mafia perhaps?

Kommodus

02-07-2008, 18:04

I'd like to get in a ring with any one of you, along with their non-firearm weapon of choice, and mine - my beautiful Swiss Pattern Bayonet.

That wasn't one of your choices. :stare:

I guess I'll have to choose for you. You're getting the strychnine. :skull:

Ferret

02-07-2008, 18:11

Vote:Glenn

why would anyone protect a townie on night one?

(PS if there is anyone who would give me a call, protection for the town can never be a bad thing :clown:)

Pannonian

02-07-2008, 18:26

An "interesting" PM exchange with The Stranger.

PM title: Re: CDTC - alliantie
Presumably he'd been in a conversation with a Dutch-speaking player, leading him to contact me.

:inquisitive: snif... snif... MAFIA??? :inquisitive:

:no:

WTF?

... don't act like you don't know... you are DIRTY!!!!!

Are you drunk? Or is this how you normally play?

both I guess... but that doesn't change the fact that I KNOW U are DIRTY!!!
Bizarre.

Ferret

02-07-2008, 18:31

lol hard to make any decisions on that except not to make any deals with TS in case he is drunk at the time.

GeneralHankerchief

02-07-2008, 18:32

I'm having pretty much the same exchange with him now.

GeneralHankerchief

02-07-2008, 18:45

Unvote: CountArach
Vote: The Stranger

He's fishing for role PMs.

The Stranger

02-07-2008, 18:47

:laugh4: no... im not fishing for role pms... but however... you people are making a big mistake...

GeneralHankerchief

02-07-2008, 18:49

So how do you explain sending the same message out to at least two people?

Sasaki Kojiro

02-07-2008, 18:50

How can you be so sure about that?

Wasn't there a certain Sasaki Kojiro who had a special role (Wolf? Some sort of rogue detective) in CDTC I and whose role pm mentioned the identity of the Mafia Dons?

:inquisitive:

The wolf know the three mafia dons, but he was mafia aligned. There's absolutely no reason to give any townie knowledge of who a mafioso is (unless it's some romeo-juliet thing) because they will just post who it is and get that person lynched.

300 posts since I last came back online??? This is crazy...

Anyway, it seems to me that with all these Glenn bashing, that everyone has forgot something that someone said about someone on post 13...

https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1823416&postcount=13

Another potential mafia perhaps?

Can whoever said this about fahad give their evidence?

Sasaki Kojiro

02-07-2008, 18:51

Unvote: CountArach
Vote: The Stranger

He's fishing for role PMs.

Quote the pm's please.

GeneralHankerchief

02-07-2008, 18:54

Running out of time - this HS period's almost over.

First exchange (he cleared the messages after every one of my replies):

:inquisitive: snif... snif... MAFIA??? :inquisitive:

:no:

Huh?

No, I'm not mafia. :dizzy2:

Second:

No, I'm definitely not.

I know U are... stop lying...

Third:

I slept last night.

Pff... so you are a townie? No... you are NOT... you showed up Criminal... so... stop lying...

My guess is he needs a Wiseguy PM.

The Stranger

02-07-2008, 19:01

i sent it to four...

sasaki got it... he knows...

those with clear concience can still save the town...

The Stranger

02-07-2008, 19:05

Running out of time - this HS period's almost over.

First exchange (he cleared the messages after every one of my replies):

Second:

Third:

My guess is he needs a Wiseguy PM.

I don't need an innocent role pm... ive already got one... my own...

Charge

02-07-2008, 19:16

Pff... so you are a townie? No... you are NOT... you showed up Criminal... so... stop lying...
I guess it was joke wasnt it? :inquisitive:

The Stranger

02-07-2008, 19:18

? how do you mean?

Omanes Alexandrapolites

02-07-2008, 19:24

Gah! I think we should lynch The Stranger just for spamming continuously.

TruePraetorian

02-07-2008, 19:29

Gah! 8 hours asleep and 4-5 pages???

Everyone who is abstaining, please reconsider. We can lynch two or more people at a time with the directors permission.

I'm not asking to hop on a bandwagon; Glenn is already lynched, but look at the gaining suspicion of The Stranger. I can see im not the only one to get a suspicious, or threatening post.

Also, Glenn, stop spamming its rather annoying to see 80% of the posts in the past few pages you talking about "don't forget!" and you giving us your excercise routines...

The Stranger

02-07-2008, 19:35

unvote: vote: Pevergreen

Charge

02-07-2008, 19:35

@ Stranger

was it you who investigated him?

Drisos

02-07-2008, 19:44

@ Stranger

was it you who investigated him?

I don' think so. Perhaps Glenn. That would explain some stuff...

Anyhow I've come to new suspicions... Andres and Pevergreen are pretty damn suspicious. Andres for, among, a special reason - Moros knows, and I'm not allowed to reveal. I still think The_Strange isn't 100% normal townie either, nor is Glenn... yet, I don't think they'd be the wisest choices for lynching.

btw, Sasaki said somewhere that my susicion of a certain don was based only the fact that he was protected? Well, think of it... I was in the protection group, so isn't it logic that I know more than the average player?

+

you all should be getting double or triple lynches! team together slightly more, to win!

Csargo

02-07-2008, 19:53

An "interesting" PM exchange with The Stranger.

PM title: Re: CDTC - alliantie
Presumably he'd been in a conversation with a Dutch-speaking player, leading him to contact me.

Bizarre.

:inquisitive: snif... snif... MAFIA??? :inquisitive:

:no:

Your silly threats won't work on me.

Ichigo

His response.

:laugh4:

JimBob

02-07-2008, 20:09

Pever's posting of the PMs is accurate. There were two minor ones, he asked me to post whatever of the role PM wasn't red, so I sent it to him, and now post it here,

And now it starts to get weird…

Not a joke, this is your:
Everything else is red.

The most suspicious thing is that they are first part of a group, and then JimBob claims that they would like to create a group. I don't know about letting the two of them knowing each other AND giving them special doctoring powers. It seems strange. Perhaps only one of them has a special thing. I am also interested as to what these special powers would do, because as far as I know 3 townies together won't fail.
We did not know each other at the begining. We were given code. Glenn has been broadcasting his code this whole time. I came late and found it. We're still broadcasting to find our third. I can't say much, but our role gives us better odds of surviving attack.

-Seamus wouldn't add a 3 person special role with a critical ability. Also, vigilantes don't save lives.
You sure? He's added some strange stuff before. You're not in Seamus's head so you really can't say what he would or would not do.

In addition to the points already made, if Glenn and jimbob's PMs are entirely in red, how are they to find the last part of the troika? How is one supposed to establish contact if the means of contact is disallowed? I find the claim hard to believe.
We have a signal. It'll sound like nonsense to everyone else.

The "our entire role pm was in red" claim seems like a very poor attempt at a fake reveal. They are lying.

Do we really seem that stupid? If we were lying we'd make something useful up. I realize this seems ridiculous, and it's hard to believe. I just don't have anything else to say, it's the truth.

Jimbob, in your pm to pevergreen you say that no Luca protected Glenn. Can you tell us then, who did protect Glenn last night? Was it you?
I can't (the curse of the red lettering).

ARE we doing the town a bear service of lynching Glenn? Or could it be Glenn is trying to drown this connection to JimBob?
Answers would be appreciated as there is time enough to change the votes.
Glenn's having fun while waiting to be lynched. I can tell you you're doing the town no favor. By lynching him you will only help to crown the mafia. If you choose to lynch Glenn, wait for his post mortem to come back. Then lynch me if he is mafia. I will participate with town protection groups in the intervening nights to assure that I will not kill as a mafia member.

Let the axe fall not on the town but on the necks of the mafia. Let the blade rise up to strike them all down with fury. May they not be crowned lords of Fatlington.

Drisos

02-07-2008, 20:13

Sorry for being such a turn ass - just had an msn conversation.

Remember btw, in two days you'll get your proof that I was really detective... please, draw your conclusions about me after that.

* Lynchees: Sigurd, Andres, Pevergreen. Bad guys.

Glenn is arguable. Very suspicious but might be pro-town.. he'll die now anyway, it's too late.

I think the_stanger is innocent after all.

another edit: let's turn that *ss once again! Glenn is innocent! once again, you'll get your proof of my pro-townness in two days... you can wait the two days. Don't lynch glenn, he is innocent!

Sasaki Kojiro

02-07-2008, 20:20

And now it starts to get weird…

Not a joke, this is your:

I don't find this fragment believable at all. Not Seamus's writing style.

Pannonian

02-07-2008, 20:43

Then let's wait for a couple of days then, to see what Drisos comes out as. I've had my suspicions of pevergreen, from his unwieldy group of 13 to his attempted cultivating of me, to a recent PM asking me what he should do now as everyone has turned against him. It's almost as though he's trying to play on past connections to strike up some kind of partnership. Others may have their own views on him, but those are my interactions with him that I've found suspicious.

Glenn has been behaving in a very lively way, but not exactly behaving consistently as we might expect mafiosi, especially new players, to do. IMHO this is more reminiscent of a noob given a townie role, as per Banquo in M4 (5?), and getting carried away with it. Since jimbob is willing to vouch for him, one way of neutralising him may be to lock both of them into protection groups, who can report on whether or not the actions were successfully carried out during the night. There are other lines to be pursued, that don't quite have the same consequence for the town as they claim, so we might as well do that until Drisos' post-mortem comes up and we can decide on whether or not to lynch Sigurd.

I suggest people take their votes off Glenn, and put it on pever instead as the next best candidate, and moreover one who doesn't have qute the same power role as those two claim. Also, any detectives reading this should investigate them both, and report to someone whom they trust.

Unvote: Beefy
Vote: pevergreen

Can someone post the tallies? It's been a while. Also, when tallies are posted, could you put "CapoTally" before them, so they're easier to search for?

Charge

02-07-2008, 20:45

ok 4 peplz so far claims to be detective .....

not sure if they are or not, until more info comes into play...

but heck.. if he mafioso can lynch him later, if town that would be stupid, so

Unvote: abstain
Vote: pevergreen

Pannonian

02-07-2008, 20:48

ok 4 peplz so far claims to be detective .....

not sure if they are or not, until more info come into play will wait...
If you got the claims via PM, you can always post the investigation results here and wait for the targets to answer for themselves. If the claims were public, could you list them and link to the posts where they made their claims? The only one I'm aware of is Drisos.

Charge

02-07-2008, 21:11

If you got the claims via PM, you can always post the investigation results here and wait for the targets to answer for themselves. If the claims were public, could you list them and link to the posts where they made their claims? The only one I'm aware of is Drisos.
all was through pm, no clear 'investigation results' was claimed so not posting any perhaps wrong accusations.

Also I'm not going to identify even 'false-cops' in thread (to help mafia?)

Waiting for Drisos' official role-revealing too mainly.

shlin28

02-07-2008, 21:14

If you reveal the false detectives, how would it help the mafia? Are you withholding infomation? Cos you are the MAFIA? :inquisitive:

CountArach

02-07-2008, 21:14

I don't find this fragment believable at all. Not Seamus's writing style.
I agree, I think that Seamus would be putting something more into it, and I am not even sure if he would write anything at all, perhaps preferring to keep it within the confines of the red itself.

I am interested in what JimBob means by "broadcasting his signal" - could you expand on this?

A couple of other posts that caught my eye:
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1826277&postcount=546
Can we get someone to translate this?

https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1826407&postcount=567
I agree with TruePraetorian here. We still have over 4 hours by my count, plenty of time to even up the vote. What is the current count? But perhaps most crucially of all is The_Stranger's next post:
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1826409&postcount=568
He gives no reason and this comes the very post after TruePraetorian suggests lynching multiple people. Perhaps TS realises he would be one of the ones whose head is on the line and tries to get someone else down with him. Then again, TS has always been very erratic, so we can't really know.

