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I think that Maple should die but I think that there's value to giving jan the card bc even if he doesn't jail maple bc he could tell whoever was jailed that he was given the card. That said I'm kinda hoping one gets jailed and the other executed regardless of card outcome.
With that said, I think that Maple and Wisdom are both wolves and just based on claims and vibes Maple is more likely to be the more valuable wolf but I think relying on that is to egoy, I'll just say that Maple is the most likely wolf imo
insomnia
08-13-2024, 17:39
ngl, i dont get the point of maple giving the card or whatever. all it does is confirm his role does something around that. does it confirm him as villa? will it not make us want to kill him? you need to ask these questions as well
manti is good with mech and i dislike the fact he implied he'd be cleared even tho he has no clue what his cards do. also if i were in position i'd target an UTR target that I have as a villa read, not arctic. after all, my intention is to prove my role is what it is. if a wolf gets it, we know who that wolf is and we confirm maple as legit his role
manti, what was your thought process in picking the card recipient if not this?
insomnia
08-13-2024, 17:43
i'd rather jan jails someone that he actually plans on executing. if the plan is for him to jail manti just to "confirm" he does his thing, you are all aware that jan is simply gonna die and won't be able to claim that, right?
or are we all oblivious to that fact
i see no reason for why jan should jail maple. we should just kill him rn and let him jail wisdom or whoever his heart desires and give us some KP since we lost all of it
ngl, i dont get the point of maple giving the card or whatever. all it does is confirm his role does something around that. does it confirm him as villa? will it not make us want to kill him? you need to ask these questions as well
manti is good with mech and i dislike the fact he implied he'd be cleared even tho he has no clue what his cards do. also if i were in position i'd target an UTR target that I have as a villa read, not arctic. after all, my intention is to prove my role is what it is. if a wolf gets it, we know who that wolf is and we confirm maple as legit his role
manti, what was your thought process in picking the card recipient if not this?
im p. sure maple will never be confirmed of anything lol i just convinced myself wisdom should be a wolf here.
ngl, i dont get the point of maple giving the card or whatever. all it does is confirm his role does something around that. does it confirm him as villa? will it not make us want to kill him? you need to ask these questions as well
manti is good with mech and i dislike the fact he implied he'd be cleared even tho he has no clue what his cards do. also if i were in position i'd target an UTR target that I have as a villa read, not arctic. after all, my intention is to prove my role is what it is. if a wolf gets it, we know who that wolf is and we confirm maple as legit his role
manti, what was your thought process in picking the card recipient if not this?
I never should have been getting pushed in the first place. The fact that people didn't fuck off when I initially claimed PR is what led us to this situation.
If Arctic lived the night he confirms I did something very village aligned at night with an action and people get off my back long enough to let me be useful.
Did I overplay the confirmable nature of my role? Yes. But only because people decided to fuck around for some inexplicable reason. You'll notice I never even implied my alignment was hard confirmable until it looked like I was dying, up until that point I just claimed I had a role that gave verifiable feedback.
Sure let's just go into tomorrow with, like, 4 more flips and I'm sure the remaining villagers can pick up the pieces. If we're lucky, Jan hits a wolf and I give out a gun or a check or some shit.
Fake solving is like breathing for me so it's not even like I can believably solve until people don't kill me.
Largely because, fmpov, this shit is so straight forward.
Players Votes
Wisdom 4 (Gemma, Ladd, grr, EnderWiggin)
Maple 4 (nebjiamn, insomnia, Wisdom, Dolby)
Ladd 2 (Montmorency, dyachei)
Jan 1 (Theknightsofneeee)
whatthistextdo
if maple is a villager it means he get one more action, I get a card and even if he dies to my hand there are cards that might have high value to use for me on the same night.
maybe I get a pgo and kill a wolf visiting me?
maybe I get to doc a player or a vigshot?
Maybe it is nothing.
There are a lot of good outcomes in a v!maple world.
i'd rather jan jails someone that he actually plans on executing. if the plan is for him to jail manti just to "confirm" he does his thing, you are all aware that jan is simply gonna die and won't be able to claim that, right?
or are we all oblivious to that fact
i see no reason for why jan should jail maple. we should just kill him rn and let him jail wisdom or whoever his heart desires and give us some KP since we lost all of it
there is a high chance I die tonight so I should almost always execute.
unless I find an unclaimed pr and believe the claim I should just reduce the general poe.
If maple is v, they get off an useful action tonight
If wisdom is v, they have no action
If you think they ar eboth wolves, vote wisdom imo
Montmorency
08-13-2024, 17:55
theknightsofneeee
You found Sunbae "LACKING" throughout D1. Do you find his thread presence today reassuring or not?
also from what i have seen people are COMPLETELY dropping everyones legacies immediately so you'll also be forgotten the minute ur dead. xD I cant recall anyone ever referring to a legacy (it probably happened once or twice I struggle to be aware of everything).
(which is also kinda a subtle hint to me that dead villa legacies are probs decent).
I'm not sure I've ever seen a game in which people truly cared about legacies. Even, like, detailed analyses on the threshold of the flip by PR that lay out who is clear and who is sus more or less correctly.
While I am at it.
Wisdoms progression on Sunbae:
Hm. I don't understand the progression from pure and TL, to bottom null in a few hours D2, and to voting Sunbae today.
(btw now that i come across this just saying my handling of rask was actually villagery af its clear i was confused about getting my top townread in a CC from someone who shouldnt be a wolf by how the claim went down and then decided to be convinced he is a wolf him after he made the wolfiest post in the entire thread, which shows i have no TMI and read also him exactly like what he was: a serial killer (probably). also makes no sense for me as wolf to push him there cuz if i was a wolf rask is a villa who announced to kill a (likely? dunno) villa tonight).
Sorry, word salad. Rephrase.
ok so someone explain to me why maple is a wolf and not just a villager fucking around like he does?
And no mont, your argument of he did this in a previous wolf game is lame because he's also done this in a previous village game
I said that about ladd.
in tarot, the meaning of a card and its relation to other cards in a reading changes depending on the way the card is facing when it is dealt
look at the card in your role pm, it's facing upwards, the normal way
it can be turned sideways or upside down and that changes how its interpreted
"inverting" is just this game's language to describe that change
everyone has their role, then they have another hidden role. when they get inverted, their role changes to the hidden (and more fun) role
Now we're getting somewhere. I looked up the (new) Mafia modifier "inverted" at first, and have been confused ever since.
bop claimed vt fwiw
id imagine inverter is still out there
Could have been stetter or arctic.
Looking back I just realized that Maple and Wisdom just kinda had the same POE? Wisdom had Gemma/Me/Monty/Vanta in a post earlier today before they decided after prompting that Maple was bad and voted them, and Maple had that same poe + Benneh (and presumably ladd). I kind of think that having that POE is wolf indicative anyway but I also think that, looking at this from Wisdom specific POV if Wisdom and Maple are w/w, why have any of your other teammates below Maple?
Dolby
Dya - though I think that there is a VERY slim world where mafia somehow found out that Rask is SK and they CCed to kill him and fakeclear
Knights
grr
Insomnia
Monty - yes he is up here and yes I think he still could be 3p
Jan - realisitcally I think with his current claimed role he is forced to use it in a pro town way even if wolf. Could be wolf roleblocker I guess (funny).
Benneh
Vanta
Gemma
Sunbae
Ender
Wisdom
Ladd
Maple
I think that within the big middle group Monty and Jan are probably town and as long as I resolve doubt on the people between Benneh and Ender we're fine?
I straight up think that Maple/Wisdom/Ladd are 3/3 and I'd expect more from Maple today on the sole basis that Maple is the presumptive yeet.
Let's say we have more or less the same POE. But - can you convince Jan to dice ladd if we do oust Maple today, or vice versa? It's important. (Scrap the scenario where he extorts and executes Maple; PGO risk too high.) Jan Dolby
Why spend time reading Jan though? It's a truly self-resolving slot.
If maple is v, they get off an useful action tonight
If wisdom is v, they have no action
If you think they ar eboth wolves, vote wisdom imo
Mine is a day action tbf, I get an action off either way.
Also jan prolly should claim ITT who he is jailing to avoid cross fire with eventual other village kp and i see no downside to it
Montmorency
08-13-2024, 17:57
I will vote Wisdom if ladd dies tonight. (I will also vote Maple if ladd dies tonight.)
if maple is a villager it means he get one more action, I get a card and even if he dies to my hand there are cards that might have high value to use for me on the same night.
maybe I get a pgo and kill a wolf visiting me?
maybe I get to doc a player or a vigshot?
Maybe it is nothing.
There are a lot of good outcomes in a v!maple world.
I don't really doubt that Maple's role is real
But I doubt that she has it and is town.
I don't like how he tried to sell himself as confirmable
I don't like his thread play
I don't like how he's playing today NOT like a towny who knows they are about to die. Yes the VC is 4-4 right now, but Maple has been kind of the presumptive yeet since SOD
I don't like how the card went to Arctic. To be frank I think that it's pretty likely Maple gave a card to a teammate.
If Maple gives you a card I still want to kill them. In addition, I think there's odds you could be killed and roleblocked tonight in that world, and we will keep on being given reasons to give Maple another day.
14 posts left
Also jan prolly should claim ITT who he is jailing to avoid cross fire with eventual other village kp and i see no downside to it
wolves know if I pick one of them anyway because they are banned from wolfchat if I do (for the night).
And I doubt I would pick a villager that wolves want to kill tbh.
Let's say we have more or less the same POE. But - can you convince Jan to dice ladd if we do oust Maple today, or vice versa? It's important. (Scrap the scenario where he extorts and executes Maple; PGO risk too high.) Jan Dolby
Why spend time reading Jan though? It's a truly self-resolving slot.
I hope I can convince Jan. Not to sure, I think that he will arrive wherever he arrives on his own. I was kinda worried for a second that Jan could have started as a alalouge to a mafia roleblocker, but reading through him made me feel WAY better about him. That's why I read through him
13 posts left
I think Wisdom voted Sunbae as a joke. Not sure if I need to rephrase as I was just talking to Wisdom because she said I was not villagery in thread when something spicy with Rask happened. Unless you desperately want to understand it then I could. (i didnt need to add it there i was just rambling).
Currently have nothing to add to the discussion. Suppose I could tell Jan who to shoot if he's (a real hehe) villa Killpower, but i'd rather he just snipes a wolf. Idk how confident he feels on his own reads.
I am honestly pretty convinced wisdom is a wolf
Not sure maple is but maybe i am being a dummie there
I think assuming above is right then there is 2 in benneh/sunbae/knights and then unsure on the last atm but with wolf flips it should be findable
Montmorency
08-13-2024, 18:13
I never should have been getting pushed in the first place. The fact that people didn't fuck off when I initially claimed PR is what led us to this situation.
If Arctic lived the night he confirms I did something very village aligned at night with an action and people get off my back long enough to let me be useful.
Did I overplay the confirmable nature of my role? Yes. But only because people decided to fuck around for some inexplicable reason. You'll notice I never even implied my alignment was hard confirmable until it looked like I was dying, up until that point I just claimed I had a role that gave verifiable feedback.
Give me a power-up and I will spare you. I'm actually the best gift recipient if you think about it. Gib
if maple is a villager it means he get one more action, I get a card and even if he dies to my hand there are cards that might have high value to use for me on the same night.
maybe I get a pgo and kill a wolf visiting me?
maybe I get to doc a player or a vigshot?
Maybe it is nothing.
There are a lot of good outcomes in a v!maple world.
Do we actually know the gift actions are exclusive?
Please do kill bottom of masons POE though.
For the love of god dont give monty any cards
Montmorency
08-13-2024, 18:22
For the love of god dont give monty any cards
Tell Maple in chat to gift me and I will drop my sus. I won't even finish
<--- woke up feeling quite sick, apologies. will try to power through but i make no promises
<--- woke up feeling quite sick, apologies. will try to power through but i make no promises
take care of yourself first.
game is slow enough that you can mostly skip a day or 3 and be fine.
and today likely should not depend on your single vote.
take care of yourself first.
game is slow enough that you can mostly skip a day or 3 and be fine.
and today likely should not depend on your single vote.
I have a few things I want to say first and like, if they come off pointed I promise it's just sick cranky and not actually mad at anyone.
But:
1. I'm kind of flustered at reading Ladd just lumping me in with Benneh and Knights because "i guess he could be doing this as a wolf" or w/e. It's not just Ladd who has been doing this (and I'm also kind of flustered with everyone else doing it, and with Gemma acting like I'm out in left field ... my reads aren't that wild anymore for the most part!) but after I tried hard to see the game through a vLadd perspective while everyone was zoning in on him and extended an olive branch, seeing that just left me :| because it's like he didn't even try to make a real read on me. I know I've been talking about shitposting and I've been silly from time to time, but the reality is I'm basically the top poster who has given reads on nearly the entire game on every single game day. I've explained those reads when I could, tried to when I couldn't, pressed people about them, defended them when I was confident on them, adjusted when others made good points against them, and got a consensus for blind spots from others to shore things up.
I'm not saying that to say "obvious villager" I'm saying that to say that it is easy to have some sort of read on me for it! Just like read my posts and call me a villager or a wolf. Just call me something. I genuinely want people to just read through my reads and take a stand one way or another. If you call me a wolf and give reasons I can at least refute those with explanations (as long as its not vague buzzwords like "performative" or things like that) which can get you in my head and maybe make it click. But just shrugging, putting me aside, and locking me in for the d4/5 shrug yeet is like, i cant really do anything about that!
Again: top poster with reads on the entire game at various points outside of maybe Vanta (who I have asked about at least a few times) and dolby (who I would call pretty solidly solvey today and I'm worried about right now).
Just like, try? meet me half way? You can see Ive been trying!!
2. Gemma called me "sitting back playing for d6" and how thats concerning but I find it absolutely impossible to read my posts today and think that? Like I am actively explaining to Insom that I do not want to sleepwalk through two claims being killed because if it's wrong it's going to be too late and am actively exploring various other worlds because I think it's important. And Gemma read this post because they also call me out for being "in narnia" and "so out in left field" because I explore Insom/Gemma/Benneh in that exact same post. So like, what is going on with that? I mean I get everyone else seems to have Gemma villa and that's why I'm not locking in on that but can someone just recognize that with me and tell me I'm not crazy for thinking that's weird? I feel similar to how I felt about rasks posting towards me day 1 where I just see it and say "theres no way this person is actually reading my posts" you know? Which, fine, maybe they ARENT and are a villager anyways, but yeah.
Of course none of this matters if general consensus of maple/wisdom being wolves is right cause we're steamrolling in that case but I'm looking around and being c o n c e r n e d that if they aren't i have been lined up to get railroaded and i am trying to ring alarm bells for it you know?
ok dolby but what if i told you manti/maple does that kind of "im confirmable" shit as a villager, too. Im so confused why everyone is so sure he's a wolf while I'm sitting here scratching my head. I think wisdom or ladd are better choices
Ender,
Saw your post: I think in game vibing would be pretty nice if we can line that up but idk our schedules seem so opposite
ok dolby but what if i told you manti/maple does that kind of "im confirmable" shit as a villager, too. Im so confused why everyone is so sure he's a wolf while I'm sitting here scratching my head. I think wisdom or ladd are better choices
it impacts my read a bit but Manti has not been playing today like a dying villager has been. He's been spinning wheels and trying to get One More Day from Jan. He hasn't been solving, he's been saying "these people are villagers and these people are my POE" without really anything else to really say. He isn't solving, I don't see evidence that he's evaluating. He's just existing.
I think all three are wolves. I hope that Manti goes today and Wisdom is executed rn. I currently think all three are wolves.
I have read Ladd's concern about Knights and while I don't agree with it right now, I have noted that Knight's villageryist posting to me was while under direct threat of dying eod1 and has fallen off since. I explained day 2 away with birthday stuff but Ill keep it in the back of my mind for the future.
Also Jan,
it's been nice to get into the mid stages of a game with you and try and solve. we havent gotten that in a while
I have a few things I want to say first and like, if they come off pointed I promise it's just sick cranky and not actually mad at anyone.
But:
1. I'm kind of flustered at reading Ladd just lumping me in with Benneh and Knights because "i guess he could be doing this as a wolf" or w/e. It's not just Ladd who has been doing this (and I'm also kind of flustered with everyone else doing it, and with Gemma acting like I'm out in left field ... my reads aren't that wild anymore for the most part!) but after I tried hard to see the game through a vLadd perspective while everyone was zoning in on him and extended an olive branch, seeing that just left me :| because it's like he didn't even try to make a real read on me. I know I've been talking about shitposting and I've been silly from time to time, but the reality is I'm basically the top poster who has given reads on nearly the entire game on every single game day. I've explained those reads when I could, tried to when I couldn't, pressed people about them, defended them when I was confident on them, adjusted when others made good points against them, and got a consensus for blind spots from others to shore things up.
