Capo de Tutti Capi - II [Concluded]

[Seamus Fermanagh]

Using a "blind" to do posting is perfectly legal. As Capo I teaches it is also not a foolproof defense.

Referring to the "red" material in specific fashion, using a blind or not, could get you wogged.

Using a 2nd account of your own, if detected, would not only get you wogged but it might get you banned. TosaInu is NOT amused by such.

[Pannonian]

Well I looked through the rules briefly and didn't see anything about it. The writing style looks like Glenn's though.
So yet another claim to add to his catalogue. I'm pretty sure that, were we to look at the red part of his PM, we will see that he gets 10 investigations per night.

[Tratorix]

So yet another claim to add to his catalogue. I'm pretty sure that, were we to look at the red part of his PM, we will see that he gets 10 investigations per night.

Plus he's invulnerable to night kills, and if they find their mysterious "third member" will have vigilante kills too. ~:rolleyes:

[TinCow]

Let's make sure we take care of this once and for all with the day 3 lynching.

[Csargo]

Well chewy has made one post on this board in the Hail new members thread.


Hello ppl, i am finally an Orgah like my brother :2thumbsup:

Brother=Glenn? joined 1-30 last activity was today

Has anyone else received a PM from chewy?

[Chimpyang]

There is also the third type of player, those who both find you annoying and decided to vote for Kagemusha....if you apply critical thinking, the two events are not mutually exclusive and therefore there is hole in your logic there!

I also disagree that you overactive FoS - which has translated into countless posts, have actually helped the town whatsoever. I believe that you have spread the suspicion so wide that we have begin to let events of the past merge into darkness. In fact, we forget the minor hints that may just be the mistake that a mafioso makes. How quickly has this thread forgotten NN's mistake (either innocent or incriminating) on the first day? Did we stop to question? No, because you are intentionally pulling the thread away from such issues. In fact, the chaotic scene (on the face of it, we do not see the flurry of PM's going on) is promoting discord amongst townies themselves. So please, if you are truly pro-town, at least consider my side of the argument.

Anyways, if you refer back to my voting post....you will find that I have put what I consider to be a perfectly valid reason down. You have not queried this reason per se, rather, you decided to attack me with a flippant line of reasoning - one that I couldn't resist countering with sarcasm. So if you have a problem with my initial reasoning, go ahead, ask away, happy to accommodate your questions.

[TruePraetorian]

I see Robin sent me a message. To clear things up everyone, chewy is MY little brother, but I didn't ask him to post that. I could easily go on his computer and see who it was if that's not against the rules? If I go on his computer would that be against game policy? Forum Policy?

edit: asked if it was ok

[Moros]

Hmm I missed voting.

[Crazed Rabbit]

I see Robin sent me a message. To clear things up everyone, chewy is MY little brother, but I didn't ask him to post that. I could easily go on his computer and see who it was if that's not against the rules? If I go on his computer would that be against game policy? Forum Policy?

edit: asked if it was ok

Well, this is uncharted waters for mafia rules. I don't know what Seamus thinks, but the issue here might be whatever rules the Org has on logging in on a relative's account. Though, from my experience here I've seen people log on to a relative's account and post, so it shouldn't be a big problem.

And Seamus does allow intermediaries not in the game to be used. And he also said there are hazards to that. I guess this is one of them. I* say go for it.

CR
*I am not an Org Moderator, nor do I play one on TV.

[Csargo]

I see Robin sent me a message. To clear things up everyone, chewy is MY little brother, but I didn't ask him to post that. I could easily go on his computer and see who it was if that's not against the rules? If I go on his computer would that be against game policy? Forum Policy?

edit: asked if it was ok

I don't see why we would need too. The style looks extremely like Glenn's and I'm pretty sure it is his.

[Seamus Fermanagh]

I see Robin sent me a message. To clear things up everyone, chewy is MY little brother, but I didn't ask him to post that. I could easily go on his computer and see who it was if that's not against the rules? If I go on his computer would that be against game policy? Forum Policy?

edit: asked if it was ok

WIthout his permission, it would be a breach of your sib's privacy.

CR is correct that this is so far outside the realm of what comes into a normal mafia game, that I had not considered the point.

I will make no ruling on this.

[JimBob]

I don't see why we would need too. The style looks extremely like Glenn's and I'm pretty sure it is his.

I can guarantee you that it is not Glenn's work. Our group has been pursuing other leads, Sarathos has not been a major blip on our radar yet. We really haven't thought about him much, he's not too important to us right now (no offense man~:)).

I have Glenn's assurance that he was not the sender of that message. And you have my assurance that our group did not send it.

[TevashSzat]

Bah, missed the voting. My head hurts right now from all the analysis/accusations going on and all I can pretty definately say is that probably a great number of those throwing accusations at each other are scummy because if that any people come up with all of this contradictary "evidence," some people are blatantly lying

[Csargo]

Well, that leaves TP. It makes sense. The odds of some mafia player PMing another member of this game's brother is extremely unlikely.

[Caius]

I am willing to join a group.

[TruePraetorian]

Ichigo, you have to think how sensless that would make me. If im not mistaken, ip addresses can be traced. PMing possibly the closest link in the forums to do me a favor is hardly reasonable, and I like to think of myself as at least a little reasonable. Honestly, if I were to do it i'd at least select someone that i have no connection to.

[KukriKhan]

WIthout his permission, it would be a breach of your sib's privacy.

CR is correct that this is so far outside the realm of what comes into a normal mafia game, that I had not considered the point.

I will make no ruling on this.

Fine decision IMO. :bow: This is Moderator territory, and I trust Andres can/will handle it.

[Tratorix]

Well, that leaves TP. It makes sense. The odds of some mafia player PMing another member of this game's brother is extremely unlikely.

He might as well have just sent it himself. His brother has one post on the org., which identifies him as TP's brother. It took me about thirty seconds to track that connection down.

[TruePraetorian]

He might as well have just sent it himself. His brother has one post on the org., which identifies him as TP's brother. It took me about thirty seconds to track that connection down.

Don't know his pass

[Tratorix]

Don't know his pass

I meant you might as well have just sent it with your account. :oops:

[TruePraetorian]

But if it was sent from my account then why would my brother be involved at all?

EDIT: oh I see, sent it to him.
Well, I got nothing to hide. I've been in 3 protection groups so far, including tonight, so i hope thats enough to clear my name. Due to the close link with our names i blame no one who accuses me...just hope you can see that me choosing my own brother would be a pretty dumb move on my part. If anyone can think of some way to prove i didn't do it then please let me hear.

[Tratorix]

I was trying to point out that it would be pointless for you to send pm's through your brother when there is such a clear link between the 2 of you. If you sent a threatening pm to someone through him it would be easily traced back to you.

[TruePraetorian]

Ah, I see (in my edit), thats also what im trying to say. Not much I can do about it though, just hope everyone else can reason it out like you.

[Csargo]

He might as well have just sent it himself. His brother has one post on the org., which identifies him as TP's brother. It took me about thirty seconds to track that connection down.

You're right. I went back and looked at the thread and noticed the post after chewy's first one. It links them pretty clearly, so I'm pretty sure it isn't TP.

[Zorg]

I was wrong, a double lynch is possible. Congrats to everyone who made that possible.

I have still yet to hear about the exact specifics of holmes, but I guess we'll now be able to see how effective it is.

[Husar]

It makes perfect sense that TP would make a second account, write a very suspicious PM with it and then come here to tell everybody that he has access to that account. :dizzy2:

[CountArach]

It makes perfect sense that TP would make a second account, write a very suspicious PM with it and then come here to tell everybody that he has access to that account. :dizzy2:
WIFOM :laugh4:

[Csargo]

I was wrong, a double lynch is possible. Congrats to everyone who made that possible.

I have still yet to hear about the exact specifics of holmes, but I guess we'll now be able to see how effective it is.

https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?t=78384

[Zorg]

Thanks for that, it has answered all the questions I had about that. And quite interesting too.:nice:

[Sarathos]

My bad guys, I read the rules differently.

[Omanes Alexandrapolites]

Using a non-player as a proxy was used in Capo I - one family sent a PM to pevergreen using AndresTheCunning (now known as Andres). He later entered the game as a wise guy after gaining a substantial number of votes for him to be lynched before he even began playing. In this case, as far as I know, nothing was done about it.

[Csargo]

I might as well post my reasoning for voting GH since I have nothing better to do.

My first question (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1827667&postcount=785)

Very blunt and direct. He seems very closed off to me.

My response and his reply (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1827677&postcount=790)

Yet again a very direct and blunt answer. To me this seems like an angry response as well, but I could be mistaking anger for disinterest.



So, who do you think deserves to be lynched next round?
@Ichigo: I don't know, it depends on what the Detectives say regarding their investigation targets during the night phase.

I'd expect GH to have some suspicion of at least a couple of people at this point and a few people he would consider worthy of being lynched.



I'm sure you know that in the third round it's highly unlikely that a Detective would reveal anything. I expected a much better response from you honestly. So, who's the most suspicious person in your opinion?
In my opinion, the most suspicious people are Sigurd and Stranger.

I can't see why Drisos would do a fake reveal, especially after he died, unless he was hoping for a quick lynch (i.e. before his role was determined). Stranger is suspicious for his usual shenanigans, but it could just be normal behavior.

Yet again nothing that is of really any help to me trying to read his behavior. Nothing that isn't already obvious to most other people. I know there are more people that GH suspects at this point.

At this point other than the guilty result people have gotten on GH it seems he's disinterested in this game. Maybe because he's garnered a lot of attention from the beginning or just doesn't want to play. I'm not really sure at this point and the only person who can really answer this question is GH. So what is it buddy?

[Andres]

I trust pann and kommo despite the criminal results. They've both been working for the town. Kommo also hates being mafia. Pann has claimed wise guy and kommo has claimed townie.

This differs from Andres who hasn't claimed wise guy or townie and is instead casting doubt on the investigators. So it's pretty clear he's mafia.



So, after a 'criminal' result, Kommo claims townie and thus he's no longer suspicious.

:inquisitive:

Andres did not claim a fake role, thus he is guilty.

Like I said to Drisos: please put some effort in your accusations. Or better: let your mafia buddies kill me tonight instead of trying to get me lynched with really bad reasoning.

[Csargo]

You're off a bit with your style Andres. It's strange.

[PershsNhpios]

P.S. Andres... Made a decision on the lynch yet?

[Andres]

You're off a bit with your style Andres. It's strange.

I'm getting annoyed about these random accusations based on nothing. It's as ridiculous as getting lynched because your name starts with an A.

@Glenn: I asked Seamus to lynch them both.

[Csargo]

I'm getting annoyed about these random accusations based on nothing. It's as ridiculous as getting lynched because your name starts with an A.

Don't worry yourself about it. It's currently 3:30am and I don't feel like sifting through a bunch of posts to find the one I'm thinking of. Why are you angry? I didn't accuse you of being guilty I said your play was off a bit. Whether that means something or not has yet to be found out in my mind.

[Husar]

Haven't seen anything but "Andres is weird" so I say Andres is right. :2thumbsup:

I hope I'm weird as well, only the cool guys are.

[Beefy187]

I would much rather be lynched because im wierd then stupid reason such as "Anonymus message" saying "Beefy is guilty"

[Sarathos]

Hahaha, wouldn't we all. Btw, is it still voting phase?

[Beefy187]

Nah its night phrase

[Seamus Fermanagh]

Lynch write up completed. Both died by hanging.

Remember that night orders are due no later than 1400 EST today, that's about 4.5 hours hence.

[The Stranger]

when is the reveal of drisos' role

[Caius]

I think in Day 3 or 4.

[The Stranger]

day 3 has already passed hasnt it?

[Pannonian]

Gruesome. Were the details Andres' or Seamus' doing?

The Stranger: The autopsies for the first killings and lynchings appear after tonight.

[Seamus Fermanagh]

Revelation speed, e.g.

Dead night #1 = revelation Day #4
Dead day #2 = revelation Day #5


@ Panno. My details, Andres just said "lynch both." I used the verb literally. And what is film noir without a little "dark" imagery? :devilish:

[Caius]

I think that, being a lot of players, everyone posts his/her black list and their reasoning. In that way, something will see the light in those black lists.

[The Stranger]

i doubt i understand you... what are black lists?

[Seamus Fermanagh]

Night Three Endeth

Standeth by for Summary....eth.

[The Stranger]

bleugh...

[Omanes Alexandrapolites]

i doubt i understand you... what are black lists?A Black List, in this case, is a list of individuals who are considered untrustworthy. It can also be used to describe a list of persons who are banned from a specific activity. You can find a full list of meanings for the term here (http://dictionary.reference.com/search?q=blacklist).

~:)

[The Stranger]

thanx :)

[Moros]

is it now day or night or...?

[Charge]

day... results soon

[Northnovas]

I just noticed the last tally in the no lynch I did abstain but was not counted there were only 4 and there should have been 5. My director vote was counted.
Just to note I have been voting.

[Drisos]

Ah, good, so both are lynched. :2thumbsup:

Another mention. I don't believe you, TruePraetorian.

A) You pm with a very good reason for your behaviour. since next night, I will be revealed dectective by seamus, so you can trust me. ~;)
B) I will be yelling around here that you should be lynched. :balloon2: :book: :yes:

Edit: I can imagine you not wanting to give in because now you heard people've even been banned for double accounts. Go ahead and explain all nicely to Tosa, and apologize. If you do so, it won't be problem, I think. I think no one wants you to get a temp ban, or whatever. And I can imagine these kinds of efforts in the heat of game. I've noticed myself really pretending this all is real and begin quite agressive here and there in the game. It's just because of the game, I'm more friendly normally. (I hope ~;p)

[woad&fangs]

I like Caius' idea of posting your own personal "black list". I'll wait until the night is over until I make one(If I made it through the night.)

Edit: I say that we spare the axe on Glenn and Jimbob for now. I think that the WoG's will come at the end of this round so the inactive "crown" role will hopefully be WoG'd and the role redistributed to a random townie. If someone doesn't come forward claiming the "crown role" by day 4 then we'll know with 100% positivity that Glenn and Jimbob are Don and Luca.

[PershsNhpios]

Ha! That is if I survived Night 3... I've got a bad feeling my luck is running out! No - no speculation, just instinct.

[TruePraetorian]

I just have something to say to all my accusers, and I think it is the thing that can clear my name.

If the account was made 1-30, and Mafia started february something, then why would I make another account if I didn't even have my role? It's obvious that it is pure coincidence. Go ahead and call for my name to be lynched, but honestly just because we are related doesn't mean I did it..

And for all of you wanting proof I have a brother and he's not made up, I can post some pics of him, or even give you guys his myspace. His myspace name is even chewy....Matthew, nickname Mattchew, after starwars nickname became chewy..sometimes even Chewybacca.