Crazed Rabbit

02-07-2008, 21:16

Glenn is clearly a don, and Jimbob is either the made or the luca of his mafia. Lynch Glenn today and Jimbob tomorrow - if the other mafias don't kill him off. Is the final member GH?

The Stranger seems scummy. But since he's a big of a threat to the town even when he's innocent (ie completely getting duped by Sasaki in Capo I and intentionally sabotaging the town in a different game).

Sigurd seems suspicious. Moros does a bit as well, when he says he doesn't find Glenn or TS suspicious.

Pevergreen makes me wary, but I don't think he deserves a lynch yet.

CR

Pannonian

02-07-2008, 21:20

all was through pm, no clear 'investigation results' was claimed so not posting any perhaps wrong accusations.

Also I'm not going to identify even 'false-cops' in thread (to help mafia?)

Waiting for Drisos' official role-revealing too mainly.
Just post the results here and let the accusations speak for themselves. With a game of this size, any leads are good. Even false leads are good, for they give us something to chew on. Eg. Generalhankerchief's early reveal in the first Capo gave us clues, both in its randomness and what it didn't say.

Omanes Alexandrapolites

02-07-2008, 21:21

If you reveal the false detectives, how would it help the mafia? Are you withholding infomation? Cos you are the MAFIA? :inquisitive:I think he means that identifying false detectives will also reveal the true detectives to the mafia - the mafia stereotypically then hunt down the real detectives before they get rumbled by them.

On another note, I'm still yet to hear from GH - anything to say about your previous overtly obsessive/aggressive defence of yourself and Glenn. I must say that it all sounds very scummy and mafia like to me.

The Stranger

02-07-2008, 21:21

23 Glenn(kamikhaan,xehh2,Ichigo,Sigurd,Sasaki,Big King Sanctaphrax,Kagemusha, Sarathos,husar, beefy, elite ferret, glenn Hannibalbarc,pevergreen,Lt. Pinard,Brave Sir Robin,Xiahou,, Joe Monks, Kukri, Count Arach,Crazed Rabbit,Tiberius of the Drake)

6 pevergreen(tincow,LittleGrizzly zorg, sarathos charge, pann stranger)
1 Beefy(shlin)
1 CountArach(GH)
1 norwegian nerd(omanes)
2 sigurd(prole, andres)
6 The Stranger (Craterus, True Praetorian,scottishranger,Rythmic, myrdraal, GH)
1 abstain (norwegian nerd)
1 molonthegreat (Tran)
1 GH (Omanes)

old tally
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1825791&postcount=437

abstain kommodus, alexanderptg, jimbob, johnsomething, moros, chimpyang, haudegen

TevashSzat

02-07-2008, 21:21

Okay just got through about 200 posts.

From what I can see, Glenn is dead already since so many people just bandwagoned on. I would be more sure that at least a significant portion of those bandwagoned on Glenn is scummy than he is. The Jimbob thing, though does suggest that Glenn is scummy, but who knows, they may be a vigilante/special group.

As for pevergreen, his actions are a bit suspicious for keeping everyone in the dark, but his actions are consistent with what a wise guy might want to do to get established towards the mafia side.

I for now would justVote Abstain

Also, btw, my computer has had an issue yesterday and I will attempt to fix it tonight, but I am currently using a comp that I can't necessarily access often and so I might not be able to participate that much

Csargo

02-07-2008, 21:23

Tally:
Glenn:(everybody, everybody, everybody, everybody, everybody)

Pannonian

02-07-2008, 21:25

I agree, I think that Seamus would be putting something more into it, and I am not even sure if he would write anything at all, perhaps preferring to keep it within the confines of the red itself.

I am interested in what JimBob means by "broadcasting his signal" - could you expand on this?

A couple of other posts that caught my eye:
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1826277&postcount=546
Can we get someone to translate this?

Using Google-translate.
Kommo is director, heeft geen bescherming nodig...
Kommo is director does not need protection ...

Sigurd Fafnesbane is misschien ook een goeie optie. K zou het graag vandaag nog weten
Sigurd Fafnesbane also could be a good option. K would like to know today

scottishranger

02-07-2008, 21:26

The Stranger

02-07-2008, 21:32

pfff you do not know what you are talking about... im the one who is at this point prolly trying the hardest to save the town... and im even putting my life at stake for it.

Pannonian

02-07-2008, 21:41

I still believe that The Stranger is the one most deserving of a lynch right now. His erratic playing style, his agressive posts and pms lead me to believe that at the very least he does not have the interests of the town at heart. What I don't get is how The Stranger is claiming he can investigate and kill people on the same turn. He already said he was a wise guy, now all of a sudden he is some special role?
TS is an irritating little so-so, but those of us who've played with him before have got used to it. He's going to be lynched at some point for being an irritating little so-so, but while there are better targets we might as well look at those others.

It might behove TS to remember there are some of us who have specific problems with your playing style, who might yet start a campaign against you. So don't even think about teamkills in the early game unless you want me on your back (Capo 1), and don't play randomly unless you want Sasaki at your throat (Kung Fu Mafia).

scottishranger

02-07-2008, 21:42

pfff you do not know what you are talking about... im the one who is at this point prolly trying the hardest to save the town... and im even putting my life at stake for it.
I do not know what I am talking about? How actually showing us some evidence that you are not as guilty as all the posts about you have shown eh? And how are you trying to save the town? You have done nothing to help it so far, least of all putting your life at stake.

The Stranger

02-07-2008, 21:43

i swear i will behave

Ironside

02-07-2008, 21:51

Vote:Abstain

We'll see were this Glenn issue ends up after the investigation I guess. JimBob's covering is odd (pulling out his neck in that way), but he'll need to stay alive until after the investigation for certain.

Few things I've haven't seen commented much on yet.

The townie group that attacked Glenn? Any ideas about whom and why? My guess on the why is something with someone's red text as townie attacks at this point is going to be bad for the town. Or mafia infiltration.

The inactive mafia? Only 1 or 2 moves, from 5 families. What are the rest doing? Infiltrating protection groups or claiming to be detectives (both for later intel and/or deception)?

Charge, you could post them nameless until some of the "detectives" start to show wrongful data. Even mades claiming to be detectives can be useful in eliminating 4 of the families, but they need to be uncovered after that or they'll destroy the town.

Makanyane

02-07-2008, 21:53

agreeing with Pannonian's feelings about pevergreen, I was suspicious before, but much more so now

vote: pevergreen

The Stranger

02-07-2008, 21:55

keep the tally plz

Lt. Pinard

02-07-2008, 21:56

OMG this game is way over my head. I voted for Glenn because it seemed right at the time. Now I doubt myself more and more. Too many different things happening and ppl accusing this person and that.

We seem to point the figure at anyone that defends themselves or sticks their neck out. What about the people that are first to jump on bringing those people down.
idk:huh2:
idk
idk:huh2:

So confused~:confused:

:drama3:

Makanyane

02-07-2008, 21:58

23 Glenn(kamikhaan,xehh2,Ichigo,Sigurd,Sasaki,Big King Sanctaphrax,Kagemusha, Sarathos,husar, beefy, elite ferret, glenn Hannibalbarc,pevergreen,Lt. Pinard,Brave Sir Robin,Xiahou,, Joe Monks, Kukri, Count Arach,Crazed Rabbit,Tiberius of the Drake)

8 pevergreen(tincow,LittleGrizzly zorg, sarathos, charge, pann, stranger, mak)
1 Beefy(shlin)
1 CountArach(GH)
1 norwegian nerd(omanes)
2 sigurd(prole, andres)
6 The Stranger (Craterus, True Praetorian,scottishranger,Rythmic, myrdraal, GH)
1 abstain (norwegian nerd)
1 molonthegreat (Tran)
1 GH (Omanes)

sorry updated tally - think pever line had miscount before please check

JimBob

02-07-2008, 22:01

I don't find this fragment believable at all. Not Seamus's writing style.
On what grounds? You've got two lines.

I am interested in what JimBob means by "broadcasting his signal" - could you expand on this?
We have code words we try to work into our posts. Simple as that.

I agree, I think that Seamus would be putting something more into it, and I am not even sure if he would write anything at all, perhaps preferring to keep it within the confines of the red itself.
There is more. It's all in RED.

I think Pannonian has a good plan. Tie Glen and I up in protection groups for the next few nights. That way we won't be able to do anything bad. You can investigate the ever-loving hell out of us. I swear we will come up on the town's side.

unvote: Abstain
Vote: No Lynch

Chimpyang

02-07-2008, 22:08

Hmm...code words you say....I would trawl through all of your posts trying to string together what they may be. I assume that is the only broad communication, but then again, more pressing issues of real life call :furious3:

Pannonian

02-07-2008, 22:09

Crazed Rabbit

02-07-2008, 22:13

Last game dons showed up as innocent.

Tie Glen and I up in protection groups for the next few nights. That way we won't be able to do anything bad.

Ha! No one would know if you really did it unless the target was attacked.

You're just tying to buy time.

CR

Sasaki Kojiro

02-07-2008, 22:13

We have code words we try to work into our posts. Simple as that. There is more. It's all in RED.

So far you said that there are three of you, that glenn is one, that you are a vigilante type group, that you have a life saving ability, and that you can communicate with code words. If all of that was in red how are you allowed to tell us?

On what grounds? You've got two lines.

Yes, two lines that are very informal when all of Seamus's role pm's are very formal.

Andres

02-07-2008, 22:17

Using Google-translate.
Kommo is director, heeft geen bescherming nodig...
Sigurd Fafnesbane is misschien ook een goeie optie. K zou het graag vandaag nog weten

"Kommodus is director. He doesn't need protection. Sigurd might be a good option. I'd like to make a decision today"

With the last sentence I was referring to the fact that nobody but me suggested someone to protect and I was getting annoyed at the indecisiveness of my companions.

At first, I suggested to protect Louis or Prole. Both did very well in Capo I and if they were town, they would be valuable enough to keep alive. TS immediately called it suspicous that I wanted to protect one of those, but didn't come up with a suggestion himself :shrug:

Afterwards I got contacted by Zorg who said he had information about pevergreen but he was afraid to get killed by one of pevergreens' squads.

When I suggested to protect Zorg, TS insisted on blackmailing Zorg, forcing him to share everything he had, including role pm. I politely asked Zorg if he wanted to share some info. He told me some things about pevergreen, but I wasn't willing to share it with TS. So, TS didn't want so protect Zorg.

Then I suggested Sigurd, who had proven to be an outstanding townie mastermind in past games.

And Sigurd it became. No objections from TS.

Voilà, my pm exchanges with TS in a nutshell.

Omanes Alexandrapolites

02-07-2008, 22:19

What did Zorg say about pevergreen Andres? Is there anything that might be important to the case against/for him?

Originally I was a little in doubt over The Stranger's status, but now my judgement is more and more leaning in the "pro-mafia" direction. Something about his double posting and behind the scenes methods makes him sound like a fairly desperate and erratic mafioso, trying to find excuses to prevent his group from doing what he doesn't wish them to do and attempting to manipulate others into revealing valuable information. He's a very dodgy player to say the least, and possibly should be lynched when the next opportunity is available.

Sasaki Kojiro

02-07-2008, 22:19

Then let's wait for a couple of days then, to see what Drisos comes out as.
so we might as well do that until Drisos' post-mortem comes up and we can decide on whether or not to lynch Sigurd.

Drisos's post-mortem tells us nothing about sigurd. If he's guilty Sigurd could still be guilty, if he's innocent sigurd could be innocent.

I suggest people take their votes off Glenn, and put it on pever instead as the next best candidate, and moreover one who doesn't have qute the same power role as those two claim. Also, any detectives reading this should investigate them both, and report to someone whom they trust.