I'm not saying that to say "obvious villager" I'm saying that to say that it is easy to have some sort of read on me for it! Just like read my posts and call me a villager or a wolf. Just call me something. I genuinely want people to just read through my reads and take a stand one way or another. If you call me a wolf and give reasons I can at least refute those with explanations (as long as its not vague buzzwords like "performative" or things like that) which can get you in my head and maybe make it click. But just shrugging, putting me aside, and locking me in for the d4/5 shrug yeet is like, i cant really do anything about that!
Again: top poster with reads on the entire game at various points outside of maybe Vanta (who I have asked about at least a few times) and dolby (who I would call pretty solidly solvey today and I'm worried about right now).
Just like, try? meet me half way? You can see Ive been trying!!
fair enuf, I have def not put a ton of effort into reading you or benneh
I said you are gth in my reads list but right now i am mostly at wisdom/knights/x/x and i think you or benneh would fit well for 1 of the x slots; unsure about the other
thats really all there is to it
it impacts my read a bit but Manti has not been playing today like a dying villager has been. He's been spinning wheels and trying to get One More Day from Jan. He hasn't been solving, he's been saying "these people are villagers and these people are my POE" without really anything else to really say. He isn't solving, I don't see evidence that he's evaluating. He's just existing.
I think all three are wolves. I hope that Manti goes today and Wisdom is executed rn. I currently think all three are wolves.
why am i a wolf without pre associatives with maple w?
I have read Ladd's concern about Knights and while I don't agree with it right now, I have noted that Knight's villageryist posting to me was while under direct threat of dying eod1 and has fallen off since. I explained day 2 away with birthday stuff but Ill keep it in the back of my mind for the future.
i just dont see where else the wolves can be
if someone can make a case for someone else i am willing to hear it (yes i know you have said concerns about gemma and insomnia but I re checked gemma and it only strenghtned my v read on them, insomnia i havent really cared to recheck cause i think he is out of his wolf range. if not congrats to him)
fair enuf, I have def not put a ton of effort into reading you or benneh
I said you are gth in my reads list but right now i am mostly at wisdom/knights/x/x and i think you or benneh would fit well for 1 of the x slots; unsure about the other
thats really all there is to it
why am i a wolf without pre associatives with maple w?
yeah please note the whole "not actually mad, just feeling a bit yuck so might come off that way". just trying to word vomit feelings and ive always been bad at concisely articulating them
I like your village lists ladd but I don't feel that you're really pushing anyone with conviction. What I was saying your push on Maple D2 is an example of it and it kinda extends to pretty much every push you've had after day two excepting Wisdom where I do at least feel that you're trying to move votes there. But also feel that you're kinda there from threadstate (ex. if you had actually done something with your Wisdom pings yesterday I would have found that towny but I am pretty worried that you are going after Wisdom now for threadstate reasons). You have had Benneh/Sunbae as stronger susses and I just don't feel that you believe in them. I also just don't feel any villagery energy from you
11 posts left, saving 5 for last two hours
Im gonna pull villa legacies and see if that tells us much, one sec
Vanta Black
08-13-2024, 19:11
Vanta Black what are your reads at right now?
I read Vanta Black's ISO, thought it was lightly towny, until I saw the Dya vote. i think it's kinda not what mafia would do to ask the thread which one should I vote when half the thread is there and then vote Dya over Rask
I do not disagree that that was a bad vote! It seemed okay at the time. I really didn't want Rask to be a woof (like my vote could change anything).
Right now I would like to vote within Maple/Wisdom. Sometimes things that seem towny at the time, like Maple's early "6 words" post, don't age well. And Wisdom put a vote on me early D2 for what looks like nothing more than me being LHF.
I did reread insomnia and realized why I read over it before. A lot of the kind of analysis I have to reread to get, a lot of meta stuff. I think insomnia is probably town.
I didn't get a strong town lean from reading Sunbae. Looks solvy, also looks like a player who can fake solvy.
This is a quick thing because I'm on my way out teh door right now, will be back before EOD. Town lean on Dolby, grr, dya. Still TLing Jan but with a bit more reservation.
I finally have to ask, who or what is IH? People keep throwing that in there. I try to make sense of abbreviations/acronyms in context so I shoudl probaby have figured it out, but I haven't. Also someone mentioned Matt. I don't know who Matt is but would vote there just because.
actually can someone else pull newcomb/colonel/arctic/stett legacies for me
suddenly feeling worse
I like your village lists ladd but I don't feel that you're really pushing anyone with conviction. What I was saying your push on Maple D2 is an example of it and it kinda extends to pretty much every push you've had after day two excepting Wisdom where I do at least feel that you're trying to move votes there. But also feel that you're kinda there from threadstate (ex. if you had actually done something with your Wisdom pings yesterday I would have found that towny but I am pretty worried that you are going after Wisdom now for threadstate reasons). You have had Benneh/Sunbae as stronger susses and I just don't feel that you believe in them. I also just don't feel any villagery energy from you
11 posts left, saving 5 for last two hours
ok, so who has made a strong push on d2+ of the alive people?
I am genuinely curious if you think sunbae/benneh have made a strong push on d2+ IYO
Sunbae you are at 0 risk, just take a break and come back tomorrow imo
but if u want ehre is bop legacy
I have one post after this i think, maybe 2 but definitely 1.
Claims in order of townyness from my PoV
Rasko- vig who killed sheep
Jan- PR
ender-something that targetted stet
wisdom-firefighter
maple-self PGO?
vvvv(o wolves)
Rasko
vvv(0-1 wolves)
stet
insomnia
vv(0-1 wolf)
dya
grr
v(1-2 wolves)
arctic
jan
vanta
gemma
knights
/shrug(1-3 wolves)
ladd
mont
dolby
maple
sunbae
benneh
w(0-2 wolves)
ender
wisdom
WRT maple- i didnt read his last couple posts before my last post so i didnt realize he PGO himself. I dont know how that is self resolving, but fuck it we can give it a day
I was looking at the wagons from eod 1 and there is a point where its
I feel like gemma/knights fell into the tonal abyss today after getting a pass from the majority of the thread; not feeling great about that. If ender is a wolf i wouldnt worry about knights. If ender is a villa then that opens up the world where knights is a wolf PR better than syn but thats a reach.
I find it kind of weird that arctic seemed to be around for the EoD but never really pparticipated when we had such close wagons, when i looked at Visor's iso for votecounts, they dont show up until the last one as one of the last minute votes. In the last 15 minutes main wagons were moving and changing but arctic doesnt vote until the pile on in the last minute. I think thats kind of a bad look if it is true they were in fact around with all the wagon changes and not commiting to anything votewise
I think the least believable claims are wisdom/maple but i wouldnt kill maple til tomorrow; he says he can self resolve, i dont think he can self resolve but i dont think it hurts us killing him tomorrow instead of today in the weird chance that he can clear himself. I wouldnt berate you for going there today though
If you want to go outside the claims, i'd go somewhere in dolby/benneh/ladd/sunbae. I would probably go sunbae
I think I'd vote out wisdom if we are to go inside the claims. The day 1 reads of jan/ender didn't make sense to me and the claim today feels meh.
my heart say go wisdom so thats where i'll vote for now
Vote: Wisdom
I think wisdom because there is no way we can confirm that role and it will always just be a question we have. Even if we can surmise there is an arsonist, it still wouldnt clear wisdom.
I believe i have two posts left and im going to save them for the eod.
PSPSPSPSPSPSPSPSPSPS
I was about to post this and i saw the dya/rask threadvelopment. The correct thing to do is to do nothing. I think if they are not v/v then rask is always the wolf. Dya is under no pressure to claim and if i understand them correctly there is some reason where rask can't be the sheep shooter. Rask still has a shot so if he's a villa you just let him shoot the wolf!dya. EZ PZ.
I'd go wisdom still because they work as a wolf regardless of how the claimbattle turns out and they have one of the weaker claims.
Vote: Wisdom
stett/newcomb idk if they left a structured one but newcomb wolfread knight/syn and thought gemma was v of the eod wagons
stett thought wisdom/me had 1 wolf
Montmorency
08-13-2024, 19:17
What do you think of this (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php/155022-Tarot-Mafia?p=2053858115&viewfull=1#post2053858115) Dolby?
I also just don't feel any villagery energy from you
like what do u expect lol
you have benneh as a villaread iirc, who has he pushed?
ok, so who has made a strong push on d2+ of the alive people?
I am genuinely curious if you think sunbae/benneh have made a strong push on d2+ IYO
benneh had ender until now which I think is wrong
sunbae idk
not gonna engage further with this with my limited post cap
What do you think of this (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php/155022-Tarot-Mafia?p=2053858115&viewfull=1#post2053858115) Dolby?
tbh I thought your CL read was whack when he was alive (he was one of my strongest townreads)
I haven't read casual December. I think the dynamic may be different from this game bc Syn was a flashwagon that didn't get any attention until right before eod but idk id have to read that game to make the comparison
I think I said at some point that syn not including ladd on this post is maybe slight town points for him bc he didn't actually care about ladd's slot but I don't really believe in this and just think Syn blindly made his readslist off of the playerlist in the OP
10 posts left
Also Jan,
it's been nice to get into the mid stages of a game with you and try and solve. we havent gotten that in a while
true. has been years tbh. :)
I fought through a little bit of a fever over the weekend which limited myself a lot (and I honestly have not found my full way back into the thread by now tbh).
Hope whatever you have is gone swift and soon enough.
I looked through who liked the first 6 words posts in what order earlier, but it did not seem relevant.
Syn called it based right away.
Newcomb said that he loves to hate it soon after.
and any other reaction was several pages later and I didn't get any wolves jumping on a read feels from it. :(
Actually I will make one last post here cause I gotta leave soon
I had something earlier close to day start where I said that I would look in gemma/monty/vanta if game is hard. I don't really think that anymore. This is pending a Gemma re-eval but I think that Vanta and Monty look fine. I think where I look next if game is hard is benneh/sunbae specifically
it just feels like we're sleep walking into a village miselim. Manti isn't your usual player and I urge you to read his recent games on MU at least. his playstyle is...enigmatic
it just feels like we're sleep walking into a village miselim. Manti isn't your usual player and I urge you to read his recent games on MU at least. his playstyle is...enigmatic
if you vote wisdom they(wisdom) would be in the lead
:curtain:
Actually I will make one last post here cause I gotta leave soon
I had something earlier close to day start where I said that I would look in gemma/monty/vanta if game is hard. I don't really think that anymore. This is pending a Gemma re-eval but I think that Vanta and Monty look fine. I think where I look next if game is hard is benneh/sunbae specifically
Look at knights too
From now, i may go afk any time. I strongly suggest killing wisdom
adieu (maybe)
Maple 4 nebjiamn, insomnia, Wisdom, Dolby
Wisdom 4 Gemma, ladd, grr, Enderwiggin
ladd 2 Montmorency, dyachei
Jan 1 theknightsofneeee
dyachei thoughts?
From now, i may go afk any time. I strongly suggest killing wisdom
adieu (maybe)
we're CFDing u tho
Montmorency
08-13-2024, 19:38
Oh shit, wrong link (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php/155022-Tarot-Mafia?p=2053857986&viewfull=1#post2053857986). Dolby
it just feels like we're sleep walking into a village miselim. Manti isn't your usual player and I urge you to read his recent games on MU at least. his playstyle is...enigmatic
Find the game here where he went deep. I think that happened. Maybe 2021.
i wouldnt be surprised if the game is all upside down but i cant say i would know how or how much i'd even believe it.
Maple 4 nebjiamn, insomnia, Wisdom, Dolby
Wisdom 4 Gemma, ladd, grr, Enderwiggin
ladd 2 Montmorency, dyachei
Jan 1 theknightsofneeee
dyachei thoughts?
Sunbae you asked about legacies i dont wanna dig right now but I think all of the top 3 wagons at least would be endorsed by what the dead villas thot before they died so we're not completely off track when it comes to that (sheep was TRing wisdom I will say that). do u need anything more/specific?
Montmorency
08-13-2024, 19:42
TALLY #1079
Gemma 4 (Ladd, sheepsaysmeep, Wisdom, insomnia)
Syn 4 (Didistetter, ColonelLubriderm, Newcomb, dyachei)
Theknightsofneeee 3 (EnderWiggin, Raskolnikov, Gemma)
EnderWiggin 1 (nebjiamn)
Sunbae 1 (Jan)
sheepsaysmeep 1 (Syn)
Raskolnikov 1 (grr)
Jan 1 (Theknightsofneeee)
ColonelLubriderm 1 (Vanta Black)
TALLY #1170
Raskolnikov 4 (grr, ColonelLubriderm, Jan, Montmorency)
Theknightsofneeee 4 (EnderWiggin, Raskolnikov, Gemma, Didistetter)
Gemma 4 (Ladd, sheepsaysmeep, Wisdom, insomnia)
Syn 3 (Newcomb, dyachei)
EnderWiggin 1 (nebjiamn)
sheepsaysmeep 1 (Syn)
Jan 1 (Theknightsofneeee)
ColonelLubriderm 1 (Vanta Black)
TALLY #1196
Syn 5 ( Newcomb, Gemma, Insomnia, Theknightsofneeee, Didistetter)
Raskolnikov 4 (grr, ColonelLubriderm, Jan, Maple)
Gemma 3 (sheepsaysmeep, Wisdom, insomnia)
sheepsaysmeep 3 (Syn, dyachei, Ladd)
Theknightsofneeee 2 (EnderWiggin, Raskolnikov)
EnderWiggin 1 (nebjiamn)
ColonelLubriderm 1 (Vanta Black)
I think we have likely 2, less likely 3 mafia on the four wagons in Tally #1170. It's hard to believe the Rask wagon is pure, though it could be. It is almost certain that not all 4 non-Syn mafia are clustered among those wagons. Syn popped up as a flashwagon and was probably the only scum wagon.
When Maple voted Rask with minutes to spare, he may not have noticed that Syn's fate had been sealed in the previous minute by votes from knights and stetter. That alone is a pretty good reason to vote him, the last-minute swap to syn as the 7th vote notwithstanding. It makes me want to clear Gemma for a while.
ladd maintains that his EOD votes are special as a personal policy, and he limits himself to only one. It's remarkable that he chose his EOD vote on p40, with minutes to spare, as a switch from Gemma to sheep, a non-competitive wagon that was basically just a syn vanity wagon all day. His motivation was for "fun", but it came a minute after dya moved from syn to sheep. If it's not an outright saving attempt, I believe it was an antispew avoiding being associated with the main wagons, while still muddying the waters. Sheep wasn't there defending himself, unlike Gemma. The tally thus became:
Players Votes #1177
Raskolnikov 4 (grr, ColonelLubriderm, Jan, Montmorency)
Theknightsofneeee 3 (EnderWiggin, Raskolnikov, Didistetter)
Gemma 3 (sheepsaysmeep, Wisdom, insomnia)
sheepsaysmeep 3 (Syn, dyachei, Ladd)
Syn 2 (Newcomb, Gemma)
EnderWiggin 1 (nebjiamn)
Jan 1 (Theknightsofneeee)
ColonelLubriderm 1 (Vanta Black)
Maybe the team is just among ladd-ender-Maple-Wisdom-X. But if Wisdom is town, you can't clear Gemma. Gemma is only lockclear if Wisdom is scum.
i wouldnt be surprised if the game is all upside down but i cant say i would know how or how much i'd even believe it.
So you are daying yiu are a wolf?
:curtain:
Synchronization :14.
Coordination.
That's a wrap.
Cool thoughts though.
Honestly could very well be town.
Feel like ladd is kinda not w/w with Ender and Knights from a quote within this Monty.
in retro wrt Enders "sunbae started the wagon on me without voting" I think I was tunneled and I think that post from Ender is fine and honestly has v energy
as for the posts idk I think they are fine and tbh I just don't think that Ender says "lol I'm mindmelding with ladd" if they are teammates
I think I have 8 posts left after this
I've said what there is to say.
It's hard to figure out which wolves are trying to push me over, sort them from villagers, which is annoying. But I imagine wolves *want* me to go over here, either way.
Montmorency
08-13-2024, 19:45
Syn D1 ISO
P1: Fluff opening, TRed by Gemma. Colonel (CL) susses Gemma for finding Syn's post townier than stetter's.
P2: Syn jokingly SRs CL for posting too much.
P3: Knights trending Syn down for being against CL, still g2h town.