EDIT: And also, has it occured to anyone that this might've been the plan? I mean, I did post right after my brother declaring us related...maybe the sender saw this as the "perfect skapegoat"?

[CountArach]

I for one believe you. It wouldn't be a good idea to point out he is your brother, so I don't think you did get him to send that for you.

[PershsNhpios]

I wouldn't worry TP, the fact you haven't cared much for Sarathos and instead hunted for my blood is probably reason enough that you wouldn't go to such lengths to contact him.
I have to go in a moment.. hope the results come through!
Anxious!

[JimBob]

Edit: I say that we spare the axe on Glenn and Jimbob for now. I think that the WoG's will come at the end of this round so the inactive "crown" role will hopefully be WoG'd and the role redistributed to a random townie. If someone doesn't come forward claiming the "crown role" by day 4 then we'll know with 100% positivity that Glenn and Jimbob are Don and Luca.
Do remember that the WoG will be announced. Seamus says in the rules thread that it will be 3 missed lynch votes, D4 is probable. But, I know that in Capo I I didn't replace RTWGuru as detective until D6. So let's wait until the WoG is announced, shall we?

[TruePraetorian]

How many people can suffer from WoG at one time? I've only seen around 30 people post so far.

[CountArach]

How many people can suffer from WoG at one time? I've only seen around 30 people post so far.
As many as there are who don't post. There have been very large-scale WoGs in the past.

[Seamus Fermanagh]

This is main thread post #1316

“Take a good look at yourself.
Your eyes always glaring always comparing
you can't stop your starring because there's always something wrong
Pull apart my heart, Scratch out my soul
Silence my dreams, When you see fit
This blood feud of chains and ice,
This blood feud has gone on too long
Cast your judgement somewhere else
Cast your judgement on yourself
Burn my idols but what about yours”
-- Xdisciplex


Summary, Night Three


taka was just a bit paranoid this evening. But is it really paranoia if they ARE out to get you? He’d gotten himself a car with a driver/guard and bullet resistant armoring. He now carried a revolver and wore a bulletproof vest – trusting to luck twice is pushing it – and the driver varied his route home. He needn’t have bothered.

At a stoplight, a loaded gravel truck rammed taka’s stopped car from behind. Since the vehicle he’d stopped behind was also a loaded gravel truck, taka’s armored ride was crunched and mangled and completely immobilized. taka was knocked senseless.

The gravel truck drivers exited their trucks – they had been prepared for the collision – and using the 10-gallon containers they’d brought with them started dousing taka’s car with gasoline, pouring it into the car wherever a crack in the armor, chassis, or glass made this possible. The guard/driver attempted to smash the broken driver’s window and exit the vehicle but was stopped by a third man who pushed the muzzle of a shotgun through the window crack the driver had been trying to enlarge and pulped his face with two blasts of a shotgun. The gasoline was all poured when the third man tossed in a lit match. Waking up in a panic, taka tried to use his gun to get out. It didn’t work. taka died screaming.


Caius was researching at the Fatlington Public Library when the attack came. Shadowy figures blocked every exit from that section of the stacks – all of them with silenced pistols. Caius glanced around, terror spiking adrenalin through his system. The only door not occupied by an armed shadow figure was the one to the back stairwell.

<<So that’s where the attack will come from,>> thought Caius. <<The others are here to block my escape.>>

He crept over next to the door, hoping against hope that he’d be able to overpower this attack and make a break for it. The door opened slowly.

Caius slammed the encyclopedia he’d been reading into the head of the… <<Librarian,>> thought Caius? The librarian had gone down like she’d been hit by a tree; the noise bringing the other gunmen forward into the stacks. Caius made a break down the stairs and got away from the Library. He had no idea why the stairwell had been uncovered, but he was more than willing to take advantage of the attacker’s miscue.


Beefy187 pushed through the crowd in the taproom to make his exit and head home. He checked carefully as he exited, but things seemed clear. He was two blocks toward home when a bright light struck his vision. His night vision shot, he couldn’t see anything but vague shadows.

“Don’t move,” said a husky voice.

“What do you want,” asked Beefy?

“Check your pocket.”

He did. A book? Someone had slipped a book into his pocket as he left the bar. He fished it out and it opened to a marked page. It was a Bible, and a passage from Exodus had been circled: “Keep thee far from a false matter; and the innocent and righteous slay thou not: for I will not justify the wicked.”

Said the voice from the dark, “Exodus 23:7.”

“Can you turn off that light,” asked Beefy. He wasn’t sure what this mysterious figure wanted.

“Well, you’re NOT on the road to Damascus, so yes.”

An object whistled out of the dark, blocking part of the intense light and struck Beefy in the head. He went from light to dark in an instant.

It took Fermanagh’s team a while to find the body. Beefy187 had been quartered and floated off on four different weather balloons. The pieces, caught in trees or on roof antennae, took some time to collect. Each of the pieces had been stripped and painted with the number “216” painted on the chunk. The marked bible was found rubber-banded into Beefy’s left hand.


Evil_Maniac from Mars had gone home quietly, as he had the other nights. He was a fastidious fellow, for the most part, and definitely preferred his own cooking to that of the local restaraunts.

The attack came through both the front and back doors at once. The first attacker was met by a frying pan and hot oil flung his direction as he leveled his pistol. The attacker ducked, but never got off the shot. His jump carried him into the second assailant at the back door, knocking them both off their feet.

Evil dove down the cellar stairs, bolting the door behind him. He’d made it to the phone and dialed the operator by the time the men upstairs had started to break it down with a table – it was not your average interior door – but the men retreated when they’d heard the sirens.

Evil breathed a sigh of relief and shook his head. If the attackers had been only a bit better organized….


In restrospect, Zorg might have made it if he’d had less to drink with dinner. He’d stopped in the men’s room on the way out the door – checking to make sure nobody was in there. He hadn’t quite finished recycling some of his beverages when gunfire erupted through the door, showering the room with splinters, ricochets, and the last of his recycling effort – it’s hard to keep one’s aim true when attacked by surprise.

Still, he might have made it save for the small bathroom window. The window was too small to escape from but plenty large enough to admit a bundle of German-style stick grenades. He bled out before the ambulance crew arrived. The presence of a single perfect yellow rose was never explained.


Andres was exiting his favorite restaurant at about the same time – with nearly the same greeting awaiting him. He hadn’t gone two steps when someone across the small street opened up on him with a tommy gun. Andres had seen the glint of the muzzle as the weapon came up and – reacting quickly – sought cover. At that very moment a LaSalle rolled up to the curb and stopped in front of Andres, giving him the cover he needed.

The shooting went on for a little while, but Andres was well protected behind the motor block of the car. Andres looked around for a flanking attack, for a second gunman, but nobody materialized. With sirens wailing nearby, the gunman had faded into the shadows.

Only one of the cars screeched to a stop near Andres, the other one – and an ambulance – were headed to a different scene. When Andres stood to check on and thank the driver, there was nobody in the car.


Pannonian never actually knew what hit him. He’d been standing at the trolley stop – surrounded by plenty of potential witnesses and with a Fatlington police officer standing behind him. He only had a moment to register that the trolley car was coming toward the stop WAY too fast when the police officer “accidentally” bumped into him from behind. He was shoved into the path of the Trolley, which hit him doing more than 60 miles-per-hour. He landed hard and his neck snapped – there was little pain. The empty trolley never stopped until the end of the line.

The police officer made his way quickly to Pannonian’s corpse to see if he could “help.” Nobody saw him place the little pink ballet shoes in “3rd position” on Pannonian’s corpse, and nobody could identify him moments later when the real police showed up.


The Stranger was following his daily routine of taking a midnight stroll through the park – though perhaps a little more cautiously than usual -- when he felt a sharp pain stab his neck.

<<Damn mosiquitos,>> he thought. But the pain didn’t quite go away and his vision started to blur. He leaned against a bench, his balance suddenly chancy. <<Some kind of drug,>> he wondered, his mind not forming the thoughts easily.

”For you, The Stranger, death will no longer be a stranger,” said a deep voice from the shadows, chuckling at his own horrid pun.

The Stranger collapsed, never to awaken. His head was placed in a wire noose, the number “4” painted on his chest, and a crosses cut deeply into either cheek. When the weather balloon that had been attached to the noose was released his head was half severed and he shot up through the trees of the little park by the beach. Had The Stranger not been caught by the thick summer foliage of the tallest tree, it is hard to say if his body would ever have been recovered.


GeneralHankerchief was not in the mood to be trusting. His bungalow was pretty solidly built and he’d decided to have a last drink for the evening while sitting in a comfy chair – with his back to a wall and a gun sitting on the armrest.

“Always be prepared,” he said, quoting the boyscout motto while toasting himself.

But he wasn’t prepared when the wall of the bungalow itself – followed by a Packard – came crashing towards him. Stunned and pummeled by brick, glass, and beams, he couldn’t defend himself -- but against all the odds he didn't have to. Just as the attackers exited the car, the floor beneath GeneralHankerchief collapsed.

GH fell into the sandy bottom of the hole only to have a section of the bungalow roof above him cover the hole like a hatch. He wasn't much more than scratched and bruised. The police would be hours digging him out, and the attackers were long since gone, but at least he'd acquired a new -- albeit pretty banged up -- Packard as a trade in for his Bungalow.


Glenn hid nervously in his apartment, wondering his time was up. Sure he felt a little paranoid – who wouldn’t after the last couple of days he’d had. Checking his locks and perimeter once more, Glenn climbed into bed to try to get some sleep.

He was not prepared for the explosion. Dynamite, secreted into the floor beneath his bed, smashed his bedroom and bed into kindling, bringing the whole assemblage down into the bedroom of the apartment beneath his and stunning the two hooded and trench-coated people who had been waiting in that room as well as leaving Glenn half-deaf and immobile.

A cloaked figure entered the room, carefully thumping the hooded men with a statue to make sure they wouldn’t interfere.

”You deserve more pain than a quick death for your heresy,” said the figure. “But needs must…” He jabbed a syringe into the dazed Glenn, who quickly faded into unconsciousness.

“You can stop this right now,” said another man just entering the room, hat low over his face and a shotgun held tightly in gloved hands. “Your shadow is about to be ‘lit up.’”

“My path is like shining light, that grows in brilliance till perfect day,” said the figure who had stabbed Glenn as he lobbed the statue at the gunman.

The gunman fired, shattering the statue, but never got off a second shot. The syringe, flung just after the statue, had found its mark in the gunman, who dropped without a sound. The dark figure lifted Glenn over his shoulders and made off into the night.

Glenn awoke just before dawn, pulled back into consciousness by the searing pain in his stomach. He couldn’t move. Each of his limbs had been pinned to the flat tarred roof of some building, held down with what looked like horseshoes that had been hammered into the roof. The pain in his lower abdomen was a searing fire, and his left hand felt sore.

His eyes shifted. His hand held the tether of some kind of huge weather balloon, his grip rapidly weakening as he held back the massive lift – yet somehow he knew he shouldn’t let go. On the back of his left hand three lines had been written: “Jeremia, then below that 48:10, and immediately below that the numbers LQKI.” It made no sense. The burning pain grew even more intense. Glenn blinked, weakening, and let go the tether.

Released at last, the weather balloon shot skyward. It’s tether, simple rope at first, had been securely knotted to the severed end of Glenn’s large intestine. The balloon unreeled his viscera at a rapid pace disemboweling him as it raced skyward. As it hit the limit of its new “tether,” the balloon pulled free and floated far and away – away from Fatlington. The “rope” returned to the general vicinity of its dying owner.

Fermanagh’s team had hit the “dry heaves” stage by the time they were able to process the crime scene.


Morning, Day Four:


Fermanagh looked horrible, like he'd been dry-heaving his guts to get ready for his report. He went through the night's events in a numbed fashion, then paused.

"I have to reveal now that I've known Drisos' identity all along, though my team researched everything just to be sure," said Commissioner Fermanagh. "Drisos was a Fatlington detective, and a damned good one. I don't know how those mafia scum found out about him, but I hope you send every last one of them to Hell."

Fermanagh stormed out of the room, visibly shaking. Director Louis VI the Fat took over the meeting, explaining the procedures that would be used at the sunset gathering later.



OOC

Sorry this took so long, but I think you can see why. I'll take a dinner break and then start passing out results PMs.

1. Voting for the Day 4 Lynch will conclude at 2000 HRS EST, 13 Feb 08 (0100 next day GMT). Louis is director and should PM me the particulars to be used.

2. Here’s a Full list of players to date:

Still Alive: (68) ajaxfetish, Alexander the Pretty Good, Andres, Big King Sanctaphrax, Brave Sir Robin, Caeser the III, Caius, Charge, Chimpyang, CountArach, Cowhead418, Craterus, Crazed Rabbit, Draco Leman, Dutch guy, Elite Ferret, Evil_Maniac from Mars, FactionHeir, Fahad I, GeneralHankerchief, gibsonsg91921, Haudegen, Hiji, Husar, Ichigo, Ironside, JimBob, Joe Monks, johnhughthom, Jubal_Barca, Kagemusha, KamiKhaan, Killfr3nzy, Kommodus, KukriKhan, Leet Erikson, LittleGrizzly, Louis VI the Fat, Lt. Pinard, Makanyane, molonthegreat, Moros, Motep, Myrrdraal, Northnovas, norwegian nerd, Omanes Alexandrapolites, Proletariat, Roadkill, Rob_the_Celt, Rythmic, sapi, Sarathos, Sasaki Kojiro, scottishranger, shlin28, Sigurd Fafnesbane, TinCow, Tran, TruePraetorian, Twilightblade, Warluster, Warmaster Horus, woad&fangs, x-dANGEr, Xdeathfire, Xehh II, Xiahou.

Attacked: (12) Andres (N2, N3), Beefy187 (N1), Caius (N3), Evil_Maniac from Mars (N3), Glenn (N1, N2), Xdeathfire (N1), taka (N2), GeneralHankerchief (N2, N3), Cowhead418 (N2)

Murdered: (8) Drisos (N1), Lord Winter (N2), Beefy187 (N3), Glenn (N3), Pannonian (N3), taka (N3), The Stranger (N3), Zorg (N3)

Lynched: (3) pevergreen (D2), Hannibalbarca (D3), Tiberius of the Drake (D3)

Removed from Play: (0) Note: this will begin changing soon.

[Pannonian]

Get GH. Now.

[Proletariat]

Vote: GeneralH

Same reason as before

Capotally:Lynch: GeneralHankerchief 1 (Prole)

[GeneralHankerchief]

My God this was a bloody night.

What I make of the attacks:

taka: Three people, probably vig-killed. Same people as last night?