I don't see how you think glenn/jimbob's claim is in anyway believable. Also, glenn seems like a don from the write up and would therefore appear innocent, and pevergreen is a claimed wise guy (I believe him) and so investigating him is pointless as well. The detectives can't actually trust anyone completely. So basically you are asking the detectives to make two pointless investigations and then reveal themselves. Not a fan of this.

Unvote: Beefy
Vote: pevergreen

I've had my suspicions of pevergreen, from his unwieldy group of 13 to his attempted cultivating of me, to a recent PM asking me what he should do now as everyone has turned against him. It's almost as though he's trying to play on past connections to strike up some kind of partnership. Others may have their own views on him, but those are my interactions with him that I've found suspicious.

Pever is pretty much confirmed as "not mafia" with his claim of wise guy. He's not trustworthy sure, but certainly not lynchworthy. What do you mean by his attempt of "cultivating" you?

The Stranger

02-07-2008, 22:22

"Kommodus is director. He doesn't need protection. Sigurd might be a good option. I'd like to make a decision today"

With the last sentence I was referring to the fact that nobody but me suggested someone to protect and I was getting annoyed at the indecisiveness of my companions.

At first, I suggested to protect Louis or Prole. Both did very well in Capo I and if they were town, they would be valuable enough to keep alive. TS immediately called it suspicous that I wanted to protect one of those, but didn't come up with a suggestion himself :shrug:

Afterwards I got contacted by Zorg who said he had information about pevergreen but he was afraid to get killed by one of pevergreens' squads.

When I suggested to protect Zorg, TS insisted on blackmailing Zorg, forcing him to share everything he had, including role pm. I politely asked Zorg if he wanted to share some info. He told me some things about pevergreen, but I wasn't willing to share it with TS. So, TS didn't want so protect Zorg.

Then I suggested Sigurd, who had proven to be an outstanding townie mastermind in past games.

And Sigurd it became. No objections from TS.

Voilà, my pm exchanges with TS in a nutshell.

im not attacking you... im just saying that it is lied that i said protect sigurd.

The Stranger

02-07-2008, 22:23

i believe the claim of glenn and jimbob

Andres

02-07-2008, 22:26

My pm exchange with Zorg:

Hi Andres,

I contact you, to be blunt, because of your suspicion of Pever. I find myself in what I feel to be a bad position, incredibly early. I am currently without group, and feel I may have made a dangerous enemy. I believe Pever to be a dangerous threat to myself and, if his plans succeed, to almost all factions in the game.

I am contacting you with the hope that you can help me in exchange for what help I can give you and information I have regarding Pever.

I await your reply,

Zorg

Why would pever be a threat to you? Did you receive suspicious pm's of him? Or were you the one who forwarded him the w&f pm?

Andres.

My situation is one I believe I am in due to my own suspicion. I was approached with information about Pever which I believe to be true. The information essentially detailed that Pever has been recruiting on a large scale, and as the forum post states that he has his own protection group. It included some information about Woads protection group, but I didn't see that as relevant. In any case, I drew the conclusion that Pever is trying to form his own mafia group, under himself and generally try and make sure all forms of information go through him. I mentioned my suspicion to Beefy who I thought I could trust. I have since learnt that Beefy was one of the original receivers of w&fs pm and I believe he was the one who forwarded it.

If this was the case, then Pever will now know my understanding of his position. If I'm right, then I'm in danger.

Is there any way you can help me?

First of all, some general advice, since I believe you are rather new in mafia games: be careful with who you trust :bow:

And off course, no matter what side you're on: good luck :2thumbsup:

As for your latest pm.

I am in contact with a few townies. Their role claims all look genuine. We can protect you this night if necessary. Obviously, I'm not going to tell you who my fellow townies are, since I don't know if you are to be trusted.

I still have some questions: 1) who approached you with information about pever? 2) what information exactly (can you be a bit more specific) and how did this person acquire said information? 3) Is Beefy in pever's group or with w&f? 4) you have any clues about the roles of Beefy, pever and w&f? 5) Are you a townie?

A.

I "think" that I might have overreacted originaly when panicing and asking for your help. The paranoia is getting to me. Nevertheless I am still suspicious of Pevergreen, to answer your questions:

1. I'm afraid for my contact(s)'s own security I don't feel obliged to share that information.

2. The information was detailing some of the information about what apears to be the feud between w&f and pever. Pever has since released the bulk of this information in the thread. I also received a rumour (fairly vauge) that Pevergreen was working with Pannonian and that they intended to set up a new townie mafia.

This information was what caused me to suspect pever.

3. Beefy by his own word has his own "network", but I have also heard word that he is part of Pevers group. He was also INVITED to woad's group, but to my knowlage declined the offer.

4. I have no idea about beefy or woads, but I suspect Pever to be a rouge Wise Guy.

5. I am innocent and working for the town. My specific role I am not willing to divulge.

Pannonian

02-07-2008, 22:28

Last game dons showed up as innocent.

Ha! No one would know if you really did it unless the target was attacked.

You're just tying to buy time.

CR
Someone said earlier that the PMed results of an unsuccessful protection said that the group wasn't acting in parallel, so this could be used to detect non-compliant night actions. Also, the point about jimbob and Glenn speaking up for each other is that, if they were a Mafia family, only one of them can be a Don, while the other would be a Made of some sort. I'm not sure how the rules went last time, but weren't Mades unable to perform townie duties?

At the very least, locking them both in protection groups will prevent them from scum activity indefinitely, until we've run out of other suspects. Since we've got one definite suspect pending Drisos' report (Sigurd), we might as well mark time until then. I've not seen pevergreen offer any kind of satisfactory defence to the various suspicions of him, with the most favourable assessment being that he's a Wise Guy looking for approval from a Mafia family, so he's a low-risk, low-cost target for lynching while we wait for further information.

GeneralHankerchief

02-07-2008, 22:34

Tally is incorrect.

I switched my vote to TS some time ago.

Charge

02-07-2008, 22:38

I think this is more detailed :sweatdrop:

22 Glenn (kamikhaan,xehh2,Ichigo,Sigurd,Sasaki,Big King Sanctaphrax,Kagemusha,husar, beefy, elite ferret, glenn, Hannibalbarc,pevergreen,Lt. Pinard,Brave Sir Robin,Xiahou,Joe Monks, Kukri, Count Arach,Crazed Rabbit,Tiberius, twiligtblade)
9 pevergreen (tincow,LittleGrizzly, zorg, sarathos, charge, pann, stranger, mak, JimBob)
6 The Stranger (Craterus, True Praetorian,scottishranger,Rythmic, Myrddraal, GH)
3 Sigurd (prole, andres, woad)
1 Beefy (shlin)
1 molonthegreat (Tran)
1 GH (Omanes)

9 abstain (norwegian nerd, NN, cowhead, AtPG, johnhught., moros, chimpyang, haudegen, ironside)

seems ok?

Pannonian

02-07-2008, 22:44

Drisos's post-mortem tells us nothing about sigurd. If he's guilty Sigurd could still be guilty, if he's innocent sigurd could be innocent.

He made a definite claim as detective. The post mortem reveals, not just innocence or guilt, but the role. He also made a definite claim that Sigurd is a Don. I don't know how he got the info, but if he's stuck his (deceased) neck out for this, it should be worth testing his other claim. Sure, we might end up lynching a townie, but if Drisos is correct, we might end up lynching a Don. As I've said, I have my doubts about his claim, simply because it's technically not allowable, but that's a scenario we should bear in mind.

I don't see how you think glenn/jimbob's claim is in anyway believable. Also, glenn seems like a don from the write up and would therefore appear innocent, and pevergreen is a claimed wise guy (I believe him) and so investigating him is pointless as well. The detectives can't actually trust anyone completely. So basically you are asking the detectives to make two pointless investigations and then reveal themselves. Not a fan of this.

I never asked the detectives to publicly reveal themselves, only to someone whom they trusted. Detectives who trust no-one with their information are practically useless anyway, as they're effectively meat waiting for their turn. If either of them turn up as criminal, that will blow their story and we can lynch them both.

Pever is pretty much confirmed as "not mafia" with his claim of wise guy. He's not trustworthy sure, but certainly not lynchworthy. What do you mean by his attempt of "cultivating" you?
Trying to strike up links, talking in a suspiciously friendly manner about past games, etc. This might sound innocuous enough as described, but something triggered my scumometer.

If their claim is correct, then we lose a lot by lynching Glenn. If their claim is flase, we can still do something useful in the meanwhile by lynching pevergreen, while checking out their story and also insuring against losses by putting them both in protection groups. If they're what they claim to be, then we have something to gain by this latter course. If they're not what they claim to be, then we can still lynch them with but a little delay, and we won't have lost anything. Think about it, if Glenn and jimbob are part of a family, at least one of them will show up as criminal, and we can lynch them both then (with a double lynching if possible).

Seamus Fermanagh

02-07-2008, 22:51

Host's Tally

Glenn = 23 (Beefy17, Big King Sanctaphrax, Brave Sir Robin, CountArach, Crazed Rabbit, Elite Ferret, Glenn, Hannibalbarc, Husar, Ichigo, Joe Monks, Kagemusha, Kamikhaan, Kukrikhan, Lt. Pinard, Moros, pevergreen, Sasaki Kojiro, Sigurd Fafnesbane, Tiberius of the Drake, Twilightblade, Xehh II, & Xiahou)

Abstain = 11 (Alexander the Pretty Good, Charge, Chimpyang, Cowhead418, Haudegan, Ironside, JimBob, johnhughthom, norwegian nerd, Northnovas, Xdeathfire)

Pevergreen = 7 (LittleGrizzly, Makayane, Pannonian, Sarathos, The Stranger, TinCow, Zorg)

The Stranger = 6 (Craterus, GeneralHankerchief, Myrddraal, Rythmic, scottishranger, TruePraetorian)

Sigurd Fafnesbane = 3 (Andres, Proletariat, woad&fangs)

Singles = 3 [GeneralHankerchief (Omanes Alexandrapolites), Beefy187 (Shlin28), molonthegreat (Tran)].

Not Voting = 25 (ajaxfetish, Caeser the III, Caius, Draco Leman, Dutch_guy, Evil_Maniac from Mars, FactionHeir, Fahad I, gibsonsg91921, Hiji, Jubal_Barca, Killfr3nzy, Kommodus {not allowed}, Leet Erikson, Lord Winter, Louis VI the Fat, molonthegreat, Motep, Roadkill, Rob_the_Celt, sapi, taka, Warluster, Warmaster Horus, x-dANGEr)

Dead = 1 (Drisos)

Notify if corrections are required. Deadline is 2300 EST

JimBob

02-07-2008, 22:54

And how on earth is that wasted vote going to help your mate Glenn? Is this another part of your red text, that you must vote in order to get rid of each other? You're willing to speak up for each other, but you're not willing to vote for his nearest rival. Weird.
I was hoping reason would break out and I wouldn't have to sacrafice some two-bit wiseguy. Unfortunately it seems the mafia's dogs are angry today.
Sorry Pever, for the common good and all
unvote:No Lynch
Vote:Pevergreen

Last game dons showed up as innocent.
There's two of us, if neither or both of us show up as innocent then obviously you've not found what you're looking for.

So far you said that there are three of you, that glenn is one, that you are a vigilante type group, that you have a life saving ability, and that you can communicate with code words. If all of that was in red how are you allowed to tell us?
It's a very vague description. The only details are the number and Glenn's identity (which I need to tell you. The nature of the vigilante group you don't know. There are a number of rules concerning how we can act at night, we have very strange win conditions, and you don't know the code or what it means. This is all a vague summary, if it is in violation, I apologize. I hoped I'd be able to give these small little tidbits.