P4: Jan: "The syn villa reads are weird. Syn will be readable and there is no reason to force it this early."
P5: Wisdom shares a song with Syn. Syn responds to Jan from P4 by claiming to be mysterious and unreadable. Syn calls Maple based for SRing sheep off "6 words." Syn asks Wisdom what tapioca is.
P6: Syn discusses song with Wisdom, who tells them about tapioca. Syn wants to vote Sleep, not Sheep (Insomnia?). Gemma banters with Syn over his indirect Maple-Sheep read. Arctic finds Wisdom's music-post directed at Syn "kinda wrong." Rask kinda agrees with Syn about CL SR,
wants to kill CL and Vanta, locks Syn town.
P7: Arctic interrogates Rask over Syn, asks about meta. Rask explains that Syn should be direct and aggressive, elaborates on his own CL and Vanta SLs.
P9: Rask finds Syn OK for now. Newcomb can hardly believe Syn has posted, he's so UTR.
P10: Wisdom hedges on Syn, asks Rask for advice: "I'm a bit worried about Syn's approach to the game but I think his "threadstate is pure" post shows a towny mindset." Newcomb asks ladd whom he would dayvig, ladd suggests Syn to be "boring" (sounds like PIS, as this is ladd's first-ever comment on Syn). Ladd goes on to clarify he's not convinced Syn is scum, understands why Rask TRs them, but offers a Syn post that "was out of character for their villa self, but I am not sure how serious it is."
P11: Ladd explains to knights why he dislikes his syn read and its relationship to CL alignment. Knights justifies himself.
P12: Syn continues bantering with Wisdom and Gemma about tapioca.
P13: Wisdom wants to sus Syn for seeming happy, but will sheep Rask's read. Syn calls Jan "wolf" over a post about Superman and Batman. Syn calls Rask's never-rescind TR on him "suspiciously early." Disagrees with Ender's sus on Gemma because she is "very niceys." Wisdom is disappointed with Rask's lack of wim, but finds it towny because Rask didn't want to rand mafia and as mafia he would pretend to have wim; Syn responds with "?????????." Syn locks Newcomb town over some post. Reacting to ladd's musing that he would dayvig syn, syn reacts with "wtf man." Syn banters with Wisdom, says he should take back the principle that "it's okay to be wrong D1." Syn fluffs about neb using Mass Effect copypasta before he did. Syn votes sheep. Syn posts a leans list that leaves out hally (ladd) and monty, even though syn had just replied to a ladd post.
P14: Newcomb calls syn's list a "wild ass list" and "a breath of fresh air." Syn realizes he didn't have a lean on ladd and says "oh shit ladd lmao they go in idk fine I guess maybe I should hate them for wanting to shoot me though." Syn fluffs over Wisdom posting a comedy video. Jan leans Syn a high Tier 2.
P15: Rask discusses his town read of Syn and maintains it, although very slightly weaker. Maple shades grr, asks for help, Rask offers some thoughts, Maple thinks grr should have responded to syn and jan's leans lists and evaluated their midsections, concluding that grr is scum.
P17: CL wants to oust outside 11 players (and "maybe ladd too"), with Syn in the middle of the
pack.
P18: Syn reacts to Rask's meta post on him with "m e t a", leading to banter (including "can I be a wolf please please please please please please please please"). In the context of dya telling knights her own interaction with ladd was fine, syn asks her if she would ever admit otherwise, which she avers. Dyachei admits to being pocketed by sunbae; syn asks if he can pocket her as well. Syn banters with CL about wall posts and D1 consensuses.
P19: Syn thinks it's just silly that dya claims she can admit when she has a problematic interaction. Arctic analyzes syn, finds him strange, but is willing to sheep Rask either way for now.
P20: Arctic has 6 TRs with Syn at the bottom.
P21: Dya has Syn among many nulls.
P22: Gemma has Syn as a fairly-high town.
P23: Sheep can't categorize Syn.
P24: Wisdom has Syn among her least-confident TRs.
P27: Gemma tries to banter with Ender about something with the word "unironically", realizes it was Syn who used it previously on p6 (although she had bantered with Syn over that very post).
P28: CL pulls up quotes to justify voting Wisdom, including two from Wisdom and one from Jan, each of which mentions Syn.
P29: Stetter asks Syn for an update.
P31: Sunbae asks for thoughts on didistetter, wisdom, and syn; syn had a good post but she would like something more solid. Jan replies that Syn is within town range. Sheep responds to this post but only on stetter. For grr, Syn is an "absolute blank."
P32: CL responds to the Sunbae post but only about Wisdom, whom he admits he already discussed. Dya hedges on Syn but gth town. Maple has no read on Syn for Sunbae.
[EOD]
P33: CL still can't get over Gemma thinking Syn's opening is townier than stett's. Newcomb read on Syn: "reasons to v read them probably shouldn't cut it at this point." Arctic has the impression that syn doesn't care as either alignment. Dya agrees but thinks syn could easily be mafia. Arctic is pinged by Sunbae putting stett in the same group as Wisdom and Syn of UTR people who need more attention, thinks a villa should be more discerning. Ladd on syn: "i forgot syn, they are in the ender/sheep tier."
P34: Arctic wants either syn or Jan to round out his towncore, prefers jan. Maple has a reads post but "no read" on Syn, Monty, and Cobalt/Dobby. Stetter asks Arctic for more perspective on ladd, insomnia, CL, dyachei, and syn. Stett has reads, finds vanta and syn less towny than he would like based on past games.
P35: Newcomb underwhelmed by Syn, considering voting them. Ladd offers meta on Syn, finding
him sus but inconclusive. Ladd shades sheep, promises to skim Syn ISO. ladd [cut...] Stetter initiates the Syn wagon (ladd > syn), likes that choice better than gemma or knights. CL follows suit (knights > syn), though his vote format will be corrected soon. [In retrospect, CL had a good orientation toward the Syn wagon EOD, despite the ultimate Rask switch.]
P36: Newcomb sheeps stetter on syn (Wisdom > Syn). Dya notes the current main wagons gemma and knights are always scummy in play, so reconsiders on syn and votes Ender > syn.
P37: ladd calls dya's latest post on vote logic and voting syn villagery. Arctic offers more meta on syn, which stett finds stressful. ladd agrees with Arctic that syn's play here is better than in another game, but hasn't really presented an organic worldview yet; ladd digresses to asking the thread about sheep. Ender is getting the eepies from the EOD Syn CW. Newcomb tells him to do something about it. Ender responds: "I mean my defense is "Rask has been catching Syn for months on D1 and has them as a townread" and that just feels bad as a defense." Monty likes the composition of the syn wagon, but is discouraged by the prospect of a rask godread on syn. Jan tells ladd to judge syn on snarkiness, being more so as scum. Based on meta, jan would kill Rask before syn. Jan is unconfident but curious about a syn-rask-Wisdom team. Arctic doesn't know what to do if syn is intermediate to their town and scum meta currently.
P38: Newcomb wants to stick with his syn vote, based on his ISO rather than meta, but is OK with either knights or syn.
P39: Knights will evaluate Rask and syn and compare to the gemma POE. Insomnia would vote knights over gemma, can't remember anything about syn. Gemma doesn't think knights is scummier than Rask and Syn.
P40: Grr doesn't know what to do with Syn. Gemma makes Syn a wagon with Knights > Syn
after I tie Rask with her. Arctic tinfoils Syn-Rask, could vote for Syn. Knights' skim puts Rask as towny, Syn as null to lean-scum. Insomnia would also vote Syn over Rask, despite not having read the former. Ladd votes Gemma > sheep "for fun", thinks Rask OK, is OK with Syn dying, mentions that Rask softened on his Syn TR over time. Insomnia Gemma > Syn, despite not having read Syn. Jan reposts Rask's last Syn read, which still approved but suggested a sheep-syn tinfoil (not out of the question); ladd questions Jan's vote on Rask. Knights Gemma > Syn but might return to Gemma (Arctic is confused). Stetter Knights > Syn. Rask is currently the only viable CW to Syn, and Maple votes Rask for "wagons or something." Jan responds to questions about Rask vote by using wagonomics: "it can be w/w or w/v with rask w.in either world voting rask is better."
P41: Arctic finally votes, on Syn. Probably looks good given his steady process on Syn (engaging with Rask's reads, eventually coming around on his own perceptions). Maple piles onto Syn as 7th vote with a minute to god; no credit.
D1 vote history (https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php/155022-Tarot-Mafia?p=2053858055&viewfull=1#post2053858055)
To refer to other comments I've made, I believe it is applicable meta of ladd in this case to lay weak or unfocused FOS on specifically UTR/LHF partners in order to establish distancing. I don't believe ladd is mafia merely because he's had hedgy reads. Instead, I think ladd spent EOD 1 trying to shield m-syn while avoiding any commitments, after having already spent D1 looking like he was doing classic distancing with syn in their very limited interactions. Nothing D2 altered the picture. Ladd's final vote, his one EOD vote, on sheep in the last 7 minutes, makes the most sense if nefarious. I sympathize with other people's accounts of dissatisfaction with ladd's posting.
It remains incredible to me that both of them, having recently interacted with one another, gave full leans/reads lists, each listing every player but the other of the two. Maybe it's just a derp coincidence, but I believe the mafia team were well aware of syn's precarious D1 meta and were making an effort to avoid superficial associations.
That's all I'm going to say about ladd, or probably anyone, until tomorrow.
Only played one game with Gemma ever but they're like p different here so if you'd ask me to place a wager i'd say wolf? They said they tried harder there I think but um, i mean they repost comprehensive readslist every once in a while here so it doesn't feel like they arent trying hard. I have not really looked into them in detail tbh. Mostly tried to figure out Wisdom today.
Montmorency
08-13-2024, 19:47
Feel like ladd is kinda not w/w with Ender and Knights from a quote within this Monty.
in retro wrt Enders "sunbae started the wagon on me without voting" I think I was tunneled and I think that post from Ender is fine and honestly has v energy
as for the posts idk I think they are fine and tbh I just don't think that Ender says "lol I'm mindmelding with ladd" if they are teammates
I think I have 8 posts left after this
So, no coordination from ninjaing each other on pressuring knights? Eh, I guess it could be too pre-flippy.
So you are daying yiu are a wolf?
:curtain:
no im saying that i wouldnt be surprised if. uh. like the people no one cares about like jan dolby gemma or whomstthefuck are wolves ig.
I've said what there is to say.
It's hard to figure out which wolves are trying to push me over, sort them from villagers, which is annoying. But I imagine wolves *want* me to go over here, either way.
you'll rightfully hate this post if you are a villager but i am ngl some of your posts almost make me think you are trying to die on purpose
Montmorency
08-13-2024, 19:51
no im saying that i wouldnt be surprised if. uh. like the people no one cares about like jan dolby gemma or whomstthefuck are wolves ig.
If you want to solve Gemma, the priority should be flipping Wisdom.
So, no coordination from ninjaing each other on pressuring knights? Eh, I guess it could be too pre-flippy.
so let me get this straight you think we coordinated in wolf chat to ask knights the same question
like really? why would we?
no im saying that i wouldnt be surprised if. uh. like the people no one cares about like jan dolby gemma or whomstthefuck are wolves ig.
this whomsttefuck gui does seem pretty wolfy
Only played one game with Gemma ever but they're like p different here so if you'd ask me to place a wager i'd say wolf? They said they tried harder there I think but um, i mean they repost comprehensive readslist every once in a while here so it doesn't feel like they arent trying hard. I have not really looked into them in detail tbh. Mostly tried to figure out Wisdom today.
I am fairly confident gemma is villa.
I have nothing to quote on the matter.
I am fairly confident gemma is villa.
I have nothing to quote on the matter.
yea i agree, i really dont think they are a wolf. I could villa case them if it came down to it probably, tho i already explained it somwhere iirc
22 or 23 posts left i think
you'll rightfully hate this post if you are a villager but i am ngl some of your posts almost make me think you are trying to die on purpose
https://media1.tenor.com/m/mtkIhcU07b0AAAAC/violence-i-crave-inhumane-levels-of-violence.gif
last thoughts:
i think if wisdom/maple are w/w, wisdom has the more useful power tonight. maple would def be able to post better here as a wolf to swing the lunch if need be
I find really hard to believe wisdom v and maple w worlds cause i really dont get what manti is doing here in this scenario
v/v we are probably fucked
21
I am fairly confident gemma is villa.
I have nothing to quote on the matter.
not w/w with syn or something
nebjiamn
08-13-2024, 20:07
last thoughts:
i think if wisdom/maple are w/w, wisdom has the more useful power tonight. maple would def be able to post better here as a wolf to swing the lunch if need be
I find really hard to believe wisdom v and maple w worlds cause i really dont get what manti is doing here in this scenario
v/v we are probably fucked
21
yea i pondered that earlier. i think i was a bit thrown by how d2 played out and manti wanting one more day but that doesnt align with how they are playing today cause wisdom is like... trying and manti isnt?
if jan is real it shouldn't really matter since if they are w/w he can jail the other but im down to swap in case of shenanigans of some sort
im swamped at work so idk how realistic it is for me to make it back for eod again. sorry
vote: wisdom
nebjiamn
08-13-2024, 20:08
yea i pondered that earlier. i think i was a bit thrown by how d2 played out and manti wanting one more day but that doesnt align with how they are playing today cause wisdom is like... trying and manti isnt?
if jan is real it shouldn't really matter since if they are w/w he can jail the other but im down to swap in case of shenanigans of some sort
im swamped at work so idk how realistic it is for me to make it back for eod again. sorry
vote: wisdom
inb4 they are odd and even night vig respectively :curtain:
mont, no offense but your manti read means very little to me. You keep quoting a game that happened years ago and I've played more recent games with manti than that and have a wider array of games to sort meta from.
so you keep on thinking 1 game in 2021 is all the meta you need. I don't need to reread it. Manti might even be a wolf. But not for the reasons people are pushing him for.
last thoughts:
i think if wisdom/maple are w/w, wisdom has the more useful power tonight. maple would def be able to post better here as a wolf to swing the lunch if need be
I find really hard to believe wisdom v and maple w worlds cause i really dont get what manti is doing here in this scenario
v/v we are probably fucked
21
maple is posting, wisdom isnt posting at all. i dont think maple is posting in a way that makes more people want to vote them? it's kinda lame but like, how do you even post if u want more votes, when your cw isnt around at all lol. surprised u are very confident wisdom is a wolf but havent found associatives or anything (and no i have no clue if you do that usually xD) ur assuming jan is real, you assumed you might be KPed, honestly kinda wondering where you legacy is for a w/v flip or whatever rofl. xD
grr on i think d1 you brought up the recent game where we were both wolves. Why havent you referenced it again to solve me in this position? When the situation w!me was in isn't *too* different.
We won that game off of me getting bussed, after all.
surprised u are very confident wisdom is a wolf but havent found associatives or anything (and no i have no clue if you do that usually xD) ur assuming jan is real, you assumed you might be KPed, honestly kinda wondering where you legacy is for a w/v flip or whatever rofl. xD
i doubt i am dying and if so my plan was to leave jan my legacy (tho I realize he will probably die tonight lol but at least we will have a fun chat)
my associative stop at "i'd kill knights after wisdom" atm
my legacy is this
dont kill until lylo - should be pure
ladd
insomnia
grr
gemma
jan
dya
dolby
leaning villa
ender - again plz make them claim tho. always a villager if knights w
vanta - should be v if wisdom w
PoE
monti - I see the villagery posting but also at some point u gotta punish people for posting dumb arguments and he has been pushing some truly nonsensical things
benneh
sunbae
maple
wolves
knights
wisdom
but idrc about people following my legacy, you guis can do what you want after I die. Those are simply my reads
Montmorency
08-13-2024, 20:24
so let me get this straight you think we coordinated in wolf chat to ask knights the same question
like really? why would we?
Something to do. You're clearly serious about that knights setup.
mont, no offense but your manti read means very little to me. You keep quoting a game that happened years ago and I've played more recent games with manti than that and have a wider array of games to sort meta from.
so you keep on thinking 1 game in 2021 is all the meta you need. I don't need to reread it. Manti might even be a wolf. But not for the reasons people are pushing him for.
I feel like you have the wrong person. I'm not one of the drivers of the maple wagon.