Caius: I didn't see any calling card, so it looks like a failed vig-kill.

Beefy: This one was a Mafia hit (Bible passages). Same people who tried to get him before/got Lord Winter last time?

EMFM: Blown vig-kill.

Zorg: Successful vig-kill, most likely. I couldn't see any calling card.

Andres: He was protected and a vig-kill failed, apparently. More on this later.

Pannonian: Ballet shoes? I think this one was a Mafia hit.

Stranger: Mafia hit (#4).

GH: Looks like I, along with Beefy and taka, got lucky. From what it reads, it appears to be a vig-kill. Better luck next time, suckers.

Glenn: Mafia hit. Surprising, actually. I thought that there was massive organization surrounding him?

This is just a quick reference guide. I'll post some analysis later (eating time).

[Crazed Rabbit]

Vote: Andres

He's a killer. Though GH is also a good choice. Let's go for the double.

Better to lynch late than expire early.

Lynch tally:
GeneralHankerchief 1 (Prole)
Andres 1 (Rabbit)

What worries me is the three weather balloon killings.

CR

[TinCow]

Glenn: Mafia hit. Surprising, actually. I thought that there was massive organization surrounding him?

I can confirm this, because I was one of them. 4 of us were assigned to protect Glenn, but I am guessing from the write-up that 2 of them either didn't get their orders in on time or intentionally gave false orders. I will refrain from naming names until I have more evidence about which of these two options it was. If it was the latter, I think we have some more necks to stretch.

[PershsNhpios]

Oh god damn.

Nos missus per Deum nosque salus est suprema res pro minoris populis!

NON NOBIS, DOMINE FERMANAGIO!

[Sasaki Kojiro]

taka: Killed by group of three. No calling card. Wise guy group?

Caius: Failed attack. Looks like another group of three to me, with one of them failing to appear.

Beefy: Killed by some bible quoting mafia. Edit: now I see this is also weather balloons, most worrisome.

EMFM: Don't know what to make of this exactly. Two attackers, but failed.

Zorg: Not clear who he was killed by.

Andres: only 1 Attacker, and what looks like a doctor save to me.

Pannonian: killed by ballet slippers mafia.

The Stranger: Weather balloon mafia?

GeneralHankerchief: neither attackers no reason for failure clear.

Glenn: Weather balloon mafia? Apparently they have enough members for two kills.


3 kills by one group. At least 6 members.

[Joe Monks]

Glenn? What happens to the blade and axe now? will you never be any good to the town?

[Pannonian]

Glenn? What happens to the blade and axe now? will you never be any good to the town?
Just because he can't be wogged any more doesn't mean he should reveal any red parts of his role PM. Wait a few weeks, and we'll know everything in the writeups for this game.

[Joe Monks]

I wasnt expecting glenn to get wogged tho. If he was, surely seamus would have done it on night 2, after glenn and jimbob managed to get glenn saved on Day 1.

[CountArach]

I can confirm this, because I was one of them. 4 of us were assigned to protect Glenn, but I am guessing from the write-up that 2 of them either didn't get their orders in on time or intentionally gave false orders. I will refrain from naming names until I have more evidence about which of these two options it was. If it was the latter, I think we have some more necks to stretch.
How does that help anyone at all? Why not get it all out in the open?

Well, Andres and GH both sound like solid lynches to me, so we might as well go for the double.

Vote: GH

GeneralHankerchief 2 (Prole, CA)
Andres 1 (Rabbit)

[JimBob]

Glenn? What happens to the blade and axe now? will you never be any good to the town?
If we find the crown, we'll have something to work with. Hopefully we can get to a place where we won't need Glenn to act. Hopefully. If not, then at least we're still firmly on the town's side. We were in contact with a detective, and I'll continue to serve as a conduit for him.
Sic Semper Furibus until all the town is dead, or the mafia is gone.


I can confirm this, because I was one of them. 4 of us were assigned to protect Glenn, but I am guessing from the write-up that 2 of them either didn't get their orders in on time or intentionally gave false orders. I will refrain from naming names until I have more evidence about which of these two options it was. If it was the latter, I think we have some more necks to stretch.
I can confirm being a second. It seems orders did not get where they needed to. We shall see what comes of this.

To shed some light on the details of the kills, mostly the Biblical.
Glenn's kill quotes Jeremia, 48:10. "A curse on him who is lax in doing the LORD's work! A curse on him who keeps his sword from bloodshed!"
Someone doesn't like the fact that we haven't struck at the mafia yet.

From Beefy's death 216 is 6x6x6 and is associated with the Mark of the Beast.

I'm still looking up LQKI.

So we have someone who knows something of religion in one of the mafias.


That was a bloody night, but remember, we won Capo I with only a handful left. The mafia are still outnumbered, let's get them dead.

[GeneralHankerchief]

Okay, analysis:

First of all, it seems like the two targets that look like they had protection last night were Andres (LaSalle) and Caius (Librarian - maybe). I haven't heard anything from or about Caius, and the Librarian might not even be a protector. However, there has been lots of speculation that Andres was a Don - could his savior have been a Luca? Possibly.

If Andres is a Don, that puts minor suspicion on those who voted for him as Director on D1. They are as follows:

ajaxfetish
Andres (self-vote)
Beefy (:skull:)
Craterus
Crazed Rabbit (although I'll discount this one considering later events)
hannibalbarc (:skull: - also, considered highly suspicious)
Ichigo (something's off with your behavior)
jonhugthom (inactive)
kamikhaan
Sarathos
shlin28 (first person to do so - reasoning: "Might as well select a mod")
Tran
Zorg

Secondly, weather balloon mafia. Upon further inspection, they, as Sasaki said, killed three people last night: Beefy, Stranger, and Glenn. Finding their Don is imperative.

Thirdly, vig-kills. There seem to be a lot of unidentifiable killers. This is worrisome. Luckily, their attacks seem to be uncoordinated.

Fourthly, if a lot of these are vig-kills and three of them are done by the weather balloon mafia, that begs the question: where the heck are the other families? The "Asian" Mafia is totally gone, disappeared into the twilight after they attempted to kill me on N2. Aside from the ballet slipper mafia, that leaves two families entirely unaccounted for.

Since I believe finding the weather balloon Don to be the most important thing in the game right now, I'm going to hold off on voting until things come into a clearer picture.

Vote: Present

Edited for formatting.

[Pannonian]

The bible-balloon family are probably using their Luca as a Made, so as to get in more kills and thus promote recruited wise guys quicker. My guess would be that they're doing this because their Don is protected as a townie of some sort, possibly even the Director. This may point towards Louis, but I'm thinking Andres as well as they might have got used to the idea of him being protected (as in the night before).

GH and Andres would certainly be good choices for a double-lynch, but people should have a look at their communications with others as well. Louis' strange arguments and enthusiasm in D2 certainly has my suspicion. While he's like that in the Backroom, he was much more circumspect in Capo 1. Still, since that was a year ago, perhaps his eagerness for the next installment can account for this.

[Joe Monks]

The bible-balloon family are probably using their Luca as a Made, so as to get in more kills and thus promote recruited wise guys quicker. My guess would be that they're doing this because their Don is protected as a townie of some sort, possibly even the Director. This may point towards Louis, but I'm thinking Andres as well as they might have got used to the idea of him being protected (as in the night before).

GH and Andres would certainly be good choices for a double-lynch, but people should have a look at their communications with others as well. Louis' strange arguments and enthusiasm in D2 certainly has my suspicion. While he's like that in the Backroom, he was much more circumspect in Capo 1. Still, since that was a year ago, perhaps his eagerness for the next installment can account for this.

What if the balloon Mafia was actually Glenn? Protected by unknowing townies.

Joe

[Pannonian]

What if the balloon Mafia was actually Glenn? Protected by unknowing townies.

Joe
The balloon mafia are not Glenn, for the simple reason that it was they who killed him.

[PershsNhpios]

"We are sent by god and our life is a great thing for the little people!
Not us, Lord Fermanagh!"


I find it very interesting to note that Zorg and Stranger were killed last night also.
Zorg - no use hiding now, come forward, who do you know that knows me?
Zorg was a fine confident of mine and I kept him close on all matters, but seperate from all others for the sake of his safety.

Due to his nature, I did not think he would of made any enemies at all - this leads me to believe someone knew he was a good contact of mine - reason enough for him to die if he was also a detective.

Needless to say, I don't think my chainmail and chausses helped me at all last night.

Stranger was also a close contact of mine - he knew a great deal about the infallible three, yet I steered clear of him admittedly when I saw how often he talked to Andres.

I want to say this, because I find it odd two of my closest contacts were murdered on the same night - with neither attracting as much attention to themselves as Jimbob or Sasaki.


-------------

Before I spam any further, may I ask how acceptable my speculation is after my death? Can I still PM?
I have read the rules on the dead- but it is simply another rule of thumb and you are expected to be honourable, I want to know how to be honourable.

---------------

I don't like Joe Monks logic.

Or how Mr. Monks first spends almost every post trying to have me lynched, and then suddenly repents subtly in his post and asks me almost tauntingly how I am going to help the town now.

Well Joe Monks, you haven't come to brag about killing me have you?
Don't let anything slip now.

[Joe Monks]

Then obviously the Balloon Mafia have killed their own Don then.

Edit: I wasn't trying to taunt you Glenn. I was genuinely curious about what you could have done if you had found the third member. I am actually laughing at myself because Panns reply makes me look like a *******.

[Csargo]

Oh god damn.

Nos missus per Deum nosque salus est suprema res pro minoris populis!

NON NOBIS, DOMINE FERMANAGIO!

Anyone know what this means?

GH is being helpful so for now I think he deserves the benefit of the doubt.

At this point I'm not sure who to vote for.

[Pannonian]

Glenn, when you're dead, confine yourself to commenting on already public information. If you have private information that leads you to suspect certain people, only comment on those people if there is public information to lead that suspicion. It has been standard practice for some time now for no reveals after death, and no disclosure of private communications either (Kung Fu Mafia was the first to make this last part explicit IIRC). That's why I said it's a good idea to share your information in case you die. If you die without sharing that info, it dies with you.

[CountArach]

I can confirm being a second. It seems orders did not get where they needed to. We shall see what comes of this.
I thought you were capable of detective work or somesuch - how could you do this if you were protecting Glenn?

[PershsNhpios]

He did not investigate anyone last night - he volunteered to help me - unfortunately we either had a traitor or a layabout amidst us.

Thank you Pannonian, I will continue to contribute what I can if it is listened to. And I can assure you that if anything I gave away too much information.

Ichigo - I translated what I said - it was just roleplaying, no codes involved.

[TevashSzat]

Wow, things are certainley picking up around here with so many attacked already.

Don't have any insights to offer mainly because I skimmed most of the stuff and is still about 10 pages behind in careful reading.

[Csargo]

Vote:W&Fs

I just got some info that someone got a criminal investigation on him.

[woad&fangs]

Vote:W&Fs

I just got some info that someone got a criminal investigation on him.
I've already admitted to being a wiseguy. Pann will back me up on that.

[Pannonian]

Vote:W&Fs

I just got some info that someone got a criminal investigation on him.
Then your source must have been wasting his time, as w&f claimed wise guy (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1828736&postcount=936) 400 posts ago.

[Xehh II]

I have no idea, Vote: Abstain for now.

[PershsNhpios]

Now wait a second!
We have several other criminal results, and Pannonian, who is dead might I add - has at least moderately close ties to W&F through PMs.

Pannonian, what is your comment?

Wow, that was quick...

[John86]

I have no idea, Vote: Abstain for now.

Same, Vote:Abstain

[TinCow]

How does that help anyone at all? Why not get it all out in the open?

I don't want to get anyone in trouble if it was a simple error. There were some complications that resulted in two changes of orders within 90 minutes of the deadline. It is very possible that someone didn't get their orders in on time because of this confusion. Given how paranoid this group is, I don't want to point fingers at people for unintentional acts. Once I find out one way or another, I will let you know.

[scottishranger]

I think we need to lynch either Andres or GH today.

[Csargo]

Then your source must have been wasting his time, as w&f claimed wise guy (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1828736&postcount=936) 400 posts ago.

Unvote:W&Fs,Vote:Abstain

I was under the impression that WGs would appears as innocent if investigated.

[Crazed Rabbit]

I thought we already knew w&f was a wiseguy? And I think they appear criminal in investigation.


The "Asian" Mafia is totally gone, disappeared into the twilight after they attempted to kill me on N2. Aside from the ballet slipper mafia, that leaves two families entirely unaccounted for.

"Asian" mafia = ballet slipper mafia

More thoughts on the events of the night -

Was it a mafia group that killed Taka? There was no sign or symbol left. So vigilante group? Why would they want taka dead so bad?

Caius got attacked by a vigilante group short a member or two it seems.

Beefy got killed by the weather balloon mafia.

EMFM got attacked by a vigilante group short members, or maybe a wiseguy group who didn't get Don support.

Zorg got killed by the yellow rose mafia.

Andres was protected by someone after being attacked by one gunman.

Pannonian got offed by the ballet mafia.

The Stranger was killed by the weather balloon mafia.

GH survived by luck like Beefy, it seems, from a vigilante group.

Glenn was attacked again by the statue/weather balloon killer, who this time succeeded though Glenn's protection was greater.

CR

[woad&fangs]

Could the following players please state what they did last night?

GeneralHankerchief- the apparent lynchee

Andres- apparent lynchee #2

CountArach- Is a wiseguy and with the large number of bible/balloon mafia members it would be wise to also root out the wiseguys in case they're trying to join.

Norwegian Nerd- I think that he's a wiseguy based off of what he has said so far. See above

[Craterus]

I was under the impression that WGs would appears as innocent if investigated.

Surely you'd already know? :inquisitive:

[Myrddraal]

EDIT: nvmind, need sleep

[Hannibalbarc]

I think we need to lynch either Andres or GH today.
Why not both, Andres is both suspicious and considered criminal due to an investigation, and GH is very suspicious, if I could vote I would vote for Andres.

[ajaxfetish]

Thoughts:

Mafia Groups:

Asians/Ballet slippers
--Drisos was killed on night 1 by two individuals, one with a bad Asian accent, and had ballet slippers left on his face.
--GH was attacked night 2 by one individual with a bad Asian accent (apparently the partner failed to show, possibly missed pm deadline). No slippers since it was an unsuccessful hit.
--Pannonian was killed on night 3 after an individual dressed as a policeman pushed him in front of a trolley. The 'policeman' then placed a pair of ballet slippers on his face and vanished. No mention of Asian accents as there is no dialogue.

We have a consistent calling card in the ballet slippers, and the Asian accent to link GH's failed attack to the others. I'm thinking this is our first mafia family. Interesting that GH fails to tie the two together, noting that the Asian mafia seems to have disappeared (post 1329).