VOTE TALLY
22 Glenn (kamikhaan,xehh2,Ichigo,Sigurd,Sasaki,Big King Sanctaphrax,Kagemusha,husar, beefy, elite ferret, glenn Hannibalbarc,pevergreen,Lt. Pinard,Brave Sir Robin,Xiahou,Joe Monks, Kukri, Count Arach,Crazed Rabbit,Tiberius, twiligtblade)
9 pevergreen (tincow,LittleGrizzly, zorg, sarathos, charge, pann, stranger, mak, JimBob)
6 The Stranger (Craterus, True Praetorian,scottishranger,Rythmic, Myrddraal, GH)
3 Sigurd (prole, andres, woad)
1 Beefy (shlin)
1 molonthegreat (Tran)
1 GH (Omanes)

Glenn, unvote yourself, seriously.

And Sasaki, what kind of Don votes for themselves to be lynched?

Charge

02-07-2008, 22:55

err I voted pevergreen, and I think moros voted abstain (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?p=1826064#post1826064)

Csargo

02-07-2008, 23:19

what kind of Don votes for themselves to be lynched?

He already had 15-20 votes.

Louis VI the Fat

02-07-2008, 23:30

Glenn looks suspicious. With my mind, I think he may be guilty. But by sheer gut instinct, and from 'sniffing' the tone of his posts, he doesn't seem mafia at all.
And JimBob's story is simply so ridiculous that I am inclined to believe it. It is all way too innocent to be mafia.

I, for one, won't be jumping on the Glenn bandwagon. I want to find out more. Plus, he amuses me by speaking of Woad&Fangs in the plural.

Pevergreen I think is a liability. His acts are pro-town, his mind is lusting with power.

Vote: Pevergreen.

VOTE TALLY
22 Glenn (kamikhaan,xehh2,Ichigo,Sigurd,Sasaki,Big King Sanctaphrax,Kagemusha,husar, beefy, elite ferret, glenn Hannibalbarc,pevergreen,Lt. Pinard,Brave Sir Robin,Xiahou,Joe Monks, Kukri, Count Arach,Crazed Rabbit,Tiberius, twiligtblade)
10 pevergreen (Louis Vi the Fat, tincow,LittleGrizzly, zorg, sarathos, charge, pann, stranger, mak, JimBob)
6 The Stranger (Craterus, True Praetorian,scottishranger,Rythmic, Myrddraal, GH)
3 Sigurd (prole, andres, woad)
1 Beefy (shlin)
1 molonthegreat (Tran)
1 GH (Omanes)

seireikhaan

02-07-2008, 23:51

I'd like to point out that in Cosa Nuova II, Hughtower came up with an incredibly absurd role that Seamus used to 'reveal' with, whereupon he was some sort of voodoo doctor. Of course, Seamus was guilty as all hell, but the lie was so absurd that people, for a while, believed him. My point is, just because a story is very absurd or unusual doesn't exclude it from being true.

As for The Stranger, for anyone who hasn't played with him, he's not really that far off from his usual (and quite bizarre) posting style. I'm not quite inclined to lynch him on that basis.

I think next we should be lynching Pevergreen. I don't trust the fact that he's using the system to his own benefit, it seems far too power hungry for my likes.

I think we wait until we find out about Drisos' role from the Gendarmerie before lynching Sigurd . If innocent, Sigurd is an incredibly useful tool for the town.

Louis VI the Fat

02-08-2008, 00:16

Anyway, it seems to me that with all these Glenn bashing, that everyone has forgot something that someone said about someone on post 13...

https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1823416&postcount=13
Another potential mafia perhaps?Oops, nearly forgot to reply to this. Sasaki asked for an answer to it as well.

Err, I posted it, on page one, post 13, directly after the game began. Somebody sugested that 'We might as well give a new player the full Capo experience'. Which I promptly did. It's one of several posts I wrote to bid new players a warm welcome to the wonderful world of .org mafia.

It needs to be entirely disregarded. Sorry for that. Thanks for remembering it though, Shlin. That is a sign of a keen mind. Unlike mine then, forever given more to inserting only half-funny comments everywhere where people will put up with me.

naut

02-08-2008, 00:48

Pannonian

02-08-2008, 00:58

Personally I think it would be a waste of a lynch to lynch pever, an absolute waste, if we know he's a wise guy we can keep an eye on him. He's not a priority lynch, if he gets bandwagoned next round it won't help the town, it'll only help a whole lot of Mafioso to go unnoticed for another round.
It's not a waste if we use the time to check out Glenn and jimbob's stories. They claim to have powerful pro-town roles, they vouch for each other. If they're not pro-town after all, then only one of them can check out as innocent when investigated. So we have a sure way of checking their stories. Given the potential gain, and the fact that we can minimise our losses regarding them, we should give them a couple of turns to prove their innocence, while we look for other candidates.

As townies significantly outnumber mafiosi, even if we lynch a townie by mistake, it would not be too harmful for the town's cause, as long as we generate enough discussion in the meantime for later scrutiny. Then look at pevergreen. At best, he's a wise guy who's looking to align himself with scum, according to most people's assessments. At worst, he's scum himself. Either way, he's no great loss, and his survival represents no great potential gain for the town, as few are prepared to trust him now anyway after his shenanigans last night.

Sacrifice pever now so we can check Glenn and jimbob's stories. We can always lynch those two afterwards if we find out they're lying. There's not much to lose by giving them a reprieve, while if they're telling the truth, there's something to gain.

TruePraetorian

02-08-2008, 00:58

I think next we should be lynching Pevergreen. I don't trust the fact that he's using the system to his own benefit, it seems far too power hungry for my likes.

Again, please note we can lynch two or more people at a time. If we gather enough votes, we can get kommodus or whoever the director is to lynch both of them.

Pannonian

02-08-2008, 01:02

Can people quote properly so their posts are easily readable? The tags follow standard html rules, closing with a slash-tag.

woad&fangs

02-08-2008, 01:03

Unvote: Sigurd ; Vote: Pevergreen
I want a double lynch.

Myrddraal

02-08-2008, 01:08

FactionHeir

02-08-2008, 01:18

vote: abstain

Too many arguments to follow.

Pannonian

02-08-2008, 01:19

Well, the code words that Glenn and Jimbob are referring to are clearly: AXE, BLADE, and CROWN.

Why? I don't know. If somebody is really keen, they could check to see wether these words started appearing in their posts before the were accused. If they don't, then it might suggest they're making it up. If they do, then it might suggest they're telling the truth.

They've certainly sown the seed of doubt in my mind.

Mentions of words, if the search function is working fully.

Post #63 (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1823577&postcount=63)

Aye, the seat of the director is a crown of thorns.

When you post here in this thread, it is like viewing a harbour, plain and vast - quite peaceful and welcoming - but home to a great amount of activity and secrets that go very deep beyond the surface.

A paranoid feeling.
Post #457 (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1825880&postcount=457)

Can you people not see a bandwagon when it shows up? There are a lot of special roles that we know nothing about. Maybe Glenn has a special ability that gives him a better chance to survive. Maybe a doctor protected him. Why would that doctor come out? They'd only be a target for the mafia.

Let's not have the town go around doing the mob's work. When we kill people let's do it with firm knowledge. Let us not crown some Don king of Fatlington.
Post #488 (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1825964&postcount=488)

I want to state my last words.

"I want everyone to know that I crusaded in the name of the axe, blade and crown of the Township authority.
I was a detective with a sword.
A sword so heavy it would require three men to lift.
Post #572 (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1826424&postcount=572)

Glenn's having fun while waiting to be lynched. I can tell you you're doing the town no favor. By lynching him you will only help to crown the mafia. If you choose to lynch Glenn, wait for his post mortem to come back. Then lynch me if he is mafia. I will participate with town protection groups in the intervening nights to assure that I will not kill as a mafia member.

Let the axe fall not on the town but on the necks of the mafia. Let the blade rise up to strike them all down with fury. May they not be crowned lords of Fatlington.
Get those votes off Glenn and onto pever.

RoadKill

02-08-2008, 01:21

So many posts.... How can I read all this.... :no:

Sasaki Kojiro

02-08-2008, 01:22

Pannonian

02-08-2008, 01:22

If in doubt, vote pevergreen.

CountArach

02-08-2008, 01:23

So many posts.... How can I read all this.... :no:
With your eyes perhaps?

Has anyone else been using those words at all? I'm still sceptical, because Glenn certainly seems scummy and I don't think that this new stuff absolves him, however for now I think it is best if we try to tie up Glenn and pever so we can lynch both of them.

Unvote: Glenn
Vote: pever

Pannonian

02-08-2008, 01:24

I checked, the first use is post 488 after JimBob's pm's have been revealed.
First use was post #63 (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1826697&postcount=627) actually, way back at the start of the game.

Louis VI the Fat

02-08-2008, 01:30

Come on people! The case is solved. Thanks Myrddraal and Pannonian. Brilliant. :bow:

Glenn = mighty pro-town. We all know it.

Kill Pevergreen while we have the chance.

Edit to add: No, we don't know if Glenn is pro-town. But I think we should make the effort to find out.

Sasaki Kojiro

02-08-2008, 01:31

First use was post #63 (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1826697&postcount=627) actually, way back at the start of the game.

JimBob and Glenn, were you using those 2 instances pann pointed out to communicate?

CountArach

02-08-2008, 01:38

It might also be useful to know which post it was that gave away that the two of you were connected. You don't have to give away what is in the red to give us a post number.

GeneralHankerchief

02-08-2008, 01:45

Unvote: The Stranger
Vote: pevergreen

I've heard just about enough here.

Sasaki Kojiro

02-08-2008, 01:56

Can't say I believe Glenn and Jimbob's story in the slightest. However the mention of banquo in mafia IV strikes a nerve. I'll unvote:Glenn, Vote:Pevergreen. Someone can investigate Jimbob and we'll follow pann's plan.

Btw Jimbob and Glenn, what's your story as to how glenn survived the killing group?

Pannonian

02-08-2008, 01:59

Given that it was jimbob's infrequency of reading the thread that got Glenn into this mess in the first place, and lynching time is 3 hours hence, it is unlikely that they'll answer the questions in time to satisfy you. So I'll present the evidence instead.

In post #572 (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1826424&postcount=572), jimbob explained:

We did not know each other at the begining. We were given code. Glenn has been broadcasting his code this whole time. I came late and found it. We're still broadcasting to find our third. I can't say much, but our role gives us better odds of surviving attack.
Does this fit the evidence? A look back at post #63 (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1823577&postcount=63), way back on day 1, and Glenn was spouting this strange bit of garble.

Aye, the seat of the director is a crown of thorns.

When you post here in this thread, it is like viewing a harbour, plain and vast - quite peaceful and welcoming - but home to a great amount of activity and secrets that go very deep beyond the surface.

A paranoid feeling.
Quite some time later, on day 2 and in post #457 (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1825880&postcount=457), jimbob makes his first appearance in the thread.

Can you people not see a bandwagon when it shows up? There are a lot of special roles that we know nothing about. Maybe Glenn has a special ability that gives him a better chance to survive. Maybe a doctor protected him. Why would that doctor come out? They'd only be a target for the mafia.

Let's not have the town go around doing the mob's work. When we kill people let's do it with firm knowledge. Let us not crown some Don king of Fatlington.
Their story checks out thus far. Let's give ourselves some time to check out the other details, and lynch pever in the meantime.

GeneralHankerchief

02-08-2008, 02:00

Sorry for being anal, but the Banquo thing was Mafia V.

Mafia IV was the one that ended after 3 rounds. FWIW, Reenk Roink was Detective in that one.

Back to your regularly scheduled drama.