Something to do. You're clearly serious about that knights setup.
https://media.giphy.com/media/v1.Y2lkPTc5MGI3NjExZ2l0NTMxcTl2dGZubmMyaGIzOGRvemoyZmwxNnZjYm9vcDB0dW5mMyZlcD12MV9naWZzX3NlYXJjaCZjd D1n/l3q2K5jinAlChoCLS/giphy.gif
i doubt i am dying and if so my plan was to leave jan my legacy (tho I realize he will probably die tonight lol but at least we will have a fun chat)
my associative stop at "i'd kill knights after wisdom" atm
my legacy is this
dont kill until lylo - should be pure
ladd
insomnia
grr
gemma
jan
dya
dolby
leaning villa
ender - again plz make them claim tho. always a villager if knights w
vanta - should be v if wisdom w
PoE
monti - I see the villagery posting but also at some point u gotta punish people for posting dumb arguments and he has been pushing some truly nonsensical things
benneh
sunbae
maple
wolves
knights
wisdom
but idrc about people following my legacy, you guis can do what you want after I die. Those are simply my reads
why would jan jail you if you dont think he is gonna kill u. i have never met monti nor heard of him, but gth him not caring about who dies today as long as you get nuked overnight felt pretty villagery to me rofl. as u said it seems like villagery posting.
vanta is probably just v. I can't see a wolf hedging their bets on my alignment right now. I think being this hesitant to do more than lean me v is villagery
grr on i think d1 you brought up the recent game where we were both wolves. Why havent you referenced it again to solve me in this position? When the situation w!me was in isn't *too* different.
We won that game off of me getting bussed, after all.
Maple
It was a 2hr phase when I was alr pretty tired (like now btw), just didn't pay much attention to remember much of it. On later days what I noticed is that you tried to be more serious have more... um... likeable? posts as you did as a villager, i registered that as a potential subtle tell. Now you roll in here and... qu
ite frankly you just post like a normal player and I have never seen that so I will just say I cant do any meta? lol
i gth think your posting is kinda villagery some of your posts your posts just seem kinda silly in a v way to me, but your claim is wtf its frying my brain. i am not voting u cuz i am voting someone who I think I can sort and I think they are a wolf based on what I explained earlier wrt to interactions with ladd.
but also you commited a war crime in saying you self-resolve and then dont so if u wanna force me to actually be true to myself i should vote u again lol.
(and also like, im sorry but literally every dead villager wanted u dead, i'd have to be super convinced to fight for anything here, and i'm not. i just think gth u flip villa and im like not gunna be surprised lol, thats my take, shrug)
the thing that is currently gnawing at me is that ben and ladd have been pretty much in lockstep today wrt wisdom. they both brought the same argument as to why wisdoms claim is fake (~Wisdom did it before on MU (why that info popped up rn for both at a similar time: no idea?)) and they're both explaining how wisdom is trying more (the last thing i disagree with cuz, as i said, wisdom aint even posting rofl), so. The fact they have a synchronised opinion on something I don't even see is weird af.
Something to do. You're clearly serious about that knights setup.
I feel like you have the wrong person. I'm not one of the drivers of the maple wagon.
I hate this post
the thing that is currently gnawing at me is that ben and ladd have been pretty much in lockstep today wrt wisdom. they both brought the same argument as to why wisdoms claim is fake (~Wisdom did it before on MU (why that info popped up rn for both at a similar time: no idea?)) and they're both explaining how wisdom is trying more (the last thing i disagree with cuz, as i said, wisdom aint even posting rofl), so. The fact they have a synchronised opinion on something I don't even see is weird af.
it would be bad but if we think it outs the two of them then we hopefully still can turn it around?
I did not do numbers tbh.
it would be bad but if we think it outs the two of them then we hopefully still can turn it around?
I did not do numbers tbh.
numbers actually become really prolematic close if we miss on both wisdom and maple.
i think the funniest thing that could have happened is if i was given bombhands causing arctic to die
imagine?
i think the funniest thing that could have happened is if i was given bombhands causing arctic to die
imagine?
So. Something to think about for you. Why do you think two widely not-really-trusted slots ladd and benneh push to save you this day. I dont know your alignment but you do so I assume you should have a stronger opinion lol.
it would be bad but if we think it outs the two of them then we hopefully still can turn it around?
I did not do numbers tbh.
:inquisitive:
i mean why do you even immediately think it'd make both of them outed?
So. Something to think about for you. Why do you think two widely not-really-trusted slots ladd and benneh push to save you this day. I dont know your alignment but you do so I assume you should have a stronger opinion lol.
just operating under the assumption theyre both v for this thought
ladd would save me because he knows me better than average and would have a bad feeling about the way my wagon is going and therefore want to resolve elsewhere first
ben im not sure, could be something similar or rather in the realm of "maple would try harder to not die as w in this position" which is probably true
that's my guess, anyway
if either are w, it's just saving me to be killed in a later day and not resolving me while we have a free ML today. that said, my role is unblockable so *ideally* if i live today, my role becoming confirmed gets people to turn around on my alignment, we'll see
something like that
frankly, in my position i can't afford to be *totally* reasonable
the people trying to kill me *must* be wolves, the people trying to save me *must* be villagers
Because that scenario is the only one in which i can *do* anything of substance. If that ends up not being the case, either I die or i have to deal with it later.
My position feels forced, in that way
all that said, most of my reads survive despite this sorta stuff, to be fair; the villgaers, i mean
vanta is probably just v. I can't see a wolf hedging their bets on my alignment right now. I think being this hesitant to do more than lean me v is villagery
players who mysteriously got elevated into v-tiers and I do not know why (frankly it might have been becuz I just MISSED it, but I felt I just remembered some "posted well" arguments that i didnt NECESSARILY understand):
Jan
Dolby
Gemma (Maple explained something about not w/w with syn but uh i didnt follow ig)
Player who gets townread by everyone for uhhh. idk what reasons but idgi: Sunbae (he himself complained about being nullread or something. yea sure that is fair enough, maybe he is just NULLbinned by everyone but it still solidly keeps him from dying lol. And yes he did some solving. I read it where I saw it (no idea how he became top poster tho cuz I barely remember his impact)
points of confusion. (this is something i could probably research alas its really tiring to do so here, unfortunately)
Maple who do you think are the wolves pushing you?
Who would you vote rn if given sole control?
Who do you think is most likely to just be wrong on you?
Im kinda just viewing your most recent posts as abstractions
Im assuming that ladd and benneh are both moving up from bottom section of your reads to townreads, what does this mean for the game, and wisdom who is basically in the lead right now?
I am especially interested in your take on wisdom
7 posts left
:inquisitive:
i mean why do you even immediately think it'd make both of them outed?
it doesn't but numbers and poe make it very likely.
plus I am assuming worst worlds in that construct anyway.
just operating under the assumption theyre both v for this thought
ladd would save me because he knows me better than average and would have a bad feeling about the way my wagon is going and therefore want to resolve elsewhere first
ben im not sure, could be something similar or rather in the realm of "maple would try harder to not die as w in this position" which is probably true
that's my guess, anyway
if either are w, it's just saving me to be killed in a later day and not resolving me while we have a free ML today. that said, my role is unblockable so *ideally* if i live today, my role becoming confirmed gets people to turn around on my alignment, we'll see
something like that
eh ladd is just selling wisdom as confident wolf and didnt even really offer a read on you.
iirc correctly benneh is just saying you are both wolves (or something) and wisdom more important power which, uh. yeah idk. so like, if they are villas none of them would have been actually village reading u lol.
so ig if u are a villager the second option sounds even more likely considering theyre not really trying to save you as a VILLAGER, which means they will probably be back on your ass. but then as wolves, they should be kinda worried about your powerrole so im not sure if it completely makes sense either to keep you alive for a day, when wisdoms role would be doing nothing compared to yours.
sunbae did get nullbinned by me at least IH. thats kinda why sunbae is a slot of interest to me since me not scumreading Ender anymore means I have to find a fourth wolf
6 left
just a fair warning: i am european. next hours till EoD are 11pm-3am. it's past my usual bedtime. I might be around then, *somewhat*. There is a heavy storm going on too rn so i need to look after some things.
Players Votes
Wisdom 6 (Gemma, Ladd, grr, EnderWiggin, nebjiamn, dyachei)
Maple 3 (insomnia, Wisdom, Dolby)
Jan 1 (Theknightsofneeee)
Ladd 1 (Montmorency)
whatthistextdo
Sorry about today's overall absence. Getting back from vacation both nuked more focus and stole more time than I expected.
Getting misyeeted here is the norm but I've been even more disconnected than usually this game, that's on me. I do think both Maple and Gemma are wolves but maybe I've been too stubborn on Gemma since I know her flipping wolf is the easiest way to town clear me.
Here’s my legacy, in case I die.
Town (0 wolves)
Dya
Town lean (0-1 wolves)
Jan
Dolby
Grr
Insomnia
No idea (0-2 wolves)
Benneh
Ender
Sunbae
Knights
Monte
Wolf lean (0-2 wolves)
Vanta
Ladd
Wolf lean (1-2 wolves)
Gemma
Maple
Stay hyped and hydrated, good night <3
And yes, two wolf lean categories were intentional. I'm more confident in Maple/Gemma than Vanta/Ladd.
speaking of 0-2 wolves in vanta
its probably pretty important that people commit to *some* kind of read on that slot today just so there's some accountability with the inevitable swaps to that player if theyre alive in a couple days
which they will be
Eh I guess this is worth a post
Wisdom what caused you to go from town to wolf on Vanta during N1, I know that you wrote about it but frankly it just wasn't convincing to me and I want to try to get more into your head. Why do you htink that Vanta is a wolf voting for Dya yesterday? Knowing that Dya/Rask are almost certainly town/3P, and mafia maybe had an inkling that Rask was more likely to be 3p than Dya, I think that Vanta's vote yesterday shows a distinct lack of agenda and is pretty towny
On Day two on two separate occassions you said that Maple was sus, but that seemed to correlate with when Maple was getting a lot of pressure in the thread, and was never enough to place them with me, Gemma or Vanta (who tbh I still think are all three town). Why was Maple's posting and claim being suspicious not enough to warrant that when you didn't really seem to have a concrete take on the slot?
You also said at one point yesterday that you were concerned that I was TMIing you v when I said that I felt that purely off of Syn spew you and Rask were likely v. Why did you feel that way?
5 posts left, probably wont respond
Vote: ladd
oh yeah that makes sense.
Vote: Wisdom
I will jail Maple and you can assume I will execute.
We will have a night talk of course but this is where I stand right now and big things need to happen for that to change. (actual hard confirmation that the village can comprehend even if I die).
And yes, two wolf lean categories were intentional. I'm more confident in Maple/Gemma than Vanta/Ladd.
why maple btw. (i dont get vanta either but idc about that rn)
Vote: Ladd
want a second wagon, for the moment, that isn't Maple given Jan's action
VC after this vote is
Wisdom 6 (Gemma, Ladd, EnderWiggin, nebjiamn, dyachei, Jan)
Ladd 3 (Montmorency, grr, Dolby)
Maple 2 (insomnia, Wisdom)
Jan 1 (Theknightsofneeee)
four posts left
Players Votes
Wisdom 6 (Gemma, Ladd, EnderWiggin, nebjiamn, dyachei, Jan)
Ladd 3 (Montmorency, grr, Dolby)
Maple 2 (insomnia, Wisdom)
nebjiamn 1 (Sunbae)
Jan 1 (Theknightsofneeee)
whatthistextdo
Vote: Wisdom
I will jail Maple and you can assume I will execute.
We will have a night talk of course but this is where I stand right now and big things need to happen for that to change. (actual hard confirmation that the village can comprehend even if I die).
Is your execute a "night action" or is it a delayed trigger of your day action
or rather
can you activate an ability on the same night that you execute?
If we both die tonight it'd be annoying.
i mean, its entirely possible we have a medic or something in which case they ideally save you, at least
Im currently at the following wolves (most likely to least likely)
ladd
gemma (paired btw)
benneh
maple
only counterpoint i can give myself here is that its kinda too ez if it was literally all 4, but feel free to look into this.
like lets be real montmorency is villagery, knights "fell off" but was imo also villager idk maybe good wolf or something whatever?
if u iso gemma d1 no real reason to clear her, in fact kinda squint worthy even when u can obviously give her *some* cred for being on the right wagon but ladd's been confidently clearing her. also i believe him now he wanted to be offwagon but makes more sense when he's wolf with gemma considering the timing of his sheepvote :curtain:
idk something doesnt quite check out with the claims. what exactly was arctic. did we have 2 village kps? is dya really 1 shot or did they secretly shoot bopolis and didnt bother to tell us :curtain:
*ducks head in*
we still killing wisdom?
ok cool
bye
Is your execute a "night action" or is it a delayed trigger of your day action
or rather
can you activate an ability on the same night that you execute?
If we both die tonight it'd be annoying.
i mean, its entirely possible we have a medic or something in which case they ideally save you, at least
I should be able to do both.
k well im locking in
any thoughts on which card to pick? im gonna try for something to keep you alive, that or a Sword and hope for a vigi
Hmm, I just had a thought. Now that I'm reversed, it isn't unthinkable that my cards are reversed too. I should pick a card that doesnt look like it has a bad reveral, probably.
theknightsofneeee
08-14-2024, 00:13
hello hello hello
yes i have fallen off, wolf read me for it if you want I guess, i'll be honest that i'm not having the most fun playing 48/24 in general, but last EOD was pretty fun/realtime interaction'y so I just kinda wanted to EOD post again
if thats wolfy to you guys, so be it
haven't read the last 8 or so pages so i'm gonna skim those super quick
for the most part my stances haven't super changed, I think i'm probably more firm on sunbae=villa than I was at SOD, and i think i got there on not worrying about jan right now because he'll probably be outed in a day or two if his 'inverted role' doesn't have any results
plus with arctic dead, on the off chance that he is villa kp atm, we probably want to avoid him anyways.
still think he's wolfy but i've been wrong before, and my wolf read on jan maybe lines up a bit too cleanly.
i'm looking at ladd ATM, i think his treatment of me today feels like a wolf looking for someone to push, especially juxtaposed to sunbae who hard cleared me for day 1, and its night and day.
that combined with his day 1 pushes and vote at EOD, plus didi dying over him (for instance, no shade to didi, but if I was a wolf I would 100% put kp on villa!ladd over didi, regardless of how villa read didi was) i'm decently confident thats a hit.
k i selected the card that I think flavour-wise should be best for this situation
we'll see how it goes lol
k i selected the card that I think flavour-wise should be best for this situation
we'll see how it goes lol
69 of wands?
agree
I don't think I die in the w!jan world at least, so that's pretty poggers if you ask me
theknightsofneeee
08-14-2024, 00:18
can someone ELI5 why maple is a wolf?
i know the arctic stuff, but like.
I think they have been getting pushed from essentially everyone but me today, and perhaps i'm just out of touch or missing something obvious
but afaik he claimed he was inverted (before he claimed a role), claimed he was self resolving, claimed he used his ability on arctic and arctic died.
the one thing I could see as a reason for maple is that I know he is very much someone who role hunts villagers, and arctic dying after soft claiming vig (as well as him using his ability on arctic) seems a bit convenient
but I don't see anything necessarily outting wrt his role.
i'm open to being wrong on this, because most of my villa read on maple comes from day 1 stuff, but i'd love a case to munch on
69 of wands?
agree
we call it my Queen of Wands
she's a real beauty
theknightsofneeee
08-14-2024, 00:20
vote: ladd
theknightsofneeee
08-14-2024, 00:28
Yeah I have something insomnia.
let me show u the entire Wisdom progression on ladd here:
(this one is my favorite so i made it bigger)
Here's the thing. I think Wisdom is a wolf who decided to not bus this game (a bird whispered to me once she generally decides pregame if she wants to bus or not and then sticks with it. i have seen this once myself). She is pretty stuck with their solving because of that, she needs to protect her wolfpals which is why her reads have pretty strange focus either on slots that gonna resolve soon anyway like Rask or Maple, or on slots that are pretty much dead-ends to sus into, stetter and me. recently she is kinda distancing from ladd but also still somewhat reluctant on it because she is the one who wants to end up being bussed, not vice versa.
thots? insomnia
While I am at it.
Wisdoms progression on Sunbae:
(btw now that i come across this just saying my handling of rask was actually villagery af its clear i was confused about getting my top townread in a CC from someone who shouldnt be a wolf by how the claim went down and then decided to be convinced he is a wolf him after he made the wolfiest post in the entire thread, which shows i have no TMI and read also him exactly like what he was: a serial killer (probably). also makes no sense for me as wolf to push him there cuz if i was a wolf rask is a villa who announced to kill a (likely? dunno) villa tonight).