Religious Wackos/Weathermen
--Glenn was attacked night 2 by a lone assailant wielding a statue of St. Michael. Outside was a van filled with weather balloons, a fillet knife, and Deuteronomy 32:35 printed on the balloons. He was killed on night 3 by someone wielding a statue (again), accusing him of heresy, and leaving Jeremiah 48:10 and LQKI as calling cards. He was killed/disposed of by means of a weather balloon.
--Beefy was killed on night 3 after being knocked out by a flying object (religious statue, perchance?). A bible with Exodus 23:7 marked had been planted in his pocket, and his assailant made reference to the New Testament story of Saul. His body was dismembered and sent aloft with weather balloons. The number 216 was painted on one of his quarters, which JimBob noted as the product of 6 * 6 * 6, the mark of the beast noted in Revelation.
--The Stranger was killed on night 3 by assailants who painted the number 4 on his chest, cut crosses in his cheeks, and sent him aloft with a weather balloon. Both his and Glenn's attacks also seemed to involve projectile syringes with tranquilizers. If Beefy's object was not a statue, his may have as well.

These guys like religious symbolism, tranquilizers, and weather balloons. They're also the most worrisome because they managed three hits in one night, though they were already operative by night 2 (of course one failed attempt is unimpressive compared to three successful ones). I don't get the LQKI or the number 4 yet. Someone else may be able to shed light on it. Glenn has hinted at a religiously-themed role for himself and was accused of heresy. He was also the first target (night 2) for this gang. Are the religious affiliations in some way connected, or is it coincidence? GH in his first analysis links Beefy's killing to his first attack or Lord Winter's hit, though neither involved religion or weather balloons, and a lethal dose of heroin seems only distantly related to the use of tranquilizers.

Yellow Rose Group
--Zorg was killed on night 3 in a public bathroom. Amid the chaos of machine-gun fire and grenades, police found an inexplicable yellow rose.

Zorg seems to be introducing a new mafia family to us, as the unexplained presence of a 'single perfect yellow rose,' is about as clear a calling card as I can imagine, but it hadn't shown up previously that I noticed. Interestingly, GH's analysis was Vig Kill because he 'couldn't see a calling card' (post 1319).

-------------------------------------------------------------------

GH is either out of touch or dissembling. He made several errors in analyzing this night's events, and I would have expected more from as experienced a player as he is. He may just be having a rough day, but I'm still suspicious.

Andres is attacked unsuccessfully for the second night in a row, and in eerily similar circumstances. My gut instinct is don protected on night 3 by a luca. On night 2 he was saved by his directorial guard, but as Seamus originally overlooked his protection, he let slip that the hit would have been successful. A luca wouldn't have bothered protecting on night 2 since his services were unneeded, so it's consistent. However, didn't someone reveal an investigation on Andres that came out 'criminal'? I can't remember. That would make the situation muddier.

That's all I've got for now.

Ajax

edit: forgot about the 216 thing on Beefy. Added it.
edit 2: CR beat me to some of the mafia group connections. I guess that's what I get for trying to make a long post in such an active thread.

[ajaxfetish]

As of now, my vote will go to either GH or Andres, unless they can offer a convincing defense. I'd vote for whoever is currently behind, but the tally hasn't been updated and I'm too tired to hunt it down atm.

And for now, select: Woad & Fangs. After Pannonian revealed Tiberius, and Tiberius owned up to it, Pann was one of the few players I was starting to trust. He's dead now. Woad & Fangs I believe was the source of the reveal, was identified by Pann as working with him in a protection group night 2, and has already claimed to be a wise guy. While he could be recruited by mafia due to his neutral role, he seems to be working on the side of the town so far.

Ajax

[Csargo]

Surely you'd already know? :inquisitive:

I hardly ever pay attention

[Caius]

It isnt selection time now.

[Northnovas]

When I read the bible quotes I thought of Pulp Fiction. If anyone is a movie buff to tie in any of the clues.
As for quotes they are Old Testament and a simple English version provided.

Jeremiah 48:10

Sloppy work in God's name is cursed,
and cursed all halfhearted use of the sword.

Deuteronomy 32:35

Don't you realize that I have my shelves
well stocked, locked behind iron doors?
I'm in charge of vengeance and payback,
just waiting for them to slip up;
And the day of their doom is just around the corner,
sudden and swift and sure.

Exodus 23:7

Stay clear of false accusations. Don't contribute to the death of innocent and good people. I don't let the wicked off the hook.

By ajaxfetish summary there would be three active families at the moment? If there is no "calling card" then it is not a mafia hit?

[gibsonsg91921]

Vote:Andres

How does he keep living? Who's killing him?

[ajaxfetish]

It isnt selection time now.
Ah. Sorry, still getting the hang of the rules. Forgot about the day off selecting.

And as for the other two families, I don't know if they're active or not. Perhaps it's not necessary to have a calling card, but without one being used I can't group attacks together. Perhaps they have inactive members and haven't got off the ground. Perhaps they've been busy investigating and haven't bothered with attacks. Perhaps they've attacked and Seamus hasn't included a signature modus operandi. Perhaps he has given them a calling card and I haven't identified it.

Ajax

[TinCow]

Andres is attacked unsuccessfully for the second night in a row, and in eerily similar circumstances. My gut instinct is don protected on night 3 by a luca. On night 2 he was saved by his directorial guard, but as Seamus originally overlooked his protection, he let slip that the hit would have been successful. A luca wouldn't have bothered protecting on night 2 since his services were unneeded, so it's consistent. However, didn't someone reveal an investigation on Andres that came out 'criminal'? I can't remember. That would make the situation muddier.

I agree fully.

Vote: Andres

[TruePraetorian]

I honestly don't have an opinion of Andres...but if you think about it he can't be a don if he came up criminal, he can only be a wiseguy or made. General on the other hand is, to me, more suspicious then Andres, but I still wouldn;t put them on my "blacklist" as Caius suggested earlier. Either way, I Vote:Abstain. With so many dead from last night phase, it leaves very few suspicious people besides GH and Andres, but I see no evidence to "condemn" them. And besides that, the turn ends 11 hours from now, and I am waiting for more proof before I vote. I won't hop on another bandwaggon like I did Glenn the first round. (Sorry Glenn :shame: )

So, if you can persuade me you have my vote :laugh4:

EDIT: Vote:GeneralHankerchief
Changed vote, for the sake of a tie, and because GH is more suspcious.

Here is the Cappotally.

Tally: post 1362

GeneralHankerchief: 3 (prole, CA, TruePraetorian)
Andres: 3 (CR, Gibsong91921, TinCow)
Abstain: 3 (XeHHII, Hiji, Ichigo)
Present: 1 (GH)

[CountArach]

CountArach- Is a wiseguy and with the large number of bible/balloon mafia members it would be wise to also root out the wiseguys in case they're trying to join.
I stayed at home. So many people who I can't trust. Its all just easier that way. Also my earlier protection group broke up.

EDIT: Typo...

[Craterus]

When does this phase end? I'd like to see an updated tally before I vote but won't be online again for ~14 hours at least.

EDIT: Thursday 0100 GMT.

K, I'll vote later. ~:wave: :zzz:

[ajaxfetish]

vote: Generalhankerchief
I may not get another chance to log on before the day phase ends, so I'll vote for one of my two prime suspects, and since it looks like it's currently a tie, I guess it doesn't matter too much which one. GH gets my vote for today.

Ajax

--------------------------------------------------------------

Capotally as of post 1364

GeneralHankerchief: 4 (prole, CA, TruePraetorian, ajaxfetish)
Andres: 3 (CR, Gibsong91921, TinCow)
Abstain: 3 (XeHHII, Hiji, Ichigo)
Present: 1 (GH)

[Kagemusha]

It seems that in the mass of murders, people are forgetting the result of Drisos role. He was indeed detective and he identified Sigurd Fafnesbane as mafia Don. We cant afford to let Sigurd live with this knowledge. Vote: Sigurd

[PershsNhpios]

And you, Mr. Suspect, are forgetting that Drisos died before he could succeed in receiving any investigation results, as he woke up dead on the morning of Day 2.

Does FactionHeir agree with you?

[Csargo]

Vote:Sigurd

No idea how he got the information, but I don't see why he'd lie.

[CountArach]

And you, Mr. Suspect, are forgetting that Drisos died before he could succeed in receiving any investigation results, as he woke up dead on the morning of Day 2.

Does FactionHeir agree with you?
Ummm... you do realise that that means that he could investigate Night 1... In fact you should know that because you claim to be able to investigate...

Should we go for the triple lynch now? Andres, GH and Sigurd?

Current Tally:
GeneralHankerchief: 4 (prole, CA, TruePraetorian, ajaxfetish)
Andres: 3 (CR, Gibsong91921, TinCow)
Sigurd: 2 (Kagemusha, Ichigo)
Abstain: 3 (XeHHII, Hiji, Ichigo)
Present: 1 (GH)

[Csargo]

Should we go for the triple lynch now? Andres, GH and Sigurd?

The more the merrier.

[Kommodus]

I have some information that might shed some light on things.

GH contacted me last night. He claimed to be a wise guy, and forwarded his PM to me. I won't quote it here, but I will say that it looked completely authentic. So unless GH could have somehow obtained someone else's wise guy PM, I'm inclined to believe him.

Of course, this doesn't make him innocent; but he did agree to join my protection group (an effort which, due to poor timing on my part, unfortunately did not come together).

Question: can anyone say what Andres has been up to during the past two nights? All I know is that he was in a protection group on night 1.

As for me,

Vote: Rythmic

His behavioral patterns, as detected by Holmes, are rather fishy...

And now it's well past my bedtime. :Zzzz:

[Zorg]

Well damn.... that certainly puts a damper on things. As someone who is dead I don't think its apropriate for me to reveal, not that there is much TO reveal anyway. I was not a detective as such and had no investigation results. I wish the town the very best luck in beating the mafia, I'll help where I can.

Glenn and me had some very close conversations, however I would like to express to the town my suspicion of him. I think Glenn was very useful to know and get information from, but his honesty and integrity I doubt, and the possibility of him being a don is not one far from my mind. Now that I'm already dead I have no fear in saying this.

I have no idea why someone would kill me, other than the fact I was active enough to help the town but not active enough to be protected :wall: .

Anyway, good luck everyone. Lynch those mafia!

[PershsNhpios]

Well then Zorg, it appears I wasn't the one who lacked integrity and honesty!

Count Arach, Sasaki, (I think), noted somewhere else in this thread that if you investigate on the same night you are killed - then you cannot receive the results of that investigation.
Of course, this may be wrong - but it seemed logical to me - that if Drisos was killed his investigations could not possibly of been completed.


However, don't forget to cast attention on how Ichigo made the statement;

"No idea how he got the information, but I don't see why he'd lie."

Are you forgetting that this is a game of Mafia?
And that people in this game lie far more often than reveal the truth?

What do you know about Kagemusha's honesty that the public doesn't?
------------

I would also like to claim the privilege, should Rythmic be guilty, of being able to shout clearly, "I told you so", because I am the sole person who has tried to show how Mafia-like he is.

Along with Kagemusha, FactionHeir, Tran, and CrazedRabbit.

[Omanes Alexandrapolites]

Vote: GH

I'm not sure about Andres, although I do doubt he's a Don due to the criminal result Sassaki revealed earlier on in the game. This makes him either one of those townies who appear criminal but aren't, a Luca, a Made or a Wise Guy. Due to the low numbers of townies which are supposed to turn out guilty, I would be willing to suspect that he's either a Luca, Wise Guy or Made rather than somebody on the more innocent side of the spectrum.

What I didn't like about Andres was his defence here (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php?p=1830969#post1830969) - I thought it was a little scummy in the way it voiced an overt level of frustration at having the FoS pointing in his direction.

This could be dismissed as him having a "bad day" as he said, although I'm not sure what to believe of that - it was early on in the morning in the Netherlands (GMT+1) when he posted, so I doubt he had had enough time to actually have had a bad day. Due to this, I am lead to believe that there could be something a little more sinister behind it.

For now though I would prefer to go after GH for reasons previously specified - the evidence against him is much larger than Andres'. Although he has a wise guy PM, I wouldn't expect it to be too hard for any mafioso to get one from one of their fresh recruits.

[Andres]

a) I came up "criminal" after investigation ergo I cannot be a Don. Those voting me arguing that I'm probably a Don protected by a Luca are making a mistake.
b) Last night, I got contacted by TS who asked me to join a protection group. I asked him who we were going to protect. He didn't know yet. Heard nothing after that, so I slept.
c) N1 : I was in a protection group with Moros, TSand Drisos, protecting Sigurd : N1 results:

Protect Sigurd Fafnesbane = inconclusive
N2: I was in a protection group with The Stranger, Dutch_Guy and Myrddraal, protecting Glenn. Results:

Protect: Glenn = failure

Insufficient orders coordination for success; no solo risk to participants.
d) I came up criminal, because I'm a Wiseguy.

Here's my role pm :




WiseGuy


Victory Conditions.

You can chart your own course to victory. You can join a mafia family and work for that family’s victory. You can join a mafia family, try to supplant the Don and become Capo de Tutti Capi yourself. You can form your own Criminal family and try to dominate the others. You can even put crime behind you, change roles, and work for the victory of the town over the mafia. What route you choose is up to you.


Powers and Limitations

A. General

1. You are the raw material for expanding a crime family. Remember that if they are unable to recruit you to their cause, you probably become very “expendable” in their eyes.

2. *Red text *

B. Day Actions

1. You may vote/select as any other townie.

C. Night Actions

1. Combine with 3 townies you can attempt to kill one target per night (after two successful kills, one of them will become a “Wise Guy” and can progress from there). Such kills only count as “half-credit” for your ascension to Made Gangster (unaffiliated).

2. Combine with 2 townies you can attempt to protect one target per night (after two successful protections, one of you may become a “Doctor “ and can progress from there; if you do you’ll cease being a Wise Guy.

3. If following two successful protections you are selected as Doctor and refuse, you can choose to become a regular townie. Two further successful protections will result in your promotion to Detective – but in your case you will become a Rogue Detective similar to that occurring in Capo-I.

4. One advantage you have over a townie, while participating in such townie groups, is that should you end up as a “solo” on a save or kill attempt, it is unlikely to get you killed – though there is a chance your identity would be revealed.

5. Combine with 2 other Wise Guys you can attempt to kill one target per night (after three successful kills, one of you (random) will become a “Made Gangster (Unaffiliated)” and can progress from there).

6. Combine with 1 other Wise Guy or Made under the aegis of a Family and you can perform one killing per night (after three successful kills, and with the permission of the family Don, you will become a “Made Gangster” and can progress from there).