Myrddraal

02-08-2008, 02:02

Glenn = mighty pro-town. We all know it.

Kill Pevergreen while we have the chance.

Hmm, pevergreen is not a 100% good lynch. IMO he's just a better lynch option than Glenn at the moment, and he's the one with the most votes apart from him. So it's hardly a case of lynching him 'while we have the chance'... :inquisitive:

Sasaki Kojiro

02-08-2008, 02:07

That is odd wording. Presumably Louis means that pever has protection at night, but saying "while we have the chance" is from the perspective of someone who has considered killing at night.

Pannonian

02-08-2008, 02:10

Capotally as of post #638

Glenn = 21 (Beefy17, Big King Sanctaphrax, Brave Sir Robin, Crazed Rabbit, Elite Ferret, Glenn, Hannibalbarc, Husar, Ichigo, Joe Monks, Kagemusha, Kamikhaan, Kukrikhan, Lt. Pinard, Moros, pevergreen, Sigurd Fafnesbane, Tiberius of the Drake, Twilightblade, Xehh II, & Xiahou)

Abstain = 10 (Alexander the Pretty Good, Chimpyang, Cowhead418, Haudegan, Ironside, johnhughthom, norwegian nerd, Northnovas, Xdeathfire, FactionHeir)

Pevergreen = 15 (LittleGrizzly, Makayane, Pannonian, Sarathos, The Stranger, TinCow, Zorg, Sasaki Kojiro, CountArach, JimBob, Charge, Louis VI the Fat, woad&fangs, Myrddraal, GeneralHankerchief)

The Stranger = 4 (Craterus, Rythmic, scottishranger, TruePraetorian)

Sigurd Fafnesbane = 2 (Andres, Proletariat)

Singles = 3 [GeneralHankerchief (Omanes Alexandrapolites), Beefy187 (Shlin28), molonthegreat (Tran)].

Not Voting = 23 (ajaxfetish, Caeser the III, Caius, Draco Leman, Dutch_guy, Evil_Maniac from Mars, Fahad I, gibsonsg91921, Hiji, Jubal_Barca, Killfr3nzy, Kommodus {not allowed}, Leet Erikson, Lord Winter, molonthegreat, Motep, Roadkill, Rob_the_Celt, sapi, taka, Warluster, Warmaster Horus, x-dANGEr)

Dead = 1 (Drisos)

Proletariat

02-08-2008, 02:18

Well, that changes things. Nice work, Pan. Unvote: Sigurd, Vote: pever

Glenn = 21 (Beefy17, Big King Sanctaphrax, Brave Sir Robin, Crazed Rabbit, Elite Ferret, Glenn, Hannibalbarc, Husar, Ichigo, Joe Monks, Kagemusha, Kamikhaan, Kukrikhan, Lt. Pinard, Moros, pevergreen, Sigurd Fafnesbane, Tiberius of the Drake, Twilightblade, Xehh II, & Xiahou)

Abstain = 10 (Alexander the Pretty Good, Chimpyang, Cowhead418, Haudegan, Ironside, johnhughthom, norwegian nerd, Northnovas, Xdeathfire, FactionHeir)

Pevergreen = 16 (LittleGrizzly, Makayane, Pannonian, Sarathos, The Stranger, TinCow, Zorg, Sasaki Kojiro, CountArach, JimBob, Charge, Louis VI the Fat, woad&fangs, Myrddraal, GeneralHankerchief, Prole)

The Stranger = 4 (Craterus, Rythmic, scottishranger, TruePraetorian)

Sigurd Fafnesbane = 1 (Andres)

Singles = 3 [GeneralHankerchief (Omanes Alexandrapolites), Beefy187 (Shlin28), molonthegreat (Tran)].

TruePraetorian

02-08-2008, 02:24

I must say, my eyes have been opened a little. Though i am still suspicious of The Stranger, I have also said (actually quoted) that pevergreen is too power-hungry.

As you all know, i've been fighting for at least a double lynch. Let us even up the numbers.

Unvote: The Stranger
Vote: Pevergreen

With this, Glenn has 22 and Pevergreen 16 (unless someone new has posted)

-I am not just bandwaggoning, I have just reconsidered that Pevergreen is the best choice to lynch.

-Also, do not forget that Glenn has voted for himself. If we want a double lynch, and we remove too many, then Pevergreen will be lynched alone. This means that if Glenn is not pro-town, or he is a vigilante group, another townie may die...

Craterus

02-08-2008, 02:27

unvote: The Stranger
vote: pevergreen

Seeing as it's a two horse race now, I may as well place a vote for my second-choice.

However, just to throw it out there (I'm not even entirely sure if this is feasible in terms of time) could it be that Glenn and jimbob are part of a mafia family and, when they realised Glenn was in serious trouble, simply picked and agreed upon a word that happened to appear in one of Glenn's earlier posts. It might be worth looking at how many votes Glenn had when jimbob appeared.

EDIT: Current CapoTally
Glenn = 21 (Beefy17, Big King Sanctaphrax, Brave Sir Robin, Crazed Rabbit, Elite Ferret, Glenn, Hannibalbarc, Husar, Ichigo, Joe Monks, Kagemusha, Kamikhaan, Kukrikhan, Lt. Pinard, Moros, pevergreen, Sigurd Fafnesbane, Tiberius of the Drake, Twilightblade, Xehh II, & Xiahou)

Abstain = 10 (Alexander the Pretty Good, Chimpyang, Cowhead418, Haudegan, Ironside, johnhughthom, norwegian nerd, Northnovas, Xdeathfire, FactionHeir)

Pevergreen = 18 (LittleGrizzly, Makayane, Pannonian, Sarathos, The Stranger, TinCow, Zorg, Sasaki Kojiro, CountArach, JimBob, Charge, Louis VI the Fat, woad&fangs, Myrddraal, GeneralHankerchief, Prole, TruePraetorian, Craterus)

The Stranger = 2 (Rythmic, scottishranger)

Sigurd Fafnesbane = 1 (Andres)

Singles = 3 [GeneralHankerchief (Omanes Alexandrapolites), Beefy187 (Shlin28), molonthegreat (Tran)].

ajaxfetish

02-08-2008, 02:33

What's the latest tally? How close are Glenn and pevergreen now?

My internet was out last night, so it's taken me a lot longer to get on top of things than I expected today--lots of reading and convoluted plotting and logic to work through.

I was in one of pevergreen's protection groups. Originally I was very much in the dark in terms of purpose/coordination, as I just got names of fellow group members and a protection target: pevergreen. I verified with each of the other members that they had the same intentions before going forward, and our result was 'inconclusive,' which I take to mean that pevergreen wasn't attacked. He did indeed send another pm today which included the names and objectives of each person he had recruited, and that combined with his posting today convinces me that he is telling the truth when he says he is a wise guy. He does seem to be aiming for the killer/mafia development option, but his intentions are now in the open. I consider him a threat, but a minor (and possibly redeemable) one.

I'm torn on Glenn's issue. First, I considered him suspicious enough to lynch. Then when his lynching seemed a foregone conclusion I thought it might be better to vote for another suspicious character (The Stranger or Norwegian Nerd, for example), to keep other suspicions from being forgotten. Then his self-pity spamming made me want to vote for him simply in the hope that he would stop posting after death and rid us of the headache. However, Myrddral's and Pannonian's contributions on the matter leave me wondering whether we should preserve Glenn's life after all. (Part of me thinks sacrificing even a valuable town role might be worth it to get him to reduce his posting, but I'll do my best to keep the town's good ahead of my own personal sanity).

For now, I'll vote: abstain. It would have been Glenn before Pannonian's investigation, and I don't yet think pevergreen is worth lynching.

Ajax

Pannonian

02-08-2008, 02:33

unvote: The Stranger
vote: pevergreen

Seeing as it's a two horse race now, I may as well place a vote for my second-choice.

However, just to throw it out there (I'm not even entirely sure if this is feasible in terms of time) could it be that Glenn and jimbob are part of a mafia family and, when they realised Glenn was in serious trouble, simply picked and agreed upon a word that happened to appear in one of Glenn's earlier posts.
It doesn't matter even if they're mafia. If the detectives investigate them, even if one of them were a Don and checks out as innocent, the other will be a Made or Luca and will check out as criminal, upon which we can lynch both of them. Hence this is a no-loss proposition for the town, unless pevergreen claims some indispensible townie role we dare not risk losing. Given his activities so far, few of us would believe such a claim.

Capotally as of post #645

Glenn = 21 (Beefy17, Big King Sanctaphrax, Brave Sir Robin, Crazed Rabbit, Elite Ferret, Glenn, Hannibalbarc, Husar, Ichigo, Joe Monks, Kagemusha, Kamikhaan, Kukrikhan, Lt. Pinard, Moros, pevergreen, Sigurd Fafnesbane, Tiberius of the Drake, Twilightblade, Xehh II, & Xiahou)

Abstain = 10 (Alexander the Pretty Good, Chimpyang, Cowhead418, Haudegan, Ironside, johnhughthom, norwegian nerd, Northnovas, Xdeathfire, FactionHeir)

Pevergreen = 18 (LittleGrizzly, Makayane, Pannonian, Sarathos, The Stranger, TinCow, Zorg, Sasaki Kojiro, CountArach, JimBob, Charge, Louis VI the Fat, woad&fangs, Myrddraal, GeneralHankerchief, Prole, TruePraetorian, Craterus)

The Stranger = 2 (Rythmic, scottishranger)

Sigurd Fafnesbane = 1 (Andres)

Singles = 3 [GeneralHankerchief (Omanes Alexandrapolites), Beefy187 (Shlin28), molonthegreat (Tran)]

woad&fangs

02-08-2008, 02:35

TruePraetorian, please bold your votes.

Lt. Pinard

02-08-2008, 02:40

My doubts of Glenn's guilt is becoming less sure by the post.

Unvote: Glenn

Vote: Pevergreen

Glenn = 20 (Beefy17, Big King Sanctaphrax, Brave Sir Robin, Crazed Rabbit, Elite Ferret, Glenn, Hannibalbarc, Husar, Ichigo, Joe Monks, Kagemusha, Kamikhaan, Kukrikhan, , Moros, pevergreen, Sigurd Fafnesbane, Tiberius of the Drake, Twilightblade, Xehh II, & Xiahou)

Abstain = 10 (Alexander the Pretty Good, Chimpyang, Cowhead418, Haudegan, Ironside, johnhughthom, norwegian nerd, Northnovas, Xdeathfire, FactionHeir)

Pevergreen = 19 (LittleGrizzly, Makayane, Pannonian, Sarathos, The Stranger, TinCow, Zorg, Sasaki Kojiro, CountArach, JimBob, Charge, Louis VI the Fat, woad&fangs, Myrddraal, GeneralHankerchief, Prole, TruePraetorian, Craterus,Lt. Pinard)

The Stranger = 2 (Rythmic, scottishranger)

Sigurd Fafnesbane = 1 (Andres)

Singles = 3 [GeneralHankerchief (Omanes Alexandrapolites), Beefy187 (Shlin28), molonthegreat (Tran)]

woad&fangs

02-08-2008, 02:41

:wall: If Glenn hadn't voted for himself then we'd have a tie between him and Pevergreen:wall:

ajaxfetish

02-08-2008, 02:43

And there've been several new votes while I was writing that. Hmmm. I think I'm going to try to bring pevergreen up to an equal level with Glenn and encourage Kommodus to resolve the tie in favor of no lynchings until we have more information.

unvote: abstain
vote: pevergreen

My intention is not to lynch pevergreen, but to delay lynching anyone until we have a more firm basis.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------

Capotally as of post #651

Glenn = 20 (Beefy17, Big King Sanctaphrax, Brave Sir Robin, Crazed Rabbit, Elite Ferret, Glenn, Hannibalbarc, Husar, Ichigo, Joe Monks, Kagemusha, Kamikhaan, Kukrikhan, Moros, pevergreen, Sigurd Fafnesbane, Tiberius of the Drake, Twilightblade, Xehh II, & Xiahou)

Abstain = 10 (Alexander the Pretty Good, Chimpyang, Cowhead418, Haudegan, Ironside, johnhughthom, norwegian nerd, Northnovas, Xdeathfire, FactionHeir)

Pevergreen = 20 (LittleGrizzly, Makayane, Pannonian, Sarathos, The Stranger, TinCow, Zorg, Sasaki Kojiro, CountArach, JimBob, Charge, Louis VI the Fat, woad&fangs, Myrddraal, GeneralHankerchief, Prole, TruePraetorian, Craterus, ajaxfetish, Lt. Pinard)

The Stranger = 2 (Rythmic, scottishranger)

Sigurd Fafnesbane = 1 (Andres)

Singles = 3 [GeneralHankerchief (Omanes Alexandrapolites), Beefy187 (Shlin28), molonthegreat (Tran)]

--------------------------------------------------------------------

Ajax

edit: edited to include Lt. Pinard's vote change. The balance is now equal. If no one changes that, it is in Kommodus' hands.

scottishranger

02-08-2008, 02:46

Since my obvious suspiscion of The Stranger is now useless, I am going to change my vote. I have always thought that Glenn was a pro-town role, and I think lynching him would be a mistake.