I have. less to say about this except it also fits the same pattern as with ladd without having a post that struck me as mega pingy. However her tossing sunbae and knights and sunbae and insomnia in bins kinda seems, weird to me as first of all they arent similar at all and second of all it just kinda feels like it's conceiling spew to me. (btw the "knights towny but not unfakeable" rubbed me the wrong in general its kind of half of a vanity thing ig cuz people are obv free to not share every read i make i just didnt like my TR there to be shot down that way.). I dont think Sunbae ever answered Wisdom about prodding about the no-voting and she forgot about it lol (which is also not damning god knows all the shit i forgot to follow up on in this game just a thing i noticed)
these both read as super villagery solving to me
very thorough and i can feel the way that grr is coming to these reads feels super genuine
not touching grrr
Vanta Black
08-14-2024, 00:29
Im currently at the following wolves (most likely to least likely)
ladd
gemma (paired btw)
benneh
maple
only counterpoint i can give myself here is that its kinda too ez if it was literally all 4, but feel free to look into this.
I can't see ladd/gemma, and I kinda can't see gemma paired with anyone.
vote: Maple
theknightsofneeee
08-14-2024, 00:29
Yeah I have something insomnia.
let me show u the entire Wisdom progression on ladd here:
(this one is my favorite so i made it bigger)
Here's the thing. I think Wisdom is a wolf who decided to not bus this game (a bird whispered to me once she generally decides pregame if she wants to bus or not and then sticks with it. i have seen this once myself). She is pretty stuck with their solving because of that, she needs to protect her wolfpals which is why her reads have pretty strange focus either on slots that gonna resolve soon anyway like Rask or Maple, or on slots that are pretty much dead-ends to sus into, stetter and me. recently she is kinda distancing from ladd but also still somewhat reluctant on it because she is the one who wants to end up being bussed, not vice versa.
thots? insomnia
While I am at it.
Wisdoms progression on Sunbae:
(btw now that i come across this just saying my handling of rask was actually villagery af its clear i was confused about getting my top townread in a CC from someone who shouldnt be a wolf by how the claim went down and then decided to be convinced he is a wolf him after he made the wolfiest post in the entire thread, which shows i have no TMI and read also him exactly like what he was: a serial killer (probably). also makes no sense for me as wolf to push him there cuz if i was a wolf rask is a villa who announced to kill a (likely? dunno) villa tonight).
I have. less to say about this except it also fits the same pattern as with ladd without having a post that struck me as mega pingy. However her tossing sunbae and knights and sunbae and insomnia in bins kinda seems, weird to me as first of all they arent similar at all and second of all it just kinda feels like it's conceiling spew to me. (btw the "knights towny but not unfakeable" rubbed me the wrong in general its kind of half of a vanity thing ig cuz people are obv free to not share every read i make i just didnt like my TR there to be shot down that way.). I dont think Sunbae ever answered Wisdom about prodding about the no-voting and she forgot about it lol (which is also not damning god knows all the shit i forgot to follow up on in this game just a thing i noticed)
why etc
just said a couple posts above
but think his soft shading of me today which essentially amounted to 'knights is lacking' feels copout'y, and i'm halfway ruling him.
well
we're going into an extremely ominous night here, it feels like
in the worst case, Wisdom and I are both dying and flipping v, so we're looking at what -- 5 v deaths, down to 7-3, w/ forced to hit KP or lose? That's pretty bad lol
I think it was *probably* optimal to massclaim today in hindsight, but you know how it is. Ideally this isn't what happens lol
The claims are like
Dya, Ender, Jan, (me and wisdom who are dying) am i forgetting anything?
So we'll see some number of other deaths in the night, probably Dya + whoever is the most scary off dayplay. Ben if he's village, gamma if we're getting dommed, jan if he's real.
Hmm
I guess the main takeaway is that we *should* read into whatever kills they make tonight. That we *really* need to be highly critical of the remaining PR claims outside of dya. I don't think we have any more info kills after these two, so we gotta be prepared to be on the back foot.
The game is in a pretty fucked state for me. Basically anyone *could* be a wolf here. Ladd and knights going at each other is a pretty bad omen, in that way. *ideally* one of them is a wolf, but i cant tell you which. I think Knights looks good of d1 and general vibes. I don't even know why the heck i think ladd is a villager, idk posting i guess? it sounds bad when i put it that way. But if there isn't, i guess cut the difference and look to see [what ender's claim is, ben, dolby, sunbae]. I think in the w!sunbae world wolves aren't *that* entrenched at least though? So ya know, that shouldn't be *too* awful lol
mm anyway
i don't know what else to say
jan is *presumably* killing me here, i hope we can have a nice chat and i hope the item i give him helps the village
if i *do* live to tomorrow, and I *do* start getting railroaded, well then yeah its pretty fucked i suppose, so killing me may be for the best, in either case
what am i missing?
theknightsofneeee
08-14-2024, 00:32
ok so someone explain to me why maple is a wolf and not just a villager fucking around like he does?
And no mont, your argument of he did this in a previous wolf game is lame because he's also done this in a previous village game
cool i'm not the only one who thinks maple is just a villager here, not taking crazy pills
Players Votes
Wisdom 6 (Gemma, Ladd, EnderWiggin, nebjiamn, dyachei, Jan)
Ladd 4 (Montmorency, Theknightsofneeee, grr, Dolby)
Maple 3 (insomnia, Wisdom, Vanta Black)
nebjiamn 1 (Sunbae)
whatthistextdo
cool i'm not the only one who thinks maple is just a villager here, not taking crazy pills
well for what it's worth im not being voted out today lol
im getting killed by the unstoppable vigi instead!
oh i should clarify my role!
I think i've said it all already but:
I started the game with the ability to select any minor arcana card I wish, during the day. At the end of the day, I recieve whatever card I select which contains an ability related to that card.
n1 i was targeted by the inverser who made it so I now select a target to recieve the card (rather than getting it myself). I do not know what the cards do.
I targeted Arctic last night, and gave him some sorta Coins card, idr exactly which.
Anyway, I am currently targeting Jan w/ a utility card. We'll see what it does lol
theknightsofneeee
08-14-2024, 00:37
idt you were ladd's main push d1, i would say it was sheep/knights, you were a side dish when the thread stagnated a bit. at least that's how i read things. ladd can feel free to clarify ig
and i've factored that in, but i don't have a strong village read on you so idt its fair or charitable for me to suggest you are also a reason ladd is a wolf in that world view when i know me/sheep are villagers, knights is likely one, but my confidence on you being one is pretty shaky at best. i could easily have things inverted between you/ladd so /shrug
i'm gonna reiterate, gemma had every reason/excuse to leave their vote on me day 1 if they were a wolf
i was a competing wagon to them (i think we were both at 3 votes, and syn/sheep were the next highest at 2)
so moving off of me (villa), and onto syn (wolf), in a high leverage spot at EOD, especially considering no one cajoled gemma to move there specifically, and it reinvigorated that wagon which was dying off.
I can't really wolf read gemma after that personally. Gemma would have to be like a serial busser, or think they were for sure gonna die and was trying to distance (IMO that wasn't how EOD 1 felt).
theknightsofneeee
08-14-2024, 00:41
btw
something that I didn't want to talk about earlier but seems relevant if people are going to lynch wisdom.
Inverter seems like it would make sense with a firefighter role specifically because i assume it would turn the firefighting part of the role into a douse.
Which would make claiming the role early for clearance bad mechanically, and is the type of punishing claiming that I know visor likes to put in his games.
would also make sense to therefore only give villas the firefighter as well, because wolves/whoever the inverter is could potentially neutralize it.
I super buy the claim.
theknightsofneeee
08-14-2024, 00:44
i've noticed dolby talking about my alignment with what feels like complete certainty a couple of times, so i have just the slightest #fear that i got snowed in early by cobalt, but cobalt RWSTFO'd, and dolby is just tryharding and is also TMI'ing my alignment
not something i'm dealing with today but consider it noted
Vanta Black
08-14-2024, 00:47
Ugh, nope,let me think about this for 10 minutes
vote: Unvote
EoD hits me at dinnnertime/cook time/family time but I do have 10 minutes
theknightsofneeee
08-14-2024, 00:51
I am kinda living in a knights wolf world right now, that is probably my hottest take
I hated this post today and if you eliminate the syn vote at eod1 their posting just isnt good imo?
their jan push is obsolete by now, their d1 was wolfy (imo, but newcomb agreed!)
I see people saying "knight would tried harder as a wolf" but that read has an accurcay way below rand ime
EoD1 sure looks good from knights but they were already a wagon and widely suspected, I dont think it's really such a crazy buss for them to make. If they wolfside at EoD they just risk both of them going down
Idk i think you're familiar enough with my play that I very rarely bus, and if I do I make a show of it and try to get clearance for it.
My weak ass stuff on syn at EOD wouldn't be how i would play a bus, plus I had already set up a gemma!wolf read so i could just vote there instead of on a syn.
I agree that saying 'i would try harder as a wolf' is a bad read, but thats mostly just because I usually try just based on how much time I have available in 12/12 games.
48/24 is a different beast, and i've absolutely had time to post the last couple days, just didn't really feel like it. And I get that that is statistically >rand wolfy to admit but its the truth.
And tbqh, the wolf pushes on me day 1 were pretty lame and insubstantial, essentially boiled down to 'knights would be trying harder' or 'tone' also.
But I don't think you can reasonably make a case against me being a wolf based on my voting/pushes.
cool i'm not the only one who thinks maple is just a villager here, not taking crazy pills
I don't really have qualms with their posts and i'm fine on my wagon, but it kinda makes sense with these:
i agree on wisdom's w equity and the out of placeness of the claim in relation to everything else. idrg it but she did fake claim as a wolf in a recent 12/12er i hosted where she claimed some kinda cop (vanilla cop or somethin idr) on d2 as and survived / won the game off that silliness. if i draw a parallel from that game to this one the a) apparently unnecessary claim timing and b) the believability of the role existing in the roleset given everything else we know (she claimed that cop when other investigative had been elim'd d1 and i think the other PR had a pseudo invest like a desperado or smth) line up with my perception of the current game state and her place in it.
the 3p!devil would make sense thematically as an arsonist but there's ~0% shot rask tried to fake claim a vig shot that wasn't his own and the rest of the apparent KP in the game doesn't align with an arsonist existing unless they ignited last night AND arctic... shot someone he was village reading
my worry is that maple is wolf KP and wisdom is a meh role/Goon particularly because how the self-resolving/attention drawing occurred and if w we look at another 2/3 deaths tomorrow. but in that world i feel like wisdom would be lolcatting to throw the lunch here and they seem content? maybe that's telling lol
maybe we flip it around and kill wisdom here and have jan jail/kill maple? idk
They just came out of a game where they fakeclaimed d2 as a wolf on MU, their firefighter claim i think is pretty weak for reasons already explained
Their pushes have all been extremely surface level and especially their pushes on vanta/gemma i think lack the care/paranoia wisdom would have there as a villager. Bonus: i think gemma is a villager and the only possible wolf pushing them d1 is wisdom
bop died calling for their head
last thoughts:
i think if wisdom/maple are w/w, wisdom has the more useful power tonight. maple would def be able to post better here as a wolf to swing the lunch if need be
I find really hard to believe wisdom v and maple w worlds cause i really dont get what manti is doing here in this scenario
v/v we are probably fucked
21
yea i pondered that earlier. i think i was a bit thrown by how d2 played out and manti wanting one more day but that doesnt align with how they are playing today cause wisdom is like... trying and manti isnt?
if jan is real it shouldn't really matter since if they are w/w he can jail the other but im down to swap in case of shenanigans of some sort
im swamped at work so idk how realistic it is for me to make it back for eod again. sorry
vote: wisdom
so. 1. how did they both get the "they did that on MU idea" at the same time and both 1 day after the claim happened and not like, immediately lol.
(i believe I brought it up first btw)
2. wisdom... literally... dipped?
Vibes, I think it was Insomnia that said something about Ladd not having strong reads and his pushes has been on town, that I vibed with.
Also, his 180 on me is opportunistic. And while his reads looks good on a glance, he still has gemma as town and maybe the team is just Gemma/Ladd/Maple and Gemma buses them both to go deep since they're both is the consensus PoE.
that was her last posts 6 HOURS before benneh and ladd talked about it (and the ones before were also slow)
she just explained a bit said something among the lines "ladd sus" and disappeared? she wasnt "trying" (at least not effectively) lol. maple was active and posting. wisdom was gone rofl. so yeah the theory that wisdom posted stronger and therefor is the more powerful wolf role is kinda sus. and um, yeah that whole movement just makes more sense with maple w.
theknightsofneeee
08-14-2024, 01:00
I just consciously realized that i'm probably over indexing on villa reading people for their wall posting this game, because I think people taking the time to make compelling wall post cases/iso's in 12/12 is usually slightly >rand villager, but in a 48/24 with post cap people have way more time so its probably just = rand.
will probably reeval dolby/monty/gemma/ender with that in mind.
I just consciously realized that i'm probably over indexing on villa reading people for their wall posting this game, because I think people taking the time to make compelling wall post cases/iso's in 12/12 is usually slightly >rand villager, but in a 48/24 with post cap people have way more time so its probably just = rand.
will probably reeval dolby/monty/gemma/ender with that in mind.
on average walls are >rand w and you cant convince me otherweise
theknightsofneeee
08-14-2024, 01:02
on average walls are >rand w and you cant convince me otherweise
key word is compelling
oh look other people are questioning too
can we go back to looking at ladd?
Vanta Black
08-14-2024, 01:04
Like, I trust more of the voters on ladd, than the voters on Maple. And more of the voters on Wisdom than the voters on Maple.
The majority has been right two days in a row.
I don't wholly trust either claim but it sounds like Maple's claim is resolvable. But if Wisdom's claim is real then she does have an action tonight I think--somebody said she doesn't.
I think if Maple doesn't get resolved we kill him tomorrow?
vote: Wisdom
theknightsofneeee
08-14-2024, 01:05
Vanta Black
what would you say is your strongest 3 reads ATM?
and how do you normally like to play as a wolf? coast and try to survive? push villagers? protect wolf partners? something else? trying to see what I should see that makes you a villager.
Vanta Black
08-14-2024, 01:06
oh look other people are questioning too
can we go back to looking at ladd?
Was very nearly voting ladd until neeee hopped on there.
i've noticed dolby talking about my alignment with what feels like complete certainty a couple of times, so i have just the slightest #fear that i got snowed in early by cobalt, but cobalt RWSTFO'd, and dolby is just tryharding and is also TMI'ing my alignment
not something i'm dealing with today but consider it noted
bruh
Vanta Black
08-14-2024, 01:06
But I don't have time to go back and look.
theknightsofneeee
08-14-2024, 01:08
Was very nearly voting ladd until neeee hopped on there.
:wall:
Players Votes
Wisdom 7 (Gemma, Ladd, EnderWiggin, nebjiamn, dyachei, Jan, Vanta Black)
Ladd 4 (Montmorency, Theknightsofneeee, grr, Dolby)
Maple 2 (insomnia, Wisdom)
nebjiamn 1 (Sunbae)
whatthistextdo
theknightsofneeee
08-14-2024, 01:10
@vanta
Do you have a reason that makes you think wisdom is a wolf?
or are you just trying to vote with people you have as villagers?
oh look other people are questioning too
can we go back to looking at ladd?
dya, ladd has 4 votes
no one ever stopped looking at ladd
dya, ladd has 4 votes
no one ever stopped looking at ladd
they did when I was there earlier
Vanta Black
08-14-2024, 01:14
Vanta Black
what would you say is your strongest 3 reads ATM?
and how do you normally like to play as a wolf? coast and try to survive? push villagers? protect wolf partners? something else? trying to see what I should see that makes you a villager.
Part 1: Dolby, grr, jan (this may be halo effect from previous Saints game)
Part 2: I have done some very foolish things to protect wolf partners and oddly enough I have usually gotten away with it. Not always.
Vanta Black
08-14-2024, 01:15
@vanta
Do you have a reason that makes you think wisdom is a wolf?
or are you just trying to vote with people you have as villagers?
Yes to both.
Vanta Black
08-14-2024, 01:16
:wall:
Sorry!
nebjiamn
08-14-2024, 01:17
I don't really have qualms with their posts and i'm fine on my wagon, but it kinda makes sense with these:
so. 1. how did they both get the "they did that on MU idea" at the same time and both 1 day after the claim happened and not like, immediately lol.
(i believe I brought it up first btw)
2. wisdom... literally... dipped?
that was her last posts 6 HOURS before benneh and ladd talked about it (and the ones before were also slow)
she just explained a bit said something among the lines "ladd sus" and disappeared? she wasnt "trying" (at least not effectively) lol. maple was active and posting. wisdom was gone rofl. so yeah the theory that wisdom posted stronger and therefor is the more powerful wolf role is kinda sus. and um, yeah that whole movement just makes more sense with maple w.