D. Investigations

It is probable that, if investigated by a Detective or by a Made Gangster, you will be discovered as “criminal,” though about one in five Wise Guys will register as “Unclear.” You will only register as “guilty” if you have participated in a non-family-sanctioned killing or a family-sanctioned killing on the night of that killing.


Role Changing

As noted above, you have many options for a role change and can progress readily in that new role. Remember, once you have chosen a path by moving forward into a new role, however, you cannot reconsider and revert.

[Csargo]

Are you forgetting that this is a game of Mafia?
And that people in this game lie far more often than reveal the truth?

No, I'm not. Maybe mafia do.


"I have to reveal now that I've known Drisos' identity all along, though my team researched everything just to be sure," said Commissioner Fermanagh. "Drisos was a Fatlington detective, and a damned good one. I don't know how those mafia scum found out about him, but I hope you send every last one of them to Hell."


Your point is moot in my opinion. He didn't lie about being a detective, so I don't see why he'd try to get the town to go astray. That doesn't make sense. I have no idea how he got the information, but the one thing I do know is that he's the only person who has been proven innocent in this game and is a person who I can trust.

Andres PM looks exactly like mine. I'm a Wise Guy as well.

[Sigurd]

It seems that in the mass of murders, people are forgetting the result of Drisos role. He was indeed detective and he identified Sigurd Fafnesbane as mafia Don. We cant afford to let Sigurd live with this knowledge. Vote: Sigurd
A very scummy post there Kage...

You blatantly ignore the discussion we have had on this subject. Drisos was a detective. This has been revealed.
But he was killed on night 1 and would not have been able to do any investigations in this game. And he also claimed that he was in a protection group, protecting me or Louis. You can't do both investigations and protection on the same night. Finally he claims I am a Don, which when investigated, will come up as innocent and would be inconclusive as to the fact that the person investigated is a Don or a pro-town.
A very dangerous accusation and I want Drisos to acknowledge the fact that he is just guessing and badly so.
I could be wrong about you Kagemusha and will not vote for you. But I would like to hear why you are still pushing this theory.

While I am writing, I have a question regarding the game mechanics.
If you are attacked during a night, and you are out and about doing pro-town/mafia business, will your night action be cancelled? I know this is how it worked in previous games I have played. I have yet to find any info about it in the Capo series. Anyone have experience with this?

I haven't seen Andres making a defence yet, and he was also part of the team that set fire to the accusation of me being a Don. I therefore vote:Andres

[Andres]

I haven't seen Andres making a defence yet, and he was also part of the team that set fire to the accusation of me being a Don. I therefore vote:Andres

Ahem, two posts above yours, namely here (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1831916&postcount=1375).

And for the accusation of you being a Don, that accusation was made by Drisos, who turned out to be a detective according to the autopsy...

So, the case against me:
- Andres got protected ! He must be a Don = wrong. I came up "criminal", Dons come up "innocent" after investigation.
- Andres came up "criminal", he must be mafia = wrong, I'm a wiseguy. My reveal is genuine because:

Andres PM looks exactly like mine. I'm a Wise Guy as well.

Also note : "criminal" is not = "guilty". The fact that I came up as "criminal" means I was not involved in any of the killings. A Wiseguy who was involved in murders always gets a "guilty" result when investigated.

I'd appreciate a few unvotes.

[Sigurd]

Ahem, two posts above yours, namely here (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1831916&postcount=1375).

And for the accusation of you being a Don, that accusation was made by Drisos, who turned out to be a detective according to the autopsy...

So, the case against me:
- Andres got protected ! He must be a Don = wrong. I came up "criminal", Dons come up "innocent" after investigation.
- Andres came up "criminal", he must be mafia = wrong, I'm a wiseguy. My reveal is genuine because:

As has been noted, displaying a wise-guy role pm says squat about you beeing actually a wise-guy. We have noted that the balloon mafia has more than one kill this night. This means they have wise-guys in their ranks and it would be easy to fish a role pm from one of them. That you haven't realised this is incriminating.

To the criminal result, I bet as a Don you can join groups as any other player. And I bet if you joined one of the vigilante teams (there were at least two on night 1), you would come up as criminal or guilty that night. The way to check this is to get one innocent read on you from this point on and during the rest of the game.

[Andres]

As has been noted, displaying a wise-guy role pm says squat about you beeing actually a wise-guy. We have noted that the balloon mafia has more than one kill this night. This means they have wise-guys in their ranks and it would be easy to fish a role pm from one of them. That you haven't realised this is incriminating.

Oh come on. I might as well say that your paranoia is typical behaviour of a mafioso who wants the focus on a clear innocent.


To the criminal result, I bet as a Don you can join groups as any other player. And I bet if you joined one of the vigilante teams (there were at least two on night 1), you would come up as criminal or guilty that night. The way to check this is to get one innocent read on you from this point on and during the rest of the game.

Read the rules, read my role pm. If involved in murder, you come up as "guilty". Criminal means I wasn't involved in murders.

So again: I was not involved in any killings whatsoever. So this means that I'm a Wiseguy who has not worked yet for the mafia.

I think there are better suspects to lynch, but feel free to keep focusing on Wiseguy #14 who has no ties to any of the mafia families.

[PershsNhpios]

Three suspects all pointing the finger at one another.

BURN 'EM... BURRRRRRRRRRRRRN 'EM!

Ichigo, the fact is it seems, considering he could not of found results for his investigation because he died that, though he was proven innocent, he may of simply been making speculation.

And although Sigurd Fafnesbane is on my suspicious list - Kagemusha - who tried to point the finger at Sigurd, is far more, "Scummy", than Sigurd is presently.
---------------------------------------------

General Hankerchief is either bored and busy, or he is playing a very nice strategy and fooling everyone.
Why? He has been under scrutiny, but everyone has been so unsure about him that we simply haven't got around to doing anything about him.

So he answers everything with a metaphorical, "Why me? Just because I am GH?"

Now that I have looked at his past posts, I think he should either be completely cleared or lynched.
Maybe that will have him say something.

I can imagine everyone in the post-game saying, "Ha ha, sly work GH you did us over again!".

[Pannonian]

Read the rules, read my role pm. If involved in murder, you come up as "guilty". Criminal means I wasn't involved in murders.

So again: I was not involved in any killings whatsoever. So this means that I'm a Wiseguy who has not worked yet for the mafia.

I think there are better suspects to lynch, but feel free to keep focusing on Wiseguy #14 who has no ties to any of the mafia families.
Mades and Lucas come up as guilty on the night they murder someone, criminal otherwise.

[Andres]

Mades and Lucas come up as guilty on the night they murder someone, criminal otherwise.



"Criminal" = I cannot be a Don, since Don = "innocent".
I got protected last night. The write-up suggests that I hade 1 (one) protector.

Can the Luca protect his Made?
Can the Luca protect himself?

[Tran]

Vote: Twilightblade

People are pointing suspicion toward each others, and let this person got away after what he did last time...?

[PershsNhpios]

Why are you so intent on Twilightblade, Tran?
I'm dead, he won't be helping me anymore.

Twilightblade is the very last on everybody's list - but you have done nothing in this entire thread except ask for his lynching.

Why? What fierce reason is there to make him a more worthy candidate than GH, Andres, or Kagemusha?

Perhaps you should stay away from voting - or Holmes might find you out!

[Sigurd]

"Criminal" = I cannot be a Don, since Don = "innocent".
I got protected last night. The write-up suggests that I hade 1 (one) protector.

Can the Luca protect his Made?
Can the Luca protect himself?

Oh so you are saying you are a Luca or a Made?
Besides I think I showed how a Don could get a criminal result in my previous post.

And as for the investigation results, Seamus has a thread dedicated to explain this in detail.
It clearly states that Mades can't get guilty results. Only a detective can.
That you have be found criminal without establishing the role of the one making the investigation is another clamp on your defence. Why are you pushing this? Could it be, because you suspect this investigation were made by a made? :beam: and therefore suits your defence?

It is too easy to punch holes in your explanation Andres, and it is not just because your username starts with an A.

[Sarathos]

”You deserve more pain than a quick death for your heresy,”

That's what happens when you turn on your own family Glenn. Might you of failed to turn up to one of their kill groups and annoyed the wrong people, tisk tisk.


Yellow Rose Group
--Zorg was killed on night 3 in a public bathroom. Amid the chaos of machine-gun fire and grenades, police found an inexplicable yellow rose.

Zorg seems to be introducing a new mafia family to us, as the unexplained presence of a 'single perfect yellow rose,' is about as clear a calling card as I can imagine, but it hadn't shown up previously that I noticed.

Funny you should say introducing. Not to many mafia families kill with old-style German grenades, maybe a family wasn't getting noticed previously and decided to make a mark so they used Zorg as an example. Or pehaps Zorg was part of the family and made a sacrifice for the good of the family so they could be seen as contenders. Though judging by the yellow rose, which in German resembles jealousy or infidelity, a lesser known rival family wanted to express a show of strength and poor Zorg was an innocent victim. Alternatively it could be nothing more than mafia family infighting and again Zorg was just unluckly, teaches you for being mafia Zorg :pimp2:
Either way this kill is very interesting, and I strongly believe Zorg was a symbol along with the rose, but a symbol of what...?

EDIT: spelling

[Husar]

Vote: Sigurd Fafnesbane

You're trying really hard to get Andres lynched and your arguments are far less likely to be true than his defense IMO. I have a hard time trusting you anyway and maybe we should go for a double lynch of GH/Sigurd today as I can't vote for both.

Current Tally:
GeneralHankerchief: 5 (prole, CA, TruePraetorian, ajaxfetish, Omanes Alexandrapolites)
Andres: 4 (CR, Gibsong91921, TinCow, Sigurd Fafnesbane)
Sigurd: 3 (Kagemusha, Ichigo, Husar)
Rhytmic: 1 (Kommodus)
Twilightblade: 1 (Tran)
Present: 1 (GH)
Abstain: 3 (XeHHII, Hiji, Ichigo)

It might also make sense to keep bold and black for votes (this goes especially to Sigurd, whose vote I almost missed due to all the black bolded names in the same post).

[Drisos]

Bloody hell! What a night! :sweatdrop:


A very dangerous accusation and I want Drisos to acknowledge the fact that he is just guessing and badly so.

No, I'm not just guessing... :wall:

And as for Andres, and other wise guys... I don't it's going to help for the defense now... vigilant groups have done an attempted four kills? I say start double- or triple- lynching wiseguys...

[Andres]

Oh so you are saying you are a Luca or a Made?
Besides I think I showed how a Don could get a criminal result in my previous post.

And as for the investigation results, Seamus has a thread dedicated to explain this in detail.
It clearly states that Mades can't get guilty results. Only a detective can.
That you have be found criminal without establishing the role of the one making the investigation is another clamp on your defence. Why are you pushing this? Could it be, because you suspect this investigation were made by a made? :beam: and therefore suits your defence?

It is too easy to punch holes in your explanation Andres, and it is not just because your username starts with an A.

Criminal = I cannot be a Don. What idiot of a Don would participate in a killing? Please.

I got protected by one person. A Luca would only protect his Don, so I got protected by a townsperson.

What do you want Sigurd? That I publicly reveal the identity of a doctor? I prefer to get lynched then giving the mafia that kind of information. Besides, I don't know who protected me.

Like I said, I'm just your regular Wiseguy. One who hasn't cooperated with the mafia thus far.

You were named as a Don by someone who turned out to be a detective, remember? Tell me, what did you do on N1, N2 and N3 and please post the results of your night actions, like I did.

P.S.: Thank you for pointing out that the investigation result on me must have come from a Made. Don't forget that it was Sasaki who revealed that result, ergo Sasaki is in contact with the mafia.

[Sigurd]

I would like to draw the attention to the players not contributing... Some are known lurkers but others are not.
The list: (Name, no. of posts)... Blue = killed.



Makanyane 9
Proletariat 9
Lt. Pinard 8
Joe Monks 8
shlin28 8
Xehh II 7
Dutch_guy 7
Northnovas 7
kamikhaan 6
FactionHeir 6
Haudegen 6
Twilightblade 6
Elite Ferret 5
Tran 5
Big King Sanctaphrax 5
LittleGrizzly 5
Cowhead418 3
Xiahou 3
Alexander the Pretty Good 3
Warluster 3
Draco Leman 2
Leet Eriksson 2
Evil_Maniac From Mars 2
gibsonsg91921 2
Hiji 2
taka 2
johnhughthom 2
sapi 1
Warmaster Horus 1
Motep 1
Jubal_Barca 1
Caeser The III 1
Ironside 1
Lord Winter 1

[pevergreen]

Read the rules and the Code of Ethics instead of ruining the fun for the other participants. Think before you post. - Andres

[Andres]

I would like to draw the attention to the players not contributing... Some are known lurkers but others are not.

As long as we aren't paying attention to you and Sasaki, eh?

Anyway, look at the last write-up from Seamus. There will be WoG's next round. I suggest we look at the lurkers tomorrow. Those who didn't get WoG'ed that is.

Now, I'll repeat: a detective (whose role got confirmed) named you as a Don. What did you do on N1, N2 and N3 and post the results you got from Seamus, please.

[Sarathos]

Not quite sure on the backgrounds of the votes, and I don't want to bandwagon so for this round I will Vote:Abstain.

[Zorg]

Wow. I didn't mean that to reach the public.

I'd like to say very sincerely that I apologise for any troubles this may cause with the running of the game as I know I was not supposed to reveal until it was over. I thought I could trust pevergreen as a personal friend not to say anything as we were both dead. However this has proven to be wrong.

I regret having revealed and apologise for any effects this may have on gameplay. :sick:

[Pannonian]

You're lucky you're dead pever, or I'd ask for your wog for that.

Gameroom Mafia Player’s Code of Ethics (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1819414&postcount=1)

I will not quote from a private message or from a chat log in the main thread of a mafia game and will not do so in private messages, e-mails, or other communications with anyone who was not originally a party to that message or chat unless permitted to do so by the game host.

[Andres]

pevergreen, you broke the Code of Ethics by posting that :brood:

[Andres]

Wow. I didn't mean that to reach the public.

I'd like to say very sincerely that I apologise for any troubles this may cause with the running of the game as I know I was not supposed to reveal until it was over. I thought I could trust pevergreen as a personal friend not to say anything as we were both dead. However this has proven to be wrong.

I regret having revealed and apologise for any effects this may have on gameplay. :sick:

The chatlog is from today, so you revealed before the post mortem autopsy. That's a serious violation of the rules.

Seamus will not be happy :no:

The only reason I am not closing this thread pending staff discussion is because of the effort put in this by the host and the exceptional number of participants just trying to have fun while respecting the rules.