I Vote: pevergreen

Craterus

02-08-2008, 02:47

He talked about his death being poetic so this is ...interesting.

EDIT: Nevermind, it's unlikely that Glenn's vote on himself will be the decider. It's 21-20 now, correct?
EDIT2: Scottishranger, you should probably unvote.

Tally:

Glenn = 20 (Beefy17, Big King Sanctaphrax, Brave Sir Robin, Crazed Rabbit, Elite Ferret, Glenn, Hannibalbarc, Husar, Ichigo, Joe Monks, Kagemusha, Kamikhaan, Kukrikhan, Moros, pevergreen, Sigurd Fafnesbane, Tiberius of the Drake, Twilightblade, Xehh II, & Xiahou)

Abstain = 10 (Alexander the Pretty Good, Chimpyang, Cowhead418, Haudegan, Ironside, johnhughthom, norwegian nerd, Northnovas, Xdeathfire, FactionHeir)

Pevergreen = 21 (LittleGrizzly, Makayane, Pannonian, Sarathos, The Stranger, TinCow, Zorg, Sasaki Kojiro, CountArach, JimBob, Charge, Louis VI the Fat, woad&fangs, Myrddraal, GeneralHankerchief, Prole, TruePraetorian, Craterus, ajaxfetish, Lt. Pinard, scottishranger)

The Stranger = 1 (Rythmic)

Sigurd Fafnesbane = 1 (Andres)

Singles = 3 [GeneralHankerchief (Omanes Alexandrapolites), Beefy187 (Shlin28), molonthegreat (Tran)]

woad&fangs

02-08-2008, 02:48

nvmind

naut

02-08-2008, 02:49

For the sake of a tie and a double lynching:

Unvote: The Stranger
Vote: Glenn

TS I still have my eye on you.

Glenn = 21 (Beefy17, Big King Sanctaphrax, Brave Sir Robin, Crazed Rabbit, Elite Ferret, Glenn, Hannibalbarc, Husar, Ichigo, Joe Monks, Kagemusha, Kamikhaan, Kukrikhan, Moros, pevergreen, Sigurd Fafnesbane, Tiberius of the Drake, Twilightblade, Xehh II, & Xiahou, Rythmic)

Abstain = 10 (Alexander the Pretty Good, Chimpyang, Cowhead418, Haudegan, Ironside, johnhughthom, norwegian nerd, Northnovas, Xdeathfire, FactionHeir)

Pevergreen = 21 (LittleGrizzly, Makayane, Pannonian, Sarathos, The Stranger, TinCow, Zorg, Sasaki Kojiro, CountArach, JimBob, Charge, Louis VI the Fat, woad&fangs, Myrddraal, GeneralHankerchief, Prole, TruePraetorian, Craterus, ajaxfetish, Lt. Pinard,scottishranger)

Singles = 4 [GeneralHankerchief (Omanes Alexandrapolites), Beefy187 (Shlin28), molonthegreat (Tran), Sigurd Fafnesbane (Andres)]

scottishranger

02-08-2008, 02:51

Sorry, I forgot to Unvote: The Stranger

Csargo

02-08-2008, 03:06

What are the abilities of this so called group? I haven't seen anything in the thread that says anything about it.

Pannonian

02-08-2008, 03:12

What are the abilities of this so called group? I haven't seen anything in the thread that says anything about it.
Apparently almost their entire PM was red. However, even if this is a weak fake reveal to cover up a Don and a Luca/Made vouching for him, the game mechanics still mean that at least one of them will show up as criminal when investigated. Even if they're not willing to go into details, at least one part of their story checks out so far, and we can chase up further details given a little time. If they're scum, their story will fall apart at some point, when the investigation results come through, so they won't be escaping even if we give them a reprieve now.

Crazed Rabbit

02-08-2008, 03:13

It's not a tie if one person is voting for themselves, they'll simply unvote and vote for the other guy before the lynch.

I am slightly puzzled by the bandwagon on pevergreen. Do we have proof that he's trying to run his own mafia gang? Or is it conjecture and paranoia?

Also, looking at the 'evidence' that presumably vindicates Glenn, I must say I am unconvinced.

-He only used one of the 'code words' before he was accused - in a way that may have been natural.

-the other two 'code words' appear in a post by Glenn only after it appears that he is doomed, and after it has come out that Jimbob has claimed they have some secret role.

-the reveal of their role PM; only two lines written in non-Seamus style before the whole of the rest is red? That is ridiculous - do they not even have a section under day actions saying they can vote?

-the general fakeness of the whole role they've been claiming. I remember when I accused Sigurd of being a Don in, I think, Godfather II and he weaseled out very well by claiming to have some made up suicide bomber role.

CR

ajaxfetish

02-08-2008, 03:14

According to their own testimony, virtually their entire role pm's were red. If that is true, they would be breaking the rules to reveal their abilities. It feels almost a little too convenient, but hopefully investigation will confirm their trustworthiness or falsehood.

Ajax

ajaxfetish

02-08-2008, 03:22

It's not a tie if one person is voting for themselves, they'll simply unvote and vote for the other guy before the lynch.
Though if I'm understanding the timing right, he's only got another hour and 40 minutes to do so. Based on Glenn's flurry of posting earlier and absence for the last while, he may have already gone to bed. If he wakes up to check the status just before deadline he could change it; if not he's stuck with his current vote. We just need to keep someone (who is both in favor of a tie and voting for pevergreen) up as well, to change their vote in case Glenn changes his. I'm not sure my home internet connection is back up yet, so I may be unable to serve that function.

Ajax

naut

02-08-2008, 03:23

I have a couple questions for woad&fangs, after staring at the Who's Online List (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/online.php?order=asc&sort=location&pp=50&page=1&who=members) for an hour, why the sudden spike in PMing? Who are you contacting and why? Are you contacting ajaxfetish, he's also been PMing alot recently?

woad&fangs

02-08-2008, 03:27

I've been in contact with Pannonian about who we should protect tonight.

It's not nice to stare by the way.

naut

02-08-2008, 03:28

I've just seen you PMing, then ajaxfetish PMing, then you PMing and now ajaxfetish PMing again. Explain or is this just a coincidence?

woad&fangs

02-08-2008, 03:29

Coincidence

naut

02-08-2008, 03:29

I've been in contact with Pannonian about who we should protect tonight.

It's not nice to stare by the way.
Can Pannonian please confirm this?

Pannonian

02-08-2008, 03:32

I've just seen you PMing, then ajaxfetish PMing, then you PMing and now ajaxfetish PMing again. Explain or is this just a coincidence?
Well, I can confirm that we've been exchanging PMs. On the one hand there's the evidence you've seen of those two PMing people, though whom you don't know. On the other hand, there's the evidence I've seen of me and w&f PMing each other. Which has the greater weight, I wonder.

And no, you're not going to see those PMs.

ajaxfetish

02-08-2008, 03:33

I've just seen you PMing, then ajaxfetish PMing, then you PMing and now ajaxfetish PMing again. Explain or is this just a coincidence?
I'm not sure what you're talking about. The last pm I sent was yesterday, and the last I received was this afternoon. I have been opening my inbox fairly often (partly to refresh to see if anything new has come in, partly to review information in previous pms). How exactly does the org keep track of what I'm doing? Also, I thought I had enabled invisible mode as per Seamus' recommendation. Apparently not, whoops. I'll have to see if I can get my tech capabilities up to speed for this game.

Ajax

naut

02-08-2008, 03:41

And no, you're not going to see those PMs.
That's fine, thank you for confirming. Now I'd like to know who ajax was contacting.

Well, I can confirm that we've been exchanging PMs. On the one hand there's the evidence you've seen of those two PMing people, though whom you don't know. On the other hand, there's the evidence I've seen of me and w&f PMing each other.
I'm willing to except coincidence, but I'd rather inquire and get nothing, than leave it unanswered.

I have been opening my inbox fairly often (partly to refresh to see if anything new has come in, partly to review information in previous pms).A valid reason, yet I am not inclined to believe you 100%.

Csargo

02-08-2008, 03:54

I'm not a big fan of leaving Glenn alive, but I'm only one person. Especially with heresay as the biggest reason why he should be left alive.

CountArach

02-08-2008, 03:57

Hehe, PM watching in Capo of all games would be useless...

TruePraetorian

02-08-2008, 04:00

So, has anyone agreed to stay up for another hour exactly to watch Glenn?

Northnovas

02-08-2008, 04:01

So do we have a tie at 21 a piece for Glen and Pever with an hour to go?
Do we want to keep it tied?

norwegian nerd

02-08-2008, 04:05

I'm not gonna vote cause it seems we have them both allready.

GeneralHankerchief

02-08-2008, 04:08

Yeah, we keep it tied.

TruePraetorian

02-08-2008, 04:09

I'm not gonna vote cause it seems we have them both allready.

Well then can you stay up to make sure the vote is a tie? I will be doing so also...if im not on 5 minutes before can you take responsibility?

Lt. Pinard

02-08-2008, 04:11

I thought i read in the rules somewhere that u cant vote to lynch yourself. soooo does that mean that seamus isn't going to count his vote against him.

woad&fangs

02-08-2008, 04:15

I checked the rules thread and it didn't say anything about voting for yourself so I think that it counts.

ajaxfetish

02-08-2008, 04:18

Legal vote choices include:

1. voting by name for a living fellow townie to express your preference for their lynching
2. voting “abstain” indicating you have no preference as to who is lynched
3. voting “no lynch” indicating that you want no one lynched that day
4. voting “present” to indicate your continued participation

From the rules thread. It doesn't quite say it explicitly. The 'living fellow townie' could potentially be interpreted to mean that it can only be someone else (can you be your own 'fellow'?), but my gut instinct is to think that self-voting would be accepted. Also, I believe Seamus has included Glenn's vote for himself in his voting summaries, with no comment against it.

Ajax

norwegian nerd

02-08-2008, 04:26

Well then can you stay up to make sure the vote is a tie? I will be doing so also...if im not on 5 minutes before can you take responsibility?

I will check 5 or so before and make sure it stays tied.

woad&fangs

02-08-2008, 04:27

GeneralHankerchief

02-08-2008, 04:27

ajaxfetish, which forum skin do you use?

TruePraetorian

02-08-2008, 04:30

Who is director today, is it kommudus?