I’ve had the thought but it was offset by me initially thinking they were likely w/w and manti was a better role
I’m not spewing every thot into the game thread right away at every chance given both the cap and general thread health reasons
To your last point I think there’s an interpretation translation issue because I’m not saying wisdoms posts were good. Just that manti wasn’t really teying much to wiggle out of the elim. If they are w/w and manti had the better power I’d expect he post better and wisdom would have somewhat conceded to dying earlier since they were really the only 2 wagons in consideration for most of today
nebjiamn
08-14-2024, 01:17
vote: ladd
why ladd over wisdom dya
what are ur thoughts on Haru
why ladd over wisdom dya
what are ur thoughts on Haru
you're better at reading haru than i am but like...I really like his tone here. yeah i know we should be past tone reads but like, he's just so pure imo
ladd over wisdom because ladd is like half-assedly pushing things and it doesnt feel like there's conviction
Three posts yet
Going to take a moment to say that I don't agree with grr that ladd and gemma are pairred but I can see how you think that way from Gemma's d3. I still need to re-ev gemma but she is probs town. Gemma you talked a bit about ladd and had some as bottom sus and I know why you moved him up, he had a good post iyo, but it feels like at some points today despite him being your top scumread you dont want to be there and are searching for reasons to get off of him
I'm still at ladd/wisdom/maple
Jan I know you're saying you are going to execute Maple but please do not be swayed unless you receive something that confirms Maple's alignment to you
Sunbae's isolated Benneh vote is interesting on it's own and I want him to talk about it tomorrow
grr remains towny 2862 is towny
knights is fine. I'm at maple is a wolf bc I didn't like their posting, how Syn had them as top town, and later I didn't like their claim and felt like they weren't acting how a town that presumes they are being yeeted today and nothing can stop it SHOULD be acting. Like up until recently when they put out "ender's claim is, ben, dolby, sunbae]" I didn't even feel like I was getting that for solving and that is still unconvincing
fwiw I think that ladd's stuff on d2 with wisdom would be mildly unpairring if he went anywhere with it before today. i, again, feel like he is going there bc the gamestate is forcing him to and I agree with what grr is saying on maple being likely a more powerful wolf
Knights I think that the inverter is town from who they have targetted and tbh given inverter has if anything buffed people I kinda think that makes wisdom a more likely wolf? like, a reward for being inverter targetted.
Vanta is disconnected this EOD and I think that's towny
I have three posts left. I'm saving two of them for the last 10 minutes
theknightsofneeee
08-14-2024, 01:23
iso'd vanta because i've had a complacent villa lean on them from day 1.
was hoping i'd come away with a wolf read because I'm starting to run low on people I want to push after ladd/jan
unfortunately still villa read this slot
his early jan villa read that he gave for jan talking about tarot cards felt super pure then, and still pure now.
I am quoting this because it kind of illustrates a problem I have, and also the seal illustrates me.
I am a very low-level player and I read this three times and still don't know what you're saying. I don't know what you mean by BM, I don't know why reading MU to see if this game would be bastard would uh, tell you that, I guess I do know that Manti is Maple but "burnt inverse" etc. means nothing to me, it's just beyond me.
A lot of you guys' posts I have to read three times before I can make any sense out of them, and even when I do I lose the thread almost immediately. Sorry for dragging the general intelligence of the thread down.
I mean, I guess I thought I might improve my game by playing with elite players, but I am so far behind.
Anyway, in a couple of words, is this suspicion on Maple or not? Because I have town lean on Maple left over from yesterday. That's... basically what I got from "being targeted by maf for cred."
think this frustration could be incorrectly villa read, but i think vanta could easily feel this as either alignment so want to make it clear if people are villa reading posts like this I think that read is pretty bad.
Thank you, would you like to be my translater for the rest of the game (or as long as I last anyhow)?
Maple's response to it also helped clear things up.
didistetter I had a whole reads list, which was very heavily weighted on players I know/have played with being town, so I recalibrated. As of right now, and these are not so much reads as impressions:
Arctic--leaning town, mainly because he wrote a post that i think if he was a wolf he would have edited it
Dolby--null at the moment. I think I have played with Dolby but still no impression
ColonelLubriderm--I know I was kinda down on him yesterday because his posts seemed forced but I think Syn spewed him clear at some point. town lean.
Didistetter--Seems to be very aggressive player. Widely townread, but I'm a bit contrarian so not yet.
Dolby--null at the moment. I think I have played with Dolby but still no impression
dyachei--hard for me to read, I kinda vibed with "I'll get wolfread" though
EnderWiggen--I'm looking back at votes on him, I kind of had the same impression I had yesterday of Col. Lube, posts a little forced. But this is someone I have played with before and I've got to temper my urge to think he's wolfy because I've done that when he was town
Gemma--oh man. She's entertaining. I did like her vote on Syn, and she posted a good read list today. I never did figure out how she reversed her read on syn yesterday but for that I wouldn't vote her (but if I had a dayvig...)
grr--seems kind of contrarian, and I kinda like that. Probably not a good reason but I have TRed for less.
jan--my strongest town atm, even though he didn't give me a card
insomnia--no real opinion, sorry
ladd--did he post a cat picture? I think that was somebody else. Null atm
Maple--I really liked Maple's posts yesterday. I haven't really changed my opinion
Montmorency--no idea
nebjiamn Benneh--getting a cat? Cannot decide whether wolfy or towny for the cat thing
Sunbae--is not standing out in my memory, will reread
Raskolnikov--he is a very good wolf, also very good town. It would be hard for me to vote him today despite some pings--a lilttle defensive about defending Syn yesterday.
theknightsofneee--aside from the annoying username, which I'm probably typing wrong, SL on this one, can't really say why
Wisdom--I'm trying to get over the fact that in the last game here I sort of tunneled her and then she turned out to be town. I know she is a really good player as either alignment. Wouldn't vote today. Would like to know what folks think who have played more with her.
You have posted a vote count every now and then--where are you getting them? I kinda suspect you are just keeping track. What I've got right now in terms of votes:
EnderWiggen 3: Dolby, ColonelLubridern, didistetter
Gemma 1: Wisdom
Maple 1: ladd
nebgiamn 1: Gemma
Raskolnikov 1: EnderWiggen
Sunbae 1: grr
Not voting: Arctic, dyachei, Maple, Montmorency, nebgiamn, Sunbae, Theknightsofneee, Vanta Black
I feel like there ought to be more votes. I tend not to vote a lot when the game host is keeping track manually, or probably in general now that I think of it. Right now my vote would be on Montmorency because according to my notes hardly anybody has said anything about him.
*caveat I am intentionally not gonna over villa read wall posts*
i think the way that vanta focuses on people that he has played with before feels level 1 villagery in a good way,
Raskolnikov, I am not claiming to be a noob (even though compared to a lot of the players here, I kinda am) but I will admit to being overwhelmed. Just a bit. I think it is mean that you did not offer me a virtual mojito with that post. I coulda used it.
I don't understand all this D2 claiming tbh. I don' trust any of 'em now.
I really liked this post.
I think this is what an overwhelmed villager's first instinct would be, especially with several confusing mechanics/claims compounding.
My biggest reservation is that his pushes so far today (maple/wisdom) seem a bit unsubstantiated/concensus'y, and i don't feel much scumhunting from this slot. But by their own admission they're not the strongest villager so i'm not as concerned as I maybe should be.
theknightsofneeee
08-14-2024, 01:24
I am quoting this because it kind of illustrates a problem I have, and also the seal illustrates me.
I am a very low-level player and I read this three times and still don't know what you're saying. I don't know what you mean by BM, I don't know why reading MU to see if this game would be bastard would uh, tell you that, I guess I do know that Manti is Maple but "burnt inverse" etc. means nothing to me, it's just beyond me.
A lot of you guys' posts I have to read three times before I can make any sense out of them, and even when I do I lose the thread almost immediately. Sorry for dragging the general intelligence of the thread down.
I mean, I guess I thought I might improve my game by playing with elite players, but I am so far behind.
Anyway, in a couple of words, is this suspicion on Maple or not? Because I have town lean on Maple left over from yesterday. That's... basically what I got from "being targeted by maf for cred."
Thank you, would you like to be my translater for the rest of the game (or as long as I last anyhow)?
Maple's response to it also helped clear things up.
didistetter I had a whole reads list, which was very heavily weighted on players I know/have played with being town, so I recalibrated. As of right now, and these are not so much reads as impressions:
Arctic--leaning town, mainly because he wrote a post that i think if he was a wolf he would have edited it
Dolby--null at the moment. I think I have played with Dolby but still no impression
ColonelLubriderm--I know I was kinda down on him yesterday because his posts seemed forced but I think Syn spewed him clear at some point. town lean.
Didistetter--Seems to be very aggressive player. Widely townread, but I'm a bit contrarian so not yet.
Dolby--null at the moment. I think I have played with Dolby but still no impression
dyachei--hard for me to read, I kinda vibed with "I'll get wolfread" though
EnderWiggen--I'm looking back at votes on him, I kind of had the same impression I had yesterday of Col. Lube, posts a little forced. But this is someone I have played with before and I've got to temper my urge to think he's wolfy because I've done that when he was town
Gemma--oh man. She's entertaining. I did like her vote on Syn, and she posted a good read list today. I never did figure out how she reversed her read on syn yesterday but for that I wouldn't vote her (but if I had a dayvig...)
grr--seems kind of contrarian, and I kinda like that. Probably not a good reason but I have TRed for less.
jan--my strongest town atm, even though he didn't give me a card
insomnia--no real opinion, sorry
ladd--did he post a cat picture? I think that was somebody else. Null atm
Maple--I really liked Maple's posts yesterday. I haven't really changed my opinion
Montmorency--no idea
nebjiamn Benneh--getting a cat? Cannot decide whether wolfy or towny for the cat thing
Sunbae--is not standing out in my memory, will reread
Raskolnikov--he is a very good wolf, also very good town. It would be hard for me to vote him today despite some pings--a lilttle defensive about defending Syn yesterday.
theknightsofneee--aside from the annoying username, which I'm probably typing wrong, SL on this one, can't really say why
Wisdom--I'm trying to get over the fact that in the last game here I sort of tunneled her and then she turned out to be town. I know she is a really good player as either alignment. Wouldn't vote today. Would like to know what folks think who have played more with her.
You have posted a vote count every now and then--where are you getting them? I kinda suspect you are just keeping track. What I've got right now in terms of votes:
EnderWiggen 3: Dolby, ColonelLubridern, didistetter
Gemma 1: Wisdom
Maple 1: ladd
nebgiamn 1: Gemma
Raskolnikov 1: EnderWiggen
Sunbae 1: grr
Not voting: Arctic, dyachei, Maple, Montmorency, nebgiamn, Sunbae, Theknightsofneee, Vanta Black
I feel like there ought to be more votes. I tend not to vote a lot when the game host is keeping track manually, or probably in general now that I think of it. Right now my vote would be on Montmorency because according to my notes hardly anybody has said anything about him.
Raskolnikov, I am not claiming to be a noob (even though compared to a lot of the players here, I kinda am) but I will admit to being overwhelmed. Just a bit. I think it is mean that you did not offer me a virtual mojito with that post. I coulda used it.
I don't understand all this D2 claiming tbh. I don' trust any of 'em now.
Sorry!
nah its fine just funny/annoying if you're village
but such is life :cheers:
theknightsofneeee
08-14-2024, 01:25
why do my multiquoted posts keep staying around after i make a post with them zzzzzzzz
pls help
nebjiamn
08-14-2024, 01:26
you're better at reading haru than i am but like...I really like his tone here. yeah i know we should be past tone reads but like, he's just so pure imo
ladd over wisdom because ladd is like half-assedly pushing things and it doesnt feel like there's conviction
Do you think they’re w/w and he’s grabbing cred or do you think wisdom has more v equity than him?
agree on Haru but tones his best quality. I was hoping to solidify my read on him but we kinda didn’t get a chance to engage much. I still lean v but ya
theknightsofneeee
08-14-2024, 01:27
last thoughts:
i think if wisdom/maple are w/w, wisdom has the more useful power tonight. maple would def be able to post better here as a wolf to swing the lunch if need be
I find really hard to believe wisdom v and maple w worlds cause i really dont get what manti is doing here in this scenario
v/v we are probably fucked
21
i want to burn this post with fire
why do my multiquoted posts keep staying around after i make a post with them zzzzzzzz
pls help
skill issue tbh
nebjiamn
08-14-2024, 01:28
ladds read in knights is real bad imo and feels like widening the POE, esp since im who he’s pairing knights with
idk if i have the balls to do it and be wrong tho cause then im eating a vig shot in the face (or a launch)
Do you think they’re w/w and he’s grabbing cred or do you think wisdom has more v equity than him?
agree on Haru but tones his best quality. I was hoping to solidify my read on him but we kinda didn’t get a chance to engage much. I still lean v but ya
I think ladd is much wolfier and Idk that he's grabbing cred vs pushing someone easier to be miskilled
nebjiamn
08-14-2024, 01:30
“nebjiamn Benneh--getting a cat? Cannot decide whether wolfy or towny for the cat thing”
lmao
i want to burn this post with fire
thats a p bad post LOL
theknightsofneeee
08-14-2024, 01:31
Sorry about today's overall absence. Getting back from vacation both nuked more focus and stole more time than I expected.
Getting misyeeted here is the norm but I've been even more disconnected than usually this game, that's on me. I do think both Maple and Gemma are wolves but maybe I've been too stubborn on Gemma since I know her flipping wolf is the easiest way to town clear me.
Here’s my legacy, in case I die.
Town (0 wolves)
Dya
Town lean (0-1 wolves)
Jan
Dolby
Grr
Insomnia
No idea (0-2 wolves)
Benneh
Ender
Sunbae
Knights
Monte
Wolf lean (0-2 wolves)
Vanta
Ladd
Wolf lean (1-2 wolves)
Gemma
Maple
Stay hyped and hydrated, good night <3
/stare/
theknightsofneeee
08-14-2024, 01:32
speaking of 0-2 wolves in vanta
its probably pretty important that people commit to *some* kind of read on that slot today just so there's some accountability with the inevitable swaps to that player if theyre alive in a couple days
which they will be
very villagery from manti because i had the exact same thought (which is why i just iso'd vanta)
theknightsofneeee
08-14-2024, 01:33
Vote: Wisdom
I will jail Maple and you can assume I will execute.
We will have a night talk of course but this is where I stand right now and big things need to happen for that to change. (actual hard confirmation that the village can comprehend even if I die).
I think both this vote and this night action are very wolfy
but lets hope i'm wrong and jan's villa :juggle2:
i am kinda concerned that i may be wrong on Wisdom and it may be just Ladd/Maple. Wisdom is still a bottom three read for me and I think Wisdom can still be pairred with Ladd easy but like, Ladd calling out Wisdoms for good reasons on day two (that Wisdom just dropped a townread on Vanta to a scumread really abruptly) did feel good, but he never went anywhere with it until the middle of day three. Kinda just feels like cheap distancing in that context
Don't let anyone tell you that ladd and maple aren't teammed, I really just think they are off of interactions and ladd voting there without doing anything to inpact a Maple yeet outside that vote.
I feel that Wisdom using Gemma to say that Maple/Ladd were not w/w and Gemma was wolf was super bad and fits with wisdom/maple/ladd all being wolves
I think that ladd is only making the push on Wisdom today because of the threadstate. I think that he's only pushing wisdom today because of the threadstate. I think that if he cares about the dropped vanta read he would have done something with it on day two instead of just leaving them middle of the pack and saying (admitidly only semi prompted) that he's considering if wisdom could be a wolf and then coming up with reasons to v read wisdom. I also like, just don't feel any conviction in reads on Benneh and sunbae which is a bad sign when I feel like he's on Wisdom for gamestate only reads already
grr has had really villagery today. I don't agree with it but I feel ladd and gemma pairred was a towny thought informed by looking at what gemma has been doing on d3 only.
knights, maybe I should re-ev him but I really was feeling like his d1 posts are coming from town and I feel that the circumstances of eod1 led themselves to him being a villager, and syn probablybeing the only wolf wagon
gemma, eh I think Gemma is fine
Dolby
Dya
grr
Insomnia
Knights
Vanta Black
Monty - if bad is more likely a 3p than a mafia
EnderWiggin - yep Ender is this high! I feel like i kinda tunneled on Ender but he had a lot of villager energy today and I feel like some of his posting doesn't look as bad as I was acribing it in retrospect
Gemma - need to re-ev
Benneh - need to re-ev
Sunbae - need to re-ev
Wisdom
Ladd
Maple - please kill with fire jan
I have two posts left, this is my legacy. I am saving those two posts for vote changes if neccessary
Vanta Black
08-14-2024, 01:37
“nebjiamn Benneh--getting a cat? Cannot decide whether wolfy or towny for the cat thing”
lmao
NAI in the end. Good luck, once you have decided you need a cat, a cat will appear, somehow.