[Pannonian]

Forward the post to Seamus, then delete it.

[Sigurd]

Criminal = I cannot be a Don. What idiot of a Don would participate in a killing? Please.

I would if I were an Don ... Come on, what better cover can a Don have, acting like a townie or a wise guy?


I got protected by one person. A Luca would only protect his Don, so I got protected by a townsperson.

What do you want Sigurd? That I publicly reveal the identity of a doctor? I prefer to get lynched then giving the mafia that kind of information. Besides, I don't know who protected me.

So... you do know and then you don't...


Like I said, I'm just your regular Wiseguy. One who hasn't cooperated with the mafia thus far.

Not proved.


You were named as a Don by someone who turned out to be a detective, remember? Tell me, what did you do on N1, N2 and N3 and please post the results of your night actions, like I did.

Please not this again...
And for the record I have not participated in any action whatsoever during these 3 nights... and I would like to hear from someone claiming I did...


P.S.: Thank you for pointing out that the investigation result on me must have come from a Made. Don't forget that it was Sasaki who revealed that result, ergo Sasaki is in contact with the mafia.
Your welcome... so you are saying the result should have been guilty.

See, how easy it is to punch holes in someones defense?
unvote:Andres

I was merely making a show of how easy it is to drum up a case against any player. All I have accused you of is pure speculation on my side, I have no concrete evidence other that you have confirmed that

A. An investigation on you will turn out as criminal.
B. You accused me of being a Don based on speculation and a blanket statement from a detective that did no investigations and somehow miraculously knows this to be true. I am tempted to demand this evidence presented so we can get to the bottom of it.
C. You worked with The Stranger... this is just criminal alone :beam: .

[Tran]

You're trying really hard to get Andres lynched and your arguments are far less likely to be true than his defense IMO. I have a hard time trusting you anyway and maybe we should go for a double lynch of GH/Sigurd today as I can't vote for both.

While I'm still suspicious of Twilightblade, I have to agree with Husar. Andres might be scummy, but Sigurd seems more suspicious...

Unvote
Vote: Sigurd

[Andres]

B. You accused me of being a Don based on speculation and a blanket statement from a detective that did no investigations and somehow miraculously knows this to be true. I am tempted to demand this evidence presented so we can get to the bottom of it.


There was a role in CDTC that knew the identity of the mafia dons from the very start of the game.

It's possible that Seamus invented something similar for this game.

No night actions? How convenient...

Besides, my defense is solid as a rock, go see a doctor, your fists don't look so healthy :nurse: ~;p

[PershsNhpios]

For god's sake!

I hope the lurkers or spectators are noticing that there are two players here wrestling, the one to show the other guilty - and there are about 12 potential suspects coming and going as they please, supporting whichever bandwagon they should choose and disappearing again.

I'm not trying to take anyone's attention away from anyone-

But I am trying to broaden the tunnelvision of the voters here!!

Kommodus - speak up! You are the only one who agrees with me!

[pevergreen]

Yes I do, which is why before I post anything I check the rules thread


Chatlog conversations may be referenced/quoted, but may not be copied via screenshot. Note: it can be difficult to maintain role secrecy during chat conversations.


I will not quote from a private message or from a chat log in the main thread of a mafia game and will not do so in private messages, e-mails, or other communications with anyone who was not originally a party to that message or chat unless permitted to do so by the game host.

Such quotations are permitted in Capo - II, provided that no screenshots are used and that none of the restricted information (noted in red on your role PMs) from your role PMs is discussed. Please remember that our creative group might also be fabricating this sort of thing.


The dead may post, but not vote/select nor carry out any night actions. Dead players may not reveal their roles publicly or privately until that role has been revealed as per section V and may not reveal their “familiy” or role particulars even after that time. Dead players may not quote from a PM unless that PM has been posted in the public thread by a living player. Dead players may not reveal, recount or allude to their previous night actions (or results thereof in the case of investigations) publicly or privately – even to confirm a previously made public or private reveal. Remember, even if dead you can still score well provided your “side” achieves victory. Your participation must be circumspect, but your continued participation IS encouraged.

I posted - Allowed. I did not allude to any of my night actions - allowed. I did not reveal my role - allowed. I did not quote a PM - Allowed.

So I'm disputing the warning. Why, to my knowledge and the rules as per my interpretation, I have done nothing wrong.


A pm I sent.

For reference. After I died, I've been checking each post to make sure it doesnt go against anything in the Capo Rules thread.

[Ferret]

sorry for being quiet, I've been in Spain and forgot to say :wall:, it's nice to see I'm still alive though I think I'll be a long way behind now.

[Sigurd]

OOC: (out of character)
I would just have to say that players who keep ignoring rules, and important rules as such, should receive a temporary ban from participating in mafia games.
If they so do it again when they return to the fold there should be a permanent ban.

pevergreen has walked the thin line in many games and I would have to say ruined the last game I played.
I was a late mafia coming into the game and somehow every member of the mafia got picked one after the other suggesting cheating. There were several friends of his in my group and one claimed that his account had been breached. I haven't played a game since... until now.
I am sad that this is really a show stopper for me. :no:

[pevergreen]

I have never been in any other account but pevergreen.

Seems more people disliked me than I thought.

[Andres]

The game host will decide if rules were broken or not.

I suggest we let this rest and continue the game.

Now, Sasaki, Sigurd pointed out that the result you got on me, must have come from a Made gangster.

Who was your contact? Did you cooperate with him? What were you doing N1, N2 and N3?

[Sigurd]

Seems more people disliked me than I thought.
I never carry a long grudge.
There are other reasons for me not being active in this forum. Don't be too hard on yourself, just redeem your playstyle and all will be forgotten. :yes:

[Moros]

I'm feeling ill so I might not be active the first next days.

seamus please don't WOG me.

[woad&fangs]

GH is most likely scummy based on his defensive behaviour and the fact that Pannonian wants him to be lynched. However, I'll vote: abstain for now until I make a descision on the guilt or innocence of Andres and Sigurd.

Thank you for answering, CountArach.

Does it say somewhere how many wiseguys there are? It seems like everyone is claiming the role of wiseguy for themselves.

Wiseguys(and those that claim to be):8

woad&fangs
Pannonian-deceased
Pevergreen-deceased
CountArach
Norwegian Nerd
Ichigo
Andres
GeneralHankerchief


Andres role PM looks real but as has been said, he could have gotten it from a real wiseguy in his family.

Edit: No one on Sigurd's list of inactives really surprises me. I'd expect Factionheir and Kamikhaan to have a few more posts but they aren't surprisingly low.

[Sigurd]

Heh... looking at the tally I have noticed the following players:

TinCow - third on the GH bandwagon.
TruePretorian - third on the Andres bandwagon.
Husar - third on the Sigurd bandwagon.

According to the 'rule of third on the bandwagon', that have caught so many mafia before, I will not be surprised if we find a mafioso or two in the ranks of those bandwagoneers.

Yes I call it.

[Sasaki Kojiro]

Vote:Andres

Andres is completely full of it--I posted a criminal result several days ago and his initial reaction was to laugh about my promise of accuracy and to try and convince people I was lying. If he was really a wise guy he wouldn't have done that. Also he seems to be claiming he isn't a wise guy:



Now, Sasaki, Sigurd pointed out that the result you got on me, must have come from a Made gangster.

Who was your contact? Did you cooperate with him? What were you doing N1, N2 and N3?


Luca's and mades only come up guilty on the night of the kill. The result on you is from night one.

It's funny that you are trying to convince us with role pm's--do you remember how many I had collected in capo 1?

[Omanes Alexandrapolites]

I must admit there is something odd about Sigurd's actions. Although Andres is accused of being scummy at the moment, and for a fairly good reason, Sigurd's attack on him and then withdrawal of a vote without a decent reason is fairly suspect.

In addition Drisos claims to know you are Don. How he does is fairly out of the question, but I don't see any logical reason for him, as a pro-townie player, to be making this up. He doesn't seem to be the sort who would create fictitious stories for the fun of it either.

Let's try to create a triple lynch.
Unvote: GH
Vote: Sigurd Fafnesbane

[Sasaki Kojiro]

I do find Sigurds withdrawal of a vote and switch to attacking lurkers to be scummy.

[Andres]

Vote:Andres

Andres is completely full of it--I posted a criminal result several days ago and his initial reaction was to laugh about my promise of accuracy and to try and convince people I was lying. If he was really a wise guy he wouldn't have done that.

Ah come on Sasaki, when you of all players say "I promise these results are correct", laughing is a perfectly normal reaction.


Also he seems to be claiming he isn't a wise guy:

I beg you pardon? I claimed wiseguy and posted my role pm. So how exactly am I not claiming wiseguy?



Luca's and mades only come up guilty on the night of the kill. The result on you is from night one.

So you didn't take the effort of investigating me a second time? I'm disappointed.


It's funny that you are trying to convince us with role pm's--

It's funny how you ignore my question about what you did in the previous nights.

It's funny how you ignore the fact that your investigation result might have come from a Made gangster.

It's also funny that you expect us to believe that a detective would trust you in a game where Dons show up as "innocent".


do you remember how many I had collected in capo 1?

No.

[GeneralHankerchief]

FWIW, I confirm the authenticity of Andres's Wiseguy PM and so can Kommodus.

I'll analyze everything when I get home (several hours).

[Sasaki Kojiro]

Ah come on Sasaki, when you of all players say "I promise these results are correct", laughing is a perfectly normal reaction.

You're being evasive. Is this a natural reaction to what you are claiming is a completely accurate result:


- We have Sasaki (Sasaki, of all players !) who said I came up as "criminal" after investigation. The same Sasaki who got investigated and came up as "criminal" himself according to TS. And Sasaki backs his claim up with : "I promise that these results are 100 % accurate".

No it isn't. A wise guy, upon being shown that someone had a "criminal" result on him would believe it. If he was an innocent participant of protection groups he would simply claim wise guy. You didn't do this until days later--clearly taking time to collect what you needed to fake the claim.




I beg you pardon? I claimed wiseguy and posted my role pm. So how exactly am I not claiming wiseguy?

Made's don't get guilty results only detectives do. So if you say my source must be a made, then you are saying you are guilty.




So you didn't take the effort of investigating me a second time? I'm disappointed.




It's funny how you ignore my question about what you did in the previous nights.

I've answered that question for night one before. I'm in protection groups the other nights as well. Your posts aren't evidence of innocence btw.



It's funny how you ignore the fact that your investigation result might have come from a Made gangster.

It's also funny that you expect us to believe that a detective would trust you in a game where Dons show up as "innocent".

I'm confused now, are you claiming my result is inaccurate again?




No.

I had the townie and wise guy pm on day 1.

[TinCow]

Heh... looking at the tally I have noticed the following players:

TinCow - third on the GH bandwagon.
TruePretorian - third on the Andres bandwagon.
Husar - third on the Sigurd bandwagon.

According to the 'rule of third on the bandwagon', that have caught so many mafia before, I will not be surprised if we find a mafioso or two in the ranks of those bandwagoneers.

Yes I call it.

Pardon me, but I feel the need to point out that I voted for Andres (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1831791&postcount=1361), not GH, so I should be listed as on the Andres bandwagon.

[Drisos]

I do find Sigurds withdrawal of a vote and switch to attacking lurkers to be scummy.

Me too, this entire attack on Andres but with eventually no vote does only support my initial though of Sigurd being the Don, Andres being his Made/Luca.

Though, still, I can't be sure of anything of course.

What I do know, is that Andres has behaved awfully mafia-like and is really lynch-worthy.

btw, let's not forget about the strange behaviour of TruePraetorian.

gah, so many people to lynch! :dizzy2:

[Kagemusha]

A very scummy post there Kage...

You blatantly ignore the discussion we have had on this subject. Drisos was a detective. This has been revealed.
But he was killed on night 1 and would not have been able to do any investigations in this game. And he also claimed that he was in a protection group, protecting me or Louis. You can't do both investigations and protection on the same night. Finally he claims I am a Don, which when investigated, will come up as innocent and would be inconclusive as to the fact that the person investigated is a Don or a pro-town.
A very dangerous accusation and I want Drisos to acknowledge the fact that he is just guessing and badly so.
I could be wrong about you Kagemusha and will not vote for you. But I would like to hear why you are still pushing this theory.

While I am writing, I have a question regarding the game mechanics.
If you are attacked during a night, and you are out and about doing pro-town/mafia business, will your night action be cancelled? I know this is how it worked in previous games I have played. I have yet to find any info about it in the Capo series. Anyone have experience with this?

I haven't seen Andres making a defence yet, and he was also part of the team that set fire to the accusation of me being a Don. I therefore vote:Andres

Well. As far as i know, Drisos is the only confirmed pro town role in this game and he is dead. Why would he lie about a player, thus damaging the efforts of the town? I cant simply see this happening. What could motivate him to do so? If listening and following the advice of the one player known really innocent is scummy, im guilty as charged on that.
Glenn, i still havent got any answer from you about my questions, so im inclined to dismiss you completely until you fix the situation. The ball is in your corner.

[Sigurd]

Pardon me, but I feel the need to point out that I voted for Andres (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1831791&postcount=1361), not GH, so I should be listed as on the Andres bandwagon.
You are of course correct...
The correct extract from the tally should be:

TinCow - third on the Andres bandwagon
TruePretorian - third on the GH bandwagon
Husar - third on the Sigurd bandwagon.

[Andres]

No it isn't. A wise guy, upon being shown that someone had a "criminal" result on him would believe it. If he was an innocent participant of protection groups he would simply claim wise guy. You didn't do this until days later--clearly taking time to collect what you needed to fake the claim.

I didn't say the result was false. I said that I doubted your sincerity. And I still have my doubts.


Made's don't get guilty results only detectives do. So if you say my source must be a made, then you are saying you are guilty.

~:confused:

Or = if I'm saying your source is a Made, then I am saying Sasaki has a mafia contact.


I've answered that question for night one before. I'm in protection groups the other nights as well. Your posts aren't evidence of innocence btw.

I posted my night action results. Would I have gotten results of a failed/inconclusive protection if I didn't participate in that protection?



I'm confused now, are you claiming my result is inaccurate again?

I am claiming that I don't trust you nor your source (assuming you have a source that is).


I had the townie and wise guy pm on day 1.

How many role pm's do you have now?

[Sigurd]

Well. As far as i know, Drisos is the only confirmed pro town role in this game and he is dead. Why would he lie about a player, thus damaging the efforts of the town? I cant simply see this happening. What could motivate him to do so? If listening and following the advice of the one player known really innocent is scummy, im guilty as charged on that.