LittleGrizzly

02-08-2008, 04:47

This is getting good.

Does anyone else think we should't lynch Glenn ?

Northnovas

02-08-2008, 04:53

Who is director today, is it kommudus?
Yes he is.

I was wondering about Glen but the consensus seems to be keep it tied.

TruePraetorian

02-08-2008, 04:55

I haven't seen Glenn post in...hours...does anyone know where he is from(country-wise)?

ETA: 6 minutes until double lynching :2thumbsup:

Oh, and if it's not clear, if he changes his vote I will change my vote. We don't want 3-4 people changing at the same time...then there is no chance at all to lynch both.

EDIT: I may have to double-post, sorry you guys.

Twilightblade

02-08-2008, 05:00

7 pages of skimming done and unvote:Glenn Vote:abstain

i see no other choice but for me to step back as i may have misunderstood some of the infomation

TruePraetorian

02-08-2008, 05:01

Whaat???

He got it the second before!!!

naut

02-08-2008, 05:02

7 pages of skimming done and unvote:Glenn Vote:abstain

i see no other choice but for me to step back as i may have misunderstood some of the infomation
Is exactly on midnight is too late?

CountArach

02-08-2008, 05:03

Well then can you stay up to make sure the vote is a tie? I will be doing so also...if im not on 5 minutes before can you take responsibility?
He is an Aussie (I believe) and so am I, so I can stay online to keep up with everything.

Twilightblade - what are you doing? We need the tie to be retained...

norwegian nerd

02-08-2008, 05:03

7 pages of skimming done and unvote:Glenn Vote:abstain

i see no other choice but for me to step back as i may have misunderstood some of the infomation

Unvoting glen the minute the turn changes. Suspicious, Very suspicious. Particular reason for exactly right now. Is he your Don, or is he your Luca?

Csargo

02-08-2008, 05:03

Someone please unvote pever :wall:

norwegian nerd

02-08-2008, 05:04

Unvote:Abstain
Vote:Glen

edit: forgot to unvote

CountArach

02-08-2008, 05:04

Nevermind, Norwegian got it...

TruePraetorian

02-08-2008, 05:06

It's ok...

Voting ends at 23:00 EST

Twilight, very scummy. Very very scummy. But, it ends at 11:00, and you posted at the exact time it ended. the only way your post is valid is if it was 22:59:59...only way possible but you were too late

I immediatly cast FoS on twilight.

norwegian nerd

02-08-2008, 05:07

Agreed, very scummy. I would like to here an explanation for his near perfect timing to maybe save glen.

TruePraetorian

02-08-2008, 05:09

Sorry, double post, but NN your's don't count either, just letting you know. the rules were it ends at 23:00. He posted at 23:00, so he posted in the night phase. Ha, double lynch.

Kommodus, I ask you, as director, to preform a double-lynch on both Glenn and Pevergreen. All in favor say I.

Kommodus

02-08-2008, 05:09

So, ya'll are gonna put me in a tough position, eh? :dizzy2:

To let you know my feelings on things: I've reviewed the debate over Glenn and Jimbob, and I think their story is entirely plausible, especially considering what Myrrdraal and Pannonian have pointed out. The idea of something like a three-person secret society for the protection of the town sounds like something Seamus might very well include in the game. Besides, the idea that JimBob is Glenn's Luca is unlikely - he wouldn't have waited until Glenn's lynch was all but a foregone conclusion, then launched his defense, making an obvious connection between the two. I'm not inclined to lynch someone who is likely to have a powerful pro-town role.

Could someone summarize the case against pevergreen? Maybe we won't be lynching anyone today...

Sasaki Kojiro

02-08-2008, 05:09

When a don is lynched is that family considered out of the running?

CountArach

02-08-2008, 05:09

From a PM:

We need the vote on glenn. It makes sure we have a tie on him and pever and then we can sort out if we want to kill him and pever or just one of them.

Ahhhhhh

but i cant just change and change back as that is not my style and i sincerely think that i made a mistake voting on so little info earlier on

Sasaki Kojiro

02-08-2008, 05:11

Could someone summarize the case against pevergreen? Maybe we won't be lynching anyone today...

He's a wise guy. Bunches of wise guys joined mafia groups last game. Most of them I think, though I'd have to check that.

Twilightblade

02-08-2008, 05:11

It comes from finishing my skimming at 13:58 GMT+10 and taking 2 minutes to formulate a post

nothing more and nothing less

I also have no problems if I missed out with my unvote

CountArach

02-08-2008, 05:12

He's a wise guy. Bunches of wise guys joined mafia groups last game. Most of them I think, though I'd have to check that.
5 at least. There was my group of 3, Andres who joined late and another who joined a family very early.

TruePraetorian

02-08-2008, 05:13

Kommodus...I would hate to point the FoS at you..

Pevergreen has gained power through recruiting many "townies". He is a self-admitted wiseguy. It looks like he plans on becoming his on Mafia family.

Glenn...even if he was pro-town, if there is three does it make a difference? None have stated you need all three to work...

Seamus Fermanagh

02-08-2008, 05:15

Voting is concluded. Stand by for the lynch scene.

ajaxfetish

02-08-2008, 05:15

My intention when I tied it was to lynch neither, as the case against Glenn had just gotten very interesting and pevergreen seems to be just a wise guy, potentially trying to go mafia, but not necessarily anti-town. I support no lynching today.

ajaxfetish, which forum skin do you use?
I use the RTW skin. I got used to it as it was the default when I first joined. The switch to M2TW threw me off, so I set it to RTW.

Ajax

TruePraetorian

02-08-2008, 05:20

Has anyone thought that somewhere back there, maybe Glenn changed his vote? Maybe he edited it in one of his previous posts?? I don't feel like searching through 7 pages but i have that bad feeling that he tricked us...

Sasaki Kojiro

02-08-2008, 05:21

Out of 12 wise guys in capo 1, 7 joined the mafia. 2 got killed before they had a chance to do anything, and 1 got WoG. So, it's really in our best interest to off them. If we don't lynch pever he could join a family and kill someone tonight--perhaps even a pro-town power role.

Csargo

02-08-2008, 05:24

Should have voted Sasaki, probably would have been better off :wall:

Pannonian

02-08-2008, 05:31

When a don is lynched is that family considered out of the running?
Kralizec, Don Tataglia, was lynched on D2 in Capo, but the Tataglias recovered, eventually electing a new Don (CountArach), who incidentally started as a wise guy and joined the family on D5.

Summary (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1419051&postcount=2584)

Kommodus

02-08-2008, 05:31

Glenn...even if he was pro-town, if there is three does it make a difference? None have stated you need all three to work...

Well, we don't know this, because we don't know how the role(s) work. JimBob obviously felt pretty strongly that keeping Glenn alive was worthwhile, and as I pointed out earlier, the relationship between them doesn't seem to be Don/Luca. With votes stacked overwhelmingly against a mafioso, the others on his team almost always abandon the lost one to his fate and soldier on as best they can without him.

Some roles are cooperative, such as masons in other games. TP, I'd like to know why you're so confident that lynching Glenn wouldn't rob the town of a powerful weapon? :inquisitive:

Csargo

02-08-2008, 05:36

Some roles are cooperative, such as masons in other games. TP, I'd like to know why you're so confident that lynching Glenn wouldn't rob the town of a powerful weapon? :inquisitive:

Even if they are they're dead anyways.

TruePraetorian

02-08-2008, 05:38

Oh, i'm not sure...I just don't believe him. If he was in the same protective group as me, and I think he said he had some special power that could save people, then why the hell would he need to be in a group? Basically, if he was entirely truthful about his role, then why did he need to join a group to protect someone?

That's my thoughts, plus no one seemed to pay attention to me warning everyone of The Stranger being suspicious, so I looked for a more meaningful vote choice :yes:

CountArach

02-08-2008, 05:41

Further - remember Kommodus that if their role were entirely in red, it is unlikely that they would be able to tell everyone IT IS ENTIRELY IN RED.

TruePraetorian

02-08-2008, 05:46

Well, it's nearly 12:00 here, does anyone know when Seamus usually posts the results? It's just that I can't access a computer until around 11:00 EST (around 11 hours from now), and then another 4 hours until I get home. By then I have 5 pages to read...and hours to spend...on the game thread, and I don't want to lag behind like I did earlier today.

Sasaki Kojiro

02-08-2008, 05:47

Well, we don't know this, because we don't know how the role(s) work. JimBob obviously felt pretty strongly that keeping Glenn alive was worthwhile, and as I pointed out earlier, the relationship between them doesn't seem to be Don/Luca. With votes stacked overwhelmingly against a mafioso, the others on his team almost always abandon the lost one to his fate and soldier on as best they can without him.

Some roles are cooperative, such as masons in other games. TP, I'd like to know why you're so confident that lynching Glenn wouldn't rob the town of a powerful weapon? :inquisitive:

JimBob first tryed to keep Glenn alive by pm'ing pever and asking not to vig-kill him. He only revealed in the thread when he had no choice. An investigation would reveal all however, so we may as well wait for that.

Csargo

02-08-2008, 05:48

Tratorix

02-08-2008, 05:48

Further - remember Kommodus that if their role were entirely in red, it is unlikely that they would be able to tell everyone IT IS ENTIRELY IN RED.

Not to mention that jimbob told us several things about their "roles", despite the fact that they apparently aren't allowed to reveal anything about it. :inquisitive:

CountArach

02-08-2008, 05:48

@ True Praetorian - I guess it depends on when Kommodus tells him who to kill.

pevergreen

02-08-2008, 05:55

Oh Snap.

I can say here, I do not plan on forming my own mafia family. Never had a plan of it, never will.

My plan was to recreate the surgeon group of old capo 1.

I now ask Sarathos, Killfr3nzy and Beefy187 to acknowledge those are my plans.

I attacked Beefy187 to give a credit of protection towards those protecting him.

It may be too late if I'm dead.

Any information will be given out.

PershsNhpios

02-08-2008, 06:21

Unvote: Glenn Vote: molonthegreat

What in the blue cadwollops is going on here?

I say.. I've been away for one quarter of a day.. Alot of things went down!

naut

02-08-2008, 06:22

Too late Glenn, voting has already concluded an hour and a half ago.

CountArach

02-08-2008, 06:23

Too late Glenn, voting has already concluded an hour and a half ago.
Yes Glenn you were tied with pevergreen and may escape justice.

PershsNhpios

02-08-2008, 06:29

You mean I might receive justice.

CountArach

02-08-2008, 06:32

You mean I might receive justice.
Could be either - depends on what Kommo is thinking.

Proletariat

02-08-2008, 06:33

Where do you post from, Glenn?

naut

02-08-2008, 06:40

You mean I might receive justice.
Only if justice means a Guillotine. À la Bastille!

Kommodus

02-08-2008, 06:43

Could be either - depends on what Kommo is thinking.

Actually, it doesn't. It's out of my hands now. :shrug:

G'night everybody! :Zzzz:

Seamus Fermanagh

02-08-2008, 06:49

(Game Thread Post #729)

"Where is that Yankee ingenuity
Somebody told me how the motion picture would end
I turned and glared at them
And then I read the way the world was going to end
With a whimpering sound, not a banging away
I'm sorry I gave it away

I want a big surprise tonite
A really big surprise tonite"

-- Sparks

Sunset, Day Two

Kommodus gaveled the committee to silence. The voting session had been long and contentious, with claims and arguments bouncing around the room for more than an hour before the ballots were called for.

“I have counted the votes and that vote has been witnessed by three of the officers detailed to us by Chief Fermanagh. Having received,...”

Glenn, who’d been standing alone in the lavatory for 20 minutes stepped out into the room, his face pale and drawn, but quietly defiant. Kommodus paused and surveyed the now silent assembly.