Also insomnia congrats on the job.
nebjiamn
08-14-2024, 01:45
would Ladd be more upset at me for misvoting him here if he’s town or me breaking the spaghetti noodles I just put in the water for dinner
im fine with ladd dying im personally just not voting there rn bc im in wolfchat with him
theknightsofneeee
08-14-2024, 01:46
went back to find that wisdom/syn interaction that i liked day 2
it was this first one (where wisdom talked about giving rask a villa read) but awkwardly reading it with the rask flip makes it kinda feel like TMI from wisdom
so i came away with the opposite read lmfao
below is all syn --> wisdom interactions
?????????
take that back rn
town:
newcomb
maple
dyachei
gemma
idk fine i guess:
nebjiamn
didistetter
sunbae
grr
insomnia
c0balt
i can't recall a single post/no opinion:
arctic
vanta black
theknightsofneeee
why (diet version):
enderwiggin
colonellubriderm
why:
raskolnikov
wisdom
jan
sheepsaysmeep
are hally and montmorency actually playing this game or are they in the player list for the lulz
looks at my poe
looks at this post
looks at my poe
looks at this post
surely it cannot be
notable is ladd left off the reads list and then put in 'fine i guess' after and having this interaction with syn
wtf man
which still feels pretty partner'y to me
would Ladd be more upset at me for misvoting him here if he’s town or me breaking the spaghetti noodles I just put in the water for dinner
no boss
you cant be putting your hands in boiling water like that
and if ur implying that u put the noodles in cold water idek what to say to u rn
theknightsofneeee
08-14-2024, 01:49
after iso'ing wisdom i honestly don't see him as super wolfy
like its def not blowing me away with villageriness or anything, but yeah i'm not super feeling it
theknightsofneeee
08-14-2024, 01:51
this might be a stupid read but I think wolf!wisdom wouldn't have me as essentially null most of the game when i was one of the only people even vaguely defending him the last couple of days, and I voted on a wolf EOD1
i think he would have enough self pres instinct to at least fake that read lol
theknightsofneeee
08-14-2024, 01:53
and I think the POV of wisdom pushing his gemma wolf read in an effort to potentially clear himself, even tho realistically his read on gemma shouldn't be that strong, is something I've done as a villager who is wolf read and felt that he was likely to get miselimed
Montmorency
08-14-2024, 01:54
Like I said, I think Town has lost the initiative. I would truly have my mind blown were the trio collectively to be pure, but if any of them were town, I suspect maf will drive the lim onto them.
Why break spaghetti, it softens in just seconds. Dump it all in, wait 10 seconds (add the salt now), stir. This may or may not be a metaphor.
theknightsofneeee
08-14-2024, 01:54
im fine with ladd dying im personally just not voting there rn bc im in wolfchat with him
but imagine if we both hammered a wolf in 2 separate EOD's
think of the GLORY
nebjiamn
08-14-2024, 01:56
after iso'ing wisdom i honestly don't see him as super wolfy
like its def not blowing me away with villageriness or anything, but yeah i'm not super feeling it
wisdom goes by she or they fam
(idk if they really care or not but that's what their MU acct says)
I’ve had the thought but it was offset by me initially thinking they were likely w/w and manti was a better role
I’m not spewing every thot into the game thread right away at every chance given both the cap and general thread health reasons
To your last point I think there’s an interpretation translation issue because I’m not saying wisdoms posts were good. Just that manti wasn’t really teying much to wiggle out of the elim. If they are w/w and manti had the better power I’d expect he post better and wisdom would have somewhat conceded to dying earlier since they were really the only 2 wagons in consideration for most of today
dont think he's posting bad no idea why it was framed like he was posting someone who wants to die over a no-poster (well who later made on single post) (especially, as you can see, ppl think hes town so he isnt posting so bad rofl)
theknightsofneeee
08-14-2024, 01:58
wisdom goes by she or they fam
(idk if they really care or not but that's what their MU acct says)
wish pronouns were listed here (or if they are IDK where to look)
but i'll be honest I had no clue on wisdom, and i've been trying to just use they for everyone to avoid dealing with it but sometimes I miss a couple (sorry wisdom <3 )
but imagine if we both hammered a wolf in 2 separate EOD's
think of the GLORY
ngl swapping to ladd is tempting but it'd be rude to my boi newcomb
on the bright side if wisdom flips v and ladd is a wolf ur posting here will have u positioned to win it all in f3, now thats glory baby
Players Votes
Wisdom 6 (Gemma, Ladd, EnderWiggin, nebjiamn, Jan, Vanta Black)
Ladd 5 (Montmorency, Theknightsofneeee, dyachei, grr, Dolby)
Maple 2 (insomnia, Wisdom)
nebjiamn 1 (Sunbae)
whatthistextdo
believe this is correct
I think wisdom is likely a difference check to the entire team i posted earlier
ladd
gemma
benneh
maple
sure can be wrong but like, almost makes so much sense i find it hard to believe it can be wrong now lol
nebjiamn
08-14-2024, 01:59
dont think he's posting bad no idea why it was framed like he was posting someone who wants to die over a no-poster (well who later made on single post) (especially, as you can see, ppl think hes town so he isnt posting so bad rofl)
again mistranslation, i am saying he wasn't trying, not that his posts were bad
he could def try harder to avoid the lunch /shrug
theknightsofneeee
08-14-2024, 01:59
ngl swapping to ladd is tempting but it'd be rude to my boi newcomb
on the bright side if wisdom flips v and ladd is a wolf ur posting here will have u positioned to win it all in f3, now thats glory baby
if i'm in f3...
lets just say i won't be happy lol
Vanta Black
08-14-2024, 01:59
vote: ladd
I thought I would swap if ladd became vote leader, but there is no vote count. Also if ladd became vote leader I wouldn't have to.
mont towny dont misyeet him
also knights lots more towny than ladd gives him credit for
nebjiamn
08-14-2024, 01:59
Vote: ladd
siw trusting dya here
pasta gods give me strength
theknightsofneeee
08-14-2024, 02:00
glgl hope i'm wrong
theknightsofneeee
08-14-2024, 02:00
jk hope i'm right lol
Players Votes
Ladd 7 (Montmorency, grr, Dolby, Theknightsofneeee, dyachei, Vanta Black, nebjiamn)
Wisdom 4 (Gemma, Ladd, EnderWiggin, Jan)
Maple 2 (insomnia, Wisdom)
nebjiamn 1 (Sunbae)
whatthistextdo
ladd was killed.
They were:
The Star
https://i.imgur.com/zYvHzp8.jpeg
They were village!
24 hours for night., Night orders due 7pm, so 22 hours for night orders.
whatthistextdo
Obviously do NOT post at night, thanks.
N3 Results:
Jan was killed.
They were:
The Empress
https://i.imgur.com/Cd03GbZ.jpeg
They were village!
-----
nebjiamn was killed.
They were:
The High Priestess
https://i.imgur.com/tuE1ooW.jpeg
They were mafia!
-----
48 hours for day.
whatthistextdo
Don't post till 9pm EDT.
so i might have lied.
benneh is my pelt
I lived bitch
vote: Dolby
Jan decided to spare my life. We discussed overnight and more or less came to the conclusion that ben/dolby+2 is the team, with a rough PoE of knights/vanta/mont/wisdom.
He recieved a medic heal which we used on Dya. Looks like it may have saved, too.
Our v list is dya/sunbae/gemma/grr/insom, in descending order.
Ender probably should have full claimed yesterday, but it is waht it is.
I lived bitch
vote: Dolby
Jan decided to spare my life. We discussed overnight and more or less came to the conclusion that ben/dolby+2 is the team, with a rough PoE of knights/vanta/mont/wisdom.
He recieved a medic heal which we used on Dya. Looks like it may have saved, too.
Our v list is dya/sunbae/gemma/grr/insom, in descending order.
Ender probably should have full claimed yesterday, but it is waht it is.
i think with how benneh voted last second to save wisdom, it's probably her in there, too
Vote: Wisdom
Imma be real I did no work over night again (sorry gang). At the hour before I was considering snapping back to Wisdom but felt like I should be voting with Dya
I think that Wisdom is still a hit, idk where else I'm going. My initial reaction to this is that I don't think that Ender is with Benneh, but my reads probably suck. I don't think that Vanta Black is with Benneh with that vote movement tbh.
yeah
A big issue with Wisdom is that she's very possibly paired with basically the entire PoE. Currently leaning vanta being v in those 4. Knights and mont its very close, could go either way. Knights has been pretty wolf-sidey all game, while mont is just posting some actually insane shit.
Benneh was basically outed for that eod lol
i was pissed when i saw ladd went over
A big issue with Wisdom is that she's very possibly paired with basically the entire PoE. Currently leaning vanta being v in those 4. Knights and mont its very close, could go either way. Knights has been pretty wolf-sidey all game, while mont is just posting some actually insane shit.
Benneh was basically outed for that eod lol
i was pissed when i saw ladd went over
that's why i shot there. but it truly doesnt matter if I die tonight or not. I am actually out now
Montmorency
08-15-2024, 02:06
I assume Jan bamboozled the Mafia and hero-shot. Neb was pure sweet-spot for me in the list, alongside Vanta. Neb and Vanta voted ladd at the very end, with one minute to spare, after not doing much voting (neb voted Maple at SOD, Vanta voted Maple midday, quickly switched to Wisdom). But this is such a weird and unnecessary association that I rather believe Vanta should be unpaired.
Note: Points to everyone who challenged neb on breezily assuring us town was winning the game yesterday. Including Vanta.
Note: Find everyone who sussed neb yesterday!!!!
People are going to want to parse neb's main reads yesterday...
(For reference, D2 neb voted Ender, Rask, Maple, Rask.)
https://forums.totalwar.org/vb/showthread.php/155022-Tarot-Mafia?p=2053859172&viewfull=1#post2053859172
Yes, I was wrong about ladd, well, he's no Maple...
I would be willing to vote Dolby just for the shell game he played with ladd-Wisdom-Maple all day yesterday.
Montmorency
08-15-2024, 02:08
A big issue with Wisdom is that she's very possibly paired with basically the entire PoE. Currently leaning vanta being v in those 4. Knights and mont its very close, could go either way. Knights has been pretty wolf-sidey all game, while mont is just posting some actually insane shit.
Benneh was basically outed for that eod lol
i was pissed when i saw ladd went over
It was a beautiful world, OK? But tell me, are Wisdom and Ender scum because of neb's voting pattern? (See my other post)
The best reason to vote Wisdom IME is to clear Gemma.
so i might have lied.
benneh is my pelt
god you have brightened my day
i just want to burn vanta and knights now
god you have brightened my day
i just want to burn vanta and knights now
i think wisdom, possibly sunbae, and dolby look worse?
A big issue with Wisdom is that she's very possibly paired with basically the entire PoE. Currently leaning vanta being v in those 4. Knights and mont its very close, could go either way. Knights has been pretty wolf-sidey all game, while mont is just posting some actually insane shit.
Benneh was basically outed for that eod lol
i was pissed when i saw ladd went over
yeah ngl my jaw dropped irl when i saw that happen i was so upset, mostly with myself
The best reason to vote Wisdom IME is to clear Gemma.
terrible read boss ngl
EnderWiggin
08-15-2024, 02:27
Dya I love you rn.
(Temp here on lunch, was gonna make a pissy post about Ladd going over and proving me right about him but tbh I'm not even angry anymore. Though still boo I was right.)
EnderWiggin
08-15-2024, 02:31
Re: Role
I was able to promote a player which I don't entirely know exactly what would do but I was promised would be positive.
I tried on Stett N1 obviously. I expected they'd get something back if it worked(Which is why I said they should have proof of my actions.) but I used a shot and they apparently weren't told anything. I'd be very curious to find out what happened after end of game.
I was, however, inverted last night. Which has left me very curious because my inversion is definitely not a reverse of my role or a strict upgrade. It's more like a side-grade?
Hm is it correct to have the inverter claim today or forever hold their peace?
im not sure yet
I'm revoking masons with Monty btw
I don't think my vote ever moves off of Wisdom today tbh
EnderWiggin
08-15-2024, 02:46
I wanna have time to reread Benneh before I settle. I admit I managed to convince myself he was town yesterday which means I need to review how I was looking at things.
I lived bitch
vote: Dolby
Jan decided to spare my life. We discussed overnight and more or less came to the conclusion that ben/dolby+2 is the team, with a rough PoE of knights/vanta/mont/wisdom.
He recieved a medic heal which we used on Dya. Looks like it may have saved, too.
Our v list is dya/sunbae/gemma/grr/insom, in descending order.
Ender probably should have full claimed yesterday, but it is waht it is.
uh so what are the telephone cliffnotes on jan's dolby read?
i see u and dya talking about them being w and while i havent read whatever happened while i was asleep before eod and also i admittedly havent read a lot of dolby's longer posts, last i checked dolby was solidly v and not a read i was concerned about reassessing on so unless something wild happened in those 8 pages or so that i havent read or theres some smoking gun i didnt read in their big posts i aint considering them aorn and i think we got bigger fish to fry
I'm revoking masons with Monty btw
I don't think my vote ever moves off of Wisdom today tbh
when were u ever masons with monty???
when were u ever masons with monty???
yesterday, though I said it and offered it to him mainly because I felt it would help him become more in tune with the thread and help me read with him.
Montmorency
08-15-2024, 05:19
TALLY #1079
Gemma 4 (Ladd, sheepsaysmeep, Wisdom, insomnia)
Syn 4 (Didistetter, ColonelLubriderm, Newcomb, dyachei)
Theknightsofneeee 3 (EnderWiggin, Raskolnikov, Gemma)
EnderWiggin 1 (nebjiamn)
Sunbae 1 (Jan)
sheepsaysmeep 1 (Syn)
Raskolnikov 1 (grr)
Jan 1 (Theknightsofneeee)
ColonelLubriderm 1 (Vanta Black)
TALLY #1170
Raskolnikov 4 (grr, ColonelLubriderm, Jan, Montmorency)
Theknightsofneeee 4 (EnderWiggin, Raskolnikov, Gemma, Didistetter)
Gemma 4 (Ladd, sheepsaysmeep, Wisdom, insomnia)
Syn 2 (Newcomb, dyachei)
EnderWiggin 1 (nebjiamn)
sheepsaysmeep 1 (Syn)
Jan 1 (Theknightsofneeee)
ColonelLubriderm 1 (Vanta Black)
TALLY #1196
Syn 5 ( Newcomb, Gemma, Insomnia, Theknightsofneeee, Didistetter)
Raskolnikov 4 (grr, ColonelLubriderm, Jan, Maple)
Gemma 3 (sheepsaysmeep, Wisdom, insomnia)
sheepsaysmeep 3 (Syn, dyachei, Ladd)
Theknightsofneeee 2 (EnderWiggin, Raskolnikov)
EnderWiggin 1 (nebjiamn)
ColonelLubriderm 1 (Vanta Black)
TALLY FINAL
Syn 7 ( Newcomb, Gemma, Insomnia, Theknightsofneeee, Didistetter, Arctic, Maple)
Gemma 3 (sheepsaysmeep, Wisdom, Jan)
sheepsaysmeep 3 (Syn, dyachei, Ladd)
Raskolnikov 2 (grr, ColonelLubriderm )
Theknightsofneeee 2 (EnderWiggin, Raskolnikov)
EnderWiggin 1 (nebjiamn)
ColonelLubriderm 1 (Vanta Black)
I don't think there was more than 1 mafia operating EOD 1. Most of the dead players were AFK or lurking, including syn and neb, as well as Sunbae, Ender, Vanta, cobalt, and grr. From that presumption, Gemma's vote pattern looks very good for her - she kept the syn wagon alive at a key moment - although a m-Wisdom flip would lock her town for good. Also following from the presumption (and more so with ladd's town flip), knights' syn vote is not +EV, as he would have had no good options, although he reacted very quickly on the bus if scum. At any rate, I don't have any reason to POE him at this time.
My POE for today would have to be
sunbae
dolby
wisdom
although I can't offer a sound reason to go above Wisdom atm. m-Wisdom clears Gemma and probably Ender at this point, so it's a very desirable hit, if a hit. Vanta, like, ladd just asked me why he and ender would coordinate in chat to ask knights the same question simultaneously. He was right after all. So, the question goes, why would vanta and wisdom coordinate to vote ladd at the literal last minute when it was already 5-4 and Wisdom wasn't self-prezzing? Why not just one, or both a couple hours apart? Teams have certainly casually outed themselves before, but maybe we need a little more feedback before we decide it's what happened.