GAH!!!
How am I going to defend this allegation without getting the specifics?
I acknowledge that Drisos is detective. You could at least HINT to how you got this information Drisos.
Red text in your role pm?
Someone knowing all the Dons wispered my name in a pm?
Oh... wait, someone claiming to be my Made or Luca told you in confidence?

[TosaInu]

Greetings,

This is the Don of one of the five families.

I have a proposition to make and call a meeting for de Dons.

The Dons of the other four families should contact me via this email:

Don1_CapoDeTuttiCapi@hotmail.com

The meeting of the Dons will be on an external forum where new accounts will be made, one for each Don (the dons register via a link provided).
Send an email using a fresh account, like the one provided above, with answers to these questions where the answers will only be found in the non red sections of your role pm:

1. Your family name – there should only be one of each.
2. The codeword in parenthesis in the first section (Victory conditions)
3. The third word in the first section (Victory conditions)
4. Quote sentence no.1 in paragraph A (General) from the section; Powers & Responsibilities.

If you are not able to answer these questions you will not receive an invitation.
The questions are a precoution against any claimants not being a real Don...

I hope to hear from you...

[LittleGrizzly]

de

precoution

i tried searching the forums for these typos ? (precoution actually seems to be a word ?) but i couldn't even find the post tosa just made (google fu is weak)

hmm based on the say of the only innocent i now for sure going to go for
Vote Sigurd

But Drisos can you tell us more about this ?

[TinCow]

On the recommendation of two people who seem trustworthy to me, I am disclosing the following information regarding the death of Glenn:

I contacted Louis VI the Fat during Day 3 about helping protect someone on Night 3. He agreed, and asked me in the middle of the Night 3 turn if I want to help protect Glenn. I agreed, though I told him I was probably going to vote for Glenn to be lynched the next day, since I thought Glenn was guilty of something. He did not respond to this for many hours, at which point I contacted another person about protecting someone else since it looked like Louis VI wasn't going to be doing anything or was ignoring me.

One hour and 16 minutes before the deadline, Louis VI tells me to submit orders for me, him, and JimBob to protect Glenn. I do so and CC him on the orders. Then, 33 minutes before the deadline, he tells me someone else wants in and to submit new orders for me, him, JimBob, and Leet Eriksson to protect Glenn. I do so and CC him on the orders. Then, 25 minutes before the deadline, he sends me this message:


Husar ; Leet Eriksson ; TinCow ;


Hello, sorry 'bout this. Husar just called in. Want him to be in on the action as well. Careers in medicine are important. Also, this frees up JimBob - if he really has got detective powers, we can find out from his results.

This is the new, and definitive order for Seamus:



Protect Glenn:

Husar, Leet Eriksson, TinCow, louis.

You can lynch me for being a disorganised arse in two days. :shame:

I submit orders for me, him, Husar, and Leet Eriksson to protect Glenn and CC him on the PM, as usual.

As we all know, only two people showed up to protect Glenn, and he was killed. Leet Eriksson has not responded to anyone AFAIK, so he definitely wasn't there. This could easily have been because of the late timing of the change in orders. However, I talked to both Louis VI and Husar . Both of them claim to have submitted orders properly and both claim to have gotten the "failure" response from Seamus. I know one of them is lying because only two people showed up and I was one of them.

I leave it up to the public to figure out what this means.

[Husar]

All townies should send about 200 fake mails from faked accounts to the above address so that they won't be able to sort it out until the game is over. :sweatdrop:

[Andres]

All townies should send about 200 fake mails from faked accounts to the above address so that they won't be able to sort it out until the game is over. :sweatdrop:

:laugh4:

[Sigurd]

However, I talked to both Louis VI and Husar . Both of them claim to have submitted orders properly and both claim to have gotten the "failure" response from Seamus. I know one of them is lying because only two people showed up and I was one of them.


Heh...
What say you Husar?
Did I call it right with the third on my bandwagon? or would you say Louis or TinCow are lying?

[Kagemusha]

I think ,Husar and Louis have some explaining to do.:inquisitive:

[Husar]

As we all know, only two people showed up to protect Glenn, and he was killed. Leet Eriksson has not responded to anyone AFAIK, so he definitely wasn't there. This could easily have been because of the late timing of the change in orders. However, I talked to both Louis VI and Husar . Both of them claim to have submitted orders properly and both claim to have gotten the "failure" response from Seamus. I know one of them is lying because only two people showed up and I was one of them.

I leave it up to the public to figure out what this means.
Well, I sent my PM and contacted you because I was concerned, Leet Eriksson was brought into the picture by me(he's my mafia buddy, you know... :dizzy2: ) and he said the change of orders came too short and he was afk so he missed the opportunity to change his protection.
There are several possibilities actually, apart from the ones you mentioned.

I could be guilty, only I know I'm not and I wouldn't have joined a protection group then.
The above works for anyone of us I guess.
Then Leet Eriksson could be guilty and might have lied to me about not getting his PM in in time.
And then there could have been someone blocking one of us tonight.
I wouldn't draw too many conclusions and instead propose a more scientific approach although I would have preferred to do that in private as we're all potential mafia targets now. :wall:

[Pannonian]

All townies should send about 200 fake mails from faked accounts to the above address so that they won't be able to sort it out until the game is over. :sweatdrop:
A bit like Lemur flooding GH's inbox so the detective couldn't get his orders through.

[Andres]

I submit orders for me, him, Husar, and Leet Eriksson to protect Glenn and CC him on the PM, as usual.

As we all know, only two people showed up to protect Glenn, and he was killed. Leet Eriksson has not responded to anyone AFAIK, so he definitely wasn't there. This could easily have been because of the late timing of the change in orders. However, I talked to both Louis VI and Husar . Both of them claim to have submitted orders properly and both claim to have gotten the "failure" response from Seamus. I know one of them is lying because only two people showed up and I was one of them.

I leave it up to the public to figure out what this means.

And how can we be sure that you really sent your pm to Seamus (and not just sent a pm to Husar, Louis and Leet)?

Why did you wait for the recommendation of two trustworthy people? You do realise that those trustworthy people who made you post this, created four suspects?

[TinCow]

I understand no one has any reason to trust me and that is fine. I would raise the same objection if this info was posted by anyone else. As far the town should be concerned, one of the three of us is defitinitely lying. Either TinCow, Louis VI the Fat, or Husar is directly and intentionally responsible for Glenn's failed protection.

[TinCow]

Well, I sent my PM and contacted you because I was concerned, Leet Eriksson was brought into the picture by me(he's my mafia buddy, you know... :dizzy2: ) and he said the change of orders came too short and he was afk so he missed the opportunity to change his protection.
There are several possibilities actually, apart from the ones you mentioned.

I could be guilty, only I know I'm not and I wouldn't have joined a protection group then.
The above works for anyone of us I guess.
Then Leet Eriksson could be guilty and might have lied to me about not getting his PM in in time.
And then there could have been someone blocking one of us tonight.
I wouldn't draw too many conclusions and instead propose a more scientific approach although I would have preferred to do that in private as we're all potential mafia targets now. :wall:

No, there is no other alternative. I accept the idea that Leet Eriksson simply didn't get his orders in on time. That is perfectly logical under the circumstances. However, the rest of us all claim to have submitted proper orders and to have gotten the proper response from Seamus. Since only 3 townies are required to protect someone, that should have been enough. The write-up clearly shows that only two people showed up. Therefore one of the three of us is lying about getting the failure PM.

Yes, this makes us potential mafia targets, but the important thing is to ensure that the town wins, not that we live. This information is important IMO, since it strongly suggests that one of the three of us is mafia.

[LittleGrizzly]

So tincow, louis and husar are all claiming to have thier orders in on time ?

in sigurds post earlier he mentions the third person on the bandwagon which mentions tincow and husar

there is another mention of louis in sasaki umm fos ? list

maybe it is time for a vote change...

Unvote sigurd
Vote abstain for the moment...

[The Stranger]

you know the mafia just weakened the town severely...

I say andres and sigurd are scum

[LittleGrizzly]

you know the mafia just weakened the town severely...

how so... ? please tell!

[Husar]

Is it possible that Louis is trying to disorganize the town's protection efforts?
He may already have killed two detectives that way.

[Andres]

I say andres and sigurd are scum

Nice reasoning. Interesting arguments. A solid case :bow:

[Sasaki Kojiro]

I think the time has come to post this case:

After seeing chimpyang say in the thread that he'd received recruitment pm's I sent him a pm the exchange went like this:





When you say recruitment pm's do you mean people trying to get you to join a protection group or people trying to get you to join a family?

Sasaki

I guess they are protection groups, however, one offer was for a "private group", leaning towards the ambiguous!


Ok I have an idea. Reply to this person who offered a private group and hint that you are perhaps on the shady side, looking for a mafia group to join. If they say yes then you can infiltrate and expose them in the thread. If they say no, and quote your pm in the thread and say "let's lynch chimpyang he's mafia" I'll back you up and say we set it up as a sting operation. Sound good?

Sasaki

We'll see how the cookie crumbles in this case...I may try this once the day phase has finished...then the lynch effort is delayed.

The result was that he infiltrated this group (some pm's left out here) leading to:


Just as a heads up, Hannibalbarc is in the "private group"..so any investigation will have to take account that he probably took part in the hit on LW yesterday....the others are :

- Zorg
- Xdeathfire
- scottishranger

and me as well...

On my suggestion he post this:






Just as a heads up, Hannibalbarc is in the "private group"..so any investigation will have to take account that he probably took part in the hit on LW yesterday....the others are :

- Zorg
- Xdeathfire
- scottishranger

and me as well...

So, this private group went after taka today? I think it is time to post what you've got, should be enough to lynch xdeathfire and scottishranger.

Sasaki


Also, there are only 3 left now, which means that I think unless we recruit another, no kills can be made. Will let you know ASAP if we do. But the threat is neutered as far as this group is concerned.


Wasn't taka, as far as I know, we went after Caius...Xdeathfire is def a wiseguy at least, he's in charge now....


It's my opinion that thy should be lynched asap, I think a couple kills is enough to promote to made. Sorry to post this without your permission chimp, nice work though.

[Husar]

Quintuple lynch then? ~D

[Caius]

Greetings,

This is the Don of one of the five families.

I have a proposition to make and call a meeting for de Dons.

The Dons of the other four families should contact me via this email:

Don1_CapoDeTuttiCapi@hotmail.com

The meeting of the Dons will be on an external forum where new accounts will be made, one for each Don (the dons register via a link provided).
Send an email using a fresh account, like the one provided above, with answers to these questions where the answers will only be found in the non red sections of your role pm:

1. Your family name – there should only be one of each.
2. The codeword in parenthesis in the first section (Victory conditions)
3. The third word in the first section (Victory conditions)
4. Quote sentence no.1 in paragraph A (General) from the section; Powers & Responsibilities.

If you are not able to answer these questions you will not receive an invitation.
The questions are a precoution against any claimants not being a real Don...

I hope to hear from you...
I cant believe the mafia is being organizated, and we townies are ruining our own lifes.
Why do you kill poor old bald Caius? LEave him alone!

[Sasaki Kojiro]

Quintuple lynch then? ~D

You jest, but if the dons are organizing we may need to do this.

Currently we have:

One of Louis/Husar is mafia (I trust TinCow). I would go with Louis personally, he was really active pro town last game and isn't at all this game, his logic in attacks hasn't been the best and it's somewhat suspicious the way the wagon rolled on for his selection.

ScottishRanger/Xdeathfire: at least one of them needs to go right away, both eventually.

Andres--At best an evil wise guy, probably made or luca, I can't see any pro town wise guy reacting the way he has. He also tried to become mafia the last game where he was a wise guy.

GH-imo not as high a priority as these 4.

Does anyone have the latest tally? Can directors be lynched on a day they aren't up for election? It would be nice to lynch three of these if not four.

[Andres]

Aren't you forgetting Sigurd?

Or are we not going to lynch the only one who got accused of being a Don by the only confirmed innocent detective we have?

:inquisitive:

[shlin28]

Aren't you forgetting Sigurd?

Or are we not going to lynch the only one who got accused of being a Don by the only confirmed innocent detective we have?

:inquisitive:
But the only innocent detective DID NOT INVESTIGATE ANYONE! (You are referring to Drisos right?)

Will vote later when I finish reading the posts.

[Sasaki Kojiro]

Aren't you forgetting Sigurd?

Or are we not going to lynch the only one who got accused of being a Don by the only confirmed innocent detective we have?

:inquisitive:

Last game an innocent detective vouched for the wolf. You are using poor reasoning. There are plenty of reasons to be suspicious of Sigurd but this is not one of them. He's on my list (see sig) but not at the top.

[Husar]

One of Louis/Husar is mafia (I trust TinCow). I would go with Louis personally, he was really active pro town last game and isn't at all this game, his logic in attacks hasn't been the best and it's somewhat suspicious the way the wagon rolled on for his selection.
If you trust TinCow then I guess it's Louis, he was coordinating our protection efforts and changed them in the last minute, maybe hoping we wouldn't get our PMs in in time so he could blame us for the failure. :inquisitive:
That's why I said he may have led us astray so his buddies could lynch a detective or two. I'm not 100% sure about this though(might be good to know why you trust TinCow) and as long as he is director I guess we won't be able to lynch him anyway. :shrug:

[shlin28]

Last game an innocent detective vouched for the wolf. You are using poor reasoning. There are plenty of reasons to be suspicious of Sigurd but this is not one of them. He's on my list (see sig) but not at the top.

I dont get your list :embarassed:

[GeneralHankerchief]

If we do not trust Louis then we must remove him from the Director position this day phase. If there's a tie vote, he'll obviously do what's best for him and not the town. Clearly, he won't lynch himself. I suggest getting rid of Louis tonight and then the combo of Xdeath/scottish tomorrow.

QUESTION FOR SEAMUS:

Can we vote to sack a Director on a phase when there's no Director election? Or does he hold his position unless he gets lynched?

Until Seamus answers, I'm going to do a tentative

Vote: Louis VI the Fat

[Crazed Rabbit]

Let's leave Louis off for now - we can only get one lynch at most, not the double or triple we want. As he's director he can choose not to be lynched in the event of a tie.

So Andres, GH, Xdeathfire, sound like good bets for now. I think a triple lynch is the way to go. Lynching Louis removes one disorganizer of protection groups, lynching the others removes active killers.

Oh, and the whole Andres pretending he was a wiseguy thing - wasn't he found guilty, meaning he killed somebody night one? Meaning he is part of the ballet slipper mafia? Since they were the only people who killed Night one.

CR

[Caius]

I do not trust Andres after all. I have my reasons to not to trust him.

[Pannonian]

I do not trust Andres after all. I have my reasons to not to trust him.
Why don't you state them publicly then? You're alive, aren't you?