“…Having received more votes than any other, it is the sentence of the Committee of Vigilance for Fatlington that pevergreen is to be executed.”

Glenn had just inhaled in preparation for one last defiant statement. He paused, visibly stunned at the change of events.

So was pevergreen. “That’s ludicrous!…”

Other voices broke in “It was a tie…he switched his vote late…wanted them both...what do you mean you abstained?!…”

“Count those slips again,” shouted pevergreen, “this is impossible.”

Somewhat stunned himself by the turn of events, Kommodus agreed to a re-count. This one was conducted with both Glenn and pevergreen physically restrained by Fermanagh’s muscle.

By one vote it would be Pevergreen who would die.

Kommodus led him to the table he’d prepared – or so he’d thought –- for Glenn. A sumptuous meal of fine steak, succulent lobster, exquisitely sauced summer vegetables and a perfectly sweetened cobbler of Jersey peaches for dessert. The wines accompanying each dish were of good quality – one of the finest restaurants in town had provided them – and much better than pevergreen had ever drunk.

To his credit, pevergreen worked at enjoying every morsel – offering a bite to any who wanted to enjoy the rich flavors. No one did. He commented on the flavor, and managed to down each bottle provided with its respective course.

Each course was laced with a progressively higher dose of strychnine. Fortunately for pevergreen, the wine had dulled the onset of the poisoning symptoms. The pain produced by each progressively harsher seizure was also lessened, so his groans were minimal. He had lost consciousness entirely before the grand mal seizure that killed him struck.

Somberly, the Committee adjourned, each member leaving the chamber to seek their own dinner. They stepped out into a steamy, moonless night, the air strangely still but charged with the energy of an impending storm. Nobody expected a restful night.

OOC

Wild one. nn's vote was technically late, but not decisive. Charge corrected me in post #615 as to his vote and Moros' abstention (which I read when I returned from work). I think the "tie" efforts were off after this.

Night PMs need to be in to me no later than 2330 EST 8 Feb 8.

I’ll wrap up the night summary as quickly as my weekend schedule allows. I’m projecting Day three to run from then until about 1400 EST on 10 Feb 8. We’ll try to keep to 24 hour sessions from there.

Final Vote Tally for Day Two session:

Glenn = 20 (Beefy187, Big King Sanctaphrax, Brave Sir Robin, Crazed Rabbit, Elite Ferret, Glenn, Hannibalbarc, Husar, Ichigo, Joe Monks, Kagemusha, Kamikhaan, Kukrikhan, norwegian nerd*, pevergreen, Rythmic, Sigurd Fafnesbane, Tiberius of the Drake, Xehh II, & Xiahou)

Abstain = 11 (Alexander the Pretty Good, Chimpyang, Cowhead418, FactionHeir, Haudegan, Ironside, johnhughthom, Moros, Northnovas, Twilightblade, Xdeathfire)

Pevergreen = 21 (ajaxfetish, Charge, CountArach, Craterus, GeneralHankerchief, JimBob, LittleGrizzly, Louis VI the Fat, Lt. Pinard, Makayane, Myrddraal, Pannonian, Proletariat, Sasaki Kojiro, Sarathos, scottishranger, The Stranger, TinCow, TruePraetorian, woad&fangs, Zorg)

Singles = 4 [Beefy187 (Shlin28), GeneralHankerchief (Omanes Alexandrapolites), molonthegreat (Tran), Sigurd Fafnesbane (Andres)].

Not Voting = 22 (Caeser the III, Caius, Draco Leman, Dutch_guy, Evil_Maniac from Mars, Fahad I, gibsonsg91921, Hiji, Jubal_Barca, Killfr3nzy, Kommodus {not allowed}, Leet Erikson, Lord Winter, molonthegreat, Motep, Roadkill, Rob_the_Celt, sapi, taka, Warluster, Warmaster Horus, x-dANGEr)

Dead = 1 (Drisos)

PershsNhpios

02-08-2008, 06:54

.............................

OH - MY - GOD!

I WILL EDIT THIS!

JimBob.. and others - you have almost certainly put yourselves in the firing line, by god, it is so telling of how great the teamwork really was behind the scenes that you could save me like this.
I have determined even more clearly who is innocent and who is not by viewing the responses.

How many innocent people were willing to believe Pannonian's logic, and how few simply wanted me dead.

I really don't know what to type.. I really don't know how I'm going to survive the night - but I survived the day, didn't I?

Now that I can be a part of my role again.. I can help my comrades wield the sword I spoke of - for the people I spoke of. I may not have the most powerful pro-town role, but with time our strength will grow.

I thought speaking so freely of my actual role itself would only lead to the Mafia killing me anyway, so I gave out all the information and speculation I had, and hoped it would be enough.
Then I left to get on with my real work as I thought I was dead.

I apologise to Louis VI the Fat. I renounce every suspicion of him.

I also apologise to The Stranger, and everything I did to put him in the guise of Mafia.

I am very relieved, not only that I live, but that by Jimbob's heroic efforts, and in return the efforts of those he contacted, and Pannonian, that they not only saved me but they also brought the Townies closer together, that we may work as a township and not against each other!

Pevergreen.. For my part, I believed you innocent. You had strange intentions. But I think there may of been a mistake made in his death.

I don't mean to be ingrateful - but I must announce my uncertainty in his guilt.

Thank you, those who believed my cavalry, my supports - I can now return to my role - at least until the morning.

CountArach

02-08-2008, 07:15

Glenn - realise now that you shouldn't be alive now - many of us who voted pevergreen also wanted you dead. Don't read too much into the list of people who followed Pann. Not that we don't like you, its just that we still think you are scum.

Why are you suddenly not suspicious of Louis or TS?

Zorg

02-08-2008, 07:18

Wow..... :drama3:

I really did not see that coming... That said, Pevergreen was someone I truely did not trust and I think that in the case he had bad intentions (whatever he may say) the town is in a better place with his death.

I don't have time to write much more (going to a Chinese new year dinner now) but I will post up some other thoughts when I get back.

I'm still in shock, this game just keeps getting more and more crazy.

PershsNhpios

02-08-2008, 07:21

Why am I not suspicious of Louis or TS?

Because they went from threatening to kill me to saving my life for no apparent reason... Just like Night 1.

Did Seamus not tell me something??

Then again, alot of people went from trying to have me killed to wanting me alive.. You have not idea how grateful I am, I shall return the favour for as long as I'm alive.
Which might not be long.

naut

02-08-2008, 07:23

alot of people went from trying to have me killed to wanting me and pevergreen dead
Fixed it for you.

Sasaki Kojiro

02-08-2008, 07:23

You'll probably be lynched tomorrow along with Jimbob.

ajaxfetish

02-08-2008, 07:26

Partially depends on whether you survive the night and whether we get access to relevant investigation reports.

Ajax

Sarathos

02-08-2008, 07:56

Partially depends on whether you survive the night.

Thats a very good point. Be fearful Glenn, fearful of your life. But BL to pevergreen, stuff happens.

pevergreen

02-08-2008, 08:00

Happy W&F?

Next time leave personal grudges out of mafia games. If you dont like me **** * ****.

Beefy187

02-08-2008, 08:03

I beefy although knowing it is probebly late testifies that, Pevers intention was pure and terribly misunderstood. :sweatdrop:

He got what he wanted (Die famous) and it is a shame that I couldnt came any earlier.

If there is anyone who still wants to make docter groups please contact me.

and ill remind you again. Good luck because you need them if you want to kill me:beam:

JimBob

02-08-2008, 09:14

JimBob first tryed to keep Glenn alive by pm'ing pever and asking not to vig-kill him. He only revealed in the thread when he had no choice. An investigation would reveal all however, so we may as well wait for that.
I tried to go through back channels because I didn't want to reveal myself to everyone and draw fire. I fear I may be attacked tonight. Would a detective reveal on the first day, unless there was another option?

Further - remember Kommodus that if their role were entirely in red, it is unlikely that they would be able to tell everyone IT IS ENTIRELY IN RED.

Not to mention that jimbob told us several things about their "roles", despite the fact that they apparently aren't allowed to reveal anything about it.
The fact that it is not in red is not in red. Seamus hasn't had a problem with it so far (to my knowledge). My understanding is that the rules mean we cannot tell details. I'm trying to be round about and vague. I hope this is in the spirit of the rules.

JimBob and Glenn, were you using those 2 instances pann pointed out to communicate?
Glenn has been broadcasting from the beginning. His user title included. I showed up for the first time on the 7th, I'd been sick in RL and away from the computer. I came back to find on of my partners, and then discover him on the chopping block. I went into over drive to pull him out because we had no idea who our third was. I started working them in quickly.
See also: Post 10 (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1823410&postcount=10)

Btw Jimbob and Glenn, what's your story as to how glenn survived the killing group?
We've got special rules. I can't say more.

I'd like to apologize to pever. I've got to save my own comrades, so we can do what we need to. It'll come out for the town.

pevergreen

02-08-2008, 09:23

I hope so. Thats what I was gunning for.

TBH, If I had been convinced by Jimbob or Glenn, my plan to stop their lynch was get myself lynched.

Makanyane

02-08-2008, 09:28

Happy W&F?

Next time leave personal grudges out of mafia games. If you dont like me **** * ****.
what he was doing was just getting you sympathy / protection (whether deliberately or not), your own moves are the ones that caused suspicion.

I hope so. Thats what I was gunning for.

TBH, If I had been convinced by Jimbob or Glenn, my plan to stop their lynch was get myself lynched.
you're not really trying to pull the idea that this was self sacrifice are you? :laugh4:

PershsNhpios

02-08-2008, 09:44

This was not self-sacrifice, but Pevergreen was willing to help if he could be convinced of my innocence.
Considering the fact I had being supplying so much detail with his name, I could not blame him for despising me.

As I have said, I feel Pevergreen was innocent, Wise-guy or Townie, who was either at first being recruited into the Mafia, and trying to win, "Brownie Points", or he was simply trying to organise as many people as possible under his power - which is valid due to his apparent nature and attitude.
He wanted to be on top of things.

pevergreen

02-08-2008, 09:50

It wasnt Sacrifice as Glenn noted.

I went too active and tried to get more people on my side. Bad move.

The Stranger

02-08-2008, 09:53

whahahahhahahah!!!!! TIHAAA!!

Sasaki Kojiro

02-08-2008, 10:02

I tried to go through back channels because I didn't want to reveal myself to everyone and draw fire. I fear I may be attacked tonight. Would a detective reveal on the first day, unless there was another option?

The fact that it is not in red is not in red. Seamus hasn't had a problem with it so far (to my knowledge). My understanding is that the rules mean we cannot tell details. I'm trying to be round about and vague. I hope this is in the spirit of the rules.

2. Here is where information as to any whacky individual characteristics will go. They will NOT be for sharing with any other player, but may provide you some advantage. ANY information in RED on your rolesheets is to be held in strict confidence and NOT shared in any manner during the game without the express prior consent of the Game host. You have been warned. Save it for your post-game write up.

Glenn has been broadcasting from the beginning. His user title included. I showed up for the first time on the 7th, I'd been sick in RL and away from the computer. I came back to find on of my partners, and then discover him on the chopping block. I went into over drive to pull him out because we had no idea who our third was. I started working them in quickly.
See also: Post 10 (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1823410&postcount=10)

So your custom title is "The blade" and Glenn's mentions the axe. Now, what's up with this:

I want to state my last words.

"I want everyone to know that I crusaded in the name of the axe, blade and crown of the Township authority.
I was a detective with a sword.
A sword so heavy it would require three men to lift.

... Let's do the time warp again!"

Here Glenn says that he is the blade. On the other hand post 10 would actually be a reasonable breadcrumb.