I'm revoking masons with Monty btw
I don't think my vote ever moves off of Wisdom today tbh
luhmao
Dolby, I strongly disliked the pattern of cycling through wagons and reevaluating all of them. It did feel like a shell game designed to swamp a very important town PR. If Wisdom is indeed the scum of three, it's hard to credit you for it now. Other than that, cobalt had a rather poor D1. He only posted the first half of D1, but almost all of it is fluff directed at people who flipped or locked in the first round (Newcomb, stetter, sheep, etc.). I'm not sure what the best thing to do for you would be (but it's not wall-posting more ISOs).
offered it to him mainly because I felt it would help him become more in tune with the thread and help me read with him.
So you were trying to pocket me? :verycool:
i doubt i am dying and if so my plan was to leave jan my legacy (tho I realize he will probably die tonight lol but at least we will have a fun chat)
my associative stop at "i'd kill knights after wisdom" atm
my legacy is this
dont kill until lylo - should be pure
ladd
insomnia
grr
gemma
jan
dya
dolby
leaning villa
ender - again plz make them claim tho. always a villager if knights w
vanta - should be v if wisdom w
PoE
monti - I see the villagery posting but also at some point u gotta punish people for posting dumb arguments and he has been pushing some truly nonsensical things
benneh
sunbae
maple
wolves
knights
wisdom
but idrc about people following my legacy, you guis can do what you want after I die. Those are simply my reads
Ladd legacy for me
Me: cases ladd town, votes benneh
Thread: OVER IN NARNIA OVER THERE WHO KNOWS WHAT HES DOING
At some point I'm going to have to figure out what wins out between my positive feelings of Knights end of day one and my negative feelings of rereading the thread and seeing Kngihts constantly lumping me in with benneh yet shading me and boosting benneh whenever he gets the chance
i agree, but i think i can explain it, ymmv. i think it was cause it was an odd segue onto a topic that was somewhat ... irrelevant anyway? like the idea that it was something of inherent value that sheep/knights didn't pick up on and point out is the wolfy part to me, because why did they have to think that was the case? what value or interest is gleaned from either of those players just taking stett's post as off the cuff. it seemed like a bunch of casual shade thrown onto ppl for making gut reads/leans which is the wolfy part to me
my only guess was the timing of stett's post could have made wisdom think this, but reading it in 'real-time' that wasn't something that occurred to me cause it was a pretty ~whatever post beyond being tonally towny and i didnt think much of anyone else reading into that post either
Initial thought is this is way too defend-y for such a little comment from cobalt to be on a teammate. Like I feel it's more inclined to try and pocket wisdom than to push Cobalt off of a read or anything. I'm actually a bit confused why it got this response in the first place. Making a mental note. I suppose if Wisdom is wolf arsonist or w/e and the plan is to defend out of the gate maybe but it sounds sketchy to me.
theknightsofneeee
08-15-2024, 05:45
At some point I'm going to have to figure out what wins out between my positive feelings of Knights end of day one and my negative feelings of rereading the thread and seeing Kngihts constantly lumping me in with benneh yet shading me and boosting benneh whenever he gets the chance
hey i specifically cleared you EOD 3 if it makes you feel better :)
theknightsofneeee
08-15-2024, 05:50
i'd say my bad about my ladd read, but honestly it was both my bad and his bad. >.<
nice shot on benneh dya, i was 100% gonna push him for his very tentative vote on ladd at the EOD only when it was likely to push him over.
blame vanta much less for their vote because they showed hesitancy to voting with me and picked a different wagon first.
glad i got there on jan, but i'm surprised that Maple is alive ? did he give reasoning for not killing you?
my initial thought is that maybe jan got roleblocked and couldn't execute maple? (afaik thats how it works in TOS, if the jailer gets roleblocked they can't execute)
gonna read benneh for spew, probably a fairly good amount there, gonna read specifically for his reads on wisdom/maple/vanta/monty/enderwiggen as those are my most unsure atm
i mean, i was actively encouraging him to go on...
sick lost mafia goon soft, ty [ glow] tags
oh thats a cute post cause now i have to wonder if people knew you were a wolf day 1 argh
theknightsofneeee
08-15-2024, 05:54
sunbae pushing benneh yesterday when benneh wasn't really on my radar at all is also probably extra clearing for him but I already had him as villa
but just in case anyone else didn't have him cleared yet, he's >> rand villager
sunbae could have been potentially distancing from benneh in a world where wisdom/maple/ladd are all villagers and sunbae knew the elim wouldn't really be close to hitting a wolf, and trying to set up for late game, but a) i don't believe that is the world and b) I think benneh felt way more willing to give sunbae shallow reads that don't feel like wolf bro's trying to make fleshed out reads on each other.
i'd say my bad about my ladd read, but honestly it was both my bad and his bad. >.<
https://media.tenor.com/PF0BL5IWwjoAAAAM/dwight-shotgun.gif
theknightsofneeee
08-15-2024, 05:57
https://media.tenor.com/PF0BL5IWwjoAAAAM/dwight-shotgun.gif
he wolf read me for like 2.5 out of 3 days
and 90% of the read was 'knights is lacking'
i'm a strong man but i'm not strong enough to wolf read that lol
Bennehs day 1 posts about alive players. I'm making no commentary on them yet
About Wisdom:
q: do you think wisdom was actually interested in why bob/knights/sheep (im forgetting who exactly it was now) didn't question whether that was a pre-written post?
that does not seem like something she would actually care about in that spot and i disliked the way it was framed because it came across as shade. so even if i accept maybe she just had a different thought/approach to the stett post the framing thereafter felt ruff to me
unfortunately i kinda like wisdoms other posts since then and i dont really care to go down this road a ton but c'est la vie and all since u brought it up
okie dokie -- i still think that was phrased wolfily but w/e
i feel extremly called out by this spoiler
also i did not tunnel you last game, cmon. i had a bad read but i did not act as if you were the only and obvoius scum at any point. hally just played well and avoided suspicion until i didnt have other areas to visit (in my mind)
About Grrr
i liked his tone around the newcomb vote and his logic there but also that he isn't tunneling it, just stating it as a matter of fact. i liked his intro. he's got more of a dgaf confidence to him than stiltedness iyam.
i feel like his early posting here would be more subdued or more strategic as a wolf given FTR/Turbo meta vis a vis this game's list and the dayphase length but it feels like he's just leting things fly here
>IH isn't really a strategic wolf imo so i just disagree on the reasoning given and thats why i cant really buy the explanation
this is doing a lot of heavy lifting for your logic on the IH read given the post is less about his strategy and more about his inability to push on a player new to him like newcomb with any amount of sincerity. newcomb isn't katze (or insom or ladd) otherwise i probably wouldn't have made that read, but the dynamic there is and was decently out of his wolf range, particularly early d1 before any lines were drawn in the sand
About Ender
yesssssssssssss, that page 6 post pinged me too
i was too lazy to do the math on what page 6 would be since i'm on 40 or 35 or 62 posts per page or whatever, but my estimate was he was sussing inso earlier for his like, ~4 intro posts that were pretty ~whatever?
(thats jumping on my Ender suspicion)
vote: enderwiggin
Jan its nothing mega deep, just these posts in particular pinged me
emphasizing the vote on you was a joke twice/clarifying his intent just pings me a bit
the post about insom pings me for the 'kinda sus early' 'but p6 insom hits diff' when early on was mostly intro posts and it feels like somewhat of an exaggeration for something i viewed as either null or just irrelevant from insom (but ender being around to clarify which posts early he sus'd would help tbf)
the post about newcomb is just super awkward. its mostly fluff about his willingness to vote newcomb as a wolf in a game from a year ago segueing into 'why are you reading him?' with clarification that he doesnt even have a read on newcomb
i cant really explain the read beyond that. i admit its kinda meh but i don't really have much else to work on rn. his other posts in the flurry were ~fine i agree but for my money he's the wolfiest of the interesting/non-cop-out yeets on the table we're likely heading to (sheep/knights) that i think have more villa equity
theknightsofneeee
08-15-2024, 06:01
ladds read in knights is real bad imo and feels like widening the POE, esp since im who he’s pairing knights with
idk if i have the balls to do it and be wrong tho cause then im eating a vig shot in the face (or a launch)
i read this as super villagery at EOD especially when i was still in the middle of my crusade on ladd and it almost word for word described my read on ladd/why i was pushing him
but in retrospect it should have been kinda obvious that he was using me to springboard a vote/elim on ladd
bleh
Montmorency
08-15-2024, 06:02
my initial thought is that maybe jan got roleblocked and couldn't execute maple? (afaik thats how it works in TOS, if the jailer gets roleblocked they can't execute)
According to the claim, Maple gifted Jan a 1x doc, Jan TRed Maple after discussion, Jan protected dya. It's not verifiable - maybe Mafia have only 1 kp left and rationally used it against the JK with KP - but a hit on both dya and Jan with dya getting protected with Maple's gift is also very plausible. Maybe Maple has just been running a fabulous gambit, but he's near-clear.
theknightsofneeee
08-15-2024, 06:10
i agree, but i think i can explain it, ymmv. i think it was cause it was an odd segue onto a topic that was somewhat ... irrelevant anyway? like the idea that it was something of inherent value that sheep/knights didn't pick up on and point out is the wolfy part to me, because why did they have to think that was the case? what value or interest is gleaned from either of those players just taking stett's post as off the cuff. it seemed like a bunch of casual shade thrown onto ppl for making gut reads/leans which is the wolfy part to me
my only guess was the timing of stett's post could have made wisdom think this, but reading it in 'real-time' that wasn't something that occurred to me cause it was a pretty ~whatever post beyond being tonally towny and i didnt think much of anyone else reading into that post either
According to the claim, Maple gifted Jan a 1x doc, Jan TRed Maple after discussion, Jan protected dya. It's not verifiable - maybe Mafia have only 1 kp left and rationally used it against the JK with KP - but a hit on both dya and Jan with dya getting protected with Maple's gift is also very plausible. Maybe Maple has just been running a fabulous gambit, but he's near-clear.
another relatively plausible world is
maple is wolf kp (there were multiple kills n2 and arctic wasn't able to kill maple n2)
n3 jan jailkeeps maple (this roleblocks and protects maple, but allows jan the ability to talk to maple at night, and decide to execute before SOD)
during n3 no wolf kp is shown except a kill on jan, and wolves roleblock jan to prevent him from executing maple (since he's wolf kp)
reads as super plausible to me
also maple being able to give items out to jan either during the day or at the start of the night phase feels super weird/counter intuitive to me, i would have to double check with maple's earlier claims and see if that is something that is consistent from the start of his claim or not, because that just feels fishy mechanically that he was able to prove himself to jan before he was jailed.
Nice one Dya! I hadn't even read EoD yet except for the flip so didn't know Ben was outted. Should have time after work to do some digging.
i'd say my bad about my ladd read, but honestly it was both my bad and his bad. >.<
nice shot on benneh dya, i was 100% gonna push him for his very tentative vote on ladd at the EOD only when it was likely to push him over.
blame vanta much less for their vote because they showed hesitancy to voting with me and picked a different wagon first.
glad i got there on jan, but i'm surprised that Maple is alive ? did he give reasoning for not killing you?
my initial thought is that maybe jan got roleblocked and couldn't execute maple? (afaik thats how it works in TOS, if the jailer gets roleblocked they can't execute)
gonna read benneh for spew, probably a fairly good amount there, gonna read specifically for his reads on wisdom/maple/vanta/monty/enderwiggen as those are my most unsure atm
jan and i were ride or die after some discussion and analysis. Also, with ladd dying and it being pretty blatantly obvious that ben was more or less outed and in the worst case (wolves getting multiple kills + village having no KP left) our only shot at winning was attempting to get a good day today.
Fortunately, wolves only got 1 kill off and dya had another kill so it didn't go as bad as we feared.
Now, on a *mechanical* level, I should be treated as clear from now on. I hope it goes without saying how fuckin dumb it'd be for people to go for me after all that, especially given how good my PR evidently is and the fact that I am now a priority for the wolves - we got a doctor out of it, who knows what other goodies I can give out? Not to mention how s p e w e d clear I am here. If you think I'm a wolf at this point, you just gotta take the L and blame Jan in post.
As far as dolby goes, seemed paired with ben + the handling of wisdom + me + ladd yesterday and ending on ladd (with both wisdom's w equity and the fact that ladd was just straight up the worst kill of the three) + the blatant wolfsiding.
When compared to sunbae and insom, who aren't like *that* villagery in the grand scheme of things, the issue is that there are *several* slots that are varying degrees of just mindfuckingly wolfy or deranged in this game. We can debate the specifics later, and I *am* down to start with a lower effort wagon, but it was more or less ben>dolby>wisdom>knights=vanta=mont
w/ a side of ender
and the potential of there being perhaps 1 deeper wolf in the clears (most likely between sunbae or insom, but perhaps grr but again there's a gap between these peeps and the wolf reads)
I'll be fishing for a vigi shot tonight. Given the currently level of KP in a game of this size, i'm pretty certain that there's a vigi shot *somewhere* in my deck.
Yeah Ender is just town imo. Benneh used multiple people's sus on Ender as a way to try to direct greater sus towards him, and I've just feeling the villa energy from him since
Also irregardless of mech Maple just looks good from how Benneh treated her. I also do believe that Jan got the card and the card used used on Dya
kinda thinking that I was wrong to dismiss what ladd was saying about knights yesterday.
but w/e today is wisdom day
Maple our slots have pretty much agreed on exactly nothing this game but I would appreciate if you heard me out, at least for one day. i am thinking you are town now and the best thing we can do is just kill wisdom. After that happens, if Wisdom flips red I should be able to get myself clear. I do kinda have marginal concerns about you still tbh (like you just not voting yesterday but I do get the sense that you weren't all there on ladd v at that point in time) but frankly it's w/e since I believe you gave Jan the card.
I assumed that everyone was going to fall in line and wisdom would *just go over* yesterday. I was AFK for eod, so I wasn't there for the shenanigans.
And in any case, if you *are* a villager, I am reading your posts and considering our options. It seems pretty possible that we go Wisdom today, but it would be irresponsible for any of us to lock into that now. There's definitely the possibility that we end up somewhere else in the PoE today.
theknightsofneeee
i just don't view this as the case tbh (Maple being jailed wolf kp) and I can easily see Jan just not exeing Maple based off the flip. i was already feeling before the flip when Jan announced he was jailing maple that he probably wouldn't exe maple if he got a card tbh, but uh, Benneh just looks pretty unteammed with Maple, and if he is with Maple, Maple isn't KP. Which suggests either someone else got a doc off, maf vig is even night, or maple's doc card was real and was given to Jan.
Like look at this, I know that Benneh shifted his vote around to wisdom and ladd, but he kept on pushing this pretty consistently from mid-d2 onward. i think he probably ends up on Maple EOD2 if Rask doesn't get outted, and is pretty ungenerous to that slot. There's tons of other posts like this but I don't feel like really beating it in when I think the thread is going to get there anyway.
i think maple looks worse but i think its a very good chance they're w/w
ladd's pushes this game are not great but maple is like, very likely just wolf kp
Vanta Black
08-15-2024, 08:22
god you have brightened my day
i just want to burn vanta and knights now
Hey now.
Vanta Black
08-15-2024, 08:30
...
idk if i have the balls to do it and be wrong tho cause then im eating a vig shot in the face (or a launch)
Prophetic. Or foreshadowing.
Vanta Black
08-15-2024, 08:32
...
I don't think my vote ever moves off of Wisdom today tbh
Incllined to vote there myself.
But if neeee hops on then I don't knooooooow
Vote: ladd
siw trusting dya here
pasta gods give me strength
Oh, this is the outing post?
I read it before but I guess I'm missing some context.
If Benneh decided to sacrifice himself to make sure both Ladd and myself get yeeted is probably proof that an arsonist actually exists and will ignite to a victory.
What's the numbers now? 12 players, 2-3 wolves?
Let's run that, say 3 wolves
9v/3w
I get misyeeted
8v/3w
Ignition kills 2 + factional
5v/3w
Okay that's not an auto win but it's getting the team to f3 with 3 wolves.
Yeah that's not looking good for us.
Could be two wolves left tho. Could be no arsonist. Not sure why Benneh would make a move like that in that case.
Vanta Black
08-15-2024, 08:32
Should probably work on developing some reads instead of whatever it is I've been doing.
I'm not gonna bother with Dolby's tunnel. He's likely town and won't look elsewhere before I'm flipped.
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