[Caius]

Why don't you state them publicly then? You're alive, aren't you?
What do you mean?

I forgot to, Vote:Andres

[Sigurd]

I believe a tally is in order: (edit: added Caius' vote)


Andres: 5 (CR, Gibson, Sasaki, TinCow, Caius)
GH: 4 (ajaxfetish, CountA, Proletariat, TruePretorian)
Sigurd: 4 (Husar, Ichigo, Kage, Omanes)
Louis: 1 (GH)
Rythmic: 1 (Kommodus)

Abstains: 5 (hiji, LittleGriz, Sarathos, w&f, Xehh II)
Not voting: 49 !!!

[Caius]

This is in order:
GH: 4 (ajaxfetish, CountA, Proletariat, TruePretorian)
Andres: 5 (CR, Gibson, Sasaki, TinCow, Caius)
Sigurd: 4 (Husar, Ichigo, Kage, Omanes)
Louis: 1 (GH)
Rythmic: 1 (Kommodus)

Abstains: 5 (hiji, LittleGriz, Sarathos, w&f, Xehh II)
Not voting: 48 !!!

[KukriKhan]

So TosaInu, a previously-unlisted player reveals he is a Don, in his single post in-thread. Are there other "surprise" players waiting to spring from the wings?

If so, it makes the task of winnowing out threats even harder.

We've had a few players self-reveal as alleged wise-guys, and one player self-reveal as a detective.

As the only self-admitted Don, I feel I have to:

Vote: TosaInu.

I'll edit-in the vote count here when I find it.
---------------------------------------
-edit-
Just saw Caius's tally, and updated:

GH: 4 (ajaxfetish, CountA, Proletariat, TruePretorian)
Andres: 5 (CR, Gibson, Sasaki, TinCow, Caius)
Sigurd: 4 (Husar, Ichigo, Kage, Omanes)
Louis: 1 (GH)
Rythmic: 1 (Kommodus)
TosaInu: 1 (KukriKhan)

Abstains: 5 (hiji, LittleGriz, Sarathos, w&f, Xehh II)
Not voting: 47

[Sasaki Kojiro]

hmm kukri I think tosa was told by someone else to post that.

[Pannonian]

Tosa's passing on the message for someone else, he's not playing and hence he can't be lynched. We had the same situation with Andres in Capo 1, when he PMed a load of people on Kralizec's behalf.

[Andres]

I think Kukri is well aware of that.

Playing the joker to hide scummy activities?

Vote : Kukrikhan

Let's lynch him. People are dying and he starts making jokes.

[Caius]

Best way to quit himself the suspiction.

[Sasaki Kojiro]

I think Kukri is well aware of that.

Playing the joker to hide scummy activities?

Vote : Kukrikhan

Let's lynch him. People are dying and he starts making jokes.

Seriously now? Voting for kukri is your choice given louis, scottishranger, and xdeathfire?

Andres must be lynched today.

[Ferret]

Vote:Sigurd

he's acting very suspicious

[Andres]

Seriously now? Voting for kukri is your choice given louis, scottishranger, and xdeathfire?

Andres must be lynched today.

I was joking :shame:

[Charge]

vote: abstain
will let you guys decide who goes to be lynched this time as they all claims that other one is guilty and i'm not a detective

[Sigurd]

Vote:Sigurd

he's acting very suspicious
Please do elaborate...
Did Andres tell you to put that vote on me?

[Sasaki Kojiro]

I was joking :shame:

Where is the joke?

[Charge]

Tosa's passing on the message for someone else, he's not playing and hence he can't be lynched. We had the same situation with Andres in Capo 1, when he PMed a load of people on Kralizec's behalf.
Should Tosa join then too? :beam:

[Ferret]

Andres has never said anything to me in my life, I just voted because you seem to love making tallies and are eager to kill off seemingly innocent people. If someone else looks more suspicious I'll change my vote to them for you :clown:

[Drisos]

Lol, andres. Want to lynch someone because he makes a joke? really, you're way off normal behaviour.

Tally now looks like we can lynch, Andres, Sigurd and GH. That would be nice. Lycnhing 3 a day will get our list done, hopefully.

Chimpyang, please confirm Sasaki's story. If you do, indeed, these group members are lynchees..

oh btw, you people keep asking for reasons why I think andres and sigurd are guilty. well first of all, you don't need it, and you have proof I'm pro-town. and I'm not going to write a book on it, but: remember I was in a protection group with andres to protect sigurd night 1? andres behaviour in that group, in pm, + what other people knew from pm contact with him, + sigurd and andres' behaviour in this thread... it all seems to fit as, Sigurd=Don and Andres=Family member

I can repeat, I'm not sure, but I still strongly believe this.

btw, another repeat: soo many people to lynch! :S

[Andres]

Where is the joke?

Why don't you love me? :bigcry:

[Caius]

Wasn't taka, as far as I know, we went after Caius...Xdeathfire is def a wiseguy at least, he's in charge now....
Who said this?

[Omanes Alexandrapolites]

Unvote: Sigurd
Vote: GH

Balancing things up for the best chances of the removal of two scummy players.

BTW, Caius, might I ask what this evidence against Andres is. It may be useful for future reference's sake.

Tally:
GeneralHankerchief: 5 (ajaxfetish, CountArach, Proletariat, TruePretorian, Omanes Alexandrapoites)
Andres: 5 (CrazedRabbit, Gibson, Sasaki Kojiro, TinCow, Caius)

Sigurd: 4 (Husar, Ichigo, Kagemusha, Elite Ferret)

Louis VI the Fat: 1 (GeneralHankerchief)
Rythmic: 1 (Kommodus)
TosaInu: 1 (KukriKhan)

Abstains: 5 (Hiji, LittleGriz, Sarathos, woad&fangs, Xehh II)

Not voting: 47 players

[Andres]

Unvote : Kukrikhan ; Vote : Sigurd Fafnesbane

Might as well take a Don with me.


Not voting: 47 players

This is bad news for the town...

[Sasaki Kojiro]

Unvote: Sigurd
Vote: GH

Balancing things up for the best chances of the removal of two scummy players.


I really think we need to lynch xdeathfire today.


Why don't you love me? :bigcry:

because you're mafia


Who said this?

chimpyang


ok I'll repeat this

Lynch xdeathfire he's confirmed mafia

we need to get him up to the others level.

[Charge]

Tally 1482:
GH: 5 (ajaxfetish, CountArach, Proletariat, TruePretorian, Omanes Alexandrapoites)
Andres: 5 (CrazedRabbit, Gibson, Sasaki Kojiro, TinCow, Caius)
Sigurd: 4 (Husar, Ichigo, Elite Ferret, Andres)

Xdeathfire: 2 (GH, Shlin)
Rythmic: 1 (Kommodus)
TosaInu: 1 (KukriKhan)

Abstains: 7 (Hiji, LittleGriz, Sarathos, woad&fangs, Xehh II, Charge, Kage)

Not voting: 44 !!!!

[Kagemusha]

Unvote, vote: abstain may change.


Tally:
GH: 5 (ajaxfetish, CountArach, Proletariat, TruePretorian, Omanes Alexandrapoites)
Andres: 5 (CrazedRabbit, Gibson, Sasaki Kojiro, TinCow, Caius)

Sigurd: 3 (Husar, Ichigo, Andres)

Louis VI the Fat: 1 (GeneralHankerchief)
Rythmic: 1 (Kommodus)
TosaInu: 1 (KukriKhan)

Abstains: 7 (Hiji, LittleGriz, Sarathos, woad&fangs, Xehh II,Charge, Kage)

Not voting: 45 players

[Omanes Alexandrapolites]

Might I request your reasoning for attempting to save Sigurd through the removal of a tie Kagemusha? It seems very scummy to try and save an extremely suspicious player so late on in the day phase.

[GeneralHankerchief]

All right, fine.

Unvote: Louis
Vote: Xdeathfire

[Ferret]

Kagemusha's tally misses off my vote and so is wrong, look at Charge's version.

[shlin28]

Vote Xdeathfire

But which post specififcally point to him as guilty?

Bah, screwed up the poll, see charge's version.

[Kagemusha]

Might I request your reasoning for attempting to save Sigurd through the removal of a tie Kagemusha? It seems very scummy to try and save a suspicious player so late on in the day phase.

Omanes,look at the Drisos last post. at the second last page.He is admitting he is not sure about Sigurd, he is just speculating.Well thats too damned light to lynch Sigurd when there are others to lynch with heavier reasons.

[GeneralHankerchief]

A reminder of why you should vote for Xdeathfire and/or scottishranger. (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showpost.php?p=1832259&postcount=1442)

Short of a Detective reveal, that's the closest thing to confirmed evidence we're gonna get. Stop voting based on speculation!!!

[Charge]

Bah, unvote; vote: xdeathfire

Tally 1485:
GH: 5 (ajaxfetish, CountArach, Proletariat, TruePretorian, Omanes Alexandrapoites)
Andres: 5 (CrazedRabbit, Gibson, Sasaki Kojiro, TinCow, Caius)
Sigurd: 4 (Husar, Ichigo, Elite Ferret, Andres)
Xdeathfire: 3 (GH, Shlin, Charge)

Rythmic: 1 (Kommodus)
TosaInu: 1 (KukriKhan)

Abstains: 6 (Hiji, LittleGriz, Sarathos, woad&fangs, Xehh II, Kage)

Not voting: 44 !!!!

[Sasaki Kojiro]

unvote,vote:xdeathfire


Tally 1486:
GH: 5 (ajaxfetish, CountArach, Proletariat, TruePretorian, Omanes Alexandrapoites)
Andres: 4 (CrazedRabbit, Gibson, TinCow, Caius)
Sigurd: 4 (Husar, Ichigo, Elite Ferret, Andres)
Xdeathfire: 4 (GH, Shlin, Charge,Sasaki Kojiro)

Rythmic: 1 (Kommodus)
TosaInu: 1 (KukriKhan)

Abstains: 6 (Hiji, LittleGriz, Sarathos, woad&fangs, Xehh II, Kage)

Not voting: 44 !!!!

[The Stranger]

Nice reasoning. Interesting arguments. A solid case :bow:

you should know better by now... and btw... your defence is scummy! you are avoiding my accusations completely!!!

[CountArach]

Unvote: GH
Vote: XDeathfire

I would much rather lynch someone on close-to confirmed guilt than on suspicions.

Also - me thinks some townies need a wake-up PM.

Tally 1488:
Xdeathfire: 5 (GH, Shlin, Charge, Sasaki Kojiro, CountArach)
GH: 4 (ajaxfetish, Proletariat, TruePretorian, Omanes Alexandrapoites)
Andres: 4 (CrazedRabbit, Gibson, TinCow, Caius)
Sigurd: 4 (Husar, Ichigo, Elite Ferret, Andres)

Rythmic: 1 (Kommodus)
TosaInu: 1 (KukriKhan)

Abstains: 6 (Hiji, LittleGriz, Sarathos, woad&fangs, Xehh II, Kage)

Not voting: 44 !!!!

[Lt. Pinard]

voting ends 8pm est time right? Just double checking

Just a question but in a game this size what is the normal amount of wiseguys there usually are?

[shlin28]

Someone unvote GH and we'll have a quardruple lynch!

[CountArach]

voting ends 8pm est time right? Just double checking

Just a question but in a game this size what is the normal amount of wiseguys there usually are?
We have never had a game this size in the past. Capo I had about 20-30 less people and it had 10 Wise Guys.

EDIT: Good idea shlin
Unvote: GH
Vote: Abstain

Tally 1491:
Xdeathfire: 4 (GH, Shlin, Charge, Sasaki Kojiro)
GH: 4 (ajaxfetish, Proletariat, TruePretorian, Omanes Alexandrapoites)
Andres: 4 (CrazedRabbit, Gibson, TinCow, Caius)
Sigurd: 4 (Husar, Ichigo, Elite Ferret, Andres)

Rythmic: 1 (Kommodus)
TosaInu: 1 (KukriKhan)

Abstains: 7 (Hiji, LittleGriz, Sarathos, woad&fangs, Xehh II, Kage, CountArach)

Not voting: 44

[Sasaki Kojiro]

Now if we can just keep it this way...

[Caius]

DONT VOTE! KEEP IT THAT WAY!

[Haudegen]

vote: abstain

for obvious reasons

[Craterus]

As you wish.

vote:abstain

Tally 1495:
Xdeathfire: 4 (GH, Shlin, Charge, Sasaki Kojiro)
GH: 4 (ajaxfetish, Proletariat, TruePretorian, Omanes Alexandrapoites)
Andres: 4 (CrazedRabbit, Gibson, TinCow, Caius)
Sigurd: 4 (Husar, Ichigo, Elite Ferret, Andres)

Rythmic: 1 (Kommodus)
TosaInu: 1 (KukriKhan)

Abstains: 9 (Hiji, LittleGriz, Sarathos, woad&fangs, Xehh II, Kage, CountArach, Craterus, Haudegen)

Not voting: 42

EDIT: Included Haudegen

[Andres]

Unvote : Sigurd ; Vote : Xdeathfire

I'm not suicidal...

[Caius]

Wait, if there are more abstains than normal votes, what will happen?

[GeneralHankerchief]

Wait, if there are more abstains than normal votes, what will happen?

The person with the most normal votes gets lynched.

[Sasaki Kojiro]

Unvote, vote:sigurd

Let's not play this game andres.

Tally 1495:
Xdeathfire: 4 (GH, Shlin, Charge,Andres)
GH: 4 (ajaxfetish, Proletariat, TruePretorian, Omanes Alexandrapoites)
Andres: 4 (CrazedRabbit, Gibson, TinCow, Caius)
Sigurd: 4 (Husar, Ichigo, Elite Ferret, Sasaki)

Rythmic: 1 (Kommodus)
TosaInu: 1 (KukriKhan)

Abstains: 9 (Hiji, LittleGriz, Sarathos, woad&fangs, Xehh II, Kage, CountArach, Craterus, Haudegen)

Not voting: 42

[CountArach]

Unvote, Vote: GH

I think 5 is a much easier number to keep it at.

Xdeathfire: 5 (GH, Shlin, Charge, Sasaki Kojiro, Andres)
GH: 5 (ajaxfetish, Proletariat, TruePretorian, Omanes Alexandrapoites, CountArach)
Andres: 4 (CrazedRabbit, Gibson, TinCow, Caius)
Sigurd: 4 (Husar, Ichigo, Elite Ferret, Sasaki)

Rythmic: 1 (Kommodus)
TosaInu: 1 (KukriKhan)

Abstains: 8 (Hiji, LittleGriz, Sarathos, woad&fangs, Xehh II, Kage, Craterus, Haudegen)

Not voting: